MiseryHatesCompany
Well-Known Member
The game is over analysed. Just let us watch the game and move on.
The amount of coaching that youngsters get these days has improved technique beyond all recognition from 80s & 90s but has dramatically reduced invention and individual decision-making and taking of responsibility.
I have believed that for years. My comparison was the modern day Liverpool V Old Liverpool with Rush, Barnes, Beardsley, etc. Ian Rush in the 80's (1980 to 87) Liverpool team scored 14 goals in Europe with 26 appearances, but to to score those goals they had to win a domestic trophy or finish in a decent position to get EUFA cup football. Teams winning the Champions League when they aren't even their countries champion is a farce and devalues the competition.Every record broken is utterly meaningless now because of the change of the game and the amount of matches played and it makes players who would get ignored at any other time into undeserving legends.
Pants.Its now basically a competition for the elite teams in the elite leagues of Europe.Accept that fact.What would devalue it is in the old european cup smaller teams drawing other smaller teams all the way to the final.Romance of the cup rubbish.I have believed that for years. My comparison was the modern day Liverpool V Old Liverpool with Rush, Barnes, Beardsley, etc. Ian Rush in the 80's (1980 to 87) Liverpool team scored 14 goals in Europe with 26 appearances, but to to score those goals they had to win a domestic trophy or finish in a decent position to get EUFA cup football. Teams winning the Champions League when they aren't even their countries champion is a farce and devalues the competition.
I have believed that for years. My comparison was the modern day Liverpool V Old Liverpool with Rush, Barnes, Beardsley, etc. Ian Rush in the 80's (1980 to 87) Liverpool team scored 14 goals in Europe with 26 appearances, but to to score those goals they had to win a domestic trophy or finish in a decent position to get EUFA cup football. Teams winning the Champions League when they aren't even their countries champion is a farce and devalues the competition.
Your avatar still looks like an eyelash on my phone.Arrrrrrgģggghhhhhh.It's not really the amount of coaching that's reduces the latter. It's that the hours dedicated to informal and unorganised football/sport are no longer widely at a level to develop invention and individual decision-making and taking of responsibility.
Kids at pro-youth level generally train 4 hours 30 minutes in a week then play a game at the weekend of circa 90 minutes. That 6 hours of football across a week and that's about the most someone will get. If it's not supported by individual practice and unorganised football then you won't see a great development in the skills you listed. As no matter what's done in those training sessions, it isn't enough time to develop them. If you had both the training and a higher amount of time dedicated to informal/organised playing then you'd see all areas improve.
In terms of 'taking responsibility', there's an argument that is a wider environmental and societal issue. As kids aren't really given independence and responsibility in the same way as previously, that's why you have kids whose only sport practice is the organised adult-centric version where parents drive them to and pick them up from training.
Correct. The defending in that game is so bad, sooo bad. Worse than the current women's game for sure.Football 'back in the day' was garbage.
Watch footage of the 1958 World Cup Final on YouTube and you'll laugh at the standard. The players are literally walking about and look worse than Sunday league players.
Even in the 70s when the Cruyff turn was 'invented'. It's the most simple skill in football that 3 year olds can do.
People don't watch the Champions League to watch the champions of a country square off against one another. They watch it because they want to see likes of Real Madrid vs Ac Milan or Manchester United vs Bayern Munich play each other.
Mingeball is good.Following on from the controversial rangers opinions, what are your controversial general football opinions.
I have 2 main ones
1. Zidanes champions league final goal was brilliant but not deserving of the gushing 20 years on. Bales one in the champions league final a few years back was far better.
2. Carlos Alberto goal in 1970 was average at best. It was done at walking pace and there was absolutely zero press from opposition player. Decent goal but nowhere near as good as made out.
Jesus fucking Christ.I have next to no appreciation for the Makelele role, much preferred players who could just play in a 4-4-2 and both attack and defend
I get the role and understand it I just find it shite
Show me a 3 year old doing the Cruyff turn properly.Football 'back in the day' was garbage.
Watch footage of the 1958 World Cup Final on YouTube and you'll laugh at the standard. The players are literally walking about and look worse than Sunday league players.
Even in the 70s when the Cruyff turn was 'invented'. It's the most simple skill in football that 3 year olds can do.
I could be wrong, but from the top of my head I can't think of 1 example of this happening.What would devalue it is in the old european cup smaller teams drawing other smaller teams all the way to the final.
Messi/Ronaldo have massively covered up that the overall top level quality of players has decreased.
90’s or a 00’s world 11 absolutely batter one from 2010-19.
Show me a 3 year old doing the Cruyff turn properly.
Along the same lines, The Championship in England is more exciting than the EPL.The Europa League is more exciting than the Champions League.
The vast majority of time spent watching football is actually quite boring but we all continue for the infrequent moments that get you on your feet.
The amount of coaching that youngsters get these days has improved technique beyond all recognition from 80s & 90s but has dramatically reduced invention and individual decision-making and taking of responsibility.
My papa was was ahead of his time when he told me in the 1990s that football had been ruined by money. I didn’t see it then but I wholeheartedly agree with him now.
Chris Woods and Klos have European Cup medals.Chris Woods was an average goalkeeper and should not be mentioned in the same bracket as Goram,Klos or McGregor.
It is but the quality is massively overstated.Along the same lines, The Championship in England is more exciting than the EPL.
I watched it last year when the Euros were postponed. Terrible tournament and if it wasn't for it being held in England, them getting to the semis, the culture around Britpop and Cool Britannia then it wouldn't be spoken about the way it is. Same with Italia 90.Having watched it back as an adult, Euro 96 was a shit tournament that also laid the foundations for modern football.
100%. I love it in the run in as it's usually quite close at the promotion and relegation places but a lot of games are a tough watch. Very poor quality and just a lot of effort and hard work.It is but the quality is massively overstated.
If people were only interested in the big names playing each other then why was there a big kick up when they all wanted to piss off and do their own thing.
Seems you have missed the theme of the thread TBH.Jesus fucking Christ.
Seems you have missed the theme of the thread TBH.
I much preferred football with wingers, two central midfielders asked to do more i.e a pair like Viera and Petit or Viera and Silva a Keane and Scholes, with players asked to do more both ways
Arsenal at their best under Wenger, Man U at their best under Ferguson, Rangers at their best under Smith, it is a way of playing football I much preferred to that which was predominantly introduced by Mourinho.
Don't @me I just don't find the 3 in midfield thing with one often sitting as fun
I've not missed the theme of this thread, but there's controversial then there is not appreciating football.
Honestly mate don't get that you don't enjoy players like Kante, Makalele or anyone in that mould.
I can't remember the exact figures but I'm sure Scotland has either won more or the same amount of European club trophies as France and both are behind Belgium.The French league cannot be classed as a "big5" league
And that goes before PSG becoming an oil-club.
They have a lot of diddy clubs and a few big clubs who challenge for top 4
Dunga and Deschamps were doing the water carrying thing in the 90s to great success were they not? I think what you're demonstrating is favoring the British approach when continental and worldwide tactics were evolving and moving on.Seems you have missed the theme of the thread TBH.
I much preferred football with wingers, two central midfielders asked to do more i.e a pair like Viera and Petit or Viera and Silva a Keane and Scholes, with players asked to do more both ways
Arsenal at their best under Wenger, Man U at their best under Ferguson, Rangers at their best under Smith, it is a way of playing football I much preferred to that which was predominantly introduced by Mourinho.
Don't @me I just don't find the 3 in midfield thing with one often sitting as fun
I mean this is controversial alongside the one about Scottish football being better than you think when they get regularly beaten early on every year.If the Edinburgh teams got into the Europa Conference League, they'd get to the knockout round.
Scottish football is nowhere near as bad as it's made out to be.
Dunga and Deschamps were doing the water carrying thing in the 90s to great success were they not? I think what you're demonstrating is favoring the British approach when continental and worldwide tactics were evolving and moving on.
That'll be why one dominated the Premier League and Europe while the other signed for Blackburn and potentially never got past a group stage?Barry Ferguson was a better all round footballer than Roy Keane.
if they were good enough to get out of the group they would be good enough to qualify for it in the first place !I mean this is controversial alongside the one about Scottish football being better than you think when they get regularly beaten early on every year.
This whole post can be translated to I'm now over 25 in almost all cases.Football is basically just rubbish now. I used to be obsessed and love it, I would watch every and any game I could, tried to watch every match at major tournaments, etc, now, I just follow Rangers.
Have you seen A View from the Terrace where diddy team fans make the same argument about the lower leagues? That's all this is.Seems mine isn't that controversial going by some comments in here but Scottish football is far more entertaining on and off the field than Champions League and English Premier League.
I say more entertaining rather than better but I would rather watch an entertaining game with two shite teams than a boring match with two good teams.
A big club winning the champions league by beating several other big clubs from big leagues instead of champions of clubs from smaller leagues isn't what devalues the competition.I have believed that for years. My comparison was the modern day Liverpool V Old Liverpool with Rush, Barnes, Beardsley, etc. Ian Rush in the 80's (1980 to 87) Liverpool team scored 14 goals in Europe with 26 appearances, but to to score those goals they had to win a domestic trophy or finish in a decent position to get EUFA cup football. Teams winning the Champions League when they aren't even their countries champion is a farce and devalues the competition.
To be fair Ferguson was made Blackburn skipper and got some Man of The Match awards. In truth he was a fine player.That'll be why one dominated the Premier League and Europe while the other signed for Blackburn and potentially never got past a group stage?
Not sure about that. Some absolutely incredible players outside Messi and Ronaldo. Real Madrid's Champions League winning sides were unreal.
I recently started watching MOTD on a Saturday night without having any knowledge of the scores during the day. It makes it so much better. Also good to switch off from football on the Saturday (provided Rangers are not playing) and spend more time with the family. Less time on the phone.Match of the day is pointless now. You can watch the highlights anywhere and don’t have to listen to their shite pundits.
Belgium should never have given the job to Roberto martinez and have never looked like winning anything
Been to a few lower league games and I would agree with them. Some are very entertaining. Used to go to Highland League games also, same thing a 4-3 in any league is more entertaining that a 0-0 for instance.Have you seen A View from the Terrace where diddy team fans make the same argument about the lower leagues? That's all this is.
There's nothing to suggest we wouldn't be another Newcastle.Is this controversial? If there had been a British League since almost Day 1 would we have won a bucket load of European trophies by virtue of playing in a much more competitive league?
I know, that's why I'm floating the question out there...There's nothing to suggest we wouldn't be another Newcastle.
In 2011 that Barcelona v Man United final had Iniesta, Xavi and Busquets in the middle of the park. Arguably the best midfield of all time. Some relatively average players won the CL in the 00's too. That Liverpool side in 07 gets nowhere near a final these days.very small sample size as it's super subjective.
But 90's - Real and Juve both won a champions league, and competed in a final against each other - midfield of Deschamps/Davids/Zidane up against Seedorf/Redondo/Karembeu
00's - AC Milan won it the most that decade - but even taking their starting midfield from the final they lost that decade it was Pirlo/Seedorf/Gattuso/Kaka
You're right that there is still some incredible players outside of Messi/Ronaldo -but Madrids 2017 winning midfield - Kroos/Casemiro/Modric
Teams the beat midfields - Atletico - Tiago/Raul Garci/Gabi/Koke
Juventus - Khedira/Pjanic/Dybala
Liverpool - Milner/Henderson/Wijnaldum
Now I've not going to say there's bad players, but in my opinion, there is a noticeable drop off in quality of overall player.