Bachmann to Rangers?

[bornabluenose]

If we sign Turner this forum will go into overdrive

You ain't seen nothin yet.

 

[Crispy Bacon]

4 really good players. We could see before they signed how good they were (Aluko aside maybe, but he was on trial at Juventus just before us).

The massive limitations in the likes of Jones, Shinnie & Stewarts games are clear to see and the latter 2 aren’t getting any younger.

Glad to see you are able to hold an actual debate on it though, acknowleging there is no middle ground between bang average 28 year olds from Aberdeen & Barcelona. Smart man.

So where is the middle ground?
Young English? Tried it
Old English? Tried it
Young European? Tried it
Old European? Tried it

This is what has worked in the past for us.
We are working within our means.

 

[MSF]

So where is the middle ground?
Young English? Tried it
Old English? Tried it
Young European? Tried it
Old European? Tried it

This is what has worked in the past for us.
We are working within our means.

Tried it? WTF. Mate, just so you know - not all players are the same based on their nationality & age. That is a mental post.

Old Scottish? Tried it.
Young Scottish? Tried it.

Must be nobody else we can sign in your book.

 

[Crispy Bacon]

Tried it? WTF. Mate, just so you know - not all players are the same based on their nationality & age. That is a mental post.

Old Scottish? Tried it.
Young Scottish? Tried it.

Must be nobody else we can sign in your book.

Law of averages tell us that our better signings have come from Scotland, surely you could have deducted that?
Dense as %^*&, you are.

 

[LiviLoyal]

Law of averages tell us that our better signings have come from Scotland, surely you could have deducted that?
Dense as %^*&, you are.

In what timescale are you alluding to here? If it’s recent seasons, I don’t think you can argue our best signings have come from Scotland?

Candeias, Tavernier, Morelos are 3 of, if not, our 3 most successful in terms of their output I’d argue and none of them came from Scotland.

 

[Crispy Bacon]

In what timescale are you alluding to here? If it’s recent seasons, I don’t think you can argue our best signings have come from Scotland?

Candeias, Tavernier, Morelos are 3 of, if not, our 3 most successful in terms of their output I’d argue and none of them came from Scotland.

Why would you argue? They definitely don't come from Scotland...

I'm talking about time where we have actually won trophies. Not our most unsuccessful spell ever.

 

[LiviLoyal]

Why would you argue? They definitely don't come from Scotland...

I'm talking about time where we have actually won trophies. Not our most unsuccessful spell ever.

I’d argue they’re 3 of our most successful recent signings, like I wrote. I didn’t say I’d argue they don’t come from Scotland.

@MSF has already answered your point to an extent though. Buying players from Scotland in years gone by was completely different to it is now. Some of the players you’ve already alluded to are in a completely different class to the ones we’re rumoured to be signing now.

For what it’s worth, I don’t really care if we sign Bachman or not, as he won’t play, but guys like Shinnie and Stewart aren’t what’s required. Hastie I’ll reserve judgement on as he’s a young guy and clearly has something about him.

 

[Crispy Bacon]

I’d argue they’re 3 of our most successful recent signings, like I wrote. I didn’t say I’d argue they don’t come from Scotland.

@MSF has already answered your point to an extent though. Buying players from Scotland in years gone by was completely different to it is now. Some of the players you’ve already alluded to are in a completely different class to the ones we’re rumoured to be signing now.

For what it’s worth, I don’t really care if we sign Bachman or not, as he won’t play, but guys like Shinnie and Stewart aren’t what’s required. Hastie I’ll reserve judgement on as he’s a young guy and clearly has something about him.

3 most successful with 1 trophy between them. Good players but how can you try and measure them against players who have won 5,6,7 trophies for us. Look through every league winning team it will be heavily dominated by Scots or players who came from a Scottish club


There's no argument really

 

[Crispy Bacon]

I’d argue they’re 3 of our most successful recent signings, like I wrote. I didn’t say I’d argue they don’t come from Scotland.

@MSF has already answered your point to an extent though. Buying players from Scotland in years gone by was completely different to it is now. Some of the players you’ve already alluded to are in a completely different class to the ones we’re rumoured to be signing now.

For what it’s worth, I don’t really care if we sign Bachman or not, as he won’t play, but guys like Shinnie and Stewart aren’t what’s required. Hastie I’ll reserve judgement on as he’s a young guy and clearly has something about him.

And also on his point, you say it's different now to sign Scottish players... when the leagues the most competitive it has been? Can you not see why that sounds daft? Celtics main men the last 6/7 seasons have all been Scottish or from Scottish clubs. Go figure.

 

[Vamos_buffalo]

I really hope we are actually looking outside Scotland this summer as well.

If you believe the rumours we are going to have a squad with:

Bachmann
Jones
Hastie
Stewart
Mckay-stephen
Shinnie
Max Lowe

Jesus Fvck when you put it like that it looks horrific.

Not one of those players should be anywhere near a starting place in our team

 

[Cooper 11]

This place will go into overdrive if he signs.

He’ll take care of business

 

[LiviLoyal]

And also on his point, you say it's different now to sign Scottish players... when the leagues the most competitive it has been? Can you not see why that sounds daft? Celtics main men the last 6/7 seasons have all been Scottish or from Scottish clubs. Go figure.

There’s a difference in producing Scottish players vs signing good ones though.

Who have they had?

Armstrong (fair enough, came from DU)
McGregor (youth?)
Tierney (youth)
Brown (fair enough, but signed years ago when the league was better than it is now)
Forrest (youth)

Am I missing any Scottish players? That aside, you’re talking about guys like Dembele, Eduoard, Sinclair, Ntcham, Rogic etc.

It’s hard to pick up real quality from within the Scottish league now vs what it was previously (in my opinion obviously). I think we might have one of the few gems in Kamara. I’m far from convinced with the likes of Shinnie and co.

 

[Larkhall_Exile]

This place will go into overdrive if he signs.

 

[MSF]

Why would you argue? They definitely don't come from Scotland...

I'm talking about time where we have actually won trophies. Not our most unsuccessful spell ever.

3 most successful with 1 trophy between them. Good players but how can you try and measure them against players who have won 5,6,7 trophies for us. Look through every league winning team it will be heavily dominated by Scots.

There's no argument really

You’ve went way off on one.

Started off trying to justify signing players that aren’t good enough by suggesting that because guys like Thomson, Boyd & co came from Scottish clubs then Shinnie etc will be good enough. Which is a crazy comparison in the first place.

Now having a go at Morelos & Tavs lack of trophys but thats largely down to the lack of quality around them which we’re trying to address this summer. Adding guys like Stewart does not address this issue.

 

[ThomasMRFC]

Take him as back up but all the spl players we have been linked with worry’s me. they arnt the required quality. We need 5 automatic starting players in the summer

 

[Crispy Bacon]

You’ve went way off on one.

Started off trying to justify signing players that aren’t good enough by suggesting that because guys like Thomson, Boyd & co came from Scottish clubs then Shinnie etc will be good enough. Which is a crazy comparison in the first place.

Now having a go at Morelos & Tavs lack of trophys but thats largely down to the lack of quality around them which we’re trying to address this summer. Adding guys like Stewart does not address this issue.

Where did I have a go at Morelos and tav? 2 of my favourite players...?

You said signing players from Scottish clubs won't help us move forward, someone should tell that to Celtic who have players from Scottish clubs who they have developed and sold on forfprtunes, or kept and won things with.

You are trying to say we shouldn't sign these players because of whom they currently play for, and are trying to twist my words to suit your argument... remind who who can't hold a debate?

 

[Crispy Bacon]

There’s a difference in producing Scottish players vs signing good ones though.

Who have they had?

Armstrong (fair enough, came from DU)
McGregor (youth?)
Tierney (youth)
Brown (fair enough, but signed years ago when the league was better than it is now)
Forrest (youth)

Am I missing any Scottish players? That aside, you’re talking about guys like Dembele, Eduoard, Sinclair, Ntcham, Rogic etc.

It’s hard to pick up real quality from within the Scottish league now vs what it was previously (in my opinion obviously). I think we might have one of the few gems in Kamara. I’m far from convinced with the likes of Shinnie and co.

Brown, Gordon, Armstrong, Griffiths, Christie

That's recent seasons without looking it up. All played for "diddy" clubs at some point, all are league winners

There are players in this league good enough for us and no matter how many times you shout but but but he plays for Killie, it doesn't mean anything.

 

[Rfclee]

Really think we should be thinking about a long term successor to McGregor. As much as he is a great shot stopper I would love a commanding gk in the future.

 

[MSF]

Where did I have a go at Morelos and tav? 2 of my favourite players...?

You said signing players from Scottish clubs won't help us move forward, someone should tell that to Celtic who have players from Scottish clubs who they have developed and sold on forfprtunes, or kept and won things with.

You are trying to say we shouldn't sign these players because of whom they currently play for, and are trying to twist my words to suit your argument... remind who who can't hold a debate?

OK, lets look at the mentally challengeds signings from within Scottish football since 2012, where the standard took a nosedive.

In the 7 years they’ve signed Armstrong & GMS. Ciftci, Allan, Christie, Morgan, Bain, Hendry, Hayes & Mulumbu.

The only one they’ve “developed & sold on for fortunes” is Armstrong. You could state a case for Christie doing well but he is nothing special.

The rest? Wouldn’t get near our team, which says it all.

Please continue showing us that the standard in Scottish football is good enough to buy most our players from.

 

[bornabluenose]

To be fair I thought he looked too good for Kilmarnock when we have played them .

Is he out of contract at Watford.

 

[Renoranger]

This place will go into overdrive if he signs.

Turn into overdrive....not go !

 

[giogaddi]

I really hope we are actually looking outside Scotland this summer as well.

If you believe the rumours we are going to have a squad with:

Bachmann
Jones
Hastie
Stewart
Mckay-stephen
Shinnie
Max Lowe

Indeed. A terrifying thought.

 

[Crispy Bacon]

OK, lets look at the mentally challengeds signings from within Scottish football since 2012, where the standard took a nosedive.

In the 7 years they’ve signed Armstrong & GMS. Ciftci, Allan, Christie, Morgan, Bain, Hendry, Hayes & Mulumbu.

The only one they’ve “developed & sold on for fortunes” is Armstrong. You could state a case for Christie doing well but he is nothing special.

The rest? Wouldn’t get near our team, which says it all.

Please continue showing us that the standard in Scottish football is good enough to buy most our players from.

Just seen Bachman is on loan from watford, is he good enough now? Going by your logic?

 

[MSF]

Just seen Bachman is on loan from watford, is he good enough now? Going by your logic?

Whats my logic? I’m not against signing a player from anywhere, if they’re good enough.

Its your logic that signing players from a certain place works/doesn’t work.

You’re all over the place. And completely ignored my points made about the mentally challengeds using the Scottish market, unsuprisingly.

 

[Thomas Bryce]

Been very impressed with him this season, looks a very steady goalkeeper.

 

[cloudy]

He’s got a contract with Watford till 2020.

 

[Adamski82]

We moving big Wes alongside Goldson as a cb. Top class slide on lustig tbf.

 

[Crispy Bacon]

Whats my logic? I’m not against signing a player from anywhere, if they’re good enough.

Its your logic that signing players from a certain place works/doesn’t work.

You’re all over the place. And completely ignored my points made about the mentally challengeds using the Scottish market, unsuprisingly.

You said if we sign players like Kamara (ex arsenal) we are in trouble. Paraphrasing but words to that effect.

You said we need to aim higher and I pointed out Celtic have players from Scottish clubs, in fact some of them are starters (Hayes, there's another I missed).

I have (rightly) made the point buying in Scotland is tried and tested and that's why we are doing it. We can't go buy your Edourds or ntchams.

But because they come from Killie etc, that automatically makes them pish. Logic. It's you who is everywhere buddy.

 

[MSF]

You said if we sign players like Kamara (ex arsenal) we are in trouble. Paraphrasing but words to that effect.

You said we need to aim higher and I pointed out Celtic have players from Scottish clubs, in fact some of them are starters (Hayes, there's another I missed).

I have (rightly) made the point buying in Scotland is tried and tested and that's why we are doing it. We can't go buy your Edourds or ntchams.

But because they come from Killie etc, that automatically makes them pish. Logic. It's you who is everywhere buddy.

I said if we filled the squad with players of Kamaras level it would be worrying, nothing about the club he was at.

You then said the mentally challengeds regularly buy players from Scottish clubs and sell them on for big money, but they’ve only done that with Armstrong. The rest of their Scottish signings in the past 6 years (since the standard being produced has dramatically fallen in this country) have been below par bar maybe Christie. Hayes is included in that, guy is pish.

Stewart, Jones & Shinnie could be coming from Barca. They’d still be shite.

 

[Crispy Bacon]

I said if we filled the squad with players of Kamaras level it would be worrying, nothing about the club he was at.

You then said the mentally challengeds regularly buy players from Scottish clubs and sell them on for big money, but they’ve only done that with Armstrong. The rest of their Scottish signings in the past 6 years (since the standard being produced has dramatically fallen in this country) have been below par bar maybe Christie. Hayes is included in that, guy is pish.

Stewart, Jones & Shinnie could be coming from Barca. They’d still be shite.

Read my post again wee man, sell or keep. Their squad has Christie, Hayes, Gordon, Brown, Griffiths all this season and all performing.

All played for seemingly "shite" clubs in their career.

Only a simpleton would link the club someone plays for with their ability or potential ability, like you are doing.

Not everyone walks into a championsip/epl squad and ironically your point is based around a player who came from arsenal, talk about all over the place.

 

[Virgil Hilts]

This place will go into overdrive if he signs.

ain’t seen nothin’ yet

 

[MSF]

Read my post again wee man, sell or keep. Their squad has Christie, Hayes, Gordon, Brown, Griffiths all this season and all performing.

All played for seemingly "shite" clubs in their career.

Only a simpleton would link the club someone plays for with their ability or potential ability, like you are doing.

Not everyone walks into a championsip/epl squad and ironically your point is based around a player who came from arsenal, talk about all over the place.

Brown, Griffiths & Gordon were all produced in a time where Scottish clubs were still developing good standard of players. Who has produced anywhere near them since from the likes of Hibs & Hearts? Christie is average & Hayes is utter shite.

You are the guy who judges a player based on where they come from, you literally said that. I’m judging them on their ability.

Banging my head against a brick wall trying to speak to you here. You forget what you post.

So where is the middle ground?
Young English? Tried it
Old English? Tried it
Young European? Tried it
Old European? Tried it

This is what has worked in the past for us.
We are working within our means.

Literally judging a player on their profile, not ability.

I’m telling you the standard of players developed at Scottish clubs is not of the standard it was when Thomson, Naismith, Whittaker, Brown, Griffiths, Gordon & co came through.

 

[Crispy Bacon]

Brown, Griffiths & Gordon were all produced in a time where Scottish clubs were still developing good standard of players. Who has produced anywhere near them since from the likes of Hibs & Hearts? Christie is average & Hayes is utter shite.

You are the guy who judges a player based on where they come from, you literally said that. I’m judging them on their ability.

Banging my head against a brick wall trying to speak to you here. You forget what you post.



Literally judging a player on their profile, not ability.

I’m telling you the standard of players developed at Scottish clubs is not of the standard it was when Thomson, Naismith, Whittaker, Brown, Griffiths, Gordon & co came through.

Jesus Christ okay let me spell it out for you

Scottish players are not a gamble, everything listed is.

Mcginn just went to England for a large fee, I'm not about to start trawling Google to make a point.

Spending money on foreign players comes at a risk, a risk we can't afford.

And spfl is most competitive it's ever been, these clubs are taking points off everyone so the "it's not the same" is bit mute


Buying tried and tested Scottish players, who play for teams that are performing well is what we need to do.
Even more so when they are free.

Sorry that was so hard for you to parse.

You are correct, this is tough.

 

[MSF]

Jesus Christ okay let me spell it out for you

Scottish players are not a gamble, everything listed is.

Mcginn just went to England for a large fee, I'm not about to start trawling Google to make a point.

Spending money on foreign players comes at a risk, a risk we can't afford.

And spfl is most competitive it's ever been, these clubs are taking points off everyone so the "it's not the same" is bit mute


Buying tried and tested Scottish players, who play for teams that are performing well is what we need to do.
Even more so when they are free.

Sorry that was so hard for you to parse.

You are correct, this is tough.

Scottish players are not a gamble, in what way? That you know they're shite before they sign? Frightening take.

SPFL is the most competitive its ever been. Because everyone is so spectaculary shite. Scottish Football is at an all time low. The clubs are pish, the players being developed are pish, the national team are pish. Are you Neil Doncaster?

Again, the standard of players being produced here aren't as good as they were when we used to have a lot of them in the starting XI. Currently our most talented players are from outside of Scotland, and it'll continue to be that way in the near future, until our own youth players (from U18 downwards) get to the first team stage.

 

[Crispy Bacon]

Scottish players are not a gamble, in what way? That you know they're shite before they sign? Frightening take.

SPFL is the most competitive its ever been. Because everyone is so spectaculary shite. Scottish Football is at an all time low. The clubs are pish, the players being developed are pish, the national team are pish. Are you Neil Doncaster?

Again, the standard of players being produced here aren't as good as they were when we used to have a lot of them in the starting XI. Currently our most talented players are from outside of Scotland, and it'll continue to be that way in the near future, until our own youth players (from U18 downwards) get to the first team stage.

Everyone is pish, but you only have to be better than them.

You know what, I'll concede this one, but someone better get on the phone to Bomber, Mark Allan and Stevie and let them know they are looking in all the wrong places. Sounds like you have it sussed.

 

[MSF]

Everyone is pish, but you only have to be better than them.

You know what, I'll concede this one, but someone better get on the phone to Bomber, Mark Allan and Stevie and let them know they are looking in all the wrong places. Sounds like you have it sussed.

Ah, the old "well you can't possibly be right because someone higher up than you disagrees" logic. Pathetic mindset.

Like I said, we'll come back to this in December when we have these players from the SPFL who are "not a gamble" playing for us. See how we get on with an Aberdeen/Killie XI.

 

[Crispy Bacon]

Ah, the old "well you can't possibly be right because someone higher up than you disagrees" logic. Pathetic mindset.

Like I said, we'll come back to this in December when we have these players from the SPFL who are "not a gamble" playing for us. See how we get on with an Aberdeen/Killie XI.

Okay so youare right and the people paid hundreds of thouands are wrong? Stick to FM.

Explain the gamble in signing players for no fee and paying them small wages compared to bringing in the likes of Pena, cardoso, Rob Kiernan etc in and giving them 10-20k a week? Ok mate.

 

[CaptainCourageous]

The signings the bheggars have made from Scottish sides in recent years have been garbage; Hayes, Bain, Hendry, Allan, Christie, Morgan...

 

[MSF]

Okay so youare right and the people paid hundreds of thouands are wrong? Stick to FM.

Explain the gamble in signing players for no fee and paying them small wages compared to bringing in the likes of Pena, cardoso, Rob Kiernan etc in and giving them 10-20k a week? Ok mate.

Theres no gamble, you're right. We know the guys we're bringing in aren't good enough and won't stop them winning yet another league. You're right there.

Kiernan on 10-20k.

 

[Crispy Bacon]

Theres no gamble, you're right. We know the guys we're bringing in aren't good enough and won't stop them winning yet another league. You're right there.

Kiernan on 10-20k.

Okay well you tell me what players we have signed from the spfl since our return to top flight and have flopped, i'll tell you the foreign, english, irish... All the other markets you are asking us to explore.

One list will be bigger than the other. How can that be though?

 

[MSF]

Okay well you tell me what players we have signed from the spfl since our return to top flight and have flopped, i'll tell you the foreign, english, irish... All the other markets you are asking us to explore.

One list will be bigger than the other. How can that be though?

Probably because we’ve only signed 4 players from Scotland (1 been OK, 2 been shite, 1 not had enough time to judge)...For a reason. They’re fucking shite.

How can you not see how bad the standard is in Scottish football? How bad the players coming through at clubs are? How much we have regressed as a nation?

Do you watch football?

 

[Crispy Bacon]

Probably because we’ve only signed 4 players from Scotland...

For a reason. They’re fucking shite. How can you not see how bad the standard is in Scottish football? How bad the players coming through at clubs are? How much we have regressed as a nation?

Do you watch football?

Okay, so 4. And we spent a fortune on foreign imports like you are suggesting.

We finished 3pts ahead of hibs and 3 behind Aberdeen last season.

Put out cups by Aberdeen, beat by Killie at home amongst others.

These "shite" players you are talking about? That's the low risk I'm talking about. Sorry you are too dense to parse that.

 

[MSF]

Okay, so 4. And we spent a fortune on foreign imports like you are suggesting.

We finished 3pts ahead of hibs and 3 behind Aberdeen last season.

Put out cups by Aberdeen, beat by Killie at home amongst others.

These "shite" players you are talking about? That's the low risk I'm talking about. Sorry you are too dense to parse that.

I’m not suggesting foreign players, just players that are good enough. I don’t care where they come from.

If you think the guys we have coming in are good enough then thats fine, like I said, we’ll come back to it in December.

 

[Crispy Bacon]

I’m not suggesting foreign players, just players that are good enough. I don’t care where they come from.

If you think the guys we have coming in are good enough then thats fine, like I said, we’ll come back to it in December.

I'm sorry I must have missed the official announcement.

I'll reserve judgement. Exactly what you are saying right now came out my mouth before we signed Aluko. Live and learn kiddo.

 

[gersfanal]

Foderingham might be leaving, Alnwick almost certainly will be.

You think a keeper of Foderinghams quality wants to be on the bench for the peak of his career? He could get a good gig in the Championship.

Bachmann would be a decent signing as, apart from the above, Greegsy is now 37 !

 

[Polar bear]

Utterly depressing some of the mediocre shite we are allegedly looking at.

Mark Allen needs to up his game drastically.

Why? Allen put together a team that managed
properly,should have won the league this year imho.