Who is VAR for?

Earl of Leven

Earl of Leven

Well-Known Member
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Match going fans hate it. Most, but not all, fans who can't attend matches hate it.

Is it to be part of the switch to pleasing worldwide armchair audience? Is it football as a Saturday night entertainment show?

It's already, within a year, nothing to do with checking clear and obvious errors. It's also utterly random : see Villa penalty claim at Emirates.

I haven't even touched on the farce of goals and emotions undone by millimetres, reviewed 10-15 times.

What is it supposed to be doing to improve football?
 
Not sure but all the pundits on Sky agreed with VAR decision on Chelsea goal today.

Offside by a big toe. Hardly clear and it obvious.

Not a fan of how it’s used at all.
 
Its infuriating and will drive fans away from the game. And its not as if games are being refereed better either.
 
VAR is for everyone. If it gets the correct decision, it’s done it’s job and makes the delay worthwhile. Where it’s wrong at the moment, is it’s not being used to make the right decision, it’s there to back the ref and give them a get out. The ‘clear and obvious error,’ bar is set too high. You only have to look at the Liverpool game in the week (as an Everton fan you won’t agree) where Napoli got a ridiculous penalty when Callejon dived but VAR decided it was not a clear and obvious error and so the kick stood. The stakes in modern football are too high to get these decisions wrong. VAR needs given greater power to make the right decision.
 
Superrangers said:
Perhaps but getting correct decisions is paramount. The Maradona handball could never happen now.
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It's certainly not being applied with any consistency in the EPL.

Which should surely be an important objective.
 
The game is all about goals. When VAR is being used to cancel goals in mm it’s not right. Not a Chelsea fan but just watched them have a goal chopped off when the play went on for about 30 secs and wasn’t directly involved in the goal: VAR will get reviewed at start of next season it may take a few seasons after that to get it right
 
Danger Zone said:
People cried for video technology for years, now they get it they all want rid of it.

Personally, I think it has its place but it’s being overused to the extent it’s sucking the life out of the game.
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I am not sure it’s being overused but it’s certainly not being used correctly. If you have video evidence that proves a decision but take the stance that the ref could have legitimately see it differently in the moment, that is simply wrong.
 
Kerdo1801 said:
The game is all about goals. When VAR is being used to cancel goals in mm it’s not right. Not a Chelsea fan but just watched them have a goal chopped off when the play went on for about 30 secs and wasn’t directly involved in the goal: VAR will get reviewed at start of next season it may take a few seasons after that to get it right
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They are over-complicating it though by going on about phases. A player is either offside or not, they either interfere with play or not. Mount was offside and did interfere with play, so the goal was rightly ruled out. The issue was that there were a few more seconds (far from 30) of play and the decision was close. I don’t think people were prepared for the precision of VAR.
 
I detest it. If it must be used i’d Limit it to 1 call per half per team.
If the manager calls for a VAR check and is proved correct he keeps his 1 check for the rest of the half or until he call a wrong check.
Also I’d charge teams £10,000 for each wrong call to cut down on teams using it to time waste.
It’d make the manager really think about each challenge .

Goal line technology is the only tech I’d allow , much prefer to allow the ref to do his job .
 
blueboab said:
I detest it. If it must be used i’d Limit it to 1 call per half per team.
If the manager calls for a VAR check and is proved correct he keeps his 1 check for the rest of the half or until he call a wrong check.
Also I’d charge teams £10,000 for each wrong call to cut down on teams using it to time waste.
It’d make the manager really think about each challenge .

Goal line technology is the only tech I’d allow , much prefer to allow the ref to do his job .
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And how’s that working out in Scotland?
 
It's the TV companies who want it,always been pushing for it in my view.
MOTD tonight and they discussed it after the villa farce Danny Murphy,the best on the box for me,is dead set against. Speaks like a fan who goes to games,but if you noticed the way the discussion finished,it was maybe because there are more negative decisions and it will be better if there's more positive ones. End of discussion. Therefore shutting it down on a positive note.
Goal line technology is more than enough.
 
Superrangers said:
So you would rather that an incorrect decision went against us, than have to wait 30 secs for the correct decision?
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I'd rather they just left well alone. Fed up hearing about it works at cricket and rugby. That's fine for stop start sport,jesus they found someone knitting at the ashes for fecks sake
 
Renfrew@UKGB&NI said:
It's the TV companies who want it,always been pushing for it in my view.
MOTD tonight and they discussed it after the villa farce Danny Murphy,the best on the box for me,is dead set against. Speaks like a fan who goes to games,but if you noticed the way the discussion finished,it was maybe because there are more negative decisions and it will be better if there's more positive ones. End of discussion. Therefore shutting it down on a positive note.
Goal line technology is more than enough.
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I disagree, whenever I have watched games involving VAR, the media seem only too happy to let VAR play the pantomime villain role. It was actually refreshing today to see the pundits praise VAR for correctly disallowing the Chelsea goal. Normally the British media love to get involved and have a scapegoat. You only have to look at the way they are desperate to find a scandal or criticise England in the lead up to or during major tournaments.
 
If you're going to play matches worth hundreds of millions to the clubs involved, and have the technology to help referees get the decisions correct in said matches, it's crazy to not use it.

The offside calls this weekend were the correct decisions. Doesn't matter if it's a millimetre or 3 yards, it's offside.

Imagine Liverpool had drawn today and lost the league by a point in the end?

Damn right it's for fans, because more than anyone we deserve the correct calls determining the matches we pay so much for.
 
They say that offside is factual and nothing to do with being clear and obvious. But that's not always the case when you look at the one in the Leicester Spurs game on Saturday. Minutes spent looking at it with lots of different lines and dots and it was still impossible to call one way or the other.
 
Renfrew@UKGB&NI said:
I'd rather they just left well alone. Fed up hearing about it works at cricket and rugby. That's fine for stop start sport,jesus they found someone knitting at the ashes for fecks sake
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Really? As a Rangers fan, I would rather correct decision-making and not be punished unfairly by officials making the wrong decision, as we know happens all too often.
 
Jimmy Jazz said:
They say that offside is factual and nothing to do with being clear and obvious. But that's not always the case when you look at the one in the Leicester Spurs game on Saturday. Minutes spent looking at it with lots of different lines and dots and it was still impossible to call one way or the other.
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There will always be a decision that’s too close to call and in those instances, the ref’s decision should stand.
 
Superrangers said:
I am not sure it’s being overused but it’s certainly not being used correctly. If you have video evidence that proves a decision but take the stance that the ref could have legitimately see it differently in the moment, that is simply wrong.
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Exactly.

It’s a farce if VAR allows ‘honest mistakes’ by the ref to stand.
 
Superrangers said:
Really? As a Rangers fan, I would rather correct decision-making and not be punished unfairly by officials making the wrong decision, as we know happens all too often.
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That's the thing, they aren't all correct decisions and if you think scotlands going to lead the way in this,you'll be disappointed.
To watch goals being chalked off because of someone's boot size is crazy.
They lied through their teeth when they said it would only be used for clear and obvious,now they're talking about rule changes to suit this thing.
Leave the game alone for gods sake,it was called the beautiful game long before this came along.
 
Renfrew@UKGB&NI said:
That's the thing, they aren't all correct decisions and if you think scotlands going to lead the way in this,you'll be disappointed.
To watch goals being chalked off because of someone's boot size is crazy.
They lied through their teeth when they said it would only be used for clear and obvious,now they're talking about rule changes to suit this thing.
Leave the game alone for gods sake,it was called the beautiful game long before this came along.
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No goals are being chalked off because of a boot size, although the one in the Spurs game was too much. VAR gets the right decision 99 percent time. The issue is that it is being used only for clear and obvious errors, more often than not, when it could be used to get the right decision.
 
It was always going to cause problems.
With GLT you can see a clear decision, perfect, everyone likes it. But it opened the floodgates for further technology where it's still messy and open to interpretation. The biggest problem is for fans in the stadium celebrating then being denied a goal.
If it was for clear and obvious errors then ok but it's impossible in practice as there's too much temptation to get involved.
 
Coatbridge Chancellor said:
It was always going to cause problems.
With GLT you can see a clear decision, perfect, everyone likes it. But it opened the floodgates for further technology where it's still messy and open to interpretation. The biggest problem is for fans in the stadium celebrating then being denied a goal.
If it was for clear and obvious errors then ok but it's impossible in practice as there's too much temptation to get involved.
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I think part of the issue is the different kind of offence it examines. For offsides it is very precise but for penalties it is objective and the bar is too high. Also for red card offences, it seems to err on the side of leniency.
 
Theres been plenty goals that have been chopped off by millimeters. That's why they'll eventually change the offside rule,then another all to suit var.

It is an entertainment and the first people who should be considered are the paying punters. If it keeps going the way it is,they'd be as well watching it at home.

Respect your views superrangers,but I'm never going to get to be a fan of it.
 
Renfrew@UKGB&NI said:
Theres been plenty goals that have been chopped off by millimeters. That's why they'll eventually change the offside rule,then another all to suit var.

It is an entertainment and the first people who should be considered are the paying punters. If it keeps going the way it is,they'd be as well watching it at home.

Respect your views superrangers,but I'm never going to get to be a fan of it.
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We’ll agree to disagree mate. For me getting the correct decision, irrespective of how it comes, is the best option.
 
I think it's a good idea but it would be much more sensible to implement it in the same way as tennis. You get 3 challenges per match and the captain/manager has to declare it whenever a challenge is to be instigated. If a referee makes decisions in one match that people need to question 6 times, that referee gets demoted to the lowest league. If managers/players get the first two challenges completely wrong (as a time wasting exercise for example) their third one gets revoked.
 
Kubala said:
I think it's a good idea but it would be much more sensible to implement it in the same way as tennis. You get 3 challenges per match and the captain/manager has to declare it whenever a challenge is to be instigated. If a referee makes decisions in one match that people need to question 6 times, that referee gets demoted to the lowest league. If managers/players get the first two challenges completely wrong (as a time wasting exercise for example) their third one gets revoked.
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I am not a fan of this idea. It leads to spurious challenges and would be strategically used by sides to break spells of pressure. Why also should a side lose out having to challenge a poor ref?
 
Superrangers said:
I am not a fan of this idea. It leads to spurious challenges and would be strategically used by sides to break spells of pressure. Why also should a side lose out having to challenge a poor ref?
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As I said, you get three per game but if you get the first two wrong then the third one is revoked. If you want to be stricter, you need to get your first one right to instigate another. The referees should be performing to a high standard. As also suggested, if all of the challenges are used in a game and the review indicates they're incorrect decisions, that referee should be demoted to work his way back up. It's not perfect, it's probably flawed and full of problems but it's an idea that could work with some tweaks in my opinion.
 
It's sensible to try to get decisions correct. VAR is still in its early days and the way it's done could be improved. Also folk could get more used to it.
 
Kubala said:
As I said, you get three per game but if you get the first two wrong then the third one is revoked. If you want to be stricter, you need to get your first one right to instigate another. The referees should be performing to a high standard. As also suggested, if all of the challenges are used in a game and the review indicates they're incorrect decisions, that referee should be demoted to work his way back up. It's not perfect, it's probably flawed and full of problems but it's an idea that could work with some tweaks in my opinion.
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Not for me I’m afraid. You could have a couple of really close calls that end up being judged wrong, then you lose your third call on a decision the ref gets wrong but you cannot challenge. I am huge NFL fan so I know the concept but it just doesn’t work in football. Sides will use it to break up a period of pressure from an opponent. Due to the stop start nature if the NFL, that’s not an issue,
 
My opinion is each manager should have 2 challenges each half like tennis. (If they win the challenges they keep them)
For example the Rangers penalty appeal v St Johnstone gets looked at and Rangers get penalty and keep 2 challenges.
Could also mean late in a game also v St Johnstone that they appeal the goalline clearance- challenge fails and they lose it but ifbits theirnlastbone they then cant appeal Defoe being offside.
I think VAR has its use but should be like rugby on big screen for all to see
 
Don't see the problem with it personally - it will get the vast majority of things right than it gets wrong. So that has got to be a good thing.

Issues are that you still think that the big teams will get more of the questionable decisions and the small teams won't but you would get that anyway without using the technology and the fact it takes a bit of spontaneity out of the game - but players and fans will quickly get used to that.

I think people also simply want to hate on it when the issue has absolutely nothing to do with VAR itself and more to do with the actual rules and the fact that the referee is still going to use his interpretation of those rules (at times) to reach a decision.
 
Gibraltar Loyal said:
My opinion is each manager should have 2 challenges each half like tennis. (If they win the challenges they keep them)
For example the Rangers penalty appeal v St Johnstone gets looked at and Rangers get penalty and keep 2 challenges.
Could also mean late in a game also v St Johnstone that they appeal the goalline clearance- challenge fails and they lose it but ifbits theirnlastbone they then cant appeal Defoe being offside.
I think VAR has its use but should be like rugby on big screen for all to see
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Sides will use challenges spuriously to break up play, especially late in games. Rugby and the NFL are more stop start than football. Doesn’t work for me.
 
DavieM said:
Don't see the problem with it personally - it will get the vast majority of things right than it gets wrong. So that has got to be a good thing.

Issues are that you still think that the big teams will get more of the questionable decisions and the small teams won't but you would get that anyway without using the technology and the fact it takes a bit of spontaneity out of the game - but players and fans will quickly get used to that.

I think people also simply want to hate on it when the issue has absolutely nothing to do with VAR itself and more to do with the actual rules and the fact that the referee is still going to use his interpretation of those rules (at times) to reach a decision.
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Good point about the rule changes. Trying to implement VAR, they shouldn’t have messed with the rules.
 
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