Club 1872 statement

colB1969 said:
Dave King owns 25% of Shares. So 75% of shares are owned by others. They own 5% so 30% would be in total.

So 70% owned by others, so although they would be the largest shareholders not much clout if the other 70% did not agree to a board resolution
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Special resolutions need 75% shareholder approval so having more than 25% will give the fans a veto on all special resolutions.
 
sammy1872 said:
I personally pay 5 pound a month to club 1872 but like most it’s a small enough amount I don’t even think about it . If they wanted me to increase it to a level that would require them to buy shares at this level they would seriously need to increase their structure and output or I wouldn’t consider it
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Likewise Im past £11.00 a month can't remember how I came to donate that figure, but been doing it since RST days. So donated quite a tidy wee sum so far, but raising that further would require evidence of a business plan / model for going forward.
 
MearnsUnionist said:
Not so sure mate.

Depends how it's sold to the fans.
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A number of years ago, it may have stood a slim chance, but no-one i know or have spoken with for quite a while is even remotely interested in fan ownership and all that that entails.

The appetite has dropped quite dramatically imo and I am not convinced even a hard sell by Club1872 will bring enough fans to the table. Over recent years it has been seen that the club can function well and there is no need for fan groups to have much of an influence at that level.
 
C1872 will never have the financial power to maintain the level of Mr King's shareholding.

Following X number of new share issues in the years ahead, where other shareholders and new investors have the resources to maintain and increase their holding, c1872's (King's current holding) would simply be diluted over time.

I love my club, but uniting as one supporter body/organisation to be able to sustain this level if fan ownership over a long period of time has proved beyond us to date over the last 148 years.
 
A significant minority shareholding by a "fan group" is something we have been crying out for ever since Murray just decided to sell the club to the first chancer that walked by.

However, It's going to depend on the Club 1872 structure, governance and competence as to whether this is going to be a good counterbalance to a single individual dominating the boardroom with Club 1872 being a source of stability in the boardroom or themselves becoming a catalyst of absolute fucking chaos in the boardroom.

Time will tell, I guess.
 
It would be good to know what would happen in the likely event of Club 1872 not being able to raise funds for DK's full shareholding. Would he offer them next to existing shareholders on the board first? To me that would provide some reassurance.
 
pandager1 said:
Most of the top clubs in Europe are fan owned. It's a proven successful model.

Why couldn't it work at Rangers? Would be interested to hear the arguments against, other than the cliche "our fanbase is heavily divided" point.
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The issue is that Club 1872 need to find 20,000 people willing to give them £650 so they can give Dave King back £13m - none of which goes into the club as investment for players, stadium etc. Unless the club is willing to adopt a break even model or dilute share holding every other year then it is a ticking time bomb.
 
daven37 said:
Nothing to do with a sugar daddy which seems to be a common go to jibe aimed at anyone who is hesitant at the idea of fan ownership.

There are too many egos and downright pettiness amongst our support who can't agree on anything.

I would prefer this shareholding to be split between Douglas Park and the other businessmen who currently have shareholdings as said by another poster.

Unless am missing something.
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Hesitancy or reluctance is fine and understandable but the constant dismissal and opposition points towards the 'need' of a figure head at the top.

Why not even a split between C1872 and existing supporter investors?

C1872 still has a lot of growing up and evolving to do but it can be done and done right if enough supporters want it to work.
 
CoopBlue said:
A number of years ago, it may have stood a slim chance, but no-one i know or have spoken with for quite a while is even remotely interested in fan ownership and all that that entails.

The appetite has dropped quite dramatically imo and I am not convinced even a hard sell by Club1872 will bring enough fans to the table. Over recent years it has been seen that the club can function well and there is no need for fan groups to have much of an influence at that level.
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There's a big difference between fans having a sizeable shareholding and complete fan ownership mate.

I'm in favour of the former and 100% against the latter.
 
The Crimson King said:
I agree. It isn't fan ownership that's the issue here, it's Club 1872 that make me slightly hesitant.

And I don't even mean that in a way that's aggravating or snide, I just haven't seen anything from them that would make me confident of good stewartship. Plenty of time for them to come up with something that will put the fans at rest, but at the absolute bare minimum I would expect full transparency from them, a concrete plan, and to have people with real business experience heading things up rather than just fans (even if those people are ultimately accountable to the membership).
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This in spades.

I thought it was just me that I could only name Laura out of the current directors. Only previous one I remember is James Blair who only stuck in mind as I couldn't see how a club employee on the board of an independent organisation which was a major shareholder in the club seemed like a good idea to anyone. Sounded like SPFL level conflicts of interest
 
Good stewardship given recent years, I'd say. It makes us less financially secure in a world where there aren't other, active, investors on the board (which there are) but the long-term ideological security pays for that in spades (assuming Club 1872 up the decorum a bit, if I can say that, but they are great servants and worthy hands).
 
The website being unavailable on the day of their biggest ever announcement isn’t massively encouraging.

I’m happy to contribute but we need something more than a mere statement to go on; a prospectus of sorts would be welcome and hopefully that’s forthcoming.
 
MearnsUnionist said:
Thankfully, even if C1872 is successful with this, it is a long way from fan ownership.

I'm happy enough if C1872 secure Dave King's shares, but I'd be 100% against fan ownership.
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If fans can own 25-30% of the club then I am happy. Huge voice in how things are run, largest shareholder, seats on the board and veto over special resolutions.

Leaves plenty of room for your Parks, etc to also own plenty of shares.
 
On the face of it it's an amazing gesture from DK. Other clubs have hit very choppy waters when a benefactor dies and their shareholding passes on to their children.

Can c1872 and the wider fan base step up though?

I binned my c1872 subscription as I had concerns about the direction that they were taking, particularly when they were being used by the club to fight media battles.

Now that the focus is back to what C1872 was intended to be, I would re-commit.

I would need assurances that c1872 had it's own house in order though.

And DK should have a stand named after him or a statue at Ibrox.
 
Understand how that share holding is represented will be key.

Also, it is a major investor down, who has instant access to large sums of cash. We will need to depend on a few others, should that situation arise.

Either way, King has earned the right to do whatever he wants.
 
pandager1 said:
Most of the top clubs in Europe are fan owned. It's a proven successful model.

Why couldn't it work at Rangers? Would be interested to hear the arguments against, other than the cliche "our fanbase is heavily divided" point.
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It’s not a cliche. Look at the history of all fan owned organisations that have tried anything at Rangers.

Even the current hierarchy at Club 1872 have been involved in resignations and falling outs.

It’s a recipe for disaster.

I know what you’re trying to say, but it isn’t a cliche. It happens time and time again with us as a fan base.
 
daven37 said:
Nothing to do with a sugar daddy which seems to be a common go to jibe aimed at anyone who is hesitant at the idea of fan ownership.

There are too many egos and downright pettiness amongst our support who can't agree on anything.

I would prefer this shareholding to be split between Douglas Park and the other businessmen who currently have shareholdings as said by another poster.

Unless am missing something.
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You just expect Park and Co to stump up another £13M to buy them, they are not a bottomless pit of money mate?
 
Aurelius72 said:
The issue is that Club 1872 need to find 20,000 people willing to give them £650 so they can give Dave King back £13m - none of which goes into the club as investment for players, stadium etc. Unless the club is willing to adopt a break even model or dilute share holding every other year then it is a ticking time bomb.
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I think the club has to press on and adopt a break even model (helped by player trading), irrespective of whether this transaction goes through or not.
 
I'm choosing to trust Dave King on this one. This won't be something that has come about in the last few hours. He would have considered his next move and this is it. He clearly believes this is the best option on the table and I'm willing to back him on that.
 
Deek said:
Not sure how I feel about this, given that our fan base often disagree on the most trivial of matters.
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Don’t talk pish :p :D
EndOfDays said:
I have always been in favor of fan ownership and I cant see why people think a fans group who's main goal is fan ownership would not want to buy shares in the club when they become available.

I'm delighted with this news TBH.
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It won’t be easy , but we will be the envy of every big club if we can make it work .
 
LLLG said:
What I did read out of that is that his family aren’t keen on that idea
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That’s not exactly what he said.
What he said was he couldn’t influence what any family members would do with his shares when he was no longer here.
Ie no way would he sell to a dodgy fucker but he couldn’t guarantee it wouldn’t happen in the future when he is gone by some family member who may not have the same in built affection for us that he does.
He wants the shares to be in the hands of people he knows won’t sell them no matter how much is offered.
That’s where the fans come in as none of us would sell to some crook.
He is basically trying to safeguard the club from future predators.
I think it’s an excellent gesture and as he pointed out he could have probably have doubled his cash if he wanted but is choosing to take a slight loss.
 
mdingwall said:
Press Release - 1st December 2020
Club 1872 can today announce that former Rangers Chairman, Dave King has agreed to sell his entire shareholding in Rangers International Football Club (RIFC) Plc to Club 1872. The sale, when complete, will make Club 1872 the largest, single shareholder in RIFC Plc.
The structure of the deal gives Club 1872 three years to complete the purchase - with the opportunity to purchase the entire shareholding prior to December 2021 for a price of 20p per share which is below Dave’s cost. Club 1872 will aim to create over 20,000 legacy members of the organisation, each of whom will retain a lifetime vote on the shares held in RIFC.
It has also been agreed with the RIFC Board that both Club 1872 and Dave King will have the right to participate in any impending share issue of RIFC. This means that, should Rangers require it, they will continue to be supported by Club 1872 contributors’ donations to Club 1872 for the term of the agreement and that the combined shareholding need not be diluted as long as Club 1872 has funds available to participate.
Dave King said,
“During regime change and throughout my Chairmanship I have advocated for increased supporter influence at the shareholder level and I provided opportunities for Club 1872 to participate in every share issue that was undertaken. I did this partly to express my appreciation to those supporters and supporter groups who actively assisted me in securing regime change and partly to ensure that all supporters (whether shareholders or not) retain an influential voice in directing the affairs of their Club. It is my sincere hope that “Never Again” will supporters become as disconnected and disempowered as they were at the time of my re-engagement with the Club over 6 years ago.
After completion of my service as Chairman I took time to consider how I can create a final legacy by giving supporters - including future generations - substantial shareholder influence for the first time in the almost 150 years history of our Club. The time to launch a “Never Again” campaign is now.
I made it repeatedly clear that I reinvested in the Club somewhat reluctantly and only because without my support it was proving impossible for local Scottish supporters to martial sufficient financial resources to save Rangers from the impending doom that was unavoidable at that time. In addition I committed to investing further and doing whatever else it took (e.g. getting rid

of Sports Direct/Mike Ashley) to see Rangers competing for Scottish titles and in Europe. That is firmly the case now.
As I look forward I must recognise that my family is based in South Africa and I cannot be certain as to what approach they would take to owning shares in the Club when I can no longer influence this. After considering the possible options I concluded that the only meaningful way I could deliver enduring supporter influence in my absence would be to allow supporters - via Club 1872 - to increase their influence at shareholder level by acquiring my shares over a period of time that is considered to be achievable by Club 1872.
I do not intend to profit from my efforts over the last 6 years to save our Club, even though the Club is now substantially more valuable partly through my efforts. I am happy that supporters get this increased value as without them we would not have achieved the full recovery that was completed with the recent fund raise.
I have agreed therefore to transfer my shares to Club 1872 at my historical cash cost of acquisition (which includes professional fees) and to allow Club 1872 a period of three years to build up the supporter backing that will be necessary to achieve this. My all-in cost is 23.7p per share and I am willing to put a pricing structure in place that accommodates 20p as the initial price to be consistent with the present share issue and, at Club 1872’s request, I have included an option for Club 1872 to buy all of the shares at 20p which would result in a loss to me. In my view the shares are presently worth in excess of 50p if properly valued.
I have coined the term “Never Again" as I truly believe that this is a once in a lifetime opportunity to make supporters - in perpetuity- the number one shareholder in the Club. Fortunately, the present Board supported me in my vision to see an increased shareholder influence for our fans but we cannot be sure of the fondness for this by future directors. The time to achieve this is therefore now.
Through my engagement with Club 1872 and its present board members (who are all dedicated volunteers) I have developed great trust in the individuals and the organisation. I have personally witnessed the strong benefit to the Club of having a collective voice for supporters at the shareholder level. It has been beneficial to have in Club 1872 a supporter group that is willing to challenge the Club when it feels necessary to do so and is also willing to support the Board when key resolutions that protect the Club need to be passed. Club 1872 did that extremely well during my period as Chairman to the extent that I have

absolute confidence that Club 1872 is the right vehicle for me to work with to advance supporter shareholder ownership - both now and in the future.
I would urge Rangers supporters to join Club 1872 today and ensure that the events of 2012 can “Never Again” be repeated."
Club 1872 Director, Laura Fawkes said,
“This is a huge moment for both Club 1872 and the Rangers support. We are very grateful to Dave King for his faith in Club 1872 and the Club 1872 Board and for his ongoing commitment to ensuring that the ownership structure of Rangers remains a very healthy mix of wealthy individuals and the wider supporter base.
As Club 1872 Directors, we are very proud to present this opportunity to the Rangers support. We now need over 20,000 Rangers supporters to take up the baton, join Club 1872 and ensure that the events of 2012 can never happen again. It would be a seminal moment for both Rangers Football Club and the supporters if we could achieve the position of being the largest shareholder in Rangers in time for the 150th anniversary of the club in 2022.
The rebuilding of the Club, largely overseen by the Rangers Board under Dave King’s Chairmanship, has been remarkable - from the position in 2012 to once again challenging for domestic titles and in European competition. Club 1872 can continue to assist with that process whilst ensuring that the wellbeing of the club remains at the centre of decision making in the longer term.
We fully understand the financial pressures that supporters are under in the current economic climate, and the huge contribution they have already made to Rangers this season through season ticket sales and merchandise. But, if they can dig deep one more time and join Club 1872 today as legacy members, then over the next couple of years we can together ensure that the club will remain in safe hands for generations to come."
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Love the guy
 
Blue Steel said:
Don’t talk pish :p :D

It won’t be easy , but we will be the envy of every big club if we can make it work .
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I agree but they usual "They dont speak for me" brigade will not be happy.

End of the day this is going ahead and hopefully with the King endorsement fans will get on board even more.
 
Genuine question - Do we even have a definitive list on who is on the Club 1872 board ?

Last I heard Rev McQuarrie and someone else had both chucked it and there was the continual stories of internal strife, public fallin outs and discord.

Club 1872 was a great idea but has been nothing but a basketcase in all honesty.
 
More fans will back it with simple stuff:

Who is on the board of c1872
Who is bankrolling any effort
Who, will you nominate to join your board or indeed club board that has actual experience in running a football club.

As far as we are aware, nobody currently involved with them has experience in that regard.


They will as a matter of priority have to have a figurehead who will be their main person on the club board who has experience of running a club.
 
With great power comes great responsibility.

Need to be convinced this is in the best interest of Rangers and not the egos of the those higher up in Club 1872
 
Crouchy said:
Understand how that share holding is represented will be key.

Also, it is a major investor down, who has instant access to large sums of cash. We will need to depend on a few others, should that situation arise.

Either way, King has earned the right to do whatever he wants.
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I think Stuart Gibson will be investing further funds, but i get your point about losing a major investor.
 
RoofeIsOnFire said:
There are obvious positives in Club 1872 buying all the shares but essentially fans buying shares for King rather than direct investment in the club.

Largest shareholder would then be a slow moving organisation with limited ability to further invest in the club or provide loans for equity. Thats before we get into the infighting palaver we see on a regular basis between groups and inside each group.
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I'm keen to contribute & invest in my own small way but I'd like to know how this will work & who will ultimately call the shots?
 
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