General Meeting: Club 1872

MacaroniPie said:
If it looks like a petty squabble then that's likely because it is a petty squabble. It's not my fault if the ringleaders can't explain the purpose without tying themselves in knots or making incorrect assumptions about my identity.
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But you agree that transparency for c1972 is important? Why has there been no thing from c1972 apart from 3 pre approved candidates? One who King is very dubious about. That would mean that the other 2 would be likely elected. Starts to look like SNP or Unite elections
 
Raffles said:
I’d like to simplify that question further.
@MacaroniPie are you Euan McFarlane or Chris Graham?
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Absolutely not and it's sad that these wild guesses are being made just because someone dares to ask a few questions, and it's very unfair on the people you name.

Petty squabbles have been a feature of Rangers fan groups forever - the RST was beset by them (remember the mass resignations), RF had loads of infighting, looks like it's Club 1872's turn.
 
MacaroniPie said:
If it looks like a petty squabble then that's likely because it is a petty squabble. It's not my fault if the ringleaders can't explain the purpose without tying themselves in knots or making incorrect assumptions about my identity.
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May well be a squabble but if it leads to a revamp of C1872 and improves their governance and transparency, does it really matter?

I’m not versed in past politics between fan groups but C1872 absolutely reeks and I’ve been saying it for a while now
 
I’m not very techy. How do l PM
Robert Marshall said:
Following Legal Advice, I am now asking Members of Club 1872 to add their names to call for a GM Meeting of Club 1872 with the sole purpose of having a vote of no confidence in the current board
Can you PM me your name and Club 1872 number and whether you are a life member or contributing member
If you have recently stopped contributing to Club 1872 can you PM your name and number and the reason you have left
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MacaroniPie said:
Absolutely not and it's sad that these wild guesses are being made just because someone dares to ask a few questions, and it's very unfair on the people you name.

Petty squabbles have been a feature of Rangers fan groups forever - the RST was beset by them (remember the mass resignations), RF had loads of infighting, looks like it's Club 1872's turn.
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It’s an educated guess based on your numerous attempts to muddy the waters and deflect from the main point of an EGM so far in this thread, pointing to you being very close to this issue, if not one of the main protagonists.

Agree about the petty squabbles, but unfortunately it has become clear to me that change is needed on the C1872 board, so this particular upcoming squabble is a necessary evil.
 
Sunnyvale_Loyal said:
I'm quoting you verbatim from this very site. I'm delighted you have a great job. I'm sure many Bears who saw through Chris Graham years before you did have found equally rewarding employment.
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Can you show me the post, I have only ever had a couple of 2-minute conversations with Chris Graham. So I have no idea what kind of person he is
 
Robert Marshall said:
Can you show me the post, I have only ever had a couple of 2-minute conversations with Chris Graham. So I have no idea what kind of person he is
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Not without hours of searching. Trust me, you said it in a thread on here in which you wondered why more Bears didn't join C1872 and suggested it might be at least in part down to envy of CG's "good job". I remember at the time you didn't specify what CG's job was. I would imagine most Bears have no idea what Chris does for a living.
 
MacaroniPie said:
If it looks like a petty squabble then that's likely because it is a petty squabble. It's not my fault if the ringleaders can't explain the purpose without tying themselves in knots or making incorrect assumptions about my identity.
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Tell us who you are then, for transparency of course
Why would anyone fear a GM if they have nothing to hide
 
Sunnyvale_Loyal said:
Not without hours of searching. Trust me, you said it in a thread on here in which you wondered why more Bears didn't join C1872 and suggested it might be at least in part down to envy of CG's "good job". I remember at the time you didn't specify what CG's job was. I would imagine most Bears have no idea what Chris does for a living.
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I never knew the details of Chris Graham involvement with Club 1872 until a few months ago
I was referring to the fact the first time I met him he said he was in finance and travelled a lot to meet clients and was based in Malta
 
Robert Marshall said:
I never knew the details of Chris Graham involvement with Club 1872 until a few months ago
I was referring to the fact the first time I met him he said he was in finance and travelled a lot to meet clients and was based in Malta
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No biggie. I can tell you're being genuine now in your desire to see C1872 made fit for purpose. You must have realised Chris Graham was heavily involved in C1872 when Iain Mulholland's resignation statement was posted on here though?
 
The whole org has stagnated over the last 4 years. It’s a sad state of affairs. The only people to blame for this is simply the current board. There’s zero transparency from them. This letter to Castore is my biggest gripe. Why was their any need for Club 1872 to write a letter trying to undermine the board of the football club. What were they trying to achieve.
 
sneddon38 said:
The whole org has stagnated over the last 4 years. It’s a sad state of affairs. The only people to blame for this is simply the current board. There’s zero transparency from them. This letter to Castore is my biggest gripe. Why was their any need for Club 1872 to write a letter trying to undermine the board of the football club. What were they trying to achieve.
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To be honest, I had a bit of an illness and lost interest in all this, I remember the lad resigned but nothing about the details
I had more on my mind
I don't even know if I have met him
 
Robert Marshall said:
To be honest, I had a bit of an illness and lost interest in all this, I remember the lad resigned but nothing about the details
I had more on my mind
I don't even know if I have met him
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Sorry, I didn't realise. The truth about Chris Graham's role at C1872 was made public years ago but I suspect a lot of fans chose not to believe it until recently. Incidentally, I'm told Chris is very much still running C1872 behind the scenes. The only difference is he is no longer being paid by the club to do it.
 
Robert Marshall said:
Well I can only speak for myself, but when we started RF it cost our family £12K in expenses over the 18/24 months that it took to get it sorted
I never took a penny in expenses from RF, none of us did
My problem with Chris is the way he has operated, being paid to basically run Club 1872 from the Shadows while not declaring it to the members
Sitting in meetings which he had no right to attend unless invited by Club 1872, and if he was why weren't the members told
I have never really bothered about being popular but I would have done the job for nothing, but not in the background
Club 1872 have been guilty of covering up Chris's involvement and the fact he was paid by a third party, it's irrelevant who paid him, the problem was and is that they hid it from the members
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That is enough in itself to indicate this Board is not fit for purpose. External influence on 1872 club affairs with financial incentive for Chris Graham from 3rd party but concealed from members. That’s about the worse allegation of the lot tbh. I’m a non 1872 member and not interested in any other folk in this and with no dog in the fight but I’m flabbergasted.
 
As I don't pay into Club1872, I rightly have no say in this. All I will say is the reason I never joined was because I suspected it would fall apart into in fighting and finger pointing just like every other fan organisation did. For a support who are so incredible when they unite, we have a sad recent history of being unable to agree on anything.

Trust is what holds these organisations together, and once it gets lost it's almost impossible to win back. This appears from the outside to be the latest example of the leaders losing the trust of who put them there.

Totally depressing and tragically predictable.
 
almeyda said:
Fans turning on fans and the same old faces wanting a shot at being in the limelight

Nothing changes.
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Not in this instance. Members have paid thousands of pounds to this organisation and have been ignored by the three person board.
Calling a minister of the Church of Scotland a hypocrite is not the best way to gain membership confidence.
 
Northampton Lodger said:
Sad to hear this. I have become disillusioned with club 1872 recently and got close to cancelling my direct debit earlier this week. I always thought Chris Grahm represented the fans well and was very professional on any interviews. Certainly put Spiers in his place.

Whoever puts their head above the parpet next will face the same treatmwnt.
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Not if they keep their egos under control.
 
ibroxbound said:
Not if they keep their egos under control.
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Thing is those with the egos will be trying to knock anyone in the seat off their perch.

The infighting, bitching and blazer chasing is one of the main reasons I'm not for fan ownership via a vehicle such as this.

I have my shares in Rangers itself and I vote at the AGM how I please.
 
Porto Loyal said:
Is Walter Smith tainted as he was Chairman under green?
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The difference is, it appears Smith challenged the board where as Murray seemed to hang around longer. I’d trust Kings opinion towards Murray/Smith - it’s clear how he views both individuals
 
MacaroniPie said:
If it looks like a petty squabble then that's likely because it is a petty squabble. It's not my fault if the ringleaders can't explain the purpose without tying themselves in knots or making incorrect assumptions about my identity.
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It's not a petty squabble; you're trying to turn it into one, for whatever reason. But it's not petty. C1872 has a substantial shareholding in RIFC, it's not petty at all.

I've no idea who you are, I am going to neither speculate nor assume anything, and I have to be honest I'm not sure why others are. It's irrelevant. The purpose has been explained clearly; if you refuse to acknowledge it then I'm afraid that absolutely is your fault. There is concern from a significant number of members that C1872 is beset by poor governance; not least because accusations have been made by former Directors, Directors who felt they had to resign, and the remaining Directors have done absolutely nothing to address the allegations, made no effort to deny them, offered no scrutiny.

What Robert is proposing here is exactly the right thing to do. He's calling for an EGM and calling for the members to vote on whether they have confidence in the Directors. It is, frankly, exactly what Dave King and the Three Bears did to the spivs. If the motion has the votes then it passes, if the membership are happy with the status quo then it fails.
 
Aww Skew said:
King saying much the same as some fans on the thread the other day. Malcolm Murray should be no where near any fan group given he was involved in Green’s board

He’s tainted.
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Paul Murray and Dave King were involved in David Murray's reign which ended with the club being sold to a con man for £1. Should they have been prevented from running the club?
 
PalefaceRedskin said:
That’s a very fair post.

I’ve never understood the animosity from some to Chris. He always fought our corner, spoke well and obviously played a big part in helping the good guys over the line to rid us of the spivs. I think we should be eternally grateful for that. I found the recent digs on Twitter after the publication of the CSA report (presumably aimed at David Graham) very disappointing but nobody’s perfect.

As you say though, Chris is a sideshow here. The issue is governance and if any of what Stuart McQuarrie is saying is true we really do have a problem.
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Threw toys out the pr pram when he was overlooked for the job someone far more qualified ended up getting . Then the snide social media posts started.

Wasn’t it funny how club1872 said nothing as the club and fans were being battered from pillar to post a few weeks back. They’d have loved the pressure being placed on our PR team at Ibrox. Absolutely loved it
 
Aww Skew said:
The difference is, it appears Smith challenged the board where as Murray seemed to hang around longer. I’d trust Kings opinion towards Murray/Smith - it’s clear how he views both individuals
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I'm not sure - from people I know, Murray (M) tried to do a lot to reign back the spivs and when he was getting too close to the truth they engineered him out. Dave King seems awfully close to the people running C1872, to a level that's unhealthy and this seems like an attempt to spike the candidate they don't wnat.
 
Sunnyvale_Loyal said:
Paul Murray and Dave King were involved in David Murray's reign which ended with the club being sold to a con man for £1. Should they have been prevented from running the club?
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Fair point but both lost money personally at that point. Both stood up against Green/Ahmad/Easdales etc to win back control, why didn’t Murray stand shoulder to shoulder with them?

Not heard about him in 7/8 years and all of a sudden he pops up
 
MacaroniPie said:
Going around in circles now so might as well wrap it for the night. If the club keeps issuing shares forever then that means it's in trouble. Sooner or later Club 1872 will need to buy shares on the market. The sooner we all accept that the better.
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The club can issue 7m € of shares every year. We’re a long way off C1872 buying shares on the market.
Their income had dropped 50% in5 years. It will continue to do so unless real change is affected
 
High Society said:
The club can issue 7m € of shares every year. We’re a long way off C1872 buying shares on the market.
Their income had dropped 50% in5 years. It will continue to do so unless real change is affected
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A quick look at the Club 1872 accounts would show this - pity they aren't available on the C1872 site - even for members.
 
We as a support have been here many times before. Every fan vehicle for a voice has been beset by in fighting and allegation. If such a group/shareholding exists and is classed as such, then it needs run properly as a business and overseen as such.

I would much rather see a simple situation whereby fans via DD simply pay X amount every month simply for the club to use for player transfers or running costs. No vanity projects. Running costs/player acquisition.
 
Blue Goose said:
We as a support have been here many times before. Every fan vehicle for a voice has been beset by in fighting and allegation. If such a group/shareholding exists and is classed as such, then it needs run properly as a business and overseen as such.

I would much rather see a simple situation whereby fans via DD simply pay X amount every month simply for the club to use for player transfers or running costs. No vanity projects. Running costs/player acquisition.
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That’s what I hoped MyGers would become and I definitely think there’s scope for doing so in the future

The club could easily set up such a scheme so fans can pay £ directly to the club. If they want to link it to other schemes or give benefits for being part of it then fair enough. Minimum C1872 membership was what £60 a year?

Club could easily set up DD of £5/10 a month, though they could argue fans can play pools/lotto which effectively puts £ into the club
 
Porto Loyal said:
I'm not sure - from people I know, Murray (M) tried to do a lot to reign back the spivs and when he was getting too close to the truth they engineered him out. Dave King seems awfully close to the people running C1872, to a level that's unhealthy and this seems like an attempt to spike the candidate they don't wnat.
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Or to sell his shares by exerting undue influence over 1872. Hence the lack of consultation re purchasing his shares
 
MacaroniPie said:
If it looks like a petty squabble then that's likely because it is a petty squabble. It's not my fault if the ringleaders can't explain the purpose without tying themselves in knots or making incorrect assumptions about my identity.
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The "ringleaders" want Club 1872 run by it's constitution. I believe we have explained ourselves perfectly simply - but you can always read Stuart MacQuarrie's letter to me if you wish to refresh your memory about what is currently wrong with the organisation.

No-one has made any assumptions about your identity. I've merely pointed out your posting history is rather peculiar and without much digging around it kinda points to who you are and what you are up to.
 
Cancelled my direct debit 2 days ago, after many years contributing, now will put my money towards buying my own shares.
 
Aww Skew said:
Do the board members get a salary from C1872?

If so, that’ll answer your questions above and makes more sense as to why they’re looking after their own interests
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As far as I’m aware the directors are there on a voluntary basis. I think there’s one paid employee on administration duties, I’m sure i heard Laura Fawkes say this on a podcast.
 
Porto Loyal said:
Regardless of how many people stop paying, C1872 owns a significant block of Rangers shares
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And that is the point - work by a lot of people means it controls shares and cash worth roughly £4million. We simply can't have that run by a small self-perpetuating group controlled by someone acting as a shadow director who has had the guts of club money £300,000 paid to him over the last five or so years.
 
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