A change of manager doesn't guarantee sucess

Rangerslion

Rangerslion

Well-Known Member
I'm all for Gerrard and what he has done and where he is going with us. All these change the manager threads and posts do nothing but bring the moral of the support down and they are embarrassing. You support the team through thickand thin. The good times and the bad times. These times ain't even that bad compared to some of the pish we've put up with. Yet the drama whores are out in force greeting to get Gerrard the boot and want a new manager.

First that costs a lot of money, second the new manager would want a chance to build a team (at least 3 transfer windows). Thirdly it still doesn't guarantee any success and we could be back here mumping and moaning in 2 seasons time wanting change again.

Gerrard has done a fantastic job so far. The money he has brought in from the European success has us further ahead than we could have been and you can clearly see progression. It might not be as fast as some would like but I think as soon as we got back to the premier league a lot of fans jumped back on board and wanted instant success like before.

I fully back Gerrard and I'm not for a manager merry go round every couple of seasons hoping one of them strikes it lucky. Let's just get behind the team and support them and stop all the greeting.
 
It's a joke the way some people are going on. They need to take a long hard look at themselves. It puts me off reading some threads after I've read the first few comments due to the shite they are talking. Gerrard has gave us some of the best games and results for years people have short memories.
 
This scatter gun rip it up and start again approach has to stop. I dont believe we are at the stage of needing to consider a new gaffer. The Management team are making mistakes which cannot be denied, but they have also done a lot of good work.

However, next season a collapse like what we've experienced the last two cannot be tolerated. The gaffer still has my full support, but next season domestically simply has to be better.
 
I’ve got friends who want him gone as “two seasons and no trophies is failure at rangers”.

I just shake my head and realise these guys are spoilt and deluded. There is never any credit given for Europe or looking like a team that can play cohesive football again. Nor any honey reflection about Celtics spending power in comparison to ours.
 
No, but at the same time no manager should survive failure after failure.

I don't want Gerrard sacked but if he's still not even won us a trophy by the end of next season there's no danger he can continue thereafter.
 
We are desperate for success and this will put any Rangers Manager under pressure.
I think SG is doing well, look at our European record, we were an offside goal and some shit finishing away from winning the LC.
It appeared to all of us after the OF game that we were in with a shout of the league but shit form, injuries and suspensions have costs us.
SG has made mistakes but we are progressing, I just fear that it is not at the rate that the support demands.
We need a trophy and the SC is our best option.
 
Coza said:
I’ve got friends who want him gone as “two seasons and no trophies is failure at rangers”.

I just shake my head and realise these guys are spoilt and deluded. There is never any credit given for Europe or looking like a team that can play cohesive football again. Nor any honey reflection about Celtics spending power in comparison to ours.
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Ain't that the truth mate. Those manky bastards have a better squad, more money and players used to winning when the going gets tough. We came from nothing and are trying to get back to where we are. Look at where we started with players like Kiernan, Kyle, Black, Daly etc. We've had to build a full squad from nothing to try and compete with a squad that is used to winning everything. The best managers in the world would struggle to break that cycle. I understand we all want success but some common sense and taking off the blue tinted specks wouldn't go amiss.
 
Nathan9719972 said:
Folk need to remember, we were at the bottom of Scottish football only A few years ago, success needs to be built back up, folk expected us to romp the league our first season back, we are having build the club back up from next to nothing
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Nah, the "we were playing Stirling Albion not so long ago" patter doesn't wash anymore I'm afraid.

This is now our fourth season back in the top flight. We should be at least comfortably and regularly beating the bottom 6 sides.
 
I'm rapidly losing faith in Gerrard, in my heart.

But I don't believe he's going anywhere next season so agitating for change isn't going to help. We just have to hope he gets it right next season because if he doesn't, there won't be a way back.

The real issue I have is, how prepared at we going to be for a shot at the title next year? We've signed guys like Defoe and Davis for an immediate impact. To be relying on guys like them two years later? That doesn't suggest to me we'll be any closer.
 
Jimmy Jazz said:
Nah, the "we were playing Stirling Albion not so long ago" patter doesn't wash anymore I'm afraid.

This is now our fourth season back in the top flight. We should be at least comfortably and regularly beating the bottom 6 sides.
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We smashed the tims in the cup final and battered them at the girodome, not a single manager has gotten us to a cup final or even competed with those bastards on the park for years mate. Have you forgot how bad they were beating us only a season or two ago? We are comfortably beating the bottom 6 teams as well as well as going into old firm games confident of winning. This season we have more points currently than any other season the previous 4 years, we're in Europe after Christmas for the first time in about 10 years and we got to the first cup final of the season. It hurts me just as bad as any fan when we drop points but some perspective is needed with all this instant success pish.
 
Ally Shuffle said:
We are on to what the fourth manager in six years - we gotta stick with someone. Really needs the Scottish Cup -break their stanglehold and kick on from there
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I think that's an indication of the wrong managerial appointments in the first place.

By giving the job to - yet another - a man with the same characteristics of those before, we risk Gerrard being our fifth manager in six years.

It became common to suggest that the club needed "a boost" or "a bit of a lift." It needed stability and and safety. I'd argue we're still not there with that.
 
Rangerslion said:
We smashed the tims in the cup final and battered them at the girodome, not a single manager has gotten us to a cup final or even competed with those bastards on the park for years mate. Have you forgot how bad they were beating us only a season or two ago? We are comfortably beating the bottom 6 teams as well as well as going into old firm games confident of winning. This season we have more points currently than any other season the previous 4 years, we're in Europe after Christmas for the first time in about 10 years and we got to the first cup final of the season. It hurts me just as bad as any fan when we drop points but some perspective is needed with all this instant success pish.
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Yes we did batter them in the final and beat them at their midden, but ultimately we still lost that final and find ourselves out of the title race before the end of February.

We've lost 10 points to bottom 6 teams this season, 5 of which were against bottom of the table Hearts, so we aren't regularly beating them, not regularly enough anyway.

Europe of course I'll give you, he's done an outstanding job there. But the fact quite a few of us are more confident of qualifying against Braga on Wednesday than beating Hearts on Saturday shows where we are right now.
 
What I want to see from these posters on here, is who do they want as the new manager and where the moneys coming from to compete with them financially. Dont reply with, that's up to the board. Spoke to plenty bears this week and don't hear any of this nonsence.

Good post OP, but I'm afraid there's posters on here who think god has given us the right to trophies and others, who disappeared on Thursday night about 9:45, only to return at the final whistle on sunday.
 
Jimmy Jazz said:
Yes we did batter them in the final and beat them at their midden, but ultimately we still lost that final and find ourselves out of the title race before the end of February.

We've lost 10 points to bottom 6 teams this season, 5 of which were against bottom of the table Hearts, so we aren't regularly beating them, not regularly enough anyway.

Europe of course I'll give you, he's done an outstanding job there. But the fact quite a few of us are more confident of qualifying against Braga on Wednesday than beating Hearts on Saturday shows where we are right now.
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We have a boggy team every season, it's been Killie, Aberdeen, now this season it looks like Hearts. Take Hearts out of the equation and it's only 5 points to the bottom 6 teams. We're not going to go through a full season without dropping points anyway. If you put all 4 seasons we've been back on a graph the trajectory is going up the way not down. It may not be going up the way as fast as some people would like but consistent improvement is there and we are going the right way.
 
Gerrards going nowhere and the people that want gone aren’t worth talking about.
Fully trust him to replace the players who have continually let him down and have a better bench for next season.
 
Renfrew@UKGB&NI said:
What I want to see from these posters on here, is who do they want as the new manager and where the moneys coming from to compete with them financially. Dont reply with, that's up to the board. Spoke to plenty bears this week and don't hear any of this nonsence.

Good post OP, but I'm afraid there's posters on here who think god has given us the right to trophies and others, who disappeared on Thursday night about 9:45, only to return at the final whistle on sunday.
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Exactly mate, they've got all the opinions under the sun about why we should sack Gerrard and not a single opinion on who to replace him with or where we get the cash to compete financially or build a new team for a new manager. We're all pissed off we dropped points but I guarantee the same ones shouting sack him will be blowing smoke up his arse if we win the last 2 old firm games and win the Scottish cup.
 
Coza said:
I’ve got friends who want him gone as “two seasons and no trophies is failure at rangers”.

I just shake my head and realise these guys are spoilt and deluded. There is never any credit given for Europe or looking like a team that can play cohesive football again. Nor any honey reflection about Celtics spending power in comparison to ours.
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I replied to one on twitter yesterday who used the 2 seasons no trophies requires sacking re Klopp at the start and Pochettino etc funnily enough he never replied again.

No one is happy at present I get it but to continually change managers and effectively start again gets you know where fast and is a very expensive business binning a management team and a lot of players for some new face who might not do any better. We cannot afford to keep doing that.

SG is a new manager and he needs to learn and learn fast that we need to be able to change our style of play depending on who we are playing but Jesus our last big move before him was for McInnes. I'll take my chances with that we have in place at present.
 
Ggirl said:
I replied to one on twitter yesterday who used the 2 seasons no trophies requires sacking re Klopp at the start and Pochettino etc funnily enough he never replied again.

No one is happy at present I get it but to continually change managers and effectively start again gets you know where fast and is a very expensive business binning a management team and a lot of players for some new face who might not do any better. We cannot afford to keep doing that.

SG is a new manager and he needs to learn and learn fast that we need to be able to change our style of play depending on who we are playing but Jesus our last big move before him was for McInnes. I'll take my chances with that we have in place at present.
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Klopp had won numerous trophies with Dortmund and Poch was a success elsewhere, notably at Southampton. Rangers have taken another punt on a manager who is learning on the job. Our club is being a testing board for up and coming managers who need to learn how to sink or swim. Unlike Spurs or Liverpool we have less data to go on, and the data from this year, in the league at least, does not make good reading.
 
ClockworkOrange said:
Klopp had won numerous trophies with Dortmund and Poch was a success elsewhere, notably at Southampton. Rangers have taken another punt on a manager who is learning on the job. Our club is being a testing board for up and coming managers who need to learn how to sink or swim. Unlike Spurs or Liverpool we have less data to go on, and the data from this year, in the league at least, does not make good reading.
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Our club is not being a testing board for up and coming managers ffs. That's a laughable statement.
 
I’d say the most worrying thing is that I think he has lost his hunger for the job. When he came he was full of vigour but he looks broken now
 
Rangerslion said:
Our club is not being a testing board for up and coming managers ffs. That's a laughable statement.
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McCoist - first job.
Warburton - third season as a manager. Third. One of which was in League One.
Murty, twice - youth team coach.
Pedro - a series of fairly short spells with Portuguese and Mexican teams. No tangible link to the club at all.
Gerrard - first season as manager.

We will look back on this period in ten, fifteen years time and ask why the board weren't more familiar with the definition of insanity.
 
Ggirl said:
I replied to one on twitter yesterday who used the 2 seasons no trophies requires sacking re Klopp at the start and Pochettino etc funnily enough he never replied again.

No one is happy at present I get it but to continually change managers and effectively start again gets you know where fast and is a very expensive business binning a management team and a lot of players for some new face who might not do any better. We cannot afford to keep doing that.

SG is a new manager and he needs to learn and learn fast that we need to be able to change our style of play depending on who we are playing but Jesus our last big move before him was for McInnes. I'll take my chances with that we have in place at present.
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You're not comparing like for like.EPL against 1 of the worst top flight leagues as a whole in Europe (results from rest of SPFL outwith us and them back this up in Europe)People can polish a turd all they want no trophies in 2 season in the domestic competitions we play in is failure.I don't think it's being unrealistic or too demanding to expect us to beat teams like Kilmarnock and St.Johnstone.We maybe had up to half dozen players on the park that will get more in a week than most teams we play starting 11s combined.Will be the same most weeks against the teams we play.
Gerrard wins nothing this season then serious questions should be getting asked.
 
There's a middle ground between blindly supporting him, and wanting rid of him.

I am happy enough for him to stay, but I also want him to stop publicly criticizing his players.
 
anyone who says we need to sack SG and get a new manger, at this time, doesn't have the interests of the club at heart.

We have improved vastly each year, we were unlucky not to win the SLCF due to refereeing decisions. We have VASTLY outstripped any European expectations 2 years in a row.

Starting again is not the answer, and getting in now with daft opinions is A) Knee Jerk or B) Wanting to say 'i told you so' or C) a 'concern troll'
 
ClockworkOrange said:
Klopp had won numerous trophies with Dortmund and Poch was a success elsewhere, notably at Southampton. Rangers have taken another punt on a manager who is learning on the job. Our club is being a testing board for up and coming managers who need to learn how to sink or swim. Unlike Spurs or Liverpool we have less data to go on, and the data from this year, in the league at least, does not make good reading.
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Every appointment is a gamble and no manager would be absolutely certain of being successful. When we appointed PLG for example was widely touted as the best young manager in Europe and he turned out to be a failure.
 
ClockworkOrange said:
McCoist - first job.
Warburton - third season as a manager. Third. One of which was in League One.
Murty, twice - youth team coach.
Pedro - a series of fairly short spells with Portuguese and Mexican teams. No tangible link to the club at all.
Gerrard - first season as manager.

We will look back on this period in ten, fifteen years time and ask why the board weren't more familiar with the definition of insanity.
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McCoist - Assistant manager to our greatest ever manager and stepping up was a natural progression (on paper).

Warburton - Was already a manager, irrelevant.

Murty - Was only given the job because of how bad Warburton left us in short notice.

Pedro - Was already a manager, irrelevant.

Gerrard - First season as manager, yes he qualifies.

You're clutching at straws mate but thanks for playing.
 
WinkieWATP said:
Every appointment is a gamble and no manager would be absolutely certain of being successful. When we appointed PLG for example was widely touted as the best young manager in Europe and he turned out to be a failure.
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This line is still be trotted out as an excuse for taking more of a gamble than was neccessary. It's becoming tiring.

Manchester City took a gamble in appointing the greatest manager of the last ten years. It was a considerable smaller gamble than it would have been in appointing an unknown quantity.

PLG was a great move and it didn't work. In hindsight he had a small data sample and was achieving success with a team the equivalent of PSG nowadays.
 
I think that the ones braying the loudest to get rid of SG are manky timposters who have sneaked on here under the guise of being Rangers fans.. Yes, we haven't won anything since he came in but if it wasn't for dodgy refereeing we would have won the League Cup and at least two more games this year.

All I can say, is give it a rest and it is high time that this website is cleaned out.
 
Rangerslion said:
Alright mate we're an



McCoist - Assistant manager to our greatest ever manager and stepping up was a natural progression (on paper).

Warburton - Was already a manager, irrelevant.

Murty - Was only given the job because of how bad Warburton left us in short notice.

Pedro - Was already a manager, irrelevant.

Gerrard - First season as manager, yes he qualifies.

You're clutching at straws mate but thanks for playing.
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*Checks own posts again*

*Confirms what I thought I'd said: that I mentioned "up and coming" and not "totally new"*

*Laughs at the idea that our poor managerial appointment history is somehow evidence of "clutching at straws."*
 
ClockworkOrange said:
McCoist - first job.
Warburton - third season as a manager. Third. One of which was in League One.
Murty, twice - youth team coach.
Pedro - a series of fairly short spells with Portuguese and Mexican teams. No tangible link to the club at all.
Gerrard - first season as manager.

We will look back on this period in ten, fifteen years time and ask why the board weren't more familiar with the definition of insanity.
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There is no sure way to guarantee success but there are sure ways to limit your chance of success,
the above named is a sure way to limit your chance of success.
The time and money wasted on this journey is appalling, made more painful due to it being self inflicted mistakes and has no end in sight!
 
I have been one of his biggest critics - I feel his tactics and stubborness to change formations have cost us massively in the league.

He really does need to learn and fast. Its inconcievable to think that 75% of Rangers supporters know whats wrong but he doesnt. He must surely know he needs to change this.

He will get to next season for me - irrespective if he wins a trophy this season or not. Agreed we cant chop and change every season but you can only be happy for so long if there are no changes. Bringing in another manager would be too detrimental for next season I think.

He's given us some of the best Euro nights in a long time - so its not all bad. But a good manager will adjust every game dependant on the opponent. I havent seen much difference in the way we have played under him. I also think his experienced coaching staff should be helping or guiding him a bit more.

Next Season will be make or break. If he doesnt hit the ground running he could be gone by Christmas (at least no more winter break to Dubai then :p)
 
DC Anchor said:
There is no way sure way to guarantee success but there are sure ways to limit your chance of success,
the above named is a sure way to limit your chance of success.
The time and money wasted on this journey is appalling, made more painful due to it being self inflicted mistakes and has no end in sight!
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The "every manager is a gamble" line gets me every time.

My 85 year old next door neighbour would be a gamble. Pep Guardiola would be a gamble. I wonder which of these are less of a gamble?
 
ClockworkOrange said:
The "every manager is a gamble" line gets me every time.

My 85 year old next door neighbour would be a gamble. Pep Guardiola would be a gamble. I wonder which of these are less of a gamble?
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You’ve mentioned Poch, Klopp and Pep. What about naming some realistic people that would have been interested in taking the job at the time when Gerrard was appointed?

Names that were linked at the time were Rowett sacked by Stoke since and Pardew with years of being a manager under his belt but other than taking Palace to an FA cup final has been less than great.
 
Chris01 said:
I have been one of his biggest critics - I feel his tactics and stubborness to change formations have cost us massively in the league.

He really does need to learn and fast. Its inconcievable to think that 75% of Rangers supporters know whats wrong but he doesnt. He must surely know he needs to change this.

He will get to next season for me - irrespective if he wins a trophy this season or not. Agreed we cant chop and change every season but you can only be happy for so long if there are no changes. Bringing in another manager would be too detrimental for next season I think.

He's given us some of the best Euro nights in a long time - so its not all bad. But a good manager will adjust every game dependant on the opponent. I havent seen much difference in the way we have played under him. I also think his experienced coaching staff should be helping or guiding him a bit more.

Next Season will be make or break. If he doesnt hit the ground running he could be gone by Christmas (at least no more winter break to Dubai then :p)
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Sensible.I've been very critical of him on here I still think serious questions should be asked by board at the end of the season if we end up with nothing again.
Domestically it's a more expensive Warburton team for me with same mistakes time and again with no sign of him learning.Same things Warburton got dogs abuse for.
Some on here seem to take it as a personal insult if some actually question him or wonder that he's maybe not going to be the man to do what we need.I think there's mounting evidence to say he's not and I don't think it's unreasonable to think that.
 
WinkieWATP said:
You’ve mentioned Poch, Klopp and Pep. What about naming some realistic people that would have been interested in taking the job at the time when Gerrard was appointed?

Names that were linked at the time were Rowett sacked by Stoke since and Pardew with years of being a manager under his belt but other than taking Palace to an FA cup final has been less than great.
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The board's handling, scouting and dismissal of managers has been absolutely abysmal. The Warburton fall-out, Murty stepping in, the appointment of Pedro, the sacking of Pedro, McInnes turning us down, Murty taking over again, Murty being sacked and then a former Cowdenbeath manager taking over - it was absolutely dire, so I'm not confident at all in their ability to find a manager with what I regard as the prerequisite characteristics that the club required/requires.

Though I'm ultimately still ambivalent about Gerrard, I think recruiting in the first place was a massive coup and a reminder of what a massive club we are; I'm sure the calibre of similarly interested candidates would have been very high.
 
ClockworkOrange said:
Klopp had won numerous trophies with Dortmund and Poch was a success elsewhere, notably at Southampton. Rangers have taken another punt on a manager who is learning on the job. Our club is being a testing board for up and coming managers who need to learn how to sink or swim. Unlike Spurs or Liverpool we have less data to go on, and the data from this year, in the league at least, does not make good reading.
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I understand that but not within the new criteria that seems now to be flying about. SG is a new manger so we had nothing to go on but sadly in our position I don't see how we are ever going to afford a big name and even if we could why would they come here instead of England where the opposition and money available is far more tempting.

I just think the mentality of success in 2 seasons or your are out is not one we can work with especially considering where we started and our current financial position.

That being said he will need to improve and find some success as no silverware is not acceptable long term.
 
Unless we get a goal early we struggle to win most of our games but have been able to rely on Morelos. Since the 29th we haven't looked like we can score at all apart from moments of magic from Arfield or Hagi.

After a certain point in the game the opposition settle their nerves and camp in their half and we appear to have no answers whatsoever.

We've proven in Europe that we have quality players but the inability to create anything in the domestic games is quite concerning. The only time since Hibs away where we not only looked comfortable but dominant was when we brought Kamberi on and then we changed it back.
 
Hopefully Dave King has the resolve to keep Steven Gerrard as manager come what may the rest of this season and whatever happens next season.SG needs to be ruthless replacing the players responsible for the team losing 10 pts from a winning position in the last 13 league games.
 
ClockworkOrange said:
The board's handling, scouting and dismissal of managers has been absolutely abysmal. The Warburton fall-out, Murty stepping in, the appointment of Pedro, the sacking of Pedro, McInnes turning us down, Murty taking over again, Murty being sacked and then a former Cowdenbeath manager taking over - it was absolutely dire, so I'm not confident at all in their ability to find a manager with what I regard as the prerequisite characteristics that the club required/requires.

Though I'm ultimately still ambivalent about Gerrard, I think recruiting in the first place was a massive coup and a reminder of what a massive club we are; I'm sure the calibre of similarly interested candidates would have been very high.
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The appointment of Pedro was the most random and reckless appointments in the club's history, the board were lucky that they had so much goodwill in the bank to get over it.
 
bar72bear said:
I’d say the most worrying thing is that I think he has lost his hunger for the job. When he came he was full of vigour but he looks broken now
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I get this feeling now as well,he looks a different Gerrard to the one that arrived,just my gut feeling but there's something not right behind the scenes
 
The problem at the moment is that Gerrard's tactics have been found out. Everyone in the league now knows what our starting 11 will be and how we'll approach the match, and how to counter it - very effectively.

Gerrard needs to avoid the managerial pitfall of being too damn stubborn to change it up, because plenty are getting sick of the same old formation and tactics that don't work against SPL sides. If a team is going to attack us, we look pretty good, hence the European and Old Firm matches. But if they sit in, defend deep, time waste, etc, we need to try something different.
 
Rangerslion said:
It's a joke the way some people are going on. They need to take a long hard look at themselves. It puts me off reading some threads after I've read the first few comments due to the shite they are talking. Gerrard has gave us some of the best games and results for years people have short memories.
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This is exactly the problem. Short lived memories.

It's basically people who expected us to get back into the top tier and instantly start challenging. It was never going to be that easy I'm afraid

Until we stop improving under Gerrard and we haven't so far then we should stick by him to do us right no matter how long it takes.
 
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