Another Win For Under 18’s

The Huguenot

Well-Known Member
Turning these players into first team footballers is difficult. I can remember Billy Davis being outstanding every game for the reserves but was unable to step up to the first team. Reserve football was his level. Being a good youngster doesn't guarantee that you will become a good player at the top level. But we only need 1 a season.
 

happydays

Active Member
I think he is the best of our kids and I hope we don’t allow what happened with Gilmour to happen to him. Get him on a contract as soon as possible.
Intrigued by this bearing in mind he was on the bench last night due to a dip in form. Have you watched his games this season?
 

happydays

Active Member
Lowry has been fantastic this season so far.
Again how many of the 18's games have you seen this season? Alex is a good player, but my goodness needs a lot of development if he is to nail down a starting place in a strong 18's this season. Please don't over hype these boys who just need to be left to develop without additional pressure.
 

Dotty_84

Active Member
Again how many of the 18's games have you seen this season? Alex is a good player, but my goodness needs a lot of development if he is to nail down a starting place in a strong 18's this season. Please don't over hype these boys who just need to be left to develop without additional pressure.
Just a bit of praise, I don't have insane expectations of these lads but when we see them score in a run of games it's only right to lay praise at their door.
 

happydays

Active Member
Just a bit of praise, I don't have insane expectations of these lads but when we see them score in a run of games it's only right to lay praise at their door.
Alex came on last night when the game had opened up and Hearts had a number of younger boys on the pitch. He is a talented boy but has been massively over hyped.
Hearts push their youngsters to play up and develop and put out a very young side last night. Rangers have far too many boys by comparison at each age group and that is a very short sighted policy moving forward.
At U18 level Rangers already have more than 20 boys and are about to sign at least another 3. Bear in mind that if Rangers played all their under 18's (cup games) Alex would struggle to get on the bench.
We are only in September and already boys and their parents are complaining about a lack of game time. That situation will get worse as the season goes on.

I dread to think what the budget is and how it is being justified, bearing in mind just about all of these boys are young professionals.
 

Yankeeger

Well-Known Member
Alex came on last night when the game had opened up and Hearts had a number of younger boys on the pitch. He is a talented boy but has been massively over hyped.
Hearts push their youngsters to play up and develop and put out a very young side last night. Rangers have far too many boys by comparison at each age group and that is a very short sighted policy moving forward.
At U18 level Rangers already have more than 20 boys and are about to sign at least another 3. Bear in mind that if Rangers played all their under 18's (cup games) Alex would struggle to get on the bench.
We are only in September and already boys and their parents are complaining about a lack of game time. That situation will get worse as the season goes on.

I dread to think what the budget is and how it is being justified, bearing in mind just about all of these boys are young professionals.

Hearts are obviously seeing things differently when it comes to development which seems successful
 

Ranger1003

Well-Known Member
My mate takes hearts 18s and the ages of boys he plays is unreal. They played Killie last game last season and he literally had kids playing because 9 of his team were away with the 1st team. It's incredible
 

Yankeeger

Well-Known Member
Alex came on last night when the game had opened up and Hearts had a number of younger boys on the pitch. He is a talented boy but has been massively over hyped.
Hearts push their youngsters to play up and develop and put out a very young side last night. Rangers have far too many boys by comparison at each age group and that is a very short sighted policy moving forward.
At U18 level Rangers already have more than 20 boys and are about to sign at least another 3. Bear in mind that if Rangers played all their under 18's (cup games) Alex would struggle to get on the bench.
We are only in September and already boys and their parents are complaining about a lack of game time. That situation will get worse as the season goes on.

I dread to think what the budget is and how it is being justified, bearing in mind just about all of these boys are young professionals.

Mark Allan to blame for this ?
 

tazzabear

Well-Known Member
Alex came on last night when the game had opened up and Hearts had a number of younger boys on the pitch. He is a talented boy but has been massively over hyped.
Hearts push their youngsters to play up and develop and put out a very young side last night. Rangers have far too many boys by comparison at each age group and that is a very short sighted policy moving forward.
At U18 level Rangers already have more than 20 boys and are about to sign at least another 3. Bear in mind that if Rangers played all their under 18's (cup games) Alex would struggle to get on the bench.
We are only in September and already boys and their parents are complaining about a lack of game time. That situation will get worse as the season goes on.

I dread to think what the budget is and how it is being justified, bearing in mind just about all of these boys are young professionals.
Are the Rangers coaches not doing just that?
Players playing a stage, a year, ahead of their own?
 

Coops2016

Active Member
My view is there are too many players and not enough football . Some of these boys in that squad are lucky if they are getting 15 mins game time . I think the standouts in that group are the older boys and Dickson being the top . Lowry for me has a long long way to go . Back off and let them develop.
Interesting that Hearts seem to have a different out look and carrying smaller squads to encourage development

Part of the problem for all clubs is the absolutely stupid SFA who did away with the 17’s age group . There are boys at 15 expected to compete with 18 year olds for game time and development time . It’s crazy
 

Gecekondu

Well-Known Member
Having watched a few of the u18 games this season young Umaro Balde was a stand out. Could be the first foreign signing weve made at that level in years who has a chance of making it.

Technically very good and never gives the ball away but really aggressive which is needed in Scotland and going by whats been said has a great attitude
 

Yankeeger

Well-Known Member
My view is there are too many players and not enough football . Some of these boys in that squad are lucky if they are getting 15 mins game time . I think the standouts in that group are the older boys and Dickson being the top . Lowry for me has a long long way to go . Back off and let them develop.
Interesting that Hearts seem to have a different out look and carrying smaller squads to encourage development

Part of the problem for all clubs is the absolutely stupid SFA who did away with the 17’s age group . There are boys at 15 expected to compete with 18 year olds for game time and development time . It’s crazy

Could be just one of a number of reasons Mark Allan left , how can he sell the club to a player when club has too many players plus no track record of 1st team involvement
 

happydays

Active Member
Mark Allan to blame for this ?
Don't know, but I don't think so. He did say he left Man City due to a perceived lack of pathway for the boys he was in charge of producing.

The academy management seem to be the driving force (as you'd expect) who seem to want to win every game. They aim to be the most successful academy in Europe. Nothing wrong with that, but surely success should be judged by the number of players being developed for starting places in the first team at a competitive level?

For the last two seasons Hearts have fielded a number of youngsters in their first team for the penultimate games of the season. That is to be congratulated.
 

Ranger1003

Well-Known Member
Don't know, but I don't think so. He did say he left Man City due to a perceived lack of pathway for the boys he was in charge of producing.

The academy management seem to be the driving force (as you'd expect) who seem to want to win every game. They aim to be the most successful academy in Europe. Nothing wrong with that, but surely success should be judged by the number of players being developed for starting places in the first team at a competitive level?

For the last two seasons Hearts have fielded a number of youngsters in their first team for the penultimate games of the season. That is to be congratulated.

Can you imagine a poor 16 year old playing at Ibrox with the support we have???
 

coplandrearl36

Well-Known Member
Official Ticketer
Don't know, but I don't think so. He did say he left Man City due to a perceived lack of pathway for the boys he was in charge of producing.

The academy management seem to be the driving force (as you'd expect) who seem to want to win every game. They aim to be the most successful academy in Europe. Nothing wrong with that, but surely success should be judged by the number of players being developed for starting places in the first team at a competitive level?

For the last two seasons Hearts have fielded a number of youngsters in their first team for the penultimate games of the season. That is to be congratulated.
It’s also why they are bottom of the league.
To compare Rangers with Hearts in relation to progress to 1st team is difficult.
Look at young Cochrane, he broke through, overplayed and now suffers niggling injuries resulting in poor form at times.
Pressure on Rangers youth far outstrips that of other clubs, it’s being able to handle that which is difficult, look at the full internationals who cannot wear the Rangers shirt or handle the pressure.
McCrorie is another example, he played some great games yet other games passes him by, but he has shown he can play in big games. He needs a run of games that’s why Portsmouth loan might just be the making of him.
 

Yankeeger

Well-Known Member
Don't know, but I don't think so. He did say he left Man City due to a perceived lack of pathway for the boys he was in charge of producing.

The academy management seem to be the driving force (as you'd expect) who seem to want to win every game. They aim to be the most successful academy in Europe. Nothing wrong with that, but surely success should be judged by the number of players being developed for starting places in the first team at a competitive level?

For the last two seasons Hearts have fielded a number of youngsters in their first team for the penultimate games of the season. That is to be congratulated.


Winning games over development isn’t the way to become the most successful academy in Europe
We must be bottom of any table when it comes to development of youth academy players
 

elfideldo

Well-Known Member
Alex is a decent player and could be a prospect but to compare him with Billy Gilmore is nonsense.

We do have too many players at Under 18 unless there are plans to play enough games to give them game time. It was the same last season and there is picture of that squad in reception, by the turn off the year a dozen from that squad had left.
 

Greg Marshall

Well-Known Member
Alex came on last night when the game had opened up and Hearts had a number of younger boys on the pitch. He is a talented boy but has been massively over hyped.
Hearts push their youngsters to play up and develop and put out a very young side last night. Rangers have far too many boys by comparison at each age group and that is a very short sighted policy moving forward.
At U18 level Rangers already have more than 20 boys and are about to sign at least another 3. Bear in mind that if Rangers played all their under 18's (cup games) Alex would struggle to get on the bench.
We are only in September and already boys and their parents are complaining about a lack of game time. That situation will get worse as the season goes on.

I dread to think what the budget is and how it is being justified, bearing in mind just about all of these boys are young professionals.
Alex Lowry is 16 and doing well to be involved with the 18s - don’t need to over hype our lads but also don’t need to put down their achievements.
 

queensferrybear

Active Member
Hearts are in a situation where they are not going to win anything but won’t be anywhere near the relegation spots (normally). Finishing in the Europe spots is as high as they can achieve. It therefore is very easy for young players to be played and given lots of game time throughout a season with little pressure on them. The hearts fans no they can’t win and normally can’t be relegated so take their joy from watching academy prospects playing in the first team.

We don’t have that luxury or patience with players, and rightly so, we have expectations and dropping silly points could become extremely costly for us.

We then can’t view what hearts do with youth in the same way, if we can give 2 or 3 boys 15 minutes here and there and maybe a bit more cup time is all we can realistically hope for and that will be a success.
 

Valley Bluenose

Well-Known Member
Are the Rangers coaches not doing just that?
Players playing a stage, a year, ahead of their own?
That was/is my understanding as well. We seem to always have kids an age group below playing in our teams, eg u18s in the Dev Squad, u17s in the u18 squad, u16s in the u17/18 squad.
 

Valley Bluenose

Well-Known Member
Don't know, but I don't think so. He did say he left Man City due to a perceived lack of pathway for the boys he was in charge of producing.

The academy management seem to be the driving force (as you'd expect) who seem to want to win every game. They aim to be the most successful academy in Europe. Nothing wrong with that, but surely success should be judged by the number of players being developed for starting places in the first team at a competitive level?

For the last two seasons Hearts have fielded a number of youngsters in their first team for the penultimate games of the season. That is to be congratulated.
I will put my hands up and say I’ve only been keeping a closer eye on our Academy kids for the last 18 months to 2 years. Virtually everything you’ve said on this thread is at odds with my understanding of how it’s working. We regularly play kids at least an age group up. We risk losing games by doing so but do it to aid development. We withdrew from the Reserve League last season to play a series of what were effectively friendly matches around Europe, again to aid development, and again dispelling the notion that we put more store in winning than developing the kids.

The simple fact is it is easier for a kid to breakthrough at Hearts, for example, due to the lack of cash for first team players and the lack of expectation of success. A couple of seasons ago Harry Cochrane was the bright young thing of Scottish football and looked an excellent prospect. They brought him into the first team, overplayed him, that led to injury and he’s barely featured in the last 18 months. Have they ‘broken’ a kid who looked destined for much bigger things by bringing him through too early and too often?
 

Yankeeger

Well-Known Member
I will put my hands up and say I’ve only been keeping a closer eye on our Academy kids for the last 18 months to 2 years. Virtually everything you’ve said on this thread is at odds with my understanding of how it’s working. We regularly play kids at least an age group up. We risk losing games by doing so but do it to aid development. We withdrew from the Reserve League last season to play a series of what were effectively friendly matches around Europe, again to aid development, and again dispelling the notion that we put more store in winning than developing the kids.

The simple fact is it is easier for a kid to breakthrough at Hearts, for example, due to the lack of cash for first team players and the lack of expectation of success. A couple of seasons ago Harry Cochrane was the bright young thing of Scottish football and looked an excellent prospect. They brought him into the first team, overplayed him, that led to injury and he’s barely featured in the last 18 months. Have they ‘broken’ a kid who looked destined for much bigger things by bringing him through too early and too often?

Hearts aren’t short of cash
 

Yankeeger

Well-Known Member
They aren’t short of transfer cash in comparison to East Fife I agree. In comparison to transfer cash available at Ibrox they are paupers. All relative.
So your really saying the more money a club has means they can spend big and ignore there academy players
 

Valley Bluenose

Well-Known Member
So your really saying the more money a club has means they can spend big and ignore there academy players
I’m saying that can and does happen. Taking it away from the partisan support of our own team, look at the likes of Chelsea and Man City for a lack of youngsters. In fairness, some other top teams are more willing to give the kids a chance - Liverpool and Man Utd for example. Overall though, if a team have the resources to bring in what they see as the finished article then they will do so ahead of promoting youth.

Please note I’ve not said that’s the right (or wrong!) way to do it, simply that it’s what happens.
 

elfideldo

Well-Known Member
Are the Rangers coaches not doing just that?
Players playing a stage, a year, ahead of their own?
This is a bit of a myth, there are not that many who play a year up.

U18 is a dual age group, so all U17's are part of the U18 squad. One U16 is a regular in this squad, a couple of others have made cameo appearances.

One U15 plays regularly at U16, with another two stepping up on occasions.

Two U14's have been playing at U15''s

A few U13's have played at U14's, seems to be more on a rotation, with two or three at any one time.
 

Valley Bluenose

Well-Known Member
This is a bit of a myth, there are not that many who play a year up.

U18 is a dual age group, so all U17's are part of the U18 squad. One U16 is a regular in this squad, a couple of others have made cameo appearances.

One U15 plays regularly at U16, with another two stepping up on occasions.

Two U14's have been playing at U15''s

A few U13's have played at U14's, seems to be more on a rotation, with two or three at any one time.
Thanks for clarifying mate.
 

Yankeeger

Well-Known Member
This is a bit of a myth, there are not that many who play a year up.

U18 is a dual age group, so all U17's are part of the U18 squad. One U16 is a regular in this squad, a couple of others have made cameo appearances.

One U15 plays regularly at U16, with another two stepping up on occasions.

Two U14's have been playing at U15''s

A few U13's have played at U14's, seems to be more on a rotation, with two or three at any one time.


What’s your opinion on how the club think of development is it win at all cost or development
 

tazzabear

Well-Known Member
This is a bit of a myth, there are not that many who play a year up.

U18 is a dual age group, so all U17's are part of the U18 squad. One U16 is a regular in this squad, a couple of others have made cameo appearances.

One U15 plays regularly at U16, with another two stepping up on occasions.

Two U14's have been playing at U15''s

A few U13's have played at U14's, seems to be more on a rotation, with two or three at any one time.
Thanks for that.
Kevin Thomson wasn’t the first person I heard this from but he definitely did say something along those lines.
Not that every player played up an age but, I inferred he meant most.
 

elfideldo

Well-Known Member
Thanks for that.
Kevin Thomson wasn’t the first person I heard this from but he definitely did say something along those lines.
Not that every player played up an age but, I inferred he meant most.
I can assure you what I have said is accurate, i watch these age groups on a weekly basis.

U18's on Friday - Full 18 man squad all U17's and 18's ( Starting XI- 7 x U18's & 4 x U17's). Hearts had 3 x U16's in their starting XI.

U14's on Wed - 2 x U13's involved neither started.

Last weekend 13's - 1 x U12 who started.
14's - 3 x U13 two who started
15's - 2 x U14 started
16's - 1 x U15 & 1 x U14 in squad

This is typical of most weeks.

We have played whole teams up a year against perceived weaker opposition but this once or twice a season at age groups up to U13.
 

elfideldo

Well-Known Member
Will we see any make step up to 1st team soon ?
Its difficult, when you see relatively experienced players like ,Middleton and Hastie going out on loan, and a few likely candidates also going out on loan. There are one or two not away on loan who could push on. But Lewis May/Rhys Breen now have four centre backs ahead of them, Jamie Barjonas has a host of midfielders, perhaps Dapo Mebude who has less competition, but I hope nothing happens to Alfrerdo or Defoe.

A few are now on their next stage of development by going out on loan. They have to make a success of these loans and early signs are things are going well.
 

R.W.B.

Active Member
Official Ticketer
I was there on a Friday night for he first time in a while and really enjoyed he game, I usually watch boys club (grandsons) so it’s good to see the Under 18’s as it’s obviously a different standard, I’ve also been following the career of one of our under 18’s from his boys club before he stepped up to pro-youth etc so looking forward to more Under 18’s games.
 

Coops2016

Active Member
I can assure you what I have said is accurate, i watch these age groups on a weekly basis.

U18's on Friday - Full 18 man squad all U17's and 18's ( Starting XI- 7 x U18's & 4 x U17's). Hearts had 3 x U16's in their starting XI.

U14's on Wed - 2 x U13's involved neither started.

Last weekend 13's - 1 x U12 who started.
14's - 3 x U13 two who started
15's - 2 x U14 started
16's - 1 x U15 & 1 x U14 in squad

This is typical of most weeks.

We have played whole teams up a year against perceived weaker opposition but this once or twice a season at age groups up to U13.
So Hearts had 3 players out of 10 a full age group younger than our boys . What’s your thoughts on if this is good or not ?
 
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