Arbritration

[Carsons Army]

Lets stop beating around the bush.

If the Arbitrators find that Dundee 1st vote stands, OR, Hearts have to go back to CoS on this legal point and its found in their favour, then.

Relegation is illegal on the motion that was used.

CoS will work on legal grounds and IMO it may well come back to court.

On the motion, the SPFL voted on means without relegation there is no promotion, it is invalid. And the point that all mhedia are terrified about. That legality means Celtic can be challenged regarding being declared champions.

Courts work with facts, not what they wish for. Hearts, Stranraer and Thistle were not relegated. Hence Hearts QC using the word demoted. Cove, Raith and Dundee United know this, hence them fighting tooth and nail for documents not to be released alongside the SPFL QC. Srange that eh? They wanted it thrown out as they know as much!

And the premier league club who will be having an invoice sent to them as they lost their case (promotion clubs argument). Well they know the 9 in a row can be challenged. It was not legal IMO,

 

[jweebear]

If there was a compensation order to be paid out to Hearts and PT from the proceeds of the SKY deal, or any other community pot. I think that's where our club could step in and argue against the SPFL from paying our share, especially after our warnings and vote for an independent inquiry, that might stand up in Court?

 

[okbear]

If there was a compensation ordered to paid out to Hearts and PT from the proceeds of the SKY deal, or any other community pot. I think that's where our club could step in and argue against the SPFL from paying our share, especially after our warnings and vote for an independent inquiry, that might stand up in Court?

That's why I've "suggested" that we need to know if any previous money was held back.

The money that was crucial to finishing the season as it stood so as ALL payments could be made to help clubs through the pandemic.

The compensation will not be near £8M or £2M, but whatever the total becomes, the source of that payment needs to be made clear.

 

[Arminius]

Based upon no legal expertise whatsoever, and only upon my recent experience of observing Scottish Football governance, I confidently predict that nothing will come of this.

SFA “independent” arbitration will find in SPFL favour, Hearts will fold squealing and Thistle are skint so they’ll fold as well.

 

[jweebear]

That's why I've "suggested" that we need to know if any previous money was held back.

The money that was crucial to finishing the season as it stood so as ALL payments could be made to help clubs through the pandemic.

The compensation will not be near £8M or £2M, but whatever the total becomes, the source of that payment needs to be made clear.

I think Doncaster said in the second interview on Talksport, when asked about if all league position monies had all been paid up to date, he said yes. Something else was said about the SPFL not having much left in the way of any funds?

 

[okbear]

I think Doncaster said in the second interview on Talksport, when asked about if all league position monies had all been paid up to date, he said yes. Something else was said about the SPFL not having much left in the way of any funds?

He did, in a few interviews.

 

[Tomted]

Would be very surprised if the SPFL QC has not already advised them to offer a financial settlement to Hearts and Thistle in the hope of avoiding arbitration.

 

[nublu2u]

The SPFL will argue that Dundee were allowed to change their vote from a No to a Yes within 28 days, so materially no change. I think where they will get found out is never declaring the resolution defeated when Dundee cast their vote (not when received, which should be entertaining under cross examination) as per SPFL rules.

 

[bearspakora]

Based upon no legal expertise whatsoever, and only upon my recent experience of observing Scottish Football governance, I confidently predict that nothing will come of this.

SFA “independent” arbitration will find in SPFL favour, Hearts will fold squealing and Thistle are skint so they’ll fold as well.

The SPFL quickly paying Deloitte to give them a clean bill of health was the red flag that went up as to serious misgovernance, imo. Doncaster and company should have went even before the Dundee vote scam. The SPFL telling lies to UEFA that member clubs wanted to end the season early before any vote was even placed before clubs was corrupt to the core. Get them out, all of them.

 

[nublu2u]

The SPFL will take compensation, if awarded, from future Sky money. Teams will be p!ssed off and blame Hearts and PT, and pundits will blame us!

 

[flootbon]

Lets stop beating around the bush.

........

That legality means Celtic can be challenged regarding being declared champions.

Courts work with facts, not what they wish for. Hearts, Stranraer and Thistle were not relegated. Hence Hearts QC using the word demoted. Cove, Raith and Dundee United know this, hence them fighting tooth and nail for documents not to be released alongside the SPFL QC. Srange that eh? They wanted it thrown out as they know as much!

And the premier league club who will be having an invoice sent to them as they lost their case (promotion clubs argument). Well they know the 9 in a row can be challenged. It was not legal IMO,

Who can challenge the legality of awarding the Championship ? A club ? A member of the public ?

 

[True blue too]

Surly UEFA must be watching and questioning Doncaster’s appointment to the ethics committee. He’s going to have to work hard to prove he’s neither corrupt nor simply incompetent. Lots of very uncomfortable conversations coming his way.

 

[Carsons Army]

Who can challenge the legality of awarding the Championship ? A club ? A member of the public ?

Whoever is the complainant can use an arbitration award as being legally binding. Its enforceable in court. So if relegation was illegal then you cant get a promotion. Technically you have not won that right. Its incomplete. And if incomplete any award could be challenged. Stranraer are not going to court. But if Arbitration set the course of action then they will benefit also. And those that have v
been prematurely awarded will have those roles reversed.

This is why we have got to this point. Everyone inc the promoted clubs have now got squeaky bums. All because of the SPFL decision makings. We are paying back millions because of these makings. There was no hunger to see the games played out to award trophies, relegate clubs and save the SPFL million. All this is on neil doncasters shoulders.

Why are we not hearing this cried loudly? Because it brings Celtics 9 in a row into dispute, Hence no journos with balls will say as is.

 

[bluestory]

Surly UEFA must be watching and questioning Doncaster’s appointment to the ethics committee. He’s going to have to work hard to prove he’s neither corrupt nor simply incompetent. Lots of very uncomfortable conversations coming his way.

UEFA will be wondering why they didnt appoint him a long time ago!

 

[jaws73]

The SPFL will argue that Dundee were allowed to change their vote from a No to a Yes within 28 days, so materially no change. I think where they will get found out is never declaring the resolution defeated when Dundee cast their vote (not when received, which should be entertaining under cross examination) as per SPFL rules.

Not only was Dundee's vote received at 4.48pm but Doncaster actually declared the results about an hour later. At the point of declaration any votes not received are assumed to be a vote against the resolution (to allow votes to be cast after a declaration just can't be valid, surely). Either way, the Resolution vote doesn't seem to be competent and that ignores what went on beforehand with the presentation of the Resolution itself.

On the face of it Doncaster has made a cu nt of it and is about to be found out but who knows what the arbitration legal eagles will make of it.

 

[temperance]

I‘ve seen this posted about a vote being required numerous times. There was no vote before they gave up the cash to Sky for unscreened games -nearer £7m than the reported £1.5m. Nor a vote for giving up circa £2.3m to BT Sport.

As far as I can gather the SPFL prize money is paid out after ‘expenses’. My guess is they would simply put any compo down to ‘expenses’. I’m happy to be corrected on that though if anybody can point me to a relevant extract of the Articles.

You are probably correct, but will the other clubs accept less money without a fight?

 

[Cambuslangger]

It still rankles with me that these SPFL crooks are still to answer for this scumbaggery. Blackmailing member clubs to end the season early was bad enough, as was the Dundee vote scam, but trying to con UEFA was sickening behaviour.

https://www.newsbreak.com/news/0OzI...luence-uefa-into-allowing-early-end-to-season

It sums up the state of our governance and the fact that the rest of the clubs just shrugged their shoulders. It's a farce and will continue to be so until the SPFL are cleared out.

 

[bearspakora]

It sums up the state of our governance and the fact that the rest of the clubs just shrugged their shoulders. It's a farce and will continue to be so until the SPFL are cleared out.

The SPFL and the SFA openly lied to UEFA that member clubs in Scotland wanted the season to be ended early. They should all have been fired on the spot, but they're still there, and the media don't wish to discuss it either.

 

[tottie beck]

You an forget about arbitration. It will end with Hearts getting a minor payout and things remaining the same.

The harsh truth is if we are ever going to grow as a club we will need to leave the Scottish set up. The game has changed dramatically in the past 20-25 years and TV money now rules the game. I think we are on the brink of big changes in the game, and it’s only a matter of time before the bigger European clubs realign themselves. If you think about it, we have as big a television potential as many of Europe’s elite but we are being massively undersold by the authorities in Scotland.

I think we need to find a way to take back control of our television revenue and find a way to market ourselves better. As things stand now I can’t see any way we would get an invite into any European Super League, yet I fancy we could muster a better global television audience than a team like Atletico. We need to find a way to prove this, and that will never happen when we are dependent on the SPFL to negotiate things on our behalf.

 

[Carsons Army]

Would be very surprised if the SPFL QC has not already advised them to offer a financial settlement to Hearts and Thistle in the hope of avoiding arbitration.

Agreed, and hopefully, their own QC has told them, why take the settlement when you are very likely to win reinstatement.

 

[Carsons Army]

The SPFL and the SFA openly lied to UEFA that member clubs in Scotland wanted the season to be ended early. They should all have been fired on the spot, but they're still there, and the media don't wish to discuss it either.

Agreed, and now we are getting the mhedia playing the violin in regards to if big bad Hearts win what they are entitled too, will mean financial problems to promoted clubs who did not earn the right to be promoted. Embarrassing.

Add this to the brushing under the carpet of the Rangers dossier when we said we could be facing 10m broadcaster penalties if we called the season early. At the time this was denied as a lie. We did not understand was the reply. Well fck me!

Again why is no one calling these lies out?

 

[Purpolaris]

Received just means arrived on the SPFL server. It doesn't mean they have conceded that it was read at that time. Its not new news.

I think the arbitration panel will rule that Dundee's original vote should have been taken as final regardless of any other circumstances which may have persuaded them to change vote.

I think the Judge wanting to know if the vote was received prior to 5.00pm is significant, whether it went into quarantine or not.

 

[flootbon]

Whoever is the complainant can use an arbitration award as being legally binding. Its enforceable in court. So if relegation was illegal then you cant get a promotion. Technically you have not won that right. Its incomplete. And if incomplete any award could be challenged. Stranraer are not going to court. But if Arbitration set the course of action then they will benefit also. And those that have v
been prematurely awarded will have those roles reversed.

This is why we have got to this point. Everyone inc the promoted clubs have now got squeaky bums. All because of the SPFL decision makings. We are paying back millions because of these makings. There was no hunger to see the games played out to award trophies, relegate clubs and save the SPFL million. All this is on neil doncasters shoulders.

Why are we not hearing this cried loudly? Because it brings Celtics 9 in a row into dispute, Hence no journos with balls will say as is.

Thanks for that. Celtic's so called title is dodgy as it stands. Any further muddying of the waters is more embarrassment.

Hope this brings the whole SPFL Executive down to the ground.

 

[jaws73]

Thanks for that. Celtic's so called title is dodgy as it stands. Any further muddying of the waters is more embarrassment.

Hope this brings the whole SPFL Executive down to the ground.

If Hearts/Partick/Stranraer 'relegation' is overturned making their 'expulsions illegal then there is more than an asterisk against Cletic's gifted title.

Do I think their title award would be rescinded? No I don't but it would nevertheless become an illegal title.

 

[robertobear]

Surly UEFA must be watching and questioning Doncaster’s appointment to the ethics committee. He’s going to have to work hard to prove he’s neither corrupt nor simply incompetent. Lots of very uncomfortable conversations coming his way.

He is a perfect fit for UEFA . He gave Peter his title and champions league money and in return Peter has opened the door for him which keeps him employed for Peter should he be ousted from SPFL.

 

[Chester Loyal]

If Hearts/Partick/Stranraer 'relegation' is overturned making their 'expulsions illegal then there is more than an asterisk against Cletic's gifted title.

Do I think their title award would be rescinded? No I don't but it would nevertheless become an illegal title.

If the relegations are overturned then Celtics title will be removed too.

The leagues would have to either be restarted or null and voided.