Bailey Rice

[JDC76]

I have run The Loudens for thirty years, I have had, over the years, thousands of ' well intended ' advice.
No matter who is telling me, I always listen and decide if it has any merits
I have watched Rangers for over fifty years and I'm the first one to say that I have never been involved in the Professional game ( as I said to Ally )
But as the years have went by I am totally convinced that we could have came through the Leagues and would have had an outstanding team made up of mainly home grown talent
We wasted some amount of money and time with players that should never have worn our Jersey

Playing dross like Kyle and Black and Daly at the expense of youth in that league was a massive mistake and I’m sure deep down Ally knows that. It was the perfect opportunity.

 

[Robert Marshall]

No offence pal but Rangers managers shouldn't and wouldn't take advice from random blokes in a pub no matter how sage the advice.

So you think no matter how good the advice is, people should ignore it?

 

[ICA_86]

He'll be in the team as soon as he's good enough to displace the players in front of him. It's really as simple as that.

The lack of a pathway thing is a myth. If you're good enough to play, you will. Where's all these talented players that couldn't make it at Rangers playing these days?

Yet you’re totally ignorant of the effect that starving players of a first team football between the ages of 16-22 can have.

The fact that not many have went on to better things could well be down to us stalling their development at a key stage. It won’t be the case for them all, but you’ve got to consider it.

 

[Robert Marshall]

Playing dross like Kyle and Black and Daly at the expense of youth in that league was a massive mistake and I’m sure deep down Ally knows that. It was the perfect opportunity.

I remember being at a night with Walter and he said that Ally would sign players to get them promoted from each division

 

[JDC76]

I remember being at a night with Walter and he said that Ally would sign players to get them promoted from each division

There would have been no issue with a blend of experienced players and youths. Ok maybe different going for SPL promotion but not the first few years. We played some amount of dross football in that time. Tried to forget it actually

 

[Robert Marshall]

There would have been no issue with a blend of experienced players and youths. Ok maybe different going for SPL promotion but not the first few years. We played some amount of dross football in that time. Tried to forget it actually

If we had brought youths through we might not have got promoted first years but I think we would have advanced through the Leagues after that, by the time we went the Top league, we would have a team of mainly 22 to 25 years old experienced players, playing together for years,

 

[Highway Star]

Get him in the team. The same old faces in midfield won't last forever. I would have him on instead of Lundstram in some games.

Lundstram has looked far more impressive than Raskin or Cifuentes in recent games.

He's looked a much superior midfielder to either of them.

 

[JDC76]

If we had brought youths through we might not have got promoted first years but I think we would have advanced through the Leagues after that, by the time we went the Top league, we would have a team of mainly 22 to 25 years old experienced players, playing together for years,

I still think we’d have got out of the 3rd division with a good mix. But if Rangers had said - look we’re building the next generation of players that will go on to play for this club for a long time then I think most fans would have accepted that.

 

[Simply a Bear]

Lundstram has looked far more impressive than Raskin or Cifuentes in recent games.

He's looked a much superior midfield to either of them.

I'm not a fan of Lundstram. For me he slows the play down too much, especially when we should be attacking teams in Scotland. I can see how useful he is in Europe though defensively.

 

[ICA_86]

If we had brought youths through we might not have got promoted first years but I think we would have advanced through the Leagues after that, by the time we went the Top league, we would have a team of mainly 22 to 25 years old experienced players, playing together for years,

We should/would have strolled at least the first two seasons with a team made up of our youths at that point.

 

[ScrabsterLoyal]

Maybe we need some kind of club policy where we bring two youth players through every year into the first team. The young players brought up the year before need to show their impact during their inaugural year - if they are presumably given a fair chance - or else they can be moved on just like any other player. Maybe they only get a one year senior team contract to start with or something like that. And then they are signed longer if they make the first year cut. So the opportunity and pressure to perform is there; they either sink or swim. That might help us attract the best young talent and also give a proper pathway up. We've got what 27/28 players first team players currently? Some of whom we would glad to see the back of and are dead weight on the bench.

(another reason why DOF continuity would be helpful as well as the shit-show we are suffering currently)

 

[BoyciesDa]

Lowry couldn't even get a run in the team 2 seasons ago when he really looked the part in his limited first team appearances.

Is this young fella no a bit of a rocket

 

[Highway Star]

I'm not a fan of Lundstram. For me he slows the play down too much, especially when we should be attacking teams in Scotland. I can see how useful he is in Europe though defensively.

He's definitely a better option in Europe than Raskin or Cifuentes.
The fact he can do the basics better, like retain possession and track opposition midfielders is a definite plus.

The midfield standards set in Europe by peak Davis, Kamara, Jack , Arfield, Lundstram and Aribo, is something that Raskin, Cifuentes and even Cantwell can only dream about so far.

The drop off in the midfield has been dramatic.

 

[RTD-BEAR]

I can’t answer your question but I would say that Leon King has surely proved that “throwing them in will ruin their career if it goes wrong” is wildly inaccurate.

For all we are a tough crowd, we seem capable enough of understanding that young players deserve more than one or two spells to prove their worth.

Defenders to an extent need more game time and experience in the 5 at Liverpool he did reasonable well at home against Liverpool he was to really drawn to the ball leading gaps they exploited easily

You defenders need an experienced player next to then he was very unfortunate he had midfielders next to him.

There's 2 sides to this if they are good enough they will excel if they are not they will be shipped out even though they maybe need a bit more nurturing.

 

[Chocolateleftfoot]

Yet you’re totally ignorant of the effect that starving players of a first team football between the ages of 16-22 can have.

The fact that not many have went on to better things could well be down to us stalling their development at a key stage. It won’t be the case for them all, but you’ve got to consider it.

Not ignorant of anything mate. The only way that a player of any age should get a game for Rangers is if they are good enough to play. We aren't a development club, we are, or at least should be, about winning.

Patterson played games. Gilmour, had he stayed, would have. Going further back, McGregor made it. Charlie Adam made it to EPL level. If you are good enough, you will make it.

Barry McKay played plenty of times. Is he good enough? Greg Wilde? Frazer Aird? Myles Beerman?

Playing games is important for development, no doubt, but the reality is some have it and some don't. And if you have it, there's nothing stopping you making it at Rangers. Since our much maligned academy was built, we've produced guys that have won league titles, guys that have played in European finals, Scotland internationals, guys we have sold for millions and broken our record sale twice. It works fine for the type of club we are.

Bailey Rice is a talented young man but they are ten a penny. Whether he makes it will be down to himself. Same as any of them. Lovelace, Lowry, King, Devine, all talented but that's not all it takes. Look at Kai Kennedy and Josh McPake. The list of players that has proved us wrong in the last 20 odd years must be zero.

If you are good enough, you will make it. The cream always rises to the top.

 

[prenzlauerbear]

You know things are drastic when John Lundstram is being floated as a saviour.

 

[1872BL]

If he’s good enough he’s old enough and should be getting minutes in the later stages of games we’re comfortable in to start off although I wouldn’t be against starting him at Ibrox against the likes of Dundee

 

[Big_Marvin_Andrews]

If he isn't seen as a better option than Ryan Jack or Lundstrum he would be as well leaving for his own good.

Those two stink the place out now but we still gave Jack a new contract.

 

[RTD-BEAR]

I have run The Loudens for thirty years, I have had, over the years, thousands of ' well intended ' advice.
No matter who is telling me, I always listen and decide if it has any merits
I have watched Rangers for over fifty years and I'm the first one to say that I have never been involved in the Professional game ( as I said to Ally )
But as the years have went by I am totally convinced that we could have came through the Leagues and would have had an outstanding team made up of mainly home grown talent
We wasted some amount of money and time with players that should never have worn our Jersey

Ultimately he's we could have had a brilliant home grown team that would have grown together

Very similar to the 5 that came through at man u together supplemented with couple of good players to guide them

 

[Highway Star]

You know things are drastic when John Lundstram is being floated as a saviour.

Dunno about a saviour mate, but it is a concern when he's a far better option than Raskin or Cifuentes.

 

[slorryy]

Heard he has been off the boil in training recently.

 

[Vinted]

I would play anyone willing to play ahead of Jack. As long they as they can run

Thank god that gets rid of Lundstram.

 

[Valley Bluenose]

Folk do remember that when we were in the bottom tier Andy Little had 36 appearances, Lewis MacLeod 31, Kyle Hutton 33, Chris Hegarty 29, Ross Perry 23, Barrie McKay 41, Fraser Aird 22, Kal Naismith 24, Robbie Crawford 27 - and a host of others got 5 games or so.

The idea that we didn't give the kids a chance is a myth - certainly in that first season. Aird, Little, Crawford and MacLeod had their fair share of appearances the following season as well.

 

[KingCarlos72]

Thank god that gets rid of Lundstram.

Lundstrum is 2xs the player jack is now

 

[BoyciesDa]

Folk do remember that when we were in the bottom tier Andy Little had 36 appearances, Lewis MacLeod 31, Kyle Hutton 33, Chris Hegarty 29, Ross Perry 23, Barrie McKay 41, Fraser Aird 22, Kal Naismith 24, Robbie Crawford 27 - and a host of others got 5 games or so.

The idea that we didn't give the kids a chance is a myth - certainly in that first season.

Concur VB

 

[ICA_86]

Heard he has been off the boil in training recently.

Heard that he sees Ben Davies as an uncle figure on the training ground.

 

[Run DMB]

You just have to look at Lamine Yamal at Barca who recently got his first Spainish full cap as an example that it can be done.

 

[RFC56]

You know things are drastic when John Lundstram is being floated as a saviour.

Must be reading a different thread because I haven’t seen anyone say he’s a saviour. He has been significantly better than both raskin and Cifuentes this season. That’s on raskin to get back to the form we seen last season, hopefully it wasn’t just a purple patch.

 

[Highway Star]

Thank god that gets rid of Lundstram.

I suggest you watch our recent midfield performances again and tell me why you think Lundstram is the problem?

Oh and he can run plenty, given he's the fittest player at the club.

 

[prenzlauerbear]

Must be reading a different thread because I haven’t seen anyone say he’s a saviour. He has been significantly better than both raskin and Cifuentes this season. That’s on raskin to get back to the form we seen last season, hopefully it wasn’t just a purple patch.

The hope is they will sort their form out and reach a higher level than the woefully inconsistent Lundstram.

Cifuentes has been alright domestically while still adapting. F*ck knows what is going with Raskin albeit Beale's minging system doesn't help.

 

[Highway Star]

The hope is they will sort their form out and reach a higher level than the woefully inconsistent Lundstram.

Cifuentes has been alright domestically while still adapting. F*ck knows what is going with Raskin albeit Beale's minging system doesn't help.

I agree to an extent mate, but no matter the system, it doesn't excuse turning over simple possession, or lazily failing to track opposition runners.

Raskin and Cifuentes have been guilty of both and it has cost us dearly in big games.

I actually think they're both good players too, but they aren't currently showing it and that's more down to them, than the manager.

 

[prenzlauerbear]

I agree to an extent mate, but no matter the system, it doesn't excuse turning over simple possession, or lazily failing to track opposition runners.

Raskin and Cifuentes have been guilty of both and it has cost us dearly in big games.

I actually think they're both good players too, but they aren't currently showing it and that's more down to them, than the manager.

Yeah, Raskin has been really disappointing this season. Miles off it.

Cifuentes looked shellshocked by the pace and tempo against PSV — should he have started in those games? He also isn't suited as a covering midfielder. I don't think he's been managed greatily in that regard.

 

[Highway Star]

Yeah, Raskin has been really disappointing this season. Miles off it.

Cifuentes looked shellshocked by the pace and tempo against PSV — should he have started in those games? He also isn't suited as a covering midfielder. I don't think he's been managed greatily in that regard.

Again I agree with most of what you say mate, but no matter where you're playing in midfield, you can't just let guys make a pass, run off you and receive a return, leaving our right back up against a 2 on 1 overload.

Cifuentes was guilty of this more than once too.

Like you, I would never have started him in any of the European games.

 

[BoyciesDa]

Again I agree with most of what you say mate, but no matter where you're playing in midfield, you can't just let guys make a pass, run off you and receive a return, leaving our right back up against a 2 on 1 overload.

Cifuentes was guilty of this more than once too.

Like you, I would never start him in any games.

Concur

 

[Growler]

I have run The Loudens for thirty years, I have had, over the years, thousands of ' well intended ' advice.
No matter who is telling me, I always listen and decide if it has any merits
I have watched Rangers for over fifty years and I'm the first one to say that I have never been involved in the Professional game ( as I said to Ally )
But as the years have went by I am totally convinced that we could have came through the Leagues and would have had an outstanding team made up of mainly home grown talent
We wasted some amount of money and time with players that should never have worn our Jersey

The home grown talent was awful - look at Andy Mitchell’s career and most of them were worse than him. We had zero scouting network so Ally went for what he knew. It’s pretty straight forward.

 

[Vinted]

Fair point
but I think we as a support are far more critical these days especially when it’s academy players who come through

Ho

Lundstrum is 2xs the player jack is now

2x0=0 lundstram and Jack should have gone in the last window.

 

[KingCarlos72]

Ho

2x0=0 lundstram and Jack should have gone in the last window.agreed mate

 

[Timardim]

I have no idea how many we have let slip through the net and said they weren't good enough to play for us in the modern era, but in the past we knocked back a few, Gordon McQueen, Kenny Burns along with Richard Gough come to mind

Kenny Dalglish... ( Too wee apparently )

 

[Captain_Buns]

This lad is the future & should be getting game time ahead of the likes of Jack & Lundstram.

 

[Robert Marshall]

Folk do remember that when we were in the bottom tier Andy Little had 36 appearances, Lewis MacLeod 31, Kyle Hutton 33, Chris Hegarty 29, Ross Perry 23, Barrie McKay 41, Fraser Aird 22, Kal Naismith 24, Robbie Crawford 27 - and a host of others got 5 games or so.

The idea that we didn't give the kids a chance is a myth - certainly in that first season. Aird, Little, Crawford and MacLeod had their fair share of appearances the following season as well.

We should have signed the cream of Scottish Talent, Apart from Lewis McLeod, Kyle Hutton and Barrie McKay, and with respect , the others were never going to be good enough for us

 

[Robert Marshall]

The home grown talent was awful - look at Andy Mitchell’s career and most of them were worse than him. We had zero scouting network so Ally went for what he knew. It’s pretty straight forward.

There were quite a few people he could have asked about the best talent coming through.

 

[Threetownsloyal]

53 years ago. Any other example of young players thriving in poor teams?

Wayne Rooney at Everton Jude Bellingham at Birmingham

 

[Ulsterscot]

I have run The Loudens for thirty years, I have had, over the years, thousands of ' well intended ' advice.
No matter who is telling me, I always listen and decide if it has any merits
I have watched Rangers for over fifty years and I'm the first one to say that I have never been involved in the Professional game ( as I said to Ally )
But as the years have went by I am totally convinced that we could have came through the Leagues and would have had an outstanding team made up of mainly home grown talent
We wasted some amount of money and time with players that should never have worn our Jersey

I couldn’t disagree more.

The best youth in Scotland didn’t want to come and play in the lower leagues.

There was a massive export of the best young Scottish players going down to England during “the journey”

Ally had a remit to get up the leagues as quick as he could. Tinkering and hoping for the best with building a young Scottish Team while trying to keep his job and hit the targets set to him wouldn’t allow what you’ve suggested.

I think the lowland league has shown putting our best youth (much better than we have now than we could attract back then by the way) against grown men doesn’t make them better players.

The Rangers jersey is unique that even the very best struggle with demands let alone a young boy trying to make it in football.

 

[BoyciesDa]

I couldn’t disagree more.

The best youth in Scotland didn’t want to come and play in the lower leagues.

There was a massive export of the best young Scottish players going down to England during “the journey”

Ally had a remit to get up the leagues as quick as he could. Tinkering and hoping for the best with building a young Scottish Team while trying to keep his job and hit the targets set to him wouldn’t allow what you’ve suggested.

I think the lowland league has shown putting our best youth (much better than we have now than we could attract back then by the way) against grown men doesn’t make them better players.

The Rangers jersey is unique that even the very best struggle with demands let alone a young boy trying to make it in football.

Like who ?

 

[Robert Marshall]

I couldn’t disagree more.

The best youth in Scotland didn’t want to come and play in the lower leagues.

There was a massive export of the best young Scottish players going down to England during “the journey”

Ally had a remit to get up the leagues as quick as he could. Tinkering and hoping for the best with building a young Scottish Team while trying to keep his job and hit the targets set to him wouldn’t allow what you’ve suggested.

I think the lowland league has shown putting our best youth (much better than we have now than we could attract back then by the way) against grown men doesn’t make them better players.

The Rangers jersey is unique that even the very best struggle with demands let alone a young boy trying to make it in football.

The best 17/18 year olds cost about £140K I think it was, not one young player with any ambition would not have bought into a 5 year contract with a chance of playing front of 50000 fans

 

[Robert Marshall]

Like who ?

I don't think anyone left to go to England apart from Lewis McLeod who went for£1m

 

[BoyciesDa]

I don't think anyone left to go to England aprt from Lewis McLeod who went for£1m

thought that myself

 

[biodoc]

How about Bellingham at 16 playing for Birmingham full season and coming 20th in Championship. Then getting move to Dortmund just as he turned 17?

There you go again spoiling an instant emotional response by producing facts. This is follow follow emotional lashing out is what we do not reasoned thought.

 

[Gym Bunny]

Our record of paying development fees for CAS players is very poor cant think of one player that we have paid for playing regulary for the first team. I hope young Rice makes it.

 

[Robert Marshall]

Our record of paying development fees for CAS players is very poor cant think of one player that we have paid for playing regulary for the first team. I hope young Rice makes it.

We could have bought about 16 players for about £2m
But I'm sure I recall someone saying ' You will never win anything with kids '