Celtic face threat of multimillion pound compensation claim(The Times)

nemessis

Well-Known Member
Also Andrew Gray was taken to Hampden in a taxi sent by Stuart Reagan,sat with him overlooking the park in a box and listened for his darkest secrets.

said he was extremely sympathetic and would work with him,the private councillors they provided for 2 sessions were pulled due to funding and Andrew was told to go to the NHS for help now.

Destroyed what confidence he had left and went downhill after that.
Reagan was one of Lawwell's best mates so it was never going to end well, or be for the benefit of Andrew.
 

Simply a Bear

Well-Known Member
Reagans' actions are disgraceful. He spoke to a victim, listened to what he had to say , and then promised help only to later withdraw that help.

It doesn't sit right with me that. Andrew Gray, bravely told his story, and was basically left to deal with the issue alone. Then down the line, Reagan blocks the Gray family on twitter and refuses their requests for contact . Those actions are not normal and display a lack of empathy.

Reagan and the SFA have a lot to answer for, questions should be asked about their failure to provide help for Andrew, and any others who spoke to them.
 

Simply a Bear

Well-Known Member
The man is a snake and is complicit and contributed towards his death in my eye’s,not only Andrew but let every survivor down at all club’s
throughout historical sexual abuse in footy in Scotland.
I wonder if the SFA report will say anything about his role ? That was more of a rhetorical question but if his role is omitted from that report, victims have the right to know why.
 

Ger57

Well-Known Member
I wonder if the SFA report will say anything about his role ? That was more of a rhetorical question but if his role is omitted from that report, victims have the right to know why.
Rhetorical question is right mate, it'll get kicked into the long grass as always. Child abuse is a heinous crime and you have to question the civility of a society that can apparently turn a blind eye to it.

The religious orders and some sections of society should be torn down over these abuses, and I can only draw the conclusion that those in positions of power are protecting them, because justice is rarely seen to be done. Investigations rarely ever seem to come to a successful conclusion and in many cases are long, drawn out and basically a fudge. It's a disgrace.

I really hope these people receive justice, but the cynic in me says that the rats will somehow twist their way out of it. Respect to those attempting to get some kind of closure for the victims.
 

Ger57

Well-Known Member
Well said brother.The galling thing is wee as taxpayers indirectly fund these horrible tax exempt institutions. I as most bears went to a non denomination school but the Catholic Church insists it’s minions attend Catholic schools which again I am funding through my council tax. If I wanted my kids to receive a Jedi education then I should have to fund this privately. As I have said in a previous post how on earth can this mob be deemed fit and proper to safeguard young children throughout their education. Not to mention that this catholic insistence on segregation is what fuels bigotry.
Agree 100%. They know it fuels bigotry, but to them 'it's a price worth paying'. It helps breed their 'tribe' and further their political strength, so no RC politician in this country will allow the biggest elephant in the room to even be discussed in Holyrood. I think it was John Lamont who found that out, almost to his cost as they called for his resignation. To bastardise a quote from Gangs of New York, 'I don't see christians coming out of that chapel, I see votes'.

Ireland has realised the depravity of the RC church, but it still isn't straightened out. If you youtube: 'QandA May 25th - response to question on RyanCommission Report', you'll see how badly this abuse hurts people. It tears the life out of people mate, and it isn't stopping anytime soon :(
 

BN94

Well-Known Member
Lawrence Haggart (15) was attacked in the living room of his home on the night of 16th March 1996. He was bludgeoned and tortured (including having his feet set on fire) and died from his injuries on 17th March. There were no signs of forced entry at the property.



Lawrence came through Celtic Boys Club and was signed by Tommy Burns as a Celtic F.C. Youth player. He was expected to sign senior terms the following December.



The Lead Up To The Murder

Lawrence was coached by McCafferty (convicted paedophile) at Celtic Boys Club.



McCafferty was a regular visitor to the Haggart home and occasionally took Lawrence to football matches.



Around the time of the murder, McCafferty was subject of an investigation into allegations of indecency and growing rumours about his abuse of Celtic Boys Club players.



McCafferty phoned Lawrence’s house on the day of the murder.



The Investigation

Brian Beattie - a known local paedophile - was interviewed by police the day after the attack but ruled out as a suspect.



McCafferty was named as a suspect but was not pursued.



The home of Lawrence Haggart was searched by police 9 times between 17 March and 22 March and no murder weapon was found. On 22 March a detective searching the home ‘discovered’ a hammer in the kitchen (we are to believe that detectives failed to spot this during the 9 previous crime scene searches). This discovery supported a narrative being pushed by investigating officers that Lawrence’s younger brother Dennis had bludgeoned him and set him on fire through jealousy.



Some investigating officers were intent on framing Lawrence’s younger brother.



Lawrence had the number ‘110’ written on the palms of his hands and carved into his shoulder (likely done with a key). This has never been explained.



A few weeks after the murder, McCafferty left Celtic.



The carpet and couch from the living room where the attack happened was disposed of soon after the murder, with the agreement of the police. They had not been subjected to any detailed forensic examination.



6 months after Lawrence’s murder, his dad Larry was furious at the lack of progress by police and vowed to ‘act alone’ to find out what happened.



On the first anniversary of Lawrence’s death, Detective Superintendent Joe Holden, who had recently taken charge of the case, said: "It is perfectly possible Lawrence knew his attacker, since there was no forced entry."



19 months after the murder, police identified Brian Beattie as prime suspect. He was on remand for another, unconnected, offence at the time.



The case against Beattie depended on police evidence of Beattie confessing to the murder, however no confession was ever recorded and Beattie never signed confessions that had been written up by officers.



At Beattie’s trial, defence lawyer Mr Edgar Prais QC said "Yes, ladies and gentlemen, the defence calls the police liars."



The defence alleged that Beattie was beaten while in custody.



The defence said it was strange that when Beattie supposedly confessed, no tape recording was made.



The defence discussed forensic tests that were carried out in Scotland and by the FBI in Washington - in all tests, Beattie was eliminated from any connection with the murder scene.



Beattie was convicted of Lawrence’s murder in May 1998.



Following the conviction of Beattie, Assistant Chief Constable James Mackay was ordered to investigate the CID's conduct during the investigation.



For seven years, Mackay’s report was kept hidden – not even Lawrence Haggart’s family were allowed to see it. Lawrence's father Larry said: "We will not be told the outcome, which is shocking. "It's all cloak and dagger stuff. They don't want us to know what went on."



However, seven years after the report was hidden, FOI came into existence. Author Russell Findlay submitted a FOI request with the blessing of Lawrence’s dad Larry. The report revealed that officers who has searched the house 9 times prior to 22 March were adamant there had been no hammer at the scene.



The report lists a catalogue of errors made by investigating officers, including: faking entries in an official diary of the murder inquiry; contaminating the crime scene; destroying evidence; losing a possible murder weapon.



The report concluded that the conduct of some officers was “allegedly criminal”.



The report criticised the inquiry head DS Jim Winning for not pursuing McCafferty as a suspect.



Not a single newspaper or broadcaster followed up the damning contents of the Mackay report.



Chief Insp Winning (in his late 40s), who led the initial investigation, was advised by both his GP and the force's own medical officer that he should retire immediately on health grounds. In doing so, Winning was exempt from prosecution for wrongdoing.



Two detective sergeants who worked on the original investigation were returned to uniformed duties.



In January 1999, Beattie launched an appeal against his conviction. Beattie alleged the judge allowed certain evidence that was inadmissible. He also claims Lord Dawson misdirected the jury in his summing-up at the end of the four-week trial. Beattie's solicitor said the grounds for appeal included "information that was brought to our attention after the trial".



Beattie’s appeal was rejected. Following the appeal, the Lord Justice General, Lord Cullen, who heard the appeal with Lord Hamilton and Lady Cosgrove, said they had reservations over Lord Dawson's treatment of the police evidence during Beattie’s trial. However, no action was taken.



Over 20 years later, Beattie still claims he is innocent of Lawrence’s murder.



I’ve read a bit about Beattie’s background and there is no question he is a depraved beast of the worst kind. He had previous for breaking into the homes of teenage boys and assaulting them. But something is rank rotten with the whole Lawrence Haggart case.



Given what is now known about McCafferty, there is clear cause for investigating what his involvement was, who else was involved, and which positions of power are implicated.'
 

dirty_sanshoes

Well-Known Member
Lawrence Haggart (15) was attacked in the living room of his home on the night of 16th March 1996. He was bludgeoned and tortured (including having his feet set on fire) and died from his injuries on 17th March. There were no signs of forced entry at the property.

Lawrence came through Celtic Boys Club and was signed by Tommy Burns as a Celtic F.C. Youth player. He was expected to sign senior terms the following December.

The Lead Up To The Murder

Lawrence was coached by McCafferty (convicted paedophile) at Celtic Boys Club.

McCafferty was a regular visitor to the Haggart home and occasionally took Lawrence to football matches.

Around the time of the murder, McCafferty was subject of an investigation into allegations of indecency and growing rumours about his abuse of Celtic Boys Club players.

McCafferty phoned Lawrence’s house on the day of the murder.


The Investigation

Brian Beattie - a known local paedophile - was interviewed by police the day after the attack but ruled out as a suspect.

McCafferty was named as a suspect but was not pursued.

The home of Lawrence Haggart was searched by police 9 times between 17 March and 22 March and no murder weapon was found. On 22 March a detective searching the home ‘discovered’ a hammer in the kitchen (we are to believe that detectives failed to spot this during the 9 previous crime scene searches). This discovery supported a narrative being pushed by investigating officers that Lawrence’s younger brother Dennis had bludgeoned him and set him on fire through jealousy.

Some investigating officers were intent on framing Lawrence’s younger brother.

Lawrence had the number ‘110’ written on the palms of his hands and carved into his shoulder (likely done with a key). This has never been explained.

A few weeks after the murder, McCafferty left Celtic.

The carpet and couch from the living room where the attack happened was disposed of soon after the murder, with the agreement of the police. They had not been subjected to any detailed forensic examination.

6 months after Lawrence’s murder, his dad Larry was furious at the lack of progress by police and vowed to ‘act alone’ to find out what happened.

On the first anniversary of Lawrence’s death, Detective Superintendent Joe Holden, who had recently taken charge of the case, said: "It is perfectly possible Lawrence knew his attacker, since there was no forced entry."

19 months after the murder, police identified Brian Beattie as prime suspect. He was on remand for another, unconnected, offence at the time.

The case against Beattie depended on police evidence of Beattie confessing to the murder, however no confession was ever recorded and Beattie never signed confessions that had been written up by officers.

At Beattie’s trial, defence lawyer Mr Edgar Prais QC said "Yes, ladies and gentlemen, the defence calls the police liars."

The defence alleged that Beattie was beaten while in custody.

The defence said it was strange that when Beattie supposedly confessed, no tape recording was made.

The defence discussed forensic tests that were carried out in Scotland and by the FBI in Washington - in all tests, Beattie was eliminated from any connection with the murder scene.

Beattie was convicted of Lawrence’s murder in May 1998.

Following the conviction of Beattie, Assistant Chief Constable James Mackay was ordered to investigate the CID's conduct during the investigation.

For seven years, Mackay’s report was kept hidden – not even Lawrence Haggart’s family were allowed to see it. Lawrence's father Larry said: "We will not be told the outcome, which is shocking. "It's all cloak and dagger stuff. They don't want us to know what went on."

However, seven years after the report was hidden, FOI came into existence. Author Russell Findlay submitted a FOI request with the blessing of Lawrence’s dad Larry. The report revealed that officers who has searched the house 9 times prior to 22 March were adamant there had been no hammer at the scene.

The report lists a catalogue of errors made by investigating officers, including: faking entries in an official diary of the murder inquiry; contaminating the crime scene; destroying evidence; losing a possible murder weapon.

The report concluded that the conduct of some officers was “allegedly criminal”.

The report criticised the inquiry head DS Jim Winning for not pursuing McCafferty as a suspect.

Not a single newspaper or broadcaster followed up the damning contents of the Mackay report.

Chief Insp Winning (in his late 40s), who led the initial investigation, was advised by both his GP and the force's own medical officer that he should retire immediately on health grounds. In doing so, Winning was exempt from prosecution for wrongdoing.

Two detective sergeants who worked on the original investigation were returned to uniformed duties.

In January 1999, Beattie launched an appeal against his conviction. Beattie alleged the judge allowed certain evidence that was inadmissible. He also claims Lord Dawson misdirected the jury in his summing-up at the end of the four-week trial. Beattie's solicitor said the grounds for appeal included "information that was brought to our attention after the trial".

Beattie’s appeal was rejected. Following the appeal, the Lord Justice General, Lord Cullen, who heard the appeal with Lord Hamilton and Lady Cosgrove, said they had reservations over Lord Dawson's treatment of the police evidence during Beattie’s trial. However, no action was taken.

Over 20 years later, Beattie still claims he is innocent of Lawrence’s murder.

I’ve read a bit about Beattie’s background and there is no question he is a depraved beast of the worst kind. He had previous for breaking into the homes of teenage boys and assaulting them. But something is rank rotten with the whole Lawrence Haggart case.

Given what is now known about McCafferty, there is clear cause for investigating what his involvement was, who else was involved, and which positions of power are implicated.'
Ah, my old essay ;)

I was always intrigued by:

"Lawrence had the number ‘110’ written on the palms of his hands and carved into his shoulder (likely done with a key). This has never been explained."

That's way too random not to be significant. Was it a warning to others? Would other abuse victims understand the significance of '110' and this was to frighten them into silence? Was Haggart about to speak out about McCafferty given he was under investigation at the time?
 

Div1872

Well-Known Member
Gordon Woods is a very brave man

Abused by Torbett

Ignored for decades by Nonce FC

Ignored by Strathclyde Police and Police Scotland

I hope his book helps him and other decent law abiding citizens support him

I also hope his book is making a few not sleep and wonder what his relegations about Saint Tommy will be ?
 

BN94

Well-Known Member
Ah, my old essay ;)

I was always intrigued by:

"Lawrence had the number ‘110’ written on the palms of his hands and carved into his shoulder (likely done with a key). This has never been explained."

That's way too random not to be significant. Was it a warning to others? Would other abuse victims understand the significance of '110' and this was to frighten them into silence? Was Haggart about to speak out about McCafferty given he was under investigation at the time?
There is no doubt that this case needs looking at again.
 

marmaladebear

Active Member
They have no shame and no fear because they have been protected at the highest levels. The crime scene investigation into Lawrence's murder is held up in crime scene investigation lecture / seminar circles as the worst example of complete and utter incompetence. If it wasn't so horrifying it would be comical - picture Leslie Nielsen and Police Squad. The protected crime scene that was police taped off was allegedly right around where the young man was found - not the room, not the house, not the property and it's garden. Picture that - Strathclyde Police not Police Scotland, Strathclyde Police the organisation that has run Police Scotland from the start and still holds itself up as the best compared to others.
 

ghoulishworm

Well-Known Member
Lawrence Haggart (15) was attacked in the living room of his home on the night of 16th March 1996. He was bludgeoned and tortured (including having his feet set on fire) and died from his injuries on 17th March. There were no signs of forced entry at the property.



Lawrence came through Celtic Boys Club and was signed by Tommy Burns as a Celtic F.C. Youth player. He was expected to sign senior terms the following December.



The Lead Up To The Murder

Lawrence was coached by McCafferty (convicted paedophile) at Celtic Boys Club.



McCafferty was a regular visitor to the Haggart home and occasionally took Lawrence to football matches.



Around the time of the murder, McCafferty was subject of an investigation into allegations of indecency and growing rumours about his abuse of Celtic Boys Club players.



McCafferty phoned Lawrence’s house on the day of the murder.



The Investigation

Brian Beattie - a known local paedophile - was interviewed by police the day after the attack but ruled out as a suspect.



McCafferty was named as a suspect but was not pursued.



The home of Lawrence Haggart was searched by police 9 times between 17 March and 22 March and no murder weapon was found. On 22 March a detective searching the home ‘discovered’ a hammer in the kitchen (we are to believe that detectives failed to spot this during the 9 previous crime scene searches). This discovery supported a narrative being pushed by investigating officers that Lawrence’s younger brother Dennis had bludgeoned him and set him on fire through jealousy.



Some investigating officers were intent on framing Lawrence’s younger brother.



Lawrence had the number ‘110’ written on the palms of his hands and carved into his shoulder (likely done with a key). This has never been explained.



A few weeks after the murder, McCafferty left Celtic.



The carpet and couch from the living room where the attack happened was disposed of soon after the murder, with the agreement of the police. They had not been subjected to any detailed forensic examination.



6 months after Lawrence’s murder, his dad Larry was furious at the lack of progress by police and vowed to ‘act alone’ to find out what happened.



On the first anniversary of Lawrence’s death, Detective Superintendent Joe Holden, who had recently taken charge of the case, said: "It is perfectly possible Lawrence knew his attacker, since there was no forced entry."



19 months after the murder, police identified Brian Beattie as prime suspect. He was on remand for another, unconnected, offence at the time.



The case against Beattie depended on police evidence of Beattie confessing to the murder, however no confession was ever recorded and Beattie never signed confessions that had been written up by officers.



At Beattie’s trial, defence lawyer Mr Edgar Prais QC said "Yes, ladies and gentlemen, the defence calls the police liars."



The defence alleged that Beattie was beaten while in custody.



The defence said it was strange that when Beattie supposedly confessed, no tape recording was made.



The defence discussed forensic tests that were carried out in Scotland and by the FBI in Washington - in all tests, Beattie was eliminated from any connection with the murder scene.



Beattie was convicted of Lawrence’s murder in May 1998.



Following the conviction of Beattie, Assistant Chief Constable James Mackay was ordered to investigate the CID's conduct during the investigation.



For seven years, Mackay’s report was kept hidden – not even Lawrence Haggart’s family were allowed to see it. Lawrence's father Larry said: "We will not be told the outcome, which is shocking. "It's all cloak and dagger stuff. They don't want us to know what went on."



However, seven years after the report was hidden, FOI came into existence. Author Russell Findlay submitted a FOI request with the blessing of Lawrence’s dad Larry. The report revealed that officers who has searched the house 9 times prior to 22 March were adamant there had been no hammer at the scene.



The report lists a catalogue of errors made by investigating officers, including: faking entries in an official diary of the murder inquiry; contaminating the crime scene; destroying evidence; losing a possible murder weapon.



The report concluded that the conduct of some officers was “allegedly criminal”.



The report criticised the inquiry head DS Jim Winning for not pursuing McCafferty as a suspect.



Not a single newspaper or broadcaster followed up the damning contents of the Mackay report.



Chief Insp Winning (in his late 40s), who led the initial investigation, was advised by both his GP and the force's own medical officer that he should retire immediately on health grounds. In doing so, Winning was exempt from prosecution for wrongdoing.



Two detective sergeants who worked on the original investigation were returned to uniformed duties.



In January 1999, Beattie launched an appeal against his conviction. Beattie alleged the judge allowed certain evidence that was inadmissible. He also claims Lord Dawson misdirected the jury in his summing-up at the end of the four-week trial. Beattie's solicitor said the grounds for appeal included "information that was brought to our attention after the trial".



Beattie’s appeal was rejected. Following the appeal, the Lord Justice General, Lord Cullen, who heard the appeal with Lord Hamilton and Lady Cosgrove, said they had reservations over Lord Dawson's treatment of the police evidence during Beattie’s trial. However, no action was taken.



Over 20 years later, Beattie still claims he is innocent of Lawrence’s murder.



I’ve read a bit about Beattie’s background and there is no question he is a depraved beast of the worst kind. He had previous for breaking into the homes of teenage boys and assaulting them. But something is rank rotten with the whole Lawrence Haggart case.



Given what is now known about McCafferty, there is clear cause for investigating what his involvement was, who else was involved, and which positions of power are implicated.'
That is shocking B.N. absolute depravity from the perpetrator(s) in what they did to that young boy,and as for the police its verging on criminality the way the whole investigation was carried out and as we've seen with the hanging effigies evidence being lost,hidden or stolen to order things haven't changed much through time.
 

BN94

Well-Known Member
https://www.heraldscotland.com/news/12296812.officer-denies-he-invented-haggart-murder-confession/

6th May 1998Officer denies he invented Haggart murder confession

A senior police officer yesterday denied he chose ''foul means'' to solve the murder of teenage Celtic star Lawrence Haggart.

Detective Superintendent Joseph Holden denied that as the ''new broom'' appointed to clear up the mystery he had ''invented'' a murder confession.

Mr Holden, of Central Scotland Police, also denied a defence allegation that police had battered murder-accused Brian Beattie, 33, into making a false confession to killing the 15-year-old Scottish schoolboy internationalist who was found dying in flames in his family home in Larbert, Stirlingshire, on March 15, 1996.
Mr Holden, 44, told the High Court in Edinburgh that Mr Beattie broke down and confessed to killing Lawrence Haggart during an interview at Stirling police station in August 1997.
Mr Holden told the court: ''You could see his body beginning to shake . . . he started crying loudly, making a wailing noise. Mucous was coming from his nose as well as tears from his eyes.''
Mr Holden said he asked Mr Beattie: ''Did you kill Lawrence Haggart?'' Mr Holden said at that point Beattie nodded his head

vigorously at least half a dozen times''.
Mr Holden said he then inquired: ''Does that mean yes, Brian?''
He said Mr Beattie replied: ''Aye . . . I want to talk to Willie about it.''
Mr Holden said police then took Mr Beattie's brother William to Stirling police station. But when they met, Mr Beattie told his brother he had not committed the murder. Mr Holden said Mr Beattie's alleged confession to the murder was not tape-recorded. But a police officer had noted the statement of confession.
Mr Holden said he had been asked to review the evidence of the unsolved murder in November 1996. He said Mr Beattie ''confessed'' to the murder of Lawrence Haggart in August 1997 but was not charged with murder until three months later. Mr Holden said that was a decision taken by the procurator-fiscal.
Mr Edgar Prais QC, defence counsel, asked Mr Holden if, as ''the new broom'' appointed to take over the fresh investigation, he was determined to solve the murder at any cost.
Mr Holden replied: ''I have nothing to prove. I have 18 years' service in the CID and have been a chief investigating officer for 12 years.''
Mr Prais added: ''My suggestion is that this was a crime you were going to solve by foul means or fair means. And you chose foul.''
Mr Holden denied the allegation. He said that he had reviewed all the evidence and denied that police officers assaulted Mr Beattie before the ''confession'' was made.
He said he had not threatened Mr Beattie that if he did not confess his family would be left unprotected while in fear of having their home firebombed because of local outrage.
Mr Beattie, unemployed, of Ewing Drive, Falkirk, denies murdering Lawrence Haggart by repeatedly striking him on the head and body with a weapon and setting fire to his body so that he died at Edinburgh's Western General Hospital on March 17, 1996.
The alleged offence was said to have taken place at the Haggart family home at Glenbervie Drive, Larbert, Stirlingshire, on March 15 or 16, 1996, after Mr Beattie was said to have entered the house uninvited.
Mr Beattie further denies he culpably and recklessly attempted to set fire to furniture in the home.
In a special defence of incrimination, Mr Beattie blamed Dennis Haggart, now 14, for the murder of his brother, Lawrence.
In court, Dennis denied the
allegation.
The trial continues.
 

alexg123

Well-Known Member
Reagans' actions are disgraceful. He spoke to a victim, listened to what he had to say , and then promised help only to later withdraw that help.

It doesn't sit right with me that. Andrew Gray, bravely told his story, and was basically left to deal with the issue alone. Then down the line, Reagan blocks the Gray family on twitter and refuses their requests for contact . Those actions are not normal and display a lack of empathy.

Reagan and the SFA have a lot to answer for, questions should be asked about their failure to provide help for Andrew, and any others who spoke to them.
Reagan or Doncaster would not be able to help the Gray Family without getting permission from the real man running Scottish football , none other than Mr. Liewewll of course pulling all the strings and fooling no one with what's going at Hampden .
 

EH47

Well-Known Member
Man in charge of case : Chief Superintendent Jim Winning. Criticised for his handling of the case, and suddenly "retired through ill health".
Any relation to Tom Winning, former outspoken cleric for the sect in Scotland, and elevated to cardinal in 1994?
Just curious.
 
Last edited:

alexg123

Well-Known Member
https://www.heraldscotland.com/news/12296812.officer-denies-he-invented-haggart-murder-confession/

6th May 1998Officer denies he invented Haggart murder confession

A senior police officer yesterday denied he chose ''foul means'' to solve the murder of teenage Celtic star Lawrence Haggart.

Detective Superintendent Joseph Holden denied that as the ''new broom'' appointed to clear up the mystery he had ''invented'' a murder confession.

Mr Holden, of Central Scotland Police, also denied a defence allegation that police had battered murder-accused Brian Beattie, 33, into making a false confession to killing the 15-year-old Scottish schoolboy internationalist who was found dying in flames in his family home in Larbert, Stirlingshire, on March 15, 1996.
Mr Holden, 44, told the High Court in Edinburgh that Mr Beattie broke down and confessed to killing Lawrence Haggart during an interview at Stirling police station in August 1997.
Mr Holden told the court: ''You could see his body beginning to shake . . . he started crying loudly, making a wailing noise. Mucous was coming from his nose as well as tears from his eyes.''
Mr Holden said he asked Mr Beattie: ''Did you kill Lawrence Haggart?'' Mr Holden said at that point Beattie nodded his head

vigorously at least half a dozen times''.
Mr Holden said he then inquired: ''Does that mean yes, Brian?''
He said Mr Beattie replied: ''Aye . . . I want to talk to Willie about it.''
Mr Holden said police then took Mr Beattie's brother William to Stirling police station. But when they met, Mr Beattie told his brother he had not committed the murder. Mr Holden said Mr Beattie's alleged confession to the murder was not tape-recorded. But a police officer had noted the statement of confession.
Mr Holden said he had been asked to review the evidence of the unsolved murder in November 1996. He said Mr Beattie ''confessed'' to the murder of Lawrence Haggart in August 1997 but was not charged with murder until three months later. Mr Holden said that was a decision taken by the procurator-fiscal.
Mr Edgar Prais QC, defence counsel, asked Mr Holden if, as ''the new broom'' appointed to take over the fresh investigation, he was determined to solve the murder at any cost.
Mr Holden replied: ''I have nothing to prove. I have 18 years' service in the CID and have been a chief investigating officer for 12 years.''
Mr Prais added: ''My suggestion is that this was a crime you were going to solve by foul means or fair means. And you chose foul.''
Mr Holden denied the allegation. He said that he had reviewed all the evidence and denied that police officers assaulted Mr Beattie before the ''confession'' was made.
He said he had not threatened Mr Beattie that if he did not confess his family would be left unprotected while in fear of having their home firebombed because of local outrage.
Mr Beattie, unemployed, of Ewing Drive, Falkirk, denies murdering Lawrence Haggart by repeatedly striking him on the head and body with a weapon and setting fire to his body so that he died at Edinburgh's Western General Hospital on March 17, 1996.
The alleged offence was said to have taken place at the Haggart family home at Glenbervie Drive, Larbert, Stirlingshire, on March 15 or 16, 1996, after Mr Beattie was said to have entered the house uninvited.
Mr Beattie further denies he culpably and recklessly attempted to set fire to furniture in the home.
In a special defence of incrimination, Mr Beattie blamed Dennis Haggart, now 14, for the murder of his brother, Lawrence.
In court, Dennis denied the
allegation.
The trial continues.
The plot thickens :mad:
 

Kylegib

Well-Known Member
Rhetorical question is right mate, it'll get kicked into the long grass as always. Child abuse is a heinous crime and you have to question the civility of a society that can apparently turn a blind eye to it.

The religious orders and some sections of society should be torn down over these abuses, and I can only draw the conclusion that those in positions of power are protecting them, because justice is rarely seen to be done. Investigations rarely ever seem to come to a successful conclusion and in many cases are long, drawn out and basically a fudge. It's a disgrace.

I really hope these people receive justice, but the cynic in me says that the rats will somehow twist their way out of it. Respect to those attempting to get some kind of closure for the victims.

This is a harrowing watch but it certainly gives an insight into how protected these monsters are by those in position of power.
 

BN94

Well-Known Member
Watched this a while back and wept. I just wept again. This poor man and so many others. What a truly evil institution that is the church of rome.
The stories I’ve heard, I agree with the word evil. It’s a disgusting legal cult that should be wiped off the face of the earth.
No matter what country where priests exist, then so does child abuse. I’ve mentioned it before on this thread. We are under no illusion that we are not only dealing with CFC and the pathetic devolved Scottish government, but also the cult of Catholicism.
 

ShootYouDown

Well-Known Member
Man in charge of case : Chief Superintendent Jim Winning. Criticised for his handling of the case, and suddenly "retired through ill health".
Any relation to Tom Winning, former outspoken cleric for the sect in Scotland, and elevated to cardinal in 1994?
Just curious.
I also see that Lord Dawson ,who presided over the original trial,was educated at the university of Edinburgh. He croaked it in 2007,but I wonder if he was a member of them good ole boys,the Speculative Society. His old mucker Lord Cullen was...
 

The Goal Machine

Well-Known Member
Wow caught BBC Scotland there, dont know the context but John Beattie just asked someone if he thought Celtic should basically do the decent thing as regards child abuse, not the exact words.as the guy has some connection to Celtic.

The guy replied ' I have no comment on that at all John'.

Seemingly Haughey or Lord Haughey .

Maybe someone heard it from the start.
 

The Goal Machine

Well-Known Member
Wow caught BBC Scotland there, dont know the context but John Beattie just asked someone if he thought Celtic should basically do the decent thing as regards child abuse, not the exact words.as the guy has some connection to Celtic.

The guy replied ' I have no comment on that at all John'.

Seemingly Haughey or Lord Haughey .

Maybe someone heard it from the start.
From Twitter

John@TheWestEnclosure

@Oneco55John

·
1m

Beattie"as a N E Dir of Celtic do you have anything to say now victims are about to put claims in aginst them" Lord Haughey"I have no comment to make" Just another who took the side of the paedophiles with his silence
 

BN94

Well-Known Member
This was found by a member behind the scenes recently.


Makes an interesting read.

Frank McAveety is Labour's former Sports Minister who championed the case for Sportscotland's HQ to be relocated from Edinburgh to the Parkhead site of a new National Arena, despite 90% of Sportscotland's employees expressing their desire to stay in Edinburgh,

Ron Culley is a former Labour Party candidate for Strathkelvin and Bearsden. He is also the former Chief Executive of Scottish Enterprise and former colleague of Stephen Purcell of GCC, who is on the board of Scottish Enterprise,

Jack McConnell is a personal friend Former Chairman of Scottish Enterprise is Willie Haughey. Haughey is Scotland’s biggest single donor to Labour Party funds. He received £16 million of tax-payers money, approved by Jack McConnell, to relocate his business to facilitate the M74 extension......to Parkhead.

Culley is a season ticket holder at Celtic Park as are Haughey, Purcell and McAveety. McConnell is a regular guest. Culley visited Beijing to study transport systems to "help Glasgow’s bid to host the 2014 Commonwealth Games". Culley, Haughey and McAveety were at the forefront of the campaign for the M74 extension which improved Road links to Parkhead. 3 days after McConnell and McAveety announced the relocation of Sport Scotland to land adjacent to Celtic Park,

Culley as Chief Executive of Strathclyde Passenger Transport) quietly issued a low-key statement declaring the intention to build a new £20 million train link to Parkhead jointly funded by SPT, GCC and The Scottish Executive. More recently Culley announced plans for a Glasgow Underground extension to Parkhead.

Key historic buildings at Parkhead Cross are to be refurbished as part of a drive to breathe new life into the east end of the city. The Heritage Lottery Fund has given £1.4 million – one of the largest single donations it has ever awarded – to specifically restore the 100 year old Edwardian style buildings that frame the Cross. Three former bank buildings will be renovated to bring empty floor space back into viable use and improve the overall streetscape.

The Parkhead Townscape Heritage Initiative is a £4 million five year plan, with the aim of repairing and bringing back to use landmark buildings, vacant shop units and enhancement to the public realm . The partners in the initiative include Glasgow City Council, East End Partnership, East End SIP, Communities Scotland Celtic Football Club and Scottish Enterprise Glasgow. £50 first prize to the first caller to name me a link between Glasgow City Council, Celtic Football Club and Scottish Enterprise Glasgow.

In the mid 90s after Celtic FC had submitted plans for the re-building of their stadium. Glasgow District Council sold the club significant tracts of land namely Kinloch Street, Janefield Street and Dalriada Street for the princely sum of 1p. The Planning Committee consisted thirteen members, eleven Labour, one SNP, and one Tory. The SNP member was so disgusted with the dealings of his own committee that he informed the Herald that "of them eleven Labour councillors on the committee, they are all either season ticket holders or share holders at Celtic Park. Eight of them are both". He further noted that,"if these eleven councillors were shareholders in ICI and they voted for lax planning consent on a petro-chemical plant , there would be a criminal investigation". (This scandal was also reported in Private Eye's "Rotten Borough's" column).

Okay, we have established Glasgow District Council sold three streets( Dalriada Street ,Janefield Street ,and Kinloch Street ) to their beloved

Sellik for a penny. Next, the combined efforts of the Board of Scottish Enterprise(Glasgow) ie Paul Cooney, Wullie HeeHaw, Charlie Gordon, Stephen Purcell, ....etc and the then First Minister and Sellik season ticket and share holder, Jack McConnell ensured the Commonwealth Games would be centred on Sellik Park . It was first announced by McConnell to Snyde's Paul Cooney on the evening of the home leg of the UEFA Cup tie against Liverpool. Subsequently, it came out that the Velodrome would be constructed across the London Road and the various Administrative blocks would house Sports Scotland (currently located in Edinburgh).

Those Admin' blocks have to be filled and the next vetted and fully on message tenants’ are Culture and Sport Glasgow. The Chief Executive of this public funded body is Bridget McConnell, wife of Jack. Of course, Bridget only received her in excess of £100,000 per annum designation because of a piece of horse trading by philanderer, Jack. He could not keep it zipped, got caught, ended up on the front page of the Record, and Bridget only agreed to respectability if Jack ensured she was over promoted several grades. In football parlance, Bridget was a youth team stalwart who immediately assumed Captaincy of the first team.

Really, it all makes sense to centralise all the decision making process. All those MPs, MSPs, MEPs, Councillors, and Chief Executive of Public Funded bodies can watch their hooped heroes then walk across London Road to decide what’s best for the peoples of Glasgow, Truly, the establishment Club.

I wonder if Bridget's and Jack's brother-in-law, Robert McLuckie will be first on the guest list. Perhaps I should try and explain myself further for those questioning why certain contributors raise the possibility that this proposed "Eat End Redevelopment" and "Celtic Triangle" may be of considerable benefit to Celtic FC - and indeed, that this is a primary factor in the plans we've seen released this week. Until very recently, Glasgow had not had a non-RC Lord Provost since the early 70s. A completely disproportionate number of staff at Glasgow City Council – including those at top end of the salary scale such as Bridget McConnell – are RCs. Nearly all Labour councillors are RCs and few councillors are members of any other party. Roman Catholic ex-Lord Provost Dr. Michael Kelly questioned the reasons behind this phenomenon a few years ago live on radio, the inference being the situation had arisen out of bigotry. Credit to him for being so open and honest.

A recent Lord Provost, Alex Mosson, was an IRA sympathizer who was responsible for inviting Gerry Adams to Govan Town Hall , while the Provisional’s terror campaign was in full swing. Mosson had a novel interpretation of wealth redistribution; he had several criminal convictions for burglary, two of which lead to custodial sentences, including one case which involved tying up an OAP.

Mosson's wife was certainly not prepared to let taxpayers' money go to waste during her husband's stint as Provost, insisting on an increase in her dress allowance from £8,000 to £14,000 p.a. When questioned, she justified this by famously claiming "the people of Glasgow wouldn't want to see me wearing the same outfit twice".Mr. Mosson was the inaugural Chairman of The Celtic Trust and perhaps unsurprisingly, made sure that the official limousine was at hand for his regular trips to Celtic Park, a policy that was also questioned by political opponents. Strangely, he never took the opportunity of visiting Ibrox.

Again this was swept under the carpet ,and was never brought to light at the council meetings, this was squashed when it was raised.

Perhaps it is not surprising, therefore, that some query the motives behind those at the forefront of the Commonwealth Games bid – such as Jack McConnell, Ron Culley, Steven Purcell and Frank McAveety – who are all regulars at Celtic Park .There are huge question marks over the £288m budget (80% to be paid by the Executive), given that the cost of the `indoor arena' alone has recently escalated from an original £24m to £70m. McConnell's handing of the M74 extension affair, in which he met City Refrigeration Holding boss (and ex-Celtic director) Willie Haughey before an initial £7.4m compensation award was increased to £16.5m – with Haughey subsequently donating £330,000 to the Labour Party – hardly dampens suspicion.

In contrast to the largesse being bestowed on the East End of Glasgow, SPT instructed Rangers that the club would have to fork out £500k if the old Ibrox station on the Central-Paisley line was ever to be re-opened.

A lot is spoken about `sectarianism' in Scotland I contend that there is far, far more to this problem than songs sung at football matches and that it is time the Scottish people wakened up.

When is one of our elected representatives going to ask some searching questions regarding the various deals surrounding East End regeneration, the Commonwealth Games bid, the M74 extension and the proposed rail/subway extensions? They may also care to question why the bulk of the "regeneration" seems to centre around a one mile radius of Celtic Park.

This shows the level of commitment that some of our illustrious councillors have under the cloak of City Council Dealings.
 

BN94

Well-Known Member
@BN94 that is one brutal read
Since being involved in this I can honestly say that the corruption runs deep. Let’s be honest, it has done for a lot of years.
On the issue that we are involved in then what I’ve learnt is there are individuals within the Scottish devolved government that will actually defend Celtic Football Club on this issue. Even use deflection tactics when his own son was a member of CBC.
 

Grigo Yossarian

Well-Known Member
Since being involved in this I can honestly say that the corruption runs deep. Let’s be honest, it has done for a lot of years.
On the issue that we are involved in then what I’ve learnt is there are individuals within the Scottish devolved government that will actually defend Celtic Football Club on this issue. Even use deflection tactics when his own son was a member of CBC.
The 4m they got for staging only the Commonwealth Games opening ceremony pales into insignificance here.
 
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