Celtic face threat of multimillion pound compensation claim(The Times)

GazzaG

Well-Known Member
Official Ticketer
The first question needing asked is a simple one.

Why has the Justice Minister made such a rip-roaring c*nt of this scandal ?
Next question.

Who first suggested a free pass for sports clubs and religious organisation (sellick and the rc church to me and you)?

It's not an idea that would seem normal to anyone involved in such an investigation.
 

johnkp

Well-Known Member
Next question.

Who first suggested a free pass for sports clubs and religious organisation (sellick and the rc church to me and you)? It's not an idea that would seem normal to anyone involved in such an investigation.
The inquiry states its purpose as being "to investigate the nature and extent of abuse of children whilst in care in Scotland", while considering "the extent to which institutions and bodies with legal responsibility for the care of children failed in their duty", in particular seeking any "systemic failures".

It classes "in care" as being:

- Children's homes (including residential care provided by faith-based groups),
- Secure care units including List D schools,
- Borstals and Young Offenders' Institutions,
- Places provided for Boarded-Out children in the Highlands and Islands,
- State, private and independent Boarding Schools, including state-funded school hostels,
- Healthcare establishments providing long term care, and any similar establishments intended to provide children with long-term residential care,
- Children in foster care.

But it does not cover children who were abused while using sports and leisure clubs or attending faith-based organisations on a day-to-day basis, or while living with their natural or adoptive families.

The inquiry will also not examine allegations of children being abused in non-boarding schools, nursery or day-care centres.
 

Sancus

Well-Known Member
That photo of Pat Bonner the footballer surrounded by paedophile priests gives me the creeps.o_O
You only have to look at the case of Father Steve Gilhooley who was abused by priests and then subjected to intimidation when he tried to raise the matter years later. He wrote a book called Pyjama Parade which got banned by the Catholic Church.

Google him and you’ll find how he was threatened with fire bombing for daring to speak the truth.

Edit: In fact, you’ll actually find that Google also tells you that material has been removed under data protection laws in Europe. Which says a lot.

 
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Sancus

Well-Known Member
Priest-Author Flees Home After Death Threat October 29, 2001
GLASGOW, Oct 29, 01 (CWNews.com) - A Scottish priest, who has published a book detailing the sexual abuse he suffered as a child, has fled his church following an attempt on his life.

Father Steve Gilhooley's book, The Pyjama Parade, details the abuse he suffered at the hands of a priest when he entered St. Mary's College in Grange-over-Sands, Cumbria, in the 1970s. One of the priests involved has since been jailed for his crimes.

After several threats and attacks on his home in Currie, Midlothian, Father Gilhooley, 39, asked his superior, Archbishop Keith O'Brien, to transfer him to an overseas retreat before the controversial account was published.

But the crunch came when a device was attached to his car.

 

Huckleberry

Well-Known Member
Those that have a duty of care, the fit and proper personnel, fine upstanding pillars of the community. Seem to be in short supply at parkhead, instead we have loathsome liars,phonies,imposters and charlatans masquerading as a respected club. Lawwell claims it's a misconception Celtic are doing nothing regarding the abuse of youngsters in their care, chance after chance has been missed in addressing the scandal. The deception continues and dereliction of duty by those in charge of Celtic is shameful.
 

Speminalium8

Well-Known Member
Next question.

Who first suggested a free pass for sports clubs and religious organisation (sellick and the rc church to me and you)?

It's not an idea that would seem normal to anyone involved in such an investigation.
I have asked that same question on these boards and a poster answered saying that Swinney ( I think it was ) said words to the effect that if Sports and Religious groups were included it would widen the scope of any enquiry to the extent of slowing up the findings in the other areas. So that seems to be the excuse not to pursue these groups and why the SFA is looking into football. I don’t know who is looking in to religious groups. I’m sure there’s posters who ‘ll clarify exactly what was said.
 

Commentator

Well-Known Member
I have asked that same question on these boards and a poster answered saying that Swinney ( I think it was ) said words to the effect that if Sports and Religious groups were included it would widen the scope of any enquiry to the extent of slowing up the findings in the other areas. So that seems to be the excuse not to pursue these groups and why the SFA is looking into football. I don’t know who is looking in to religious groups. I’m sure there’s posters who ‘ll clarify exactly what was said.
Could be wrong here but I'm sure that was the after-the-act risible excuse trotted out when the question was asked, maybe in the toytown parliament?
What I took out of Gazza's question was who was behind the exclusions? Who in the Natzis, when the terms of the inquiry were being framed, initially championed the free pass for protected pederasts?
Again, might be wrong.
 

GazzaG

Well-Known Member
Official Ticketer
The inquiry states its purpose as being "to investigate the nature and extent of abuse of children whilst in care in Scotland", while considering "the extent to which institutions and bodies with legal responsibility for the care of children failed in their duty", in particular seeking any "systemic failures".

It classes "in care" as being:

- Children's homes (including residential care provided by faith-based groups),
- Secure care units including List D schools,
- Borstals and Young Offenders' Institutions,
- Places provided for Boarded-Out children in the Highlands and Islands,
- State, private and independent Boarding Schools, including state-funded school hostels,
- Healthcare establishments providing long term care, and any similar establishments intended to provide children with long-term residential care,
- Children in foster care.

But it does not cover children who were abused while using sports and leisure clubs or attending faith-based organisations on a day-to-day basis, or while living with their natural or adoptive families.

The inquiry will also not examine allegations of children being abused in non-boarding schools, nursery or day-care centres.
This bit I've highlighted stands out a mile.

How can they say this and exclude the two biggest offenders?

In care? Are children not in your care when you take them on trips to other countries?
 

GazzaG

Well-Known Member
Official Ticketer
Could be wrong here but I'm sure that was the after-the-act risible excuse trotted out when the question was asked, maybe in the toytown parliament?
What I took out of Gazza's question was who was behind the exclusions? Who in the Natzis, when the terms of the inquiry were being framed, initially championed the free pass for protected pederasts?
Again, might be wrong.
That is exactly what I meant.

We either treat this issue seriously and have it dealt with properly or we just completely ignore it.

What sort of message are we sending when some abusers are effectively being told to carry on regardless depending on the institution the abuse was carried out in?
 

Sancus

Well-Known Member
This bit I've highlighted stands out a mile.

How can they say this and exclude the two biggest offenders?

In care? Are children not in your care when you take them on trips to other countries?
To exclude the 2 biggest offenders is a failure of a duty of care in itself.

Re trips abroad. Insurance is required. These players would have been insured (or should have been). Who arranged and paid for the insurance? Although given the passage of time this may never be known.
 

Simply a Bear

Well-Known Member
Those that have a duty of care, the fit and proper personnel, fine upstanding pillars of the community. Seem to be in short supply at parkhead, instead we have loathsome liars,phonies,imposters and charlatans masquerading as a respected club. Lawwell claims it's a misconception Celtic are doing nothing regarding the abuse of youngsters in their care, chance after chance has been missed in addressing the scandal. The deception continues and dereliction of duty by those in charge of Celtic is shameful.

It is the reason that club spends so much time and money on PR.

I compare them to the Pharisees. On the outside they want appear as righteous, but on the inside, when the PR is stripped away, they are full of hypocrisy and lies.
 

Ünnëcëssärÿ Ümläüts

Well-Known Member
Official Ticketer
It is the reason that club spends so much time and money on PR.

I compare them to the Pharisees. On the outside they want appear as righteous, but on the inside, when the PR is stripped away, they are full of hypocrisy and lies.
Your sentiments of Matthew 23:27 are completely correct but the actual wording sums them up even better:


"Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You are like whitewashed tombs, which look beautiful on the outside but on the inside are full of the bones of the dead and everything unclean.“
 

Cambuslang Bear

Well-Known Member
Problematic priests within the catholic community is well documented, the influence they had on Celtic FC employees is their for all to see. Winning, O'Brien and Devine regularly attended functions and games, no doubt contributed how to deal with Celtic's recurring abuse problems. The fact their is no transparency and the club has went to great lengths to protect individuals and the brand speaks volumes. When Johnny Doyle heard of a young player being abused, he approached the club and a local priest, surely the appropriate action should have been the authorities.
I'm almost certain he died due to an electrical 'accident'. Could it possibly be linked?
 
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Speminalium8

Well-Known Member
Could be wrong here but I'm sure that was the after-the-act risible excuse trotted out when the question was asked, maybe in the toytown parliament?
What I took out of Gazza's question was who was behind the exclusions? Who in the Natzis, when the terms of the inquiry were being framed, initially championed the free pass for protected pederasts?
Again, might be wrong.
I wonder if the minutes of the meeting are available under freedom of information to see who put forward and supported the inexplicable decision to exclude Sporting and Religious groups?
 

Commentator

Well-Known Member
I wonder if the minutes of the meeting are available under freedom of information to see who put forward and supported the inexplicable decision to exclude Sporting and Religious groups?
If this wasn't the rebublic of Shitland that'd be a great suggestion. I'd bet my baws that the prime mover in this isn't explicitly identified anywhere. They've learned how to work in the shadows from the organisation that's been doing it for 1400 years.
 

Bluenose Whistler

Well-Known Member
Has Matt McGlone editor/owner of NTV fanzine and hater of the old board ever been asked for his comments on the abuse? With his pure contempt for McGinn Kelly White & Co and that no love was lost between both parties he must have heard how shall l put it 'whispers' regards the boys club and could be a per son of interest to Plod IF any investigation gets underway.
 

alexg123

Well-Known Member
Exactly.

There must be a reason why politicians of all persuasions over many years have swerved this subject. Raising the topic would surely improve their credibility by actually dealing with a major historic issue and gain them votes on the back of it.

Can only conclude that there must be an underlying reason for the inaction, be it sporting or religious allegiance and influence, protecting friends/acquaintances, peer pressure or, dare I say it, involvement.
Whatever the reasons for the Politicians swerving the situation it certainly isn't doing the victims any favours and they are the ones who should be getting all the help they can muster especially from Politicians Taffy .
 

jf1960

Well-Known Member
Great finds on Kelly BN94. This man needs investigated. He clearly knows what went on. He is being let of the hook also by our compliant media. He's one, I think, who knows every sordid detail.
I've no doubt kelly's involved with seeing pictures of him with priests and of course Saville wonder if there any other pictures or info about him out there wouldn't mind seeing it if there is
 

DadoBear

Well-Known Member
Your sentiments of Matthew 23:27 are completely correct but the actual wording sums them up even better:


"Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You are like whitewashed tombs, which look beautiful on the outside but on the inside are full of the bones of the dead and everything unclean.“
What is that mumbo jumbo all about and who wrote it?
 

Ünnëcëssärÿ Ümläüts

Well-Known Member
Official Ticketer
What is that mumbo jumbo all about and who wrote it?
It’s the Bible mate. Something that lot claim to follow. Considering the thread we’re in I’ll leave any comedy out, and whether you believe it or not that’s up to you. It’s from Matthew 23 verse 27. @Simply a Bear paraphrased the verse and I felt the full quote was even stronger and more applicable.

For context it’s the words of Jesus who was looking at the religious leaders of the time (The Pharisees). The made themselves out to be good and pious, but inside were hypocrites . In another thread I’d be happy to go into it more.

But that’s it. It’s from the Bible. Jesus said it, and it’s in the New Testament, book of Matthew, which you can read online if you’re interested.
 
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Timskelper

Well-Known Member

AbronhillBear

Well-Known Member
Decided to go right back to the start and have a look at how celtic came to be. Without too much digging into their founder Brother Walfrid or Andrew Kerins as he was born as. He was a co founder of St Josephs college in Dumfries. Founded by the Marist Brothers which he was one of. Fast forward to the present day and they are part of the Scottish Child Abuse Inquiry where a man who was abused there between 1971 and 1975 describes it as "nothing more than a paedophile ring".

Quite the coincidence that two organisations that he founded are abusing boys in the 70s
 
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