Celtic not getting ‘their’ officials in Europe

[williewoodburn]

%^*& sakes , who cares . Mental that you’d post this after such a lovely night for us.

You can learn a lot from stats. Maybe you should try it sometime.

 

[Captain Steve Rogers]

I heard two mentally challengeds in the coffee shop moaning about the ref and the penalty decision this morning.

The penalty was as clear as day! They're absolutely deluded.

 

[Vince]

="Vince, post: 4376552, member: 7545"]
Last 5 European games for them and us:

Celtic ... 59 fouls conceded: 15 yellow / 1 red (3.6 fouls per card on average)
Rangers ... 59 fouls concede: 17 yellow (3.4 fouls per card)

Our fouls conceded are exactly the same and as expected our cards per foul is averaging around the same. Both teams being officiated to similar standards it seems.

Now let’s look at the last 5 SPFL games:

Celtic ... 51 fouls conceded: 2 yellow (25.5 fouls per card)
Rangers ... 68 fouls conceded: 7 yellow / 1 red (8.5 fouls per card)

Celtic are unique, rooted to the bottom of the disciplinary table - and out on their own in the SPFL with these averages. For example look at Kilmarnock who have the closest foul count next to Celtic with just 2 more fouls conceded:

Kilmarnock ... 53 fouls conceded: 10 yellow (5.3 fouls per card)

This has been going on since we came back up. The stats don’t make sense as they should average out by and large - like they do in Europe. Either this is corrupt, or Celtic foul differently - and then they must foul differently again in Europe.

Considering the long-term pattern, and the blatant avoidance of Madden to dish out two yellows to McGregor in the game vs them, the avoidance of booking them for repeated fouls - well I’m going for corruption.

That's great information to have.

Would be better comparing over a longer time than 5 games if anyone can be bothered putting in the work.
[/QUOTE]


The 5 games was just a direct comparison to our 5 league games already played. It has been largely the same ‘anomaly’ over years now. I remember the same post being made last season and in previous years also.

 

[Beer Belly Loyal]

It's only 1 game, but it's them that sits bottom of the Europa League discipline table.



They sit top for the number of fouls committed too.



Strange that innit?

 

[jigster]

Last 5 European games for them and us:

Celtic ... 59 fouls conceded: 15 yellow / 1 red (3.6 fouls per card on average)
Rangers ... 59 fouls concede: 17 yellow (3.4 fouls per card)

Our fouls conceded are exactly the same and as expected our cards per foul is averaging around the same. Both teams being officiated to similar standards it seems.

Now let’s look at the last 5 SPFL games:

Celtic ... 51 fouls conceded: 2 yellow (25.5 fouls per card)
Rangers ... 68 fouls conceded: 7 yellow / 1 red (8.5 fouls per card)

Celtic are unique, rooted to the bottom of the disciplinary table - and out on their own in the SPFL with these averages. For example look at Kilmarnock who have the closest foul count next to Celtic with just 2 more fouls conceded:

Kilmarnock ... 53 fouls conceded: 10 yellow (5.3 fouls per card)

This has been going on since we came back up. The stats don’t make sense as they should average out by and large - like they do in Europe. Either this is corrupt, or Celtic foul differently - and then they must foul differently again in Europe.

Considering the long-term pattern, and the blatant avoidance of Madden to dish out two yellows to McGregor in the game vs them, the avoidance of booking them for repeated fouls - well I’m going for corruption.

i actually think thats because of the standard of opposition in both competitions its very rare to think that teams such as Rangers or celtc in Scotland will commit as much fouls as st mirren /Livingston/ hamilton/aberdeen, where in Europe the standard is more level so fouls will be similar in that competition

 

[Vince]

i actually think thats because of the standard of opposition in both competitions its very rare to think that teams such as Rangers or celtc in Scotland will commit as much fouls as st mirren /Livingston/ hamilton/aberdeen, where in Europe the standard is more level so fouls will be similar in that competition

Rangers ‘are’ among teams like Livingston and Motherwell etc as far as Scottish stats go. Take a look at the disciplinary record since we came up. The point is that Europe is the only place where Celtic kind of match us in the disciplinary stakes. In Scotland we are at the opposite end of the rules being applied.

I don’t know if you noticed but Celtic were a very physical team at Ibrox who didn’t mess around with any niceties. They can do this in Scotland without getting the cards we might. They do it in Europe and and they get treated just like us.

 

[AC_55]

25 fouls per card is absolutely incredible. So much so that I struggle to believe it's genuine.

Staggering mate. The other clubs should be bringing this up.

 

[jigster]

Rangers ‘are’ among teams like Livingston and Motherwell etc as far as Scottish stats go. Take a look at the disciplinary record since we came up. The point is that Europe is the only place where Celtic kind of match us in the disciplinary stakes. In Scotland we are at the opposite end of the rules being applied.

I don’t know if you noticed but Celtic were a very physical team at Ibrox who didn’t mess around with any niceties. They can do this in Scotland without getting the cards we might. They do it in Europe and and they get treated just like us.

but against every other side they know they don't need to be physical , worth noting when Strachan was their manager as they had done at Coventry City previously all players at youth level who got a yellow card for dissent was immediately benched for the next game, so at a club level they obviously value discipline on the pitch because once a referee has blown they rarely if ever change their minds on their own, i'd imagine teams who do this are easier to referee in the main........

 

[giogaddi]

It's only 1 game, but it's them that sits bottom of the Europa League discipline table.



They sit top for the number of fouls committed too.



Strange that innit?

Incredible.

 

[Doctor Robert]

Well researched. I don't believe that the scottish refs set out to be biased against us. However, I do believe that their decision making is swayed by the experience that decisons against Celtic are highlighted and debated for the next week, whereas any against us are ignored. Subconsciously, they are taking the easy route.

Psychology could be a factor, but i’d say it’s handing them a massive benefit of the doubt.

 

[EKBB]

%^*& sakes , who cares . Mental that you’d post this after such a lovely night for us.

Who cares?

We are being cheated ffs. It's hard enough to compete given everything that's happened to us without the referees cheating to help them as well.

I find it quite concerning that you 'don't care' about that.

 

[Shengus Malengus]

but against every other side they know they don't need to be physical , worth noting when Strachan was their manager as they had done at Coventry City previously all players at youth level who got a yellow card for dissent was immediately benched for the next game, so at a club level they obviously value discipline on the pitch because once a referee has blown they rarely if ever change their minds on their own, i'd imagine teams who do this are easier to referee in the main........

Mate, football is a physical game. You don't go out and play less physical against lesser teams.
The argument might stand up a wee bit better if you go by possession. You have more of the ball ergo less time off the ball to make the tackles, but given that dominant teams are typically 55/45 possession it would only marginally help the beast argument and certainly goes nowhere near to explaining why another dominant team(Rangers) is bottom of the disciplinary league.

I'm fucking sick of people trying to make excuses for the beasts and for referees.
That stats are so fucking ridiculously distorted it should be beyond argument.

 

[Brick_Top]

Difference being we've always shrugged this off meanwhile Celtic fans are writing books about throw ins that went against them. Their quest to he offended or feel aggrieved has led to them being refereed to a different standard.

Its led to players staying on the park when they should be off it and penalties or offside goals that might not have been allowed elsewhere. Officials arent cheating they're just terrified to upset Celtic and their fans given the potential outcry

The amount of our support who continue to bury their heads in the sand regarding this is incredible.

We are hoping to challenge the filth for the league. That becomes one almighty task when you factor in that they are refereed to a totally different standard to the rest of the league.

It’s time to fight dirty. We need someone to get these stats out there and question why this is a regular occurrence every single season.

Put pressure back on the referees to start doing their fûcking jobs properly and stop being terrified of that bullying scum club and their scum support.

 

[Purpolaris]

I would as well but the odds wouldn't accurately reflect the chances of it happening, sadly.

The difference in quality is getting smaller, but it hasn't been negligible for the past three seasons.

I'd need to back and have a closer look at those seasons in that case - good thing I wasn't betting on cards back then!

All I'd argue is that teams who enjoy more possession and are significantly better than their nearest rivals are more likely to have fewer bookings against them. When I have a bet on cards my heart sinks when I see that the team I've bet on have lost the game, because ideally you want them to have won and have been hanging on for the victory, committing more fouls in the process (last night for instance - we committed more fouls and yellow cards). Celtic have unfortunately been the best team in Scotland for the past three seasons and their yellow and red card count matches that. They're shite in Europe, have less of the ball and need to commit fouls to get it, hence they give away more fouls there.

Scottish refs are generally poor and intimidated by them - I'm not sure these stats tell the whole story, though.

Nope, I'm not having that. 25 fouls per yellow card is probably unheard of in any other league. It's no coincidence they're brought into line when neutral refs are used.

 

[ClockworkOrange]

Nope, I'm not having that. 25 fouls per yellow card is probably unheard of in any other league. It's no coincidence they're brought into line when neutral refs are used.

You've not really understood my point, have you?

The number in the league SHOULD be higher but still significantly SMALLER than European figures.

 

[Vince]

Mate, football is a physical game. You don't go out and play less physical against lesser teams.
The argument might stand up a wee bit better if you go by possession. You have more of the ball ergo less time off the ball to make the tackles, but given that dominant teams are typically 55/45 possession it would only marginally help the beast argument and certainly goes nowhere near to explaining why another dominant team(Rangers) is bottom of the disciplinary league.

I'm fucking sick of people trying to make excuses for the beasts and for referees.
That stats are so fucking ridiculously distorted it should be beyond argument.

Yep it’s incredible mate. You highlighted the best! .... Celtic only play tough against us