They do. It's called the Champions League.
Or plastic fansAny club with a plastic pitch preferably.
I think, for the good of the leagues, it would be a good idea to merge teams - far too many teams for such a small country - and far too many of them have an average attendance that is pretty woeful.With it being highly unlikely we will see fans at games until next year, the financial strain on some will be huge. Aberdeen are selling the 9 million dollar man (snigger) so should manage but many others will be on the slippery slope to oblivion.
I have always though the herd that is Scottish football needs thinning, who do we all think will be first or who do you want gone the most.
If Livingston and Alloa dissapeared, I'd love that.
To be fair, the clubs in the lower leagues have a far more hardcore fanbase than the OF. Turn up watching dross and expecting to live their life in mediocrity (at best).Or plastic fans
I think, for the good of the leagues, it would be a good idea to merge teams - far too many teams for such a small country - and far too many of them have an average attendance that is pretty woeful.
i can think of a few that i wouldnt missDon't think I want any club to disappear, tbh.
Hardly lazy nonsense.Explain the benefits.
Explain why merging teams is a good idea? Is it going to put significant money into clubs? Is it going to increase attendances when fans are allowed back into stadiums?
Or is it lazy nonsense?
Hardly lazy nonsense.
St Mirren have an average attendance of around 4500
Morton just shy of 2000
Thats 6000 say for one club, halving the expenses - selling off the land at Cappielow and thus going into a healthy financial state as St Mirren still operate in the black.
Thats just one area, you then look at the other regions and could suggest the same for quite a few regions.
Lowering the amount of clubs, and leagues. Creating a tighter pack with hopefully less of a spread of income from TV rights etc means ideally more income for said new entity which allows them to be more competitive.
Hardly lazy nonsense.
St Mirren have an average attendance of around 4500
Morton just shy of 2000
Thats 6000 say for one club, halving the expenses - selling off the land at Cappielow and thus going into a healthy financial state as St Mirren still operate in the black.
Thats just one area, you then look at the other regions and could suggest the same for quite a few regions.
Lowering the amount of clubs, and leagues. Creating a tighter pack with hopefully less of a spread of income from TV rights etc means ideally more income for said new entity which allows them to be more competitive.
Hardly lazy nonsense.
St Mirren have an average attendance of around 4500
Morton just shy of 2000
Thats 6000 say for one club, halving the expenses - selling off the land at Cappielow and thus going into a healthy financial state as St Mirren still operate in the black.
Thats just one area, you then look at the other regions and could suggest the same for quite a few regions.
Lowering the amount of clubs, and leagues. Creating a tighter pack with hopefully less of a spread of income from TV rights etc means ideally more income for said new entity which allows them to be more competitive.
Thats not how it works.
St Mirren fans and Morton fans hate each other. The idea that you'd suddenly get the combined support of St Mirren and Morton turning up for Paisley/Inverclyde Bastardised FC is absolute nonsense based on a contemptable arrogance that fans of lower league or provincial clubs can't possibly love them the same way that you love Rangers.
It's a complete non starter. Reality is that those 6500 fans would walk away from the game for the most part. A few hundred would follow their local West of Scotland League side, but most would simply give up on football.
Lower league clubs get a pittance in prize money. The financial boost to a merged team would be minimal.
The reality is these fans are far more hardcore than OF fans, 100%. They hate each other so much that the supporters clubs hold after match knees ups for eachother after each game... thats a Danny Dyer Footballs Deadliest Rivalries episode waiting to happen!Thats not how it works.
St Mirren fans and Morton fans hate each other. The idea that you'd suddenly get the combined support of St Mirren and Morton turning up for Paisley/Inverclyde Bastardised FC is absolute nonsense based on a contemptable arrogance that fans of lower league or provincial clubs can't possibly love them the same way that you love Rangers.
It's a complete non starter. Reality is that those 6500 fans would walk away from the game for the most part. A few hundred would follow their local West of Scotland League side, but most would simply give up on football.
Lower league clubs get a pittance in prize money. The financial boost to a merged team would be minimal.
Their is a real burning hatred between us, not a local rivalry.You'd be lucky to get 600.
Would you support Glasgow United if they merged us and Celtic?
The reality is these fans are far more hardcore than OF fans, 100%. They hate each other so much that the supporters clubs hold after match knees ups for eachother after each game... thats a Danny Dyer Footballs Deadliest Rivalries episode waiting to happen!
As for a minimal amount of a raise in income, it depends on your depiction of minimal?
If these fans, who are literally loyal to the core, were given the option of St Morton or bye bye both clubs due to financial ruin, I am pretty sure the majority at an EGM would vote to coincide for the greater good.
As for my love of Rangers vs their love of their club. I would suggest that the average Andy that turns up to watch St Mirren flirt with relegation each season, watch dross every week for the odd glimmer of victory is a far greater fan of their club than the 50odd thousand that turn up to see success on a weekly basis, then wilt down to the 40s, 30s and even 20 thousands when the games were literally dross at the end of Super’s reign.
Their is a real burning hatred between us, not a local rivalry.
were it to be the case that we went to the wall and merged with Thistle into Partick Rangers or Rangers Thistle, then yes I would be there loyally.
Their is a real burning hatred between us, not a local rivalry.
were it to be the case that we went to the wall and merged with Thistle into Partick Rangers or Rangers Thistle, then yes I would be there loyally.
In what way is it a stupid post?I hope to goodness you are not in charge of any forward planning in your real life. That is quite frankly, a stupid post.
In fact, that's harsh here are x6000
Why do you doubt that? Based on your extensive knowledge of my loyalties? LolIf Rangers had went out of business in 2012 and the only option was selling Ibrox and merging Thistle then I really doubt that you'd be a regular at Firhill for the new merged team. I doubt you'd follow Partick Rangers.
Why do you doubt that? Based on your extensive knowledge of my loyalties? Lol
I sat at Ibrox vs Livingston in Dec 2014 with around 20,000 others on what can only be described as Baltic conditions watching dross where you could hear a pin drop, whilst the other 30,000 seats were sat empty.
This based on your opinion, which would be viewed as even lazier as I have actually canvassed an opinion of said fan, looked at their average attendances etc.So in other words it's lazy nonsense.
Fans would rather see their clubs gone for good than support some nonsense that was thrown together for the benefit of somebody else's balance sheet.
I fundamentally disagree.Before the lower leagues had agreed a plan to return for a shortened 27 game season, it would have been possible to mothball the lower leagues for the whole of the 20/21 season. Clubs typically sign players to single season contracts so when those contracts exhausted then the opportunity was there to keep clubs going with minimal funding and to restart when we could get fans in grounds. Unfortunately the lower leagues have assembled squads on the basis of an October start so we're looking at the completely unknown prospect of streaming games as the main source of income for lower league sides. There are plenty of potential issues around the streaming platform and whether or not fans will embrace paid streaming to watch lower league football? It's a big unknown and something that clubs need to get to grips with fast.
In terms of the bigger question about the number of clubs in Scotland, it's the same unfounded arguments made by the same people. Fewer clubs is somehow seen as being in the interest of our game. Its never actually explained why a cull of teams would benefit Scottish football. Prize money is so low in the lower leagues that going from 42 to 32 teams would put no more than about £80k extra in the coffers of the remaining 32 teams. The fans of the lost 10 teams wouldn't find other clubs to follow. Albion Rovers might only have a few hundred fans but close them down and you're not going to see those few hundred suddenly start supporting Airdrie. Merge the 4 Angus clubs and you wouldn't get the combined support of all 4 teams. Merging teams rarely works. Our most recent attempt at it? Inverness Caley Thistle are disliked in Inverness and enjoy a lower public support than neighbouring Ross County.
Those in favour of a cull routinely fail to answer the basic question as to what they'd have done on a Saturday afternoon if Whyte had killed Rangers? If the worst had happened then would 50,000 bears suddenly start following their local team? Would fans start going to watch Queens Park, Edinburgh City or Peterhead? Stirling Albion perhaps? Falkirk or St Johnstone surely? Maybe Motherwell or Dundee? Or would the 50,000 who go to home games and the countless others who follow from home simply have walked away from football? Culling teams doesnt work. The problem with football in Scotland is that the general public have fallen out of love with the game. The answer to that isnt killing off teams. The answer has to be attracting people back to the sport. We need to challenge the perception that Scottish football isnt worth watching. The skill level might not be up there with the best in the world but that doesnt mean that games can't be entertaining. Scottish grounds might not be modern arenas but that doesnt mean that people shouldn't go along to their local ground. My old man took me to games during the 1980s and 90s until he died in 1995 and some of the best memories I have were the time I spent with my dad at the football - how many families go along to games these days? How many kids are making those kinds of memories with their parents, grandparents or other relatives? How many kids go along to the football on a saturday afternoon with their friends? The Terrace did a piece about a group of kids who started going to Dumbarton home games and the response on social media was massive. Everybody was quick to post that it was great to see kids following a local team with nothing more than the enjoyment of spending time together and having a laugh in mind. How does Scottish football encourage more of that? More kids. More families. More people who might otherwise be priced out of football or who may be unable to attend the biggest of games due to health concerns. Older fans. Fans with disabilities. Community football clubs do a hell of a lot to try and keep the game accessible for people and they deserve far more than to be thrown on the scrap heap to satisfy the whims of fans of a handful of big clubs.
We need to protect community football clubs. We need these places to make football accessible for fans. We need them to make football accessible for young players. We need to recognise the part that a community club can play in it's home area - providing facilities for the community, supporting local groups or projects and making the game as accessible as possible. The last thing we need is to see communities lose their football team. Doesnt matter if a team has 50,000 fans or 500 - everybody who follows their club and loves the game deserves far more respect than to see their club written off as worthless.
As the only professional club left, we would be invited into another league. Money and TV run football.
This based on your opinion, which would be viewed as even lazier as I have actually canvassed an opinion of said fan, looked at their average attendances etc.
Lets not get into the new club debate, if we were, in 2012, forced to close with no access to the “history” that goes with the club - and Sandy Jardine/John Brown etc decided to start an amatuer Rangers FC in some form, you wouldnt have followed? Or they sat down with partick and brokered a deal to merge, you’d have spent your Saturdays pruning your roses instead? Really?Because if you're loyal to Rangers then the idea of a merged new club would be an absolute turn off.
You'd follow a new club that wasn't Rangers? Really?
Its unprecedented times, challenges no business or fan has ever faced. Prior opinions only hold so much water (as does my hypothetical theory)Given that I spent 5 years on the board of a lower league supporters trust, I reckon I've got a decent handle on how the lower leagues would view mergers and club closures.
Lets not get into the new club debate, if we were, in 2012, forced to close with no access to the “history” that goes with the club - and Sandy Jardine/John Brown etc decided to start an amatuer Rangers FC in some form, you wouldnt have followed? Or they sat down with partick and brokered a deal to merge, you’d have spent your Saturdays pruning your roses instead? Really?
Given that I spent 5 years on the board of a lower league supporters trust, I reckon I've got a decent handle on how the lower leagues would view mergers and club closures.
Thats not how it works.
St Mirren fans and Morton fans hate each other. The idea that you'd suddenly get the combined support of St Mirren and Morton turning up for Paisley/Inverclyde Bastardised FC is absolute nonsense based on a contemptable arrogance that fans of lower league or provincial clubs can't possibly love them the same way that you love Rangers.
It's a complete non starter. Reality is that those 6500 fans would walk away from the game for the most part. A few hundred would follow their local West of Scotland League side, but most would simply give up on football.
Lower league clubs get a pittance in prize money. The financial boost to a merged team would be minimal.
I work in football media and work really closely with a number of clubs in the four divisions - none of them would be in favour of local mergers. Most I've ever discussed it with think it would only serve to drive fans completely away from Scottish football completely and kill off what is left. 'Merged' clubs would have virtually no support in their local areas and the diehard supporters who are the one largely keeping them afloat wouldn't put another penny in.
I've posted this point on here often enough but success means fans. PSG lost however many with their merger and their stadium is full now. ICT attendances are higher than the two previous teams and again rises and falls in line with their relative success. The feelings of a few hundred yokels doesn't have any real meaning.
In what way is it a stupid post?
Its all hypothetical, except for the St Midden fan (expecting a slap from him) sitting 2m away from me in work (as I look out to the South Stand of St Mirren Park) and his actual opinion of what he would vote in the situation.
I've posted this point on here often enough but success means fans. PSG lost however many with their merger and their stadium is full now. ICT attendances are higher than the two previous teams and again rises and falls in line with their relative success. The feelings of a few hundred yokels doesn't have any real meaning.
Totally agree and I'm someone who will champion Colts in the league. It's the same with this idea most fans/clubs lean one way or the other with the Old Firm. Most folk at other clubs couldn't give a flying one about either of us and are only interested in their club.The general consensus amongst lower league fans is that they'd consider walking away from football if colt teams were allowed in the league. Attendances at cup games featuring colt teams are rock bottom. Far too many Rangers and Celtic fans just dont accept that fans of lower league or provincial clubs love their teams as much as any Rangers or Celtic fan. It's massively disrespectful.
Once the novelty of Caley Thistle wore off, a lot of fans stopped going. Support for the team now is far lower than support for neighbouring Ross County.
PSG's merger lasted less than five years.
Was it ever higher?
Thats what buying success does, I'm not sure a Renfrewshire United would have the means to become a force in Scottish football.And almost all of their children will support Neymar and PSG now.
Higher than it is now? Absolutely.
I can think of 11.I can think of one...
I meant were the previous teams ever getting more supporters than Ross County for a comparison to be made. ICT attendances rise and fall with their relative positions in the league table. I'm fairly certain it was the case when I looked into it - and to the point above, success (whatever that means to smaller clubs) means fans.
No, they voted on it and clubs rejected it. A second vote put is into D3.