Curtis Woodhouse on Ryan Giggs

I have said this before regarding Giggs. He wasn’t as good as he was made out and that showed when at times he couldn’t get a game for Man Utd. As the poorly constructed article said, of course he was a good player but he wasn’t a great one.

Sir Alex Ferguson obviously rated him which counts for more than anyone’s opinion on here but he did also try and sell him.
 
He was a tremendous football player and a mainstay of a Man Utd team that dominated for over a decade. Also had the skill and footballing brain to reinvent his playing style after he lost half a yard of pace.

Overrated ffs :D
 
Free kicks great.But his overall game?He was probably the most famous footballer in the world at 1 point and I genuinely don't think he was ever truly world class. That's why I think he was vastly overrated his fame and name recognition never came close to what he could actually do on the field imo.
Dear God
 
its all about trophy's:

13 times English Champions
2 Champions League Winners
4 FA Cup
4 League Cup
1 FIFA World Club Champion
1 Intercontinental Winner
1 UEFA Super Cup
He does seem like a right damp squid off the park.
He did mess around with his brothers partner.

But how can he be questioned as a player with that list of winners’ medals?

Somewhere else on FF this would be called a “head shot”.
 
its all about trophy's:

13 times English Champions
2 Champions League Winners
4 FA Cup
4 League Cup
1 FIFA World Club Champion
1 Intercontinental Winner
1 UEFA Super Cup
But, apart from that.
 
I think its easier for athletic, nippy players to get a game now in a 433 that all about pressing. Giggs played tricky wingers role, at a time when the english league was all about physicality.
I do kind of see where woodhouse is coming from, but i think he overlooks the fact that Fergie didnt want 'one man teams' in the way Gerrard was at liverpool. Its easier to stand out and shine when the whole team is built around you. Maybe the closest man utd ever got to building a team around someone was Cantona.
 
Threads like this just emphasise that football managers should completely ignore the opinions of supporters when it comes to players.

Woodhouse has got the attention he craved. Some saying he never had any outstanding seasons? Hilarious stuff. He was given the PFA Players Player of the Year award in 08/09, this 18 years after breaking through. Was picked by his fellow players for numerous PFA teams of the year and is one of British football’s most decorated players of all time.

Some folk go on social media and then claim he was average? It’s the equivalent of a labourer claiming that Stephen Hawkins wasn’t as clever as he thought he was.
 
Using modern stats against him is just stupid. The role of a left winger and any of the midfield 4 in a classic 4-4-2 is completely different to that in a modern 4-2-3-1. Goals and assists are shared across the four and your front two does the rest. The fact they won every year should tell you that.

Davie Cooper averaged about 6 goals a season. That's less than the 8 Ryan Kent was criticised for last season. It would be daft to use Kent to belittle Cooper.

By the time Giggs got to that modern football, he'd rebuilt his game to be player of the year in a side which contained Ronaldo (Ballon d'Or holder), Rooney and Tevez.
 
I can kind of see his point. Giggs was a very good player but I wouldn't label him as top drawer or world class.

Remember the hype surrounding Giggs when he was a teenager ? He didn't come close to that potential
Wonder how you would rate DF and his career.
 
Trusted by one of the best in history for 20 years. English footballs most decorated player. Averaged a goal/assist every other game over 750 Premier League and Champions League games.

Cretin of a guy and definitely had poor seasons in his time but to argue he's overrated is crazy. Scary to think how good that United team would have been if they didn't have a donkey out on the left wing all those years.
 
Depend how highly you think he was rated I suppose, he is not one of the top players in the last 25 years for me but for some he possibly is and if that’s the case then I would say that he is overrated to place him up there with the ronaldos, Gerrards etc
 
I do like Woodhouse. Calling out the troll who sending abusive messages by turning up at his house.
 
its all about trophy's:

13 times English Champions
2 Champions League Winners
4 FA Cup
4 League Cup
1 FIFA World Club Champion
1 Intercontinental Winner
1 UEFA Super Cup

Except it's not. Because if we go purely on trophy count then Shovkovskiy and Maxwell are two of the top 10 players of all time...

BTW I wonder how many people have actually read anything that Woodhouse said or if they just seen the headline and jumped on it.

He says Giggs undoubtedly played a huge part in Man Utd's success under Fergie, however that doesn't mean he wasn't overrated in terms of being genuinely world class.

He also said the same about Scholes and backed it up with facts. Scholes seems to have got better with every passing year that he's retired. If he was so good why did he never win Man Utd's player of the year (Heinze, Hernandez and Valencia have all won it). He was only in the PFA Team of the Year twice in his career. Never anywhere near it in the Ballon d'Or lists. This was in comparison to Gerrard and Lampard btw, who were streets ahead of him in terms of stats and individual awards.

Scholes' biggest accolades nowadays seem to be that Zidane supposedly mentioned him being one of the best in the world at some point in time.
 
More people agreeing with Curtis Woodhouse than Sir Alex Ferguson says it all really.

As good as he was, he made a right few howlers.

He let Pogba leave on a free and played Phil Jones in centre mid instead of him.

He signed Bebe based on an internet rumour that he was good.
 
If you think Giggs was overrated you don't know much about football. I actually think when people talk about past players he is underrated. Sounds like Ryan shagged his wife tbh.
 
Ask yourselves if he would have played in any of our great teams, answer I imagine is yes, horrible man though.
 
Except it's not. Because if we go purely on trophy count then Shovkovskiy and Maxwell are two of the top 10 players of all time...

BTW I wonder how many people have actually read anything that Woodhouse said or if they just seen the headline and jumped on it.

He says Giggs undoubtedly played a huge part in Man Utd's success under Fergie, however that doesn't mean he wasn't overrated in terms of being genuinely world class.

He also said the same about Scholes and backed it up with facts. Scholes seems to have got better with every passing year that he's retired. If he was so good why did he never win Man Utd's player of the year (Heinze, Hernandez and Valencia have all won it). He was only in the PFA Team of the Year twice in his career. Never anywhere near it in the Ballon d'Or lists. This was in comparison to Gerrard and Lampard btw, who were streets ahead of him in terms of stats and individual awards.

Scholes' biggest accolades nowadays seem to be that Zidane supposedly mentioned him being one of the best in the world at some point in time.

I have to disagree, when playing for top club its about winning Scholes and Giggs were incredibly important players in a successful team.

Paul Scholes:

11 x English Champion
2 x Champions League Winner
1 x FIFA World Club Cup
1 x Intercontinental Winner
etc
 

got to say I agree with everything he says.
Sir Alex Ferguson says Giggs is one of the top four Man Utd players of all time, the other three he says you can argue over but Giggs is definitely in the top four, but I suppose someone who gave up at 26 to become a boxer like Woodhouse would know better.
 
I have to disagree, when playing for top club its about winning Scholes and Giggs were incredibly important players in a successful team.

Paul Scholes:

11 x English Champion
2 x Champions League Winner
1 x FIFA World Club Cup
1 x Intercontinental Winner
etc

That's a different point completely though. Winning as a team is different from individual accolades which is the exact point Woodhouse was talking about.

The likes of John O'Shea and Wes Brown probably have more trophies than most players, but neither were ever remotely close to being world class.

I know this thread is about Giggs, but in terms of Scholes - he was so good that Ferguson started him on the bench twice in Champions League Finals.
 
Sometimes I think people don't actually watch football. Some mental opinions about Giggs, he was a great player.
A lot of people are just clueless. An integral player in a team who dominated English football for over a decade and won 2 champions leagues and countless other medals. They could have went out and replaced him with anyone they wanted if he was just decent or average. Laughable.
 
That's a different point completely though. Winning as a team is different from individual accolades which is the exact point Woodhouse was talking about.

The likes of John O'Shea and Wes Brown probably have more trophies than most players, but neither were ever remotely close to being world class.

I know this thread is about Giggs, but in terms of Scholes - he was so good that Ferguson started him on the bench twice in Champions League Finals.
Scholes was suspended against Bayern.
 
A lot of people are just clueless. An integral player in a team who dominated English football for over a decade and won 2 champions leagues and countless other medals. They could have went out and replaced him with anyone they wanted if he was just decent or average. Laughable.

The idea he was only decent or average is laughable.

I don't think it's wrong to say he didn't live up to his 1992-1994 hype when he was considered the best young player in the world and potentially the best in a few years. I don't think he hit anywhere near that level in the years afterwards.
 
That's a different point completely though. Winning as a team is different from individual accolades which is the exact point Woodhouse was talking about.

The likes of John O'Shea and Wes Brown probably have more trophies than most players, but neither were ever remotely close to being world class.

I know this thread is about Giggs, but in terms of Scholes - he was so good that Ferguson started him on the bench twice in Champions League Finals.

You’re not seriously questioning Paul Scholes credentials as a World Class player here too are you? For information, he was suspended for the first Champions League final. He’s also regarded by Zidane as one of the best players he ever faced, but what does Zizou know about football.
 
That's a different point completely though. Winning as a team is different from individual accolades which is the exact point Woodhouse was talking about.

The likes of John O'Shea and Wes Brown probably have more trophies than most players, but neither were ever remotely close to being world class.

I know this thread is about Giggs, but in terms of Scholes - he was so good that Ferguson started him on the bench twice in Champions League Finals.

Mid 30s Scholes starting on the bench against the best club side of all time is hardly a shock and it was probably the wrong choice in at least one of those games.
 
Using modern stats against him is just stupid. The role of a left winger and any of the midfield 4 in a classic 4-4-2 is completely different to that in a modern 4-2-3-1. Goals and assists are shared across the four and your front two does the rest. The fact they won every year should tell you that.

Davie Cooper averaged about 6 goals a season. That's less than the 8 Ryan Kent was criticised for last season. It would be daft to use Kent to belittle Cooper.

By the time Giggs got to that modern football, he'd rebuilt his game to be player of the year in a side which contained Ronaldo (Ballon d'Or holder), Rooney and Tevez.
I think it’s pretty well recognised that Giggs was not the POTY that year. Didn’t he only make something like 12 league appearances including sub appearances.
It was a ludicrous award.
If he was ever going to win the award it should have been in one of his earlier years.
I’m firmly in the very good but not great camp. And never at any time did I think he was world class.
Bale on the other hand has been or at least been very close to world class.
 
I personally agree with him about Giggs.

Look at those stats. We have full backs with better stats than those. He played in a great team which dominated. Yes he won lots of trophies but he is often remembered for his goal against Arsenal.

David May won 7 trophies.
Darren Fletcher (who I do rate) won 13 trophies.
John O'Shea won 14 trophies
Owen Hargreaves won 12 trophies in his career.
Wes Brown won 13 trophies

The difference being Giggs was a major part in all his trophies, not sure same could be said about most of these. Guys such as Fletcher/O’Shea etc probably won titles when they didn’t play a great deal of games, I could put money on Giggs playing the majority in every trophy he won.
 
His goal against Arsenal in the semi final is up there with the most overrated goals there's been.

The defending is embarrassing. Not one challenge put in, they back off and back off.


Was an excellent goal and huge moment, you have to know the context of the game, that moment, extra time, down to ten against a very good arsenal side in the semi final replay, who were the defending champions and cup holders and had missed a pen in injury time of the 90, it's fair to say both success would be feeling leggy late in extra time of a long season competing on all fronts, his directness and feints contributed to the arsenal defending, and that arsenal side could defend better than most Prem sides you see now

Don't show yourself to be clueless or ignorant.
 
Someone who is always nailing his colours to our mast on Twitter. Played 300times for Sheffield Uts and also British Boxing Title holder

Well I didn’t know this. Fantastic.
Still think he has some cheek questioning Giggs.
It’s all about opinions though.
 
Was an excellent goal and huge moment, you have to know the context of the game, that moment, extra time, down to ten against a very good arsenal side in the semi final replay, who were the defending champions and cup holders and had missed a pen in injury time of the 90, it's fair to say both success would be feeling leggy late in extra time of a long season competing on all fronts, his directness and feints contributed to the arsenal defending, and that arsenal side could defend better than most Prem sides you see now

Don't show yourself to be clueless or ignorant.

Giggs didn't start the game. He'd of been fresher than most on the pitch.

The defending is horrific. You can try paint it how you like, but it was.
 
Sir Alex played a 442. Beckham and Giggs did as much work in their own half ad they did in the opposition's. Both were great team players. Neither was world class. For years both were first picks for Utd. That phuckin dunce needs to do his homework.. Even a great of the game like e
 
Giggs is a terrible person but he was a tremendous footballer.

If he was overrated Fergie wouldn't have kept playing him for so long.
 
Giggs didn't start the game. He'd of been fresher than most on the pitch.

The defending is horrific. You can try paint it how you like, but it was.
I thought Seaman was at fault too. He was leaning back and going down before Giggs had struck the ball.
 
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