Davis Replacement

cav

Well-Known Member
He plays a lot deeper than he used to, he is now basically a 6, and plays a similar role to Davis in taking the ball in deep positions and moving it forward.
That's certainly where his limited first team football had been.
When I used to watch him in their academy he played more like an 8.
Either way, he isn't coming to us, and will be playing in the EPL next season.
^ what he said regarding position and I fear you will also be correct about what league Billy plays in next season also.

Potential to be better than Barry Ferguson imo,and I was a huge fan of his.
 

Big Joke New

Well-Known Member
He's well out of our pay structure and working ethos of the club
No he isn't. Fulham dont pay huge wages. I saw a list saying Reed is on £12k a week. While I doubt that's true I don't think he would be on more than about £25k which is well within our structure moving forward
 

Ted Rangers

Well-Known Member
we are always talking about selling players for 10, 15, 20 million so why aren't we paying 10 million for a player?? Where is all the transfer income we expect going then?
To running the club without the need for generous investors. We are very early in a rebuilding programme. I expect, at the very least, for 50% of any transfer income to go into the club coffers rather than incoming transfers.
 

Big Joke New

Well-Known Member
To running the club without the need for generous investors. We are very early in a rebuilding programme. I expect, at the very least, for 50% of any transfer income to go into the club coffers rather than incoming transfers.
Exactly. I said Barisic (for example) could be sold for 20m and 10m spent on Reed. That's 50% no?
 

erskine bear

Well-Known Member
Not if we're selling players for 20m we're not
We will be if we spend £10m of that on individual players, the board have made it no secret the club needs to become self reliant.

It’ll be a few years years before we spend anything like that on a single player, if we do!.
 

Big Joke New

Well-Known Member
To running the club without the need for generous investors. We are very early in a rebuilding programme. I expect, at the very least, for 50% of any transfer income to go into the club coffers rather than incoming transfers.
There's no such thing as a generous investor. That would be a donor. Giving money withoiut expecting a return on it. The guys investing in our club will expect to make a return on their money. If they don't expect that then as I say they are effectively donors. If they do expect to a make a return then they are investors - putting their money at risk with an expectation of getting it back and more in the future. Our investors have been great for the club but they will also be the ones taking any profits that accrue. It's the same with any investment.
 

RR83

Well-Known Member
Our midfield has been excellent but would love to see more attacking threat from them instead of relying on the front three.

Think Davis has one assist all season and one goal in the LC.
 

Big Joke New

Well-Known Member
We will be if we spend £10m of that on individual players, the board have made it no secret the club needs to become self reliant.

It’ll be a few years years before we spend anything like that on a single player, if we do!.
Don't understand that - buy at 10m and sell at 20m and we're not self-reliant? you'll need to explain to me - I'm just an accountant.
 

erskine bear

Well-Known Member
Don't understand that - buy at 10m and sell at 20m and we're not self-reliant? you'll need to explain to me - I'm just an accountant.
Well, we are currently operating at a huge loss and have been every year for the past few years.

It’s unlikely the board would feel comfortable throwing around that amount of money until we in a much better place financially.

Baring in mind any signing of that magnitude would come with colossal wages.

This will take a few years, unless you want to sell every asset this summer.

I think two will leave this summer, hopefully get CL and make a couple signings in the £5-7m bracket as opposed to the £1.5-4.5m bracket we are currently using.

It takes more than selling one player to become self reliant, especially considering we’ve been living off donations from directors and have been spending above our means for a few years.

The model is buy low-sell big to maximise profit and limit outlay, obviously there are exceptions like Kent or Roofe and your £10m man.

If we do get £20m for one of our players, which remains to be seen and then spend £10m on a single player, next to nothing will go back into the club once you factor in wages and agents fees.
 
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Big Joke New

Well-Known Member
Well, we are currently operating at a huge loss and have been every year for the past few years.

It’s unlikely the board would feel comfortable throwing around that amount of money until we in a much better place financially.

Baring in mind any signing of that magnitude would come with colossal wages.

This will take a few years, unless you want to sell every asset this summer.

I think two will leave this summer, hopefully get CL and make a couple signings in the £5-7m bracket as opposed to the £1.5-4.5m bracket we are currently using.

It takes more than selling one player to become self reliant, especially considering we’ve been living off donations from directors and have been spending above our means for a few years.

The model is buy low-sell big to maximise profit and limit outlay, obviously there are exceptions like Kent or Roofe and your £10m man.

If we do get £20m for one of our players, which remains to be seen and then spend £10m on a single player, next to nothing will go back into the club once you factor in wages and agents fees.
I get all that. Well thought out. But there are a few points you need to factor in.

1. Colossal wages are not a necessity - see my other post about Reed's wages
2. If we could just rely on buying low and selling big we would be billionaires. For every player you can show me where we've made a profit in the last 10 years I'll show you 10 we've made a loss on. If it was that simple everyone would be doing it and that's not possible.
3. If you buy a player for £1m and sell him for 100% profit at £2m, you make £1m, If you buy a player for £2m and sell him for 100% profit at £4m, you make £2m. Assuming the same profit margins you make more profit turning round higher priced players. Simple economics. Plus you have better players in your team and you win trophies and generate revenue in other ways.
4. People have houses. They have mortgages on those houses. Many can't have the house without the mortgage, Are they self reliant or not? Debt is a fact of life. We operate with it so long as we can service it. That means paying back loans and interest or dividends.
5. As per my other post we don't expect donations from directors. Most of that has been loans whether converted to equity or otherwise. They will expect a return. Dave King isn't writing his money off is he?

Rangers is a big business and big business economics are what needs to drive it. We have spent plenty to get where we are. The model may well require us to keep spending plenty but there are now massive assets on the balance sheet that weren't there before. That's business. Look at Man U, Barcelona, etc etc - they have huge debts but are they scratching around behind the sofa for pound coins to buy someone?
 

Big Joke New

Well-Known Member
We and all other clubs are losing huge amounts of money due to the pandemic so we will not be splashing out on promising but untested EPL players. The pandemic has affected the finances of all clubs…..just look at ManCity. Plus we are still rebuilding and are reliant on loans for now.
Harrison Reed is not untested. What are you on about? He's better than anyone in our current midfield Davis included.

This forum is full of people saying we will get 20m for Barisic, 15m for Tav, 25m for Morelos, etc etc. So if we can get that for them why are we not expected to pay for quality players.

Who do you want to replace Davis then - have you got someone in mind for £3m? Zungu B-)
 

SouthernGer

Administrator
Staff member
Harrison Reed is not untested. What are you on about? He's better than anyone in our current midfield Davis included.

This forum is full of people saying we will get 20m for Barisic, 15m for Tav, 25m for Morelos, etc etc. So if we can get that for them why are we not expected to pay for quality players.

Who do you want to replace Davis then - have you got someone in mind for £3m? Zungu B-)
He has spent most of his career either as a sub at Southampton or on loan and only joined Fulham permanently this season He never looked like nailing a regular spot at Southampton. (I’ve seen Southampton on a regular basis so I know what I’m talking about).

This is his first full season where he been pretty much a regular starter. So yes, he’s not quite an established EPL player quite yet.

Let’s see what we get for those players in the current climate (and I hope we do well)
 

DAMac

Active Member
Davis has had one of his best seasons for Rangers right enough but quite sure S.G and his scouts will be on the look out. Just can't see them going to EPL and paying over the odds for a first team regular, they are running on a tight budget and a substantial overdraft, they will be looking first and foremost to reduce the debt and consolidate. S.G. was well informed, before he agreed to take the job what the financial situation was/is. He and his scouts have done a remarkable job bringing in potential and through top notch coaching brought players from outside the EPL on and and into first team squad, it's part of what S.G is about building from scratch or from modest expenditure with the possible exception of Kent who they had to pay maybe a tad over the odds to persuade Liverpool to release him. What's more Scottish lads are as keen now to go to Rangers as anywhere else, the S.G aura is certainly no myth.

I don't expect that policy to change anytime soon, he/they have turned a team of understated players into SPL Champions, no mean feat, can't stop asking myself where the F**K were the Scottish team managers/coaches that let Scott Arfield go unnoticed? When I think of the some buffons who did get capped.

S.G not interested in blowing scarce money on big name(s), he's after quality fringe from EPL or lower divisions that they can and will improve and they've already shown an aptitude to do just that. Canny signings like J.D, Davis at the tail end of careers have been excellent on and off the field, good and all as they are and achieved, he has plans for further improvement which will take more than a couple of transfer windows. Some will be leaving for certain ...if/when the price and time is right.
 

Polar bear

Well-Known Member
Dare I say it but I think our midfield needs pushed up 5-10 yards? We could do with maybe a more attacking midfielder? I know he signed for them, but somebody in the turnbull role?
We paid £7,000,000 for a winger.Just saying.
 

ForGodForCountryForever

Well-Known Member
Rangers aren't paying 10 million for any player
Neither they should, the likes of Ryan Kent was a one off due to the circs around bringing him in. He was a no risk and available at a cut price compared to what Liverpool had wanted at the start of that Summer.

That situation is unlikely to repeat for another target.

Davis bring such a high level mix of quality, leadership and influence hes almost impossible to replace in the sense that such a player would normally cost a fortune that Rangers cannot afford. More likely theyll have to improve the areas around his position while looking to replace him specifically if we're not to see a drop off.
 

Chester Loyal

Well-Known Member
I don’t think we’ll see a like for like replacement for Davis tbh. I think Gerrard will want a bigger, stronger, more athletic midfielder to come in to replace Davis when he eventually hangs up his boots.

I don’t think Gerrard envisioned his midfield to have a deep lying playmaker when he first came to the club but Davis has been that good he’s made that role his own.
 

MearnsUnionist

Well-Known Member
Our midfield has been excellent but would love to see more attacking threat from them instead of relying on the front three.

Think Davis has one assist all season and one goal in the LC.


It's the way we set up though.

Our midfielders are all about retaining possession, dominating the game and covering our full backs when they go forward.

We've got around 40 assists (and over 20 goals) out of our full backs this season, which is way more than any other team's midfield, or full backs.
 

Kentbear

Well-Known Member
we are always talking about selling players for 10, 15, 20 million so why aren't we paying 10 million for a player?? Where is all the transfer income we expect going then?
If we can get Aribo/Kamara/Jack/Davis/Arfield all for next to nothing that is smart, and if we keep being smart that is the way to go.
 

Chester Loyal

Well-Known Member
He most certainly is not. Another player that is hugely over-rated in here even though he wasn't good enough first time around. An English championship standard player at best.

We signed Tav and Balogun from the championship and Aribo from league 1. The idea that some of the players playing in those leagues aren’t good enough to play for us is nonsense.
 

Strathbungo Bear

Well-Known Member
Definitely won't be shopping in EPL and paying over inflated prices. The Croatian, Czech, Belgium markets along with a few others are our routes to unearthing talent for a relatively low outlay which can then be sold on at a profit.
You are correct but the English leagues are on telly so when fans are playing director of football in their heads those are the players they talk about.
We clearly have built a decent scouting network in Belgium, there is more chance of our next playmaker being a £3-£6 million signing from there.
 

Born a Barras Hick

Well-Known Member
I disagree mate, I think he is. I don’t think we should be looking to sign him though.
All about opinions mate. Anytime I've watched a very poor blades team he has been average to non-existant and I definitely agree that we shouldn't be looking to sign him. Never a player that would shine in European competition.
 

Ross_

Well-Known Member
Official Ticketer
Fleck isn't good enough.

that’s nonsense - he is good enough to play centre midfield in the SPL the issue with him is his salary requirements / transfer fee - to say he’s not good is way wide of the mark.

a player I liked the look over a few games I had seen was Lukas Provod - obviously we wouldn’t deal with Slavia as they are utter scumbags - but someone like that from a similar league maybe far more likely than 10m + and 30+k a week from an EPL team.
 
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Born a Barras Hick

Well-Known Member
that’s nonsense - he is good enough to play centre midfield in the SPL the issue with him is his salary requirements / transfer fee - to say he’s not good is way wide of the mark.

a player I liked the look over a few games I had seen was Lukas Provod - obviously we wouldn’t deal with Slavia as they are utter scumbags - but someone like that from a similar league maybe far more likely than 10m + and 30+k a week from an EPL team.
Mate we hope to be playing in the Champions League next year. Saying he is good enough to hold his own against Ross County et. al. Is no recommendation. Fleck wasn't Rangers quality when he had the chance and he still isn't.
 

rfc_chris_rfc

Well-Known Member
Billy Gilmour on loan for the season would be ideal, not sure how feasible it is. Player who plays the Davis role currently and looks extremely good at it. Would instantly come in and be the starter for us as well.
 

Burgh-Ger

Well-Known Member
Our midfield will be looked at this summer, i’m sure of it.

Sorting Jacks fitness would be a good start!!
 

ROOFE25

Active Member
You are correct but the English leagues are on telly so when fans are playing director of football in their heads those are the players they talk about.
We clearly have built a decent scouting network in Belgium, there is more chance of our next playmaker being a £3-£6 million signing from there.
Agree!
 

cav

Well-Known Member
It's the way we set up though.

Our midfielders are all about retaining possession, dominating the game and covering our full backs when they go forward.

We've got around 40 assists (and over 20 goals) out of our full backs this season, which is way more than any other team's midfield, or full backs.
I think if you were being picky you could ask for at least one of the midfielders to have more of a threat from distance while still being highly competent at ball retention and retrieval but players like that generally are out of our price range.
An example being the Braga captain possibly?
 

MearnsUnionist

Well-Known Member
I think if you were being picky you could ask for at least one of the midfielders to have more of a threat from distance while still being highly competent at ball retention and retrieval but players like that generally are out of our price range.
An example being the Braga captain possibly?


I think Arfield has contributed fairly well, when he's been fully match fit @cav.
 
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Eddie Doc

Well-Known Member
Dare I say it but I think our midfield needs pushed up 5-10 yards? We could do with maybe a more attacking midfielder? I know he signed for them, but somebody in the turnbull role?
Turnbull role? I like whoever we sign to be able to finish the game.
 

cav

Well-Known Member
that’s nonsense - he is good enough to play centre midfield in the SPL the issue with him is his salary requirements / transfer fee - to say he’s not good is way wide of the mark.

a player I liked the look over a few games I had seen was Lukas Provod - obviously we wouldn’t deal with Slavia as they are utter scumbags - but someone like that from a similar league maybe far more likely than 10m + and 30+k a week from an EPL team.
Provod and Deli stood out for me,very good players but as you say I very much doubt we'll be dealing with them anytime in the next decade.
 

GranvillusClutterbuckus

Well-Known Member
I get all that. Well thought out. But there are a few points you need to factor in.

1. Colossal wages are not a necessity - see my other post about Reed's wages
2. If we could just rely on buying low and selling big we would be billionaires. For every player you can show me where we've made a profit in the last 10 years I'll show you 10 we've made a loss on. If it was that simple everyone would be doing it and that's not possible.
3. If you buy a player for £1m and sell him for 100% profit at £2m, you make £1m, If you buy a player for £2m and sell him for 100% profit at £4m, you make £2m. Assuming the same profit margins you make more profit turning round higher priced players. Simple economics. Plus you have better players in your team and you win trophies and generate revenue in other ways.
4. People have houses. They have mortgages on those houses. Many can't have the house without the mortgage, Are they self reliant or not? Debt is a fact of life. We operate with it so long as we can service it. That means paying back loans and interest or dividends.
5. As per my other post we don't expect donations from directors. Most of that has been loans whether converted to equity or otherwise. They will expect a return. Dave King isn't writing his money off is he?

Rangers is a big business and big business economics are what needs to drive it. We have spent plenty to get where we are. The model may well require us to keep spending plenty but there are now massive assets on the balance sheet that weren't there before. That's business. Look at Man U, Barcelona, etc etc - they have huge debts but are they scratching around behind the sofa for pound coins to buy someone?
Nope. You make a profit based on the selling price of the player minus purchase price and all expenditures related to the player since then. Bonuses, salary, any outstanding payments based on the original purchase agreement, and sell on clauses being some. Maintenance of the club can’t overlook these additional costs unfortunately.

Bear in mind that the leagues you refer to are already large cash leagues. Ours isn’t. Barcelona is also very, very bad example, given the current financial state of the club. We aren’t state bankrolled unlike them. B-D

The model is about buying low and selling high. Initial huge investment was required because you cant start that process running without that.

Bear in mind that we’ve been counting on the generosity of Rangers fans with wealth to provide loans. They are doing that out of love for the club to help get us to where they don’t NEED to do that. They don’t get any significant type of return on it.

The club needs to be in the position where at any given point in time, major debts could be called in and we are still able to operate.
 

cav

Well-Known Member
I think Arfield has contributed fairly well, when he's been fully match fit @cav.
No denying that mate,but he and Jack do seem prone to injury unfortunately and I still don't think they take a shot on as much as they could do at times.
They're both fantastic at the dirty side of the game though,trying to replicate that AND pose more of a threat shooting wise tends to cost an awful lot of money.

With the best will in the world,that's just not a market we can afford to shop in for the most part.
 

BSOI

Well-Known Member
Our midfield needs upgrading if we are to keep progressing.
Any team that rests on their laurels will soon regress.
We have
Davis.....can't go on forever and we need a genuine back up for when he hangs up his boots. It's not Fleck.
Jack......magic for us but if he can't clear up his injury problems then we won't see a settled midfield
Aribo.....bit of an enigma. I really like the guy but he misses the one ingredient needed to move up a level.....desire. Strolls games imo.
Arfield......solid performer. You get 100% every time. Even when he is not at it.
Kamara.....what can I say. Best 50K signing of all time. Don't think he will be here next season.
Others.....a no from me.
When you look at this it is clear the gaffer will have incoming for the new season.
 

TylerDurden

Well-Known Member
Official Ticketer
I get all that. Well thought out. But there are a few points you need to factor in.

1. Colossal wages are not a necessity - see my other post about Reed's wages
2. If we could just rely on buying low and selling big we would be billionaires. For every player you can show me where we've made a profit in the last 10 years I'll show you 10 we've made a loss on. If it was that simple everyone would be doing it and that's not possible.
3. If you buy a player for £1m and sell him for 100% profit at £2m, you make £1m, If you buy a player for £2m and sell him for 100% profit at £4m, you make £2m. Assuming the same profit margins you make more profit turning round higher priced players. Simple economics. Plus you have better players in your team and you win trophies and generate revenue in other ways.
4. People have houses. They have mortgages on those houses. Many can't have the house without the mortgage, Are they self reliant or not? Debt is a fact of life. We operate with it so long as we can service it. That means paying back loans and interest or dividends.
5. As per my other post we don't expect donations from directors. Most of that has been loans whether converted to equity or otherwise. They will expect a return. Dave King isn't writing his money off is he?

Rangers is a big business and big business economics are what needs to drive it. We have spent plenty to get where we are. The model may well require us to keep spending plenty but there are now massive assets on the balance sheet that weren't there before. That's business. Look at Man U, Barcelona, etc etc - they have huge debts but are they scratching around behind the sofa for pound coins to buy someone?
If you're an accountant, I'm fucking glad you're not my accountant. I'm sorry, but some of your logic is utterly moronic.
 

TylerDurden

Well-Known Member
Official Ticketer
Is Paddy McNair a viable option? Seen him mentioned previously. I can't say I have seen him play often.
Has been playing centre back for Middlesbrough all season, Neil Warnock says he is the best centre back in England outside of the EPL.... His favoured position is no.10.
Certainly has a great physical presence, I think maybe a ball playing centre half is his ideal position.
 
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