Do you feel more confident in Europe with Gerrard over Smith?

songsofglory

Well-Known Member
Not comparing managers legacy at our club in any way shape or form. Walter Smith is a Rangers hero and always will be.

But, in the qualifiers last season and this season, do you place more trust in Gerrard than Smith? Smith got it bang on a lot of the time in Europe, but we had some shockers too. In Gerrard so far in Europe we have always been a threat going forward and able to shut them out when necessary. Do you think Walter would have guided us to the groups last season and the Playoff this year?
 
Walters performance in Europe is a mixed bag .

2 fantastic runs intermingled with rubbish . Gerrard has done very well with a team that by and large has underperformed for years .
 
I think Gerrard's experience of winning several European trophies as a player, combined with his own determination and winning mentality may give him a slight edge. Unfortunately, I doubt a Scottish club will ever get as deep into a European competition as we did in the Uefa cup again due to the financial disparity of even provincial clubs in the big 5 leagues.
 
It’s a fair question but I think it can be demonstrated like this: Gerrard’s team battered a good Danish team away from home while that would’ve prob been 0-0 or 1-1 under Smith. Smith, however, wouldn’t have been beaten in Moscow.

All very hypothetical and we also need to take into account the difference in oppositions faced and the calibre of each squad.

For a young manager, Gerrard knows the ropes in Europe.
 
In truth Walter's European record is woeful bar 3 seasons

1992/93, 2007/08 & 2010/11

In Gerrard's 1st we nearly reached the knock-out stages in his 1st season - Walter had us out in the 3 of 4 of his 1st 4 seasons at in the 1st European game

Gerrard still needs time to improve our European record which at times has been woeful
 
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Away goals are I think recognised as so much more important now than they used to be. Nowadays both home and away games are much more similar. Gerrard I think gets that - the teams he picks and the way we play are quite similar regardless of whether we are home or away. In Smith’s era I think there was much more of a tendency to view a 0-0 draw or 1-0 defeat away from home as a good result, hence the approach was more defensive.
 
Walters performance in Europe is a mixed bag .

2 fantastic runs intermingled with rubbish . Gerrard has done very well with a team that by and large has underperformed for years .
It's a weird one.
I don't think Walter would have got us to the groups last season.
But once in, I think he just might have got us out of it in 2nd.
 
Walter always seemed to be an away draw/home win manager. Gerrard hasn't faced the quality Walter did however seems to set out his stall to win the tie in the first leg.
 
In truth Walter's European record is woeful bar 3 seasons

1992/93, 2007/08 & 2010/11

In Gerrard's 1st we nearly reached the knock-out stages in his 1st season - Walter had us out in the 3 of 4 of his 1st 4 seasons at in the 1st European game

Gerrard still needs time to improve our European record which at times has been woeful

It's mental just how skewered Walter's European record is with us.

First time around, almost got us to the CL final and then won just 7 (6 of them qualifiers) and lost 14 of his next 26 games in four years.

Second time around got us to the UEFA Cup final and then won 1 match out of 18 in the next three seasons.
 
Gerrard probably has a better understanding of the dynamics of European football, which makes an intuitive sort of sense given how his career went. His teams go for the away goal first and pick and choose when to shut up shop, and are as equally capable of fast attacking football as they are at parking the bus. I get the impression he learned a lot from Rafa Benitez a lot of the time. We're more varied but less disciplined than under Smith, who bar one season was outwitted constantly in Europe the first time and then only really had one game plan the second time around. I love Walter and he was a lot better in Europe the second time, but still.

It think posters above have it right. Smith probably wouldn't have got us to the group stages last year or this, but we would have won the league last year.
 
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Difficult one to call

That said, our European record recently a few seasons apart is dire and some campaigns ended before they really began.

Proges, AEK, Strasbourg, Gothenburg and Kunaus give me the fear!
 
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Walter was more pragmatic and his experience during some of our Euro games had certainly eradicated any notion of exposing the team to defeats from European teams regardless of their standard or reputation. Our run to Manchester was the ultimate expression of that.

Gerrard's take on it is, I think, based on the traditional Liverpool style of make the opponent worry about you. He has shown confidence in his squad, sending them out to score more when they could have closed up shop. The players are showing a bit of courage in being prepared to take risks and it has brought it's rewards against the Danes.

For the Legia away game I would expect that he will be looking for us to get goals in Poland and maybe we will but as the quality of opposition increases a little bit of Walter's caution might not be a bad thing.
 
Regardless of who would have done better, think about the fact that we're comparing a guy who has little over a year's managerial experience with us (or anyone), with a guy who was our manager for a total of 11 years and 5 years as our assistant (as well as a coach before that with experience as Ferguson's number 2 at Mexico 86).

Gerrard has the potential to be a giant of the game as a manager, the same as he was as a player.
 
In truth Walter's European record is woeful bar 3 seasons

1992/93, 2007/08 & 2010/11

In Gerrard's 1st we nearly reached the knock-out stages in his 1st season - Walter had us out in the 3 of 4 of his 1st 4 seasons at in the 1st European game

Gerrard still needs time to improve our European record which at times has been woeful
SG is on a shoestring budget compared to Walter , and think how long ago it was.
 
Not comparing managers legacy at our club in any way shape or form. Walter Smith is a Rangers hero and always will be.

But, in the qualifiers last season and this season, do you place more trust in Gerrard than Smith? Smith got it bang on a lot of the time in Europe, but we had some shockers too. In Gerrard so far in Europe we have always been a threat going forward and able to shut them out when necessary. Do you think Walter would have guided us to the groups last season and the Playoff this year?
I think we look a more attacking side under Gerrard.2 different teams,I know.It will be interesting to see how we fair against a big gun.
 
SG is on a shoestring budget compared to Walter , and think how long ago it was.

It is how you use that budget can determine how successful you are

Walter had the money and we generally poor European wise

Gerrard has done ok and probably used his own European playing experience to help in the European games
 
TBF to Walter, some of the sides we faced in Europe were absolutely top drawer sides. Juventus & Dortmund in the same CL group one season, Ajax in another. Even AEK Athens were a really impressive outfit. We did have a few horror stories though. Out thought against teams like Grasshopper Zurich, Strasbourg, Auxerre etc.

Levski Sofia was a team we should have beat, however we probably suffered early season from the great season before. It did take a few months to get going that year.
 
If he matches Walter we will be in heaven. Although we had a lot of disappointments one match off the first ever Champions League final and a UEFA final will be almost impossible to match nowadays.

That said Steven Gerrard has been terrific so far and has given the club back its pride.
 
If there’s someone who knows the ins and outs of European Football it’s Steven Gerrard. The guy is a Champions League winner and has 127 European appearances. Do you think we would’ve got 4 away games v Midtjylland with Walter? Gerrard plays a high intensity attacking football and it’s brilliant to watch.
 
Gerrard has a remarkably good record with us in Europe, especially considering his inexperience in management. However we have been unbelievably lucky with the draws and I would have expected smith to coast through. At the end of the day smith was the far superior manager (currently) no matter who we play.
 
If he matches Walter we will be in heaven. Although we had a lot of disappointments one match off the first ever Champions League final and a UEFA final will be almost impossible to match nowadays.

That said Steven Gerrard has been terrific so far and has given the club back its pride.

Never mind one match off it, we were one goal away from the CL final. If we had scored against CSKA we would have been in the final against AC Milan.
 
Nothing against chewing the fat over stuff like this, but to be honest I'm struggling to see the point. Two different managers at very different stages of their careers, different resources, different standings regarding the gulf between the haves and have nots in Europe, and so on. Football has moved on quite rapidly in the past 15-20 years, I think its very difficult to make comparisons.
 
A bit early comparing Walter to Gerrard in European competition. In saying that, this current Rangers side always look more likely to score away from home, which is a confidence booster for both team and fans. Let's hope it continues in Poland.
 
I have always been nervous in European matches.

Right now I have absolutely no expectations of Rangers in Europe - last season was a massive bonus.

Every game we win in Europe now passes my expectations - I am just loving the journey.
 
I think Gerrard's experience of winning several European trophies as a player, combined with his own determination and winning mentality may give him a slight edge. Unfortunately, I doubt a Scottish club will ever get as deep into a European competition as we did in the Uefa cup again due to the financial disparity of even provincial clubs in the big 5 leagues.

I think you are right. We should have never left SKY in the first place, and now it will take us at least 10+ years of building a relationship with SKY in order for us to get some sort of decent TV deal. We all know the money is there, we've just fucked them around so much over the past 20-odd years that they are right to offer us a pittance.

As for Walter Smith vs. Gerrard in Europe. I always felt regardless of our opposition under Walter Smith, we always approached the game as though we were playing one of the elite clubs, which meant that we often played in an overly defensive manner when we should have been on the front foot against the majority of teams.
 
I think we'd have been playing in the Champions League qualifiers if Walter had been manager last season.
And that's no criticism of our manager, just that Walter would have turned more draws into wins in the league.
I agree with this, Walter was the ultimate Tim slayer and just knew how to get us over the line. His record is something mad like 10 titles in 12 full seasons.

Europe was a mixed bag but I think Gerrard would be the same over a longer period.
 
Yes and I look forward to the games more under Gerrard too. Even at home, Walter was too cautious with 5 at the back and such.
 
Let’s chill out a little. Walter was usually managing us in the CL, and was up against some of the elite clubs in Europe in a lot of those games. Gerrard is doing a fantastic job but we are a long way off these comparisons.
 
He's got a long way to go before we can compare him in any managerial sense to Walter. It's unfair on SG who is doing a fine job .
 
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Walters teams faced far bigger and better teams than what Gerrard has.

Gerrard has done well but really when you list the team we’ve played, Villarreal apart, you’d fancy us on any given day over the other teams. That’s not to downplay the form or achievements in Europe under Gerrard.

I do feel longer term that Gerrard will do excellently well for us in Europe. If we win the league I’d have confidence in him taking us to the CL Group stages. I also think he’d have us having a go at Ibrox which I think sometimes we are too scared to do for fear of being turned over (I’m talking about CL games).
 
We generally played at a higher level with smith than Gerrard so far. Hopefully champions league next year!
 
Too many replies disregarding the OP’s request to focus on the specific thing he asked about.

To this outsider, the answer is an emphatic yes (go back and read what the question was).

Wasn’t the main reason Advocaat replaced Smith because of Walter’s European failings (one season excepted)? And wasn’t it exactly the same in his second spell? You never knew how Rangers would perform in Europe under Smith; under Gerrard it feels like you have the potential to win every game.
 
It is how you use that budget can determine how successful you are

Walter had the money and we generally poor European wise

Gerrard has done ok and probably used his own European playing experience to help in the European games
I would say better than ok, most of the time bar a couple of seasons ,i never had much confidence we would do much in europe
 
Never mind one match off it, we were one goal away from the CL final. If we had scored against CSKA we would have been in the final against AC Milan.

You’re right that we were one goal away but the wrong match. If we’d scored another against Marseille we’d have been through that night. The draw meant we had to better Marseille’s result in the last game which was never happening when you look at how dodgy Boksic’s goal in Brugge was.
 
Never mind one match off it, we were one goal away from the CL final. If we had scored against CSKA we would have been in the final against AC Milan.
The thing about being 'one goal away' is that it would have had to have been a winner in Marseille.
It wouldn't have mattered if we'd won 5-0 against CSKA in the last game, we needed Marseille to draw or lose against Bruges.
 
Walter absolutely would have. Think how he pulled us together and built a winning team when he returned the second time.
Yet, first time, with far superior players, we blew it against teams we should have battered.
Levski, Zurich, Gothenburg, Athens and more.
 
You’re right that we were one goal away but the wrong match. If we’d scored another against Marseille we’d have been through that night. The draw meant we had to better Marseille’s result in the last game which was never happening when you look at how dodgy Boksic’s goal in Brugge was.
I only saw that goal for the first time fairly recently on here.
There was a post about how dodgy their 6-0 against CSKA was but nobody ever mentioned the Bruges goal.

 
I would say better than ok, most of the time bar a couple of seasons ,i never had much confidence we would do much in europe

Given it was his 1st season Gerrard has done ok European wise probably even by his own expectations and even a bit unlucky not to get out of the group in the end but that could be sign that is usually with us in Europe sometimes

But in the whole as a regular and decent name on the European stage we should done better but we haven't and I think as you say that is is down to having the confidence to do that and probably like most of us agree with you on that
 
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