Standards1972
Well-Known Member
Wenger gave us a ringing endorsement of Paul Le Guen.
When it's British guys involved it's 'jobs for the boys' mentality but when Wenger recommends another Frenchman we've to sit up and take notice.
Pish.
Have we been conditioned to expect an underwhelming appointment?
- Thread starter Standards1972
- Start date
When it's British guys involved it's 'jobs for the boys' mentality but when Wenger recommends another Frenchman we've to sit up and take notice.
Pish.
The Ultimate Warrior
Well-Known Member
Ehmm so who has validated other Brittish candiates?
I love Laudrup but I wouldn't appoint a manager based on his word and the rest? You are saying we go Brittish based on Ferguson and Boyd over Wenger? Even at a patronising best that is fucken adoreable.
Dedé Arneaux
Well-Known Member
I just hope there's a unanimous view of the type of Manager we need.
King stated early doors he wanted a Coach rather than a Manager - We get Warburton who had ideas that just didn't work.
Then we had the hokey cokey will we /won't we employ a DOF - we didn't and we get Pedro who had a patchy track record and fell at the first hurdle (Progres)
Now we have a DOF and we are starting again. So the key question is .. what is the vision for the club short and long term. Oh and by the way, it would be nice if the board do know, they let us know as well.
(For the first time, for me, because we are running out 0f time) there simply has to be a short term goal of winning the league. Then we can think about organic growth.
Standards1972
Well-Known Member
I didn't say anything of the sort.
You've taken the argument away in a bizarre direction to do what you do best and use your arsenal of smart arse remarks.
Good one.
ManhattanBlue
Well-Known Member
I'm not entirely sure it is possible to have a long-term vision in Scottish football, at least not at Ibrox with the expectations and our financial position.
The Ultimate Warrior
Well-Known Member
Where as you are toiling to put over a convincing argument for other candidates even over..Remi fucken Garde! Grand job.
Standards1972
Well-Known Member
Brilliant, I don't put arguments across on here lad, certainly not to wee World Soccer dweebs like you.
I base my preferences on what look like the realistic candidates instead of living in a dream world and wasting my bloody time.
archimedes
Well-Known Member
Maybe our board have decided on McInnes but have asked that his appointment be delayed until after the 2 games against the sheep.
Why?
Has anyone considered what the feeling amongst fans towards his appointment would be like if he was in place prior to those games and the sheep beat us twice......
Why?
Has anyone considered what the feeling amongst fans towards his appointment would be like if he was in place prior to those games and the sheep beat us twice......
The Ultimate Warrior
Well-Known Member
World Soccer has been shit for years pal.
Don't get angry at people for knowing more than you. X
Standards1972
Well-Known Member
I know much more than you and you have a picture of a big muscly man as your avatar.
The Ultimate Warrior
Well-Known Member
Wait wit!!! Aww yer kidding!!.
Standards1972
Well-Known Member
Did you like watching him wearing his big leather boots?
The Ultimate Warrior
Well-Known Member
Dedé Arneaux
Well-Known Member
i understand your point and we do need some structure to work (spend) within e.g. presumably we will try and grow our own talent, so is the vision to have say a squad of 50% scots, half of them auchenhowie reared, plus 25% experienced pros and the remainder younger talent from elsewhere. (I'm making this shit up, but you get the jist)
The board can't make it up as they go along. that'll mean stumbling from one plan to another ...
ManhattanBlue
Well-Known Member
Auchenhowie is arguably the most important aspect of the Club at the moment. It would be terrific to see a predominantly homegrown team but that's going to take a while.
What do we do in the meantime? We don't have the money. It's a heck of a situation for the Board - and they certainly didn't help themselves with Pedro.
Dedé Arneaux
Well-Known Member
too true
in the meantime the tims must be stopped - the new Manager needs to (dare i say) do what Brenda has done and turn average players into first team regular winners
Mexi
Well-Known Member
and this is exactly why we will end up with McInnes, terrible thought process.
If you look back at the foreign managers, all 4 of them Advocaat, PLG, Warbuton and PC, they all talked about youth development, building the infrastructure from the bottom up, looking to the future, long term vision etc etc etc.
The mindset of beat Celtic as quickly as possible is what holds us back.
Is that not a contradiction? You're second post makes complete sense, it is going to take time and the support need to be patient.
Bluenose1979
Well-Known Member
It’s harder than ever in my opinion to rely on building a top side from homegrown youth. The Gibson example shows the challenge of identifying and nurturing talent at that level and being able to keep them through to the point they are regular first team players and good enough to win titles and go into Europe with real intent.
There will be exceptions (McRorie being an example) who get to the first team as proper players, but most who show the ability will likely be snapped up to bigger leagues with more money before they really do look like winning championship players.
It works in the other direction to an extent if we are able to snap up talent from other leagues, but I think as time goes on we are less likely to see an overall profit in playing terms in that respect.
It’s a shame as it would be the ideal way to do it with the facilities we have. It’s just never been as fruitful as we really hoped it would be.
Hobjo
Well-Known Member
Fair enough but I don’t see an agreement to manage McImnes out of those fixtures as being outlandish at all. Both teams wouldn’t have a manager, you get them out of the way and then the appointment happens.
It’s actually a pretty good explanation for this delay, they are stalling to smooth the deal with Aberdeen.
Alternatively we literally have no clue what we’re doing and a boardroom split is so serious that it’s impossible to compromise over any candidate after nearly a month.
The only problem with that theory is the apparently true fact that no interviews have happened. Even if there was no clear candidate, we’d have a shortlist by now with every competing board member’s man on it.
We’re either stalling for McInnes or stalling for someone we don’t know about yet.
Bluenose1979
Well-Known Member
As said before, I think we're stalling because there's a lack of consensus. I think we'll end up with McInnes because he'll be favoured as the best we can get by more votes than those who don't want him. Guesswork on my part entirely, but I think we are where we are.
Ultimately the stalling will allow for any further candidates to come out of the woodwork and did seem too coincidentally timed with the WC qualifiers ending to be accidental. I think they've failed to agree and ultimately those not wanting McInnes have said "give it til we see the lay of the land next week" in case changes happen and names crop up. Hopeful, rather than based on substance.
We'll still, IMHO, end up with Deek.
I don't believe for a second personally that we are smoothing things with Aberdeen and letting him stay til after the double-header. Just don't buy it. If it's to achieve a favourable compo deal, then even more frustrating, but again, I just see no real world value for the sheep in doing that just for the sake of those two games. I'd also expect our club to be more assertive in recognising the double-whammy of taking their manager and throwing them into disruption ahead of those matches as well as getting the new man in to work with our squad ahead of January. It's a glaring opportunity that should not be missed.
Ultimately, happy to reiterate that this is me guessing, but I feel fairly confident in saying that the timeline we are witnessing is not all just part of a planned process and also that I do think we'll end up after umpteen weeks getting the man that everyone has unofficially known it was going to be from the beginning.
Hobjo
Well-Known Member
I know I’m clarifying a speculative theory here but I don’t think the agreement is for AFC to keep him until after the games, it’s for him to go before but not be appointed until after (in effect). If there are release clauses we don’t want to pay in full - and angry Sheep fans not wanting to feel they have been shafted, there is a deal to be done.
All speculation of course, I’m proudly NITK
Well he is not Scottish and never worked in Scottish football so in this context yes I would class him as foreign?Warburton was foreign?
Bluenose1979
Well-Known Member
You mean, he'd exit Aberdeen, so not be in charge for those games, then after they had passed, sign up officially with us?
I'm not sure Sheep fans would feel appeased in any way, shape or form regardless of the mechanics. I think their club will want the money and want it in full. I think no matter what we pay them, their support will turn on McInnes and genuinely wish him death for coming to us.
I doubt their board are naive enough to think that they could ever make their fans the least bit accepting of a successful manager leaving Pittodrie to move to Ibrox.
Obviously, we're speculating as you say, but I think it will come down to hardball over compo (assuming we have agreement with DM himself, which I think will be less academic than many do) and I don't see Milne making it easy - if anything he'll want to publicly look like he made it as difficult as possible and got them a great deal.
wilse
Well-Known Member
I posted similar the other day. Again, nothing more than speculation but my reasoning was similar to yours; such an arrangement would allow all parties to save a bit of face around the double-header, regardless of the outcome.
Hobjo
Well-Known Member
It makes at least as much sense as “they’re waiting for Big Sam”
Bluenose1979
Well-Known Member
I still don't quite see what face is being saved in something so transparent?
The concerns of Sheep fans will be that they have a manager doing a good job there jumping ship to the team they hate the most and are in direct competition for second spot with.
The concerns of our fans are that we get him but delay it and miss an opportunity to get him in and get on with it.
Is there a single fan out there who would be in any way appeased by McInnes leaving them prior to the double-header and joining us after? It would be so transparent that the media would have a field day and I think supporters on both sides would feel no better off, probably the opposite.
wilse
Well-Known Member
When compared to him being in charge of Aberdeen for both of those games then joining us?
Quite a few, I'd imagine, possibly including myself.
i.e. If McInnes is to become our manager directly after the double header, I'd rather he wasn't in charge of Aberdeen for the games.
Bolt
Well-Known Member
I disagree. We also need a man manager who can get the best out of the players. Having a manager who can get the players up and in the right frame of mind is ometimes as important as a good coach. A good experienced manager with good coaches behind him.
Bluenose1979
Well-Known Member
Aye, but the offset is that if he isn't, their fans go tonto if he leaves them just prior and is blatantly coming to us. Where would Aberdeen see any benefit in such an agreement/plan?
To meet your logic above, we'd be as well just getting him in the door, no?
wilse
Well-Known Member
I think they would prefer it to him being in charge of us for the games.
Absolutely.
He should've been in the door within days of Pedro leaving.
Bluenose1979
Well-Known Member
I don't think it'll matter a fck to them. I think Aberdeen would rather have him in the dugout and maintain the idea that he is their manager to their support, than enter into what would be seen as an agreement with the devil that achieved nothing for their fans. As far as they are concerned, if he comes to Rangers, he'll be as hated as many manager or player they've had. Pissing about on an agreement like suggested above is not going to make one iota of difference to them in the real world.
wilse
Well-Known Member
You could well be right.
As I said, it's nothing more than a speculative guess at explaining why the board seem to be fannying about doing the square root of hee-haw.
Bluenose1979
Well-Known Member
Well, take this with a handful of salt, but I'm now hearing from someone that McInnes has 100% been sounded out in the background - probably via representative and common practice in current world of agents sorting deals - despite official comments (Aberdeen have not been contacted) and the hold-up may actually be more a reluctance/hesitancy from DM to work under DoF.
As I said, take or leave it, but not entirely implausible IMHO.
wsb&warmy
Well-Known Member
The scenario you've highlighted here is the scenario which I think is what's currently happening right now.
There were a few 'ITK' posters absolutely certain that Mcinnes was the boards choice and that it was only a matter of time before he was installed as our manager. The word from them was that negotiations had already started.
We're now some time on from those soundbites and still nothing. The only logical explanation for me, is that Aberdeen are currently resigned to losing him and are privately going through their own manager search in the knowledge that Mcinnes will be in charge up until after next weekends game and then probably a caretaker manager in place for the two games against us. I also believe our board are fully expecting Graeme Murty to be in charge of first team affairs until AFTER the sheep double header.
This arrangement takes the pressure off both Mcinnes and whoever the new sheep manager is.
Scenario 1: Derek Mcinnes is in place as our manager for both sheep games and loses them both. Calls for his head would probably start immediately.
Scenario 2: DM still in charge of the sheep and loses both games to us and THEN becomes our manager. There would be cries of foul play at hand as well as our own fans probably thinking he's a rank rotten manager that's just lost twice to Murty's team, so why are we going for him and not sticking with Murty or looking elsewhere?
Scenario 3: DM announced as our next manager before the first sheep game but won't take control until AFTER the 2nd sheep game. Graeme Murty to remain in charge for both those games. Aberdeen probably know who their next manager is by this point but won't announce him until AFTER both games against us. Caretaker manager v Caretaker manager for both games. Win, lose or draw in those games, both new managers starting with a clean slate.
It's all a bit long winded and a tad complicated, but this is what I think is happening just now. If we weren't playing the sheep any time soon then I think Derek Mcinnes would already be our new manager and taking the team this Saturday.
Partickger
Well-Known Member
The frustrating thing is that we seem to be procrastinating while the season is still very much alive. It's not like Pedro coming in when we were nowhere in the league.
Taki
Well-Known Member
In Scottish football, you're never more than a few weeks away from playing any opponent. We play Aberdeen in January after the double header in November/December. Do we wait until after January before appointing McInnes? He'll certainly be up against Aberdeen again very quickly if he's appointed after the double header. It seems a strange reason to delay his appointment, if that is actually the case.
Teddyjohn
Well-Known Member
Ancellotti was suggested at one point.
wsb&warmy
Well-Known Member
There's 6 league games to be played in-between the 2nd of the sheep double header at the beginning of December and them coming to Ibrox again at the end of January. So although it's not far apart time-wise, it's a fair amount of football to be played.
Sam English
Well-Known Member
I'm still convinced that McInnes will be the next manager.
Drumchapel-Bear
Well-Known Member
It's getting to the stage now that it wouldn't be a surprise if McInnes told us to ram it.
I would say we have, but it is also up to us to make our board know it is not acceptable. We need to stop them doing 10, that's my main concern and I sincerely hope it's our boards also, we'll see......
Sutton_Blows_goats
Well-Known Member
J Spaceman
Well-Known Member
So, essentially, they do not have the courage of their convictions? Assuming, of course, there is truth in what you suggest.
