Have we outgrown Scottish football. ?

[muttley]

Our spectacular runs in Europe over the last few years has not only highlighted but amplified the difference in us and the rest of Scottish football. We look like a fish out of water after European ties and thrown back into the grind of hammer-throwing opponents and brutal thuggery on the pitch, which is waived away as " normal " by Scottish refs and other officials. We look and play like a European side, and not a Scottish football team.

 

[HawfHeedHartson]

We out grew it years ago

 

[Kingging]

We did years ago. Belgium and Holland have shown the way with a cross border league.

Whether we could join the Belgians or form a Scandinavean league with Norway, Sweden, Denmark remains to be seen. The disparity with England seems to make a cross border league there out of the question

 

[Alfie shhh!]

We'd be better in a European Super League and leaving the rest to rot.

2 leagues like a Premiership and Championship if you're relegated but each full of the biggest clubs in Europe including the likes of Ajax and even teams like Frankfurt.

Anyway, never gonna happen!

 

[devilman]

We probably have. Then again we probably did a long time back.

What the other clubs in the Scottish Premiership should doing is using it as a platform to improve themselves. Generate more income for themselves and become better, to the stage where they don't go on massive runs but aren't beaten out of Europe instantly. This makes the league more challenging and everyone starts to get better as it filters down.

Sadly, the other clubs in Scotland out with Rangers and Celtic (and Celtic are still too focussed on their hate and beating us to really try) are too focussed on hating Rangers. They hate Rangers that much that it stunts the growth of their own club. It stops the smaller clubs even being properly supported as they work themselves into a frenzy that only games against one team counts.

It's very sad. Scottish football is f**ked. Between the SFA, SPFL, Celtic and the fans of diddy clubs there is just no interest in making it better. Thankfully for Scotland they've got us, even if they'll never admit it. We're keeping it alive.

 

[cambridgeblue]

I think that us dropping down postponed this conversation by a decade.

Just look at the interest in the Europa run - compared to the indifference to SPFL games - they aren't that interesting other than "did we win".

 

[RTB]

Yes, we almost need to have two teams, one to play football in the Euro comps and another team of battlers for Scotland.

 

[TW14]

I think we best just accept it as is, huge fish, small pond.

These fantasies of EPL, Scandinavian leagues etc are just that

 

[SSR]

We might have outgrown it..

But Scottish football is a cesspit we have no escape route from !!

 

[RangersEasyOK!]

We did years ago. Belgium and Holland have shown the way with a cross border league.

Whether we could join the Belgians or form a Scandinavean league with Norway, Sweden, Denmark remains to be seen. The disparity with England seems to make a cross border league there out of the question

The Belgians have a worse split than us.

Its f**king mental.

We are vastly bigger than other teams outwith them.

We should be fighting for an individual TV deal for us rather than a group TV deal. We shouldnt be looking to leave the league as its just as bad an idea as the european super league pish

 

[Sir Know it All]

the whole, let's leave Scotland thing is the chat of people who never go to games of football IMO.

 

[ao2]

Yes, and we did years ago. Sadly we are stuck with it though as UEFA have no interest in promoting clubs like ourselves, or allowing us to move to better setups.

 

[Supersonic2.0]

Swear a thread like this pops up every 2 weeks. If we have outgrown it why haven’t we won the league this year.

 

[le suede]

We haven't outgrown scottish football, we are scottish football, for better or worse, whether we like it or not.

 

[jim_baxter1960]

Despite losing the league this season we have outgrown our closest rival never mind Scottish Football.

Just look back to when we were in the lower divisions, we had the biggest attendancies in the country (by a mile) when the end result was a forgone conclusion (at least for three years it was).

Meanwhile the SPL clubs were covering their seats in huge banners pronouncing how loyal their fans were. Sell out Saturday (or Sunday, or whatever it was)? Ha Ha.

On our return to the top division THEY sold out their season tickets (on the pretence it was Rogers appointment - Aye Right).

 

[club175]

If I owned rangers I would be meeting all the other big clubs from diddy leagues and try and form a new euro league. It will happen in the future I’ve no doubt.

The big clubs from Holland, Belgium, Portugal alongwith rangers and Celtic would instantly be able to compete with every league out with Spain and England.

I’d happily trade winning every other year for watching competitive football every week where both teams are trying to win a game

 

[Ibroxkev]

Between us and the unwashed, we’re both far too big for the Scottish League and it shows when we have to play against 11 men behind the ball every weekend.

Playing against sides of a similar level in Europe is a breath of fresh air and a far more exciting watch than what we then have to put up with.

Sadly, I can’t see there being anyway out of our league.

 

[jim_baxter1960]

We haven't outgrown scottish football, we are scottish football, for better or worse, whether we like it or not.

Good summary of what I said. Original question still relevant and the answer is an emphatic "YES"

 

[JMCK]

It will be more attractive to more players, because of Rangers' run in Europe, and hopefully get better as a result. It has been steadily getting better since the return of Rangers to the Premier League; although Hearts weren't that great the other day, nor the week before. A strong Rangers will improve the League, hopefully.

 

[jim_baxter1960]

If I owned rangers I would be meeting all the other big clubs from diddy leagues and try and form a new euro league. It will happen in the future I’ve no doubt.

The big clubs from Holland, Belgium, Portugal alongwith rangers and Celtic would instantly be able to compete with every league out with Spain and England.

I’d happily trade winning every other year for watching competitive football every week where both teams are trying to win a game

Oh Dear!
Secondly - I want to leave them out of it. Quite happy to let them wither on the vine with the rest of the diddies.

 

[Shropshire_Bear]

Yes,as Michael Beale once said, Scottish Football is years behind everyone else, and he laid the blame at SFA referees who do nothing to protect the more skilful players. The lack of VAR also reflects badly on the backwater that is Scottish Football. The SFA should be looking at Rangers’ success in Europe and listening to managers and coaches who come to Scotland from other countries. Unfortunately, they only listen to one club and everything is done for the benefit of that club.
We will see how well the other clubs manage to play the unique Scottish style, in European competitions next season, and degrade the coefficient that Rangers have built up.
We should be bringing in referees from other European countries for some of our bigger domestic games, but we know this will never happen, as it doesn’t suit the one club who have their stooges in the top positions of Scottish Football.

 

[club175]

Oh Dear!
Secondly - I want to leave them out of it. Quite happy to let them wither on the vine with the rest of the diddies.

Obviously would never happen so it’s pointless suggesting it would be an option. Any move to a euro league would see both clubs invited. The same as Ajax and feyernoord and benfica/ Porto/ sporting Lisbon

 

[TheMarbleStaircase]

I think we’ve outgrown it for a number of years now, especially when it became obvious that only two teams will ever win the league and be able to compete in Europe, and as the years go on we are going to get further away from everyone else and nothing will ever change unless you have millionaires or sheiks that buy other Scottish teams and pour millions in to them so they can get to a level where they can compete with us.

The thought of a Scandinavia league or maybe some sort of cup to generate a bit of competition and excitement for other teams or even some sort of British cup will probably never happen and add the fact that Scottish football is too busy hating itself from the inside.

 

[Mynameismud]

Too many teams for such a small country is a big part of the problem here I think. There's no use in having two teams in Dundee and they have two in the same street there. How many teams in and around the Fife area too?

It's way too late to do anything about it now sadly but teams merging and less leagues should have happened years ago in my opinion.

I think we've always been to big for it but that's the price that other teams pay for not being from the biggest city I think.

 

[muttley]

Yes,as Michael Beale once said, Scottish Football is years behind everyone else, and he laid the blame at SFA referees who do nothing to protect the more skilful players. The lack of VAR also reflects badly on the backwater that is Scottish Football. The SFA should be looking at Rangers’ success in Europe and listening to managers and coaches who come to Scotland from other countries. Unfortunately, they only listen to one club and everything is done for the benefit of that club.
We will see how well the other clubs manage to play the unique Scottish style, in European competitions next season, and degrade the coefficient that Rangers have built up.
We should be bringing in referees from other European countries for some of our bigger domestic games, but we know this will never happen, as it doesn’t suit the one club who have their stooges in the top positions of Scottish Football.

Exactly. We don't play football as a " Scottish " side, which is probably why we are now appearing in the latter stages of European competition.

 

[MiseryHatesCompany]

Scottish Football hates itself.

Us and them have been too "good" for it for years.

It's needs an overhaul but the bitterness from each team will prevent it.

Best case scenario is a rich Arab decides to buy the league instead of a club and makes the prize money ridiculous

 

[robertobear]

If I owned rangers I would be meeting all the other big clubs from diddy leagues and try and form a new euro league. It will happen in the future I’ve no doubt.

The big clubs from Holland, Belgium, Portugal alongwith rangers and Celtic would instantly be able to compete with every league out with Spain and England.

I’d happily trade winning every other year for watching competitive football every week where both teams are trying to win a game

If we were to move somewhere else the last thing I'd want is the scum following us, they are like a dug shit on your boot you cant get rid of.

 

[WATP_74]

It's gonna take a small mutiny from a number of clubs, who are willing to break away from UEFA and form their own Scottish/Scandinavian league, to make it a reality.
It would take serious billions from a wealthy backer.
And breakaways like this in the past have usually failed - Kerry Packer's World Series Cricket springs to mind.

 

[club175]

If we were to move somewhere else the last thing I'd want is the scum following us, they are like a dug shit on your boot you cant get rid of.

As much as I agree it wouldn’t happen on our own.

The best thing to happen in our league would be some loaded person buying hearts and spending the £10-15m it would take to make them contenders. The league is so boring as it stands, I’d massively welcome a third or fourth team that could put up a challenge

 

[muttley]

I think perhaps the OP has been taken the wrong way, which is my mistake. I meant Rangers style of football has outgrown Scottish football. We are the polar opposite of the hammer-throwing thugs we face every week in Scotland, and it is shown in European competition. We have outgrown Scottish football, in that respect. We are nothing like the rest of the SPFL.

 

[Orange Peel]

Swear a thread like this pops up every 2 weeks. If we have outgrown it why haven’t we won the league this year.

Correct mate.
Utter pish.

 

[ALittleBitOfTheBubbly]

A mental thread in all honesty.

If we were not long after 9IAR/back to back trebles etc then i could maybe see the point, now with added European "success"

As great as getting to the Euriopa League final was, remember Fulham got there in 2010 and took Atletico Madrid to extra time. They finished top 10 that season. That's probably as successful as we would both be should we go elsewhere (and like it or not, any conversation about one of the two going elsewhere doesn't happen unless both are involved)

 

[Ted Rangers]

I think perhaps the OP has been taken the wrong way, which is my mistake. I meant Rangers style of football has outgrown Scottish football. We are the polar opposite of the hammer-throwing thugs we face every week in Scotland, and it is shown in European competition. We have outgrown Scottish football, in that respect. We are nothing like the rest of the SPFL.

Yeah, but the problem with trying to play proper football in Scotland is that our players aren't protected enough.

They're constantly booted about the park, and face 10 men behind the ball every game.

On the other hand, the other teams have no money to get or keep decent players

I honestly think we should have about 10 professional teams, with the diddy clubs being merged. Maybe they would then fill half of their grounds every week.

 

[Orange Peel]

As a season ticket holder since 1981, I have no interest in moving to England, joining a European league or any other pish like that.
I want to see us consistently winning the league and cups playing attacking football with young boys coming through the system regularly whilst living within our budget.
1 league title and 1 national cup in years proves we still have work to do.

 

[Solmask]

We did years ago. Belgium and Holland have shown the way with a cross border league.

Whether we could join the Belgians or form a Scandinavean league with Norway, Sweden, Denmark remains to be seen. The disparity with England seems to make a cross border league there out of the question

That isn't happening anymore the Dutch clubs pulled out back in April saying there was a lack of interest with Dutch fans.

 

[Ted Rangers]

A mental thread in all honesty.

If we were not long after 9IAR/back to back trebles etc then i could maybe see the point, now with added European "success"

As great as getting to the Euriopa League final was, remember Fulham got there in 2010 and took Atletico Madrid to extra time. They finished top 10 that season. That's probably as successful as we would both be should we go elsewhere (and like it or not, any conversation about one of the two going elsewhere doesn't happen unless both are involved)

Fulham aren't comparable to Rangers.

Teams like Fulham can have lots of money, and rich owners, but Rangers have a huge fan base that back the club financially.

Give us FFP and decent opposition every week, and we'd be competitive with the likes of Ajax, Benfica etc.

It'll never happen unfortunately, and it's just a dream.

It's a bit frustrating since it's probably easier to travel to Amsterdam or Lisbon than it is to travel to Dingwall.

 

[immortal7]

i'm beginning to hate SPFL football, there is no joy in any game, it has become a slog where every dropped point is a catastrophe.

as for the diddies merging, ICT average less than the old IC and IT combined, crowds would go down. why should st mirren fans lose their club because we are not happy?

 

[Dalmuirbear]

Not any different from other big clubs in smaller countries.

The difference being most other countries seem to have forward thinking folk in charge and seem to work together to make the leagues work as best as they can while here it seems like the opposite.

 

[pandager1]

Not sure we've won enough domestic trophies in recent years to say we've outgrown it.

It's entirely possible to dominate Scottish football and do well in Europe IMO.

 

[Alan_Morton]

This is just wishful thinking of pastures new. It isn't going to happen. We will get back to the bread and butter of the SPFL while hopefully maintaining the levels of success we have seen in recent years on the continent.

 

[GR3]

All I’ll say in the matter is what a come down it is, going from a big euro night at Ibrox to then playing any of the SPFL dross at the weekend.

 

[BroomloanWATP]

I was always against the idea of an "Atlantic League" or similar proposals, but I have completely changed my mind. The last few years in Europe have been an absolute joy with a couple of exceptions. The teams, the opposition fans and the officiating have all been on a completely different level to the shite, hateful cheating we endure in Scotland.

Rangers
Porto
Benfica
Ajax
Lyon
Marseilles (spit)
Braga
Red Star
Brondby
Feyenoord
Antwerp
Brugges
Frankfurt

Imagine playing those teams weekly instead of shite like St Mirren or Aberdeen who only exist to hate Rangers.

 

[DoubleWhopper]

No, our paucity of trophies in recent years suggests not.

We have, however, presented the rest of the league with golden opportunities. The coefficient is as strong as I can remember, with third place being guaranteed European group football

If they don’t kick on from this they never will

 

[Mad John]

2 Trophies from numerous attempts says otherwise

 

[Siberia1]

I think better, stronger refereeing which saw the rules enforced like they are in every other country would do a lot to drag the league into the 21st Century. Might take a short while for the other clubs to get used to it (to begin with they would see a lot of yellow and red cards) but once they realised that their hammer throwing tactics would no longer be accepted, it would force the teams in the league to play football, and over time would see the overall quality increase. Would benefit the national team as well.

 

[Arkansasgerstill]

Swear a thread like this pops up every 2 weeks. If we have outgrown it why haven’t we won the league this year.

Or the League Cup, and before Saturday, the Scottish. How tiresome these discussions are. The fantasists on FF love a theory and just ignore the inconvenient facts. Maybe when we have won most of the trophies over the previous 5-6 years, we can have this discussion. At least we have matched St Johnstone’s haul now!

 

[Govan_Guy]

We did years ago. Belgium and Holland have shown the way with a cross border league.

That initiative collapsed!!

 

[Govan_Guy]

If I owned rangers I would be meeting all the other big clubs from diddy leagues and try and form a new euro league. It will happen in the future I’ve no doubt.

Many clubs have outgrown their own Leagues (look down south for instance) - we are heading towards a European Super League but a proper one with promotion and relegation. Domestic Leagues will be feeders for it.

 

[GavCo]

I dont think outgrown is the right word. I just no longer care about it.

I recognise that more needs to be done to bring other teams up in quality by improving the running of the Spfl and SFA but we know what happens when you try to do that. They all voted to not change anything because they hate Rangers.

Hearts and Aberdeen both have a fanbase that should make the league more competitive but they are more interested in trying to bring the Old Firm down to their level.

 

[YorkshireBlue]

We'd be better in a European Super League and leaving the rest to rot.

2 leagues like a Premiership and Championship if you're relegated but each full of the biggest clubs in Europe including the likes of Ajax and even teams like Frankfurt.

Anyway, never gonna happen!

I've posted about this before, the foundations for something like this is already here.

UEFA could quite easily create this based on the coefficient table.

Champions League: Top 20 teams
Europa League: 21-40
Conference League: 41-64

A straight knockout cup competition between the 64 teams, call it the European Cup.

All 55 national leagues below that.

We go into the Europa and play teams similar to who we've faced over the last four years. It would be brilliant.