Is Klopp a better manager than Pep?

Stevethebluenose90 said:
You could say that pretty much every single season when one of the “top 6” doesn’t challenge for the title. Rarely do you see a 3-4 horse race for the title.

Another nonsense spin on things to try and diminish Liverpool’s success.
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I agree that you never see 3/4 horse race in the title and can’t remember the last time that actually happened. Same can be said around most leagues in Europe to be honest.

In the Prem however, you don’t normally see as many teams perform as inconsistent as they have done this season and that has definitely helped Liverpool.

It wouldn’t surprise me if the team that end up finishing 3rd do so on the lowest points total ever for the Prem. Leicester been terrible for months and still up there
 
Queenstreetloyal said:
I agree that you never see 3/4 horse race in the title and can’t remember the last time that actually happened. Same can be said around most leagues in Europe to be honest.

In the Prem however, you don’t normally see as many teams perform as inconsistent as they have done this season and that has definitely helped Liverpool.

It wouldn’t surprise me if the team that end up finishing 3rd do so on the lowest points total ever for the Prem. Leicester been terrible for months and still up there
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You could spin that and say the league is stronger top to bottom than it was before hence the dropped points.

Liverpool hit 97 points last season and don’t remember much people saying how poor the league is, but that’s probably due to the fact they never won the title.

Liverpool haven’t been helped by anyone, collecting almost 200 points over 2 seasons is remarkable and only a ridiculous Man City side could have got near it.
 
Stevethebluenose90 said:
You could spin that and say the league is stronger top to bottom than it was before hence the dropped points.

Liverpool hit 97 points last season and don’t remember much people saying how poor the league is, but that’s probably due to the fact they never won the title.

Liverpool haven’t been helped by anyone, collecting almost 200 points over 2 seasons is remarkable and only a ridiculous Man City side could have got near it.
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You could say that it would still overall make the league worse, what is better a strong 3rd placed team or a decent team that finish 17th?

For what it’s worth and as I’ve already said, Liverpool were a better side last season than this in my opinion
 
Stevethebluenose90 said:
You could say that pretty much every single season when one of the “top 6” doesn’t challenge for the title. Rarely do you see a 3-4 horse race for the title.

Another nonsense spin on things to try and diminish Liverpool’s success.
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It's not nonsense at all. I have nothing against Liverpool at all other than some of their fans saying theirs is the best Premier League team in history and Van Dijk is the best CB in PL history as well.

But it's not often you get such a weak version of the usual 'top 6' clubs.
 
Deano1990 said:
pep is a brilliant manager but he was at Barca with a team that picked itself, same with Bayern and Man City has basically unlimited funds. Could fire Mourinho in that as he won league at Porto Chelsea Madrid and inter
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That seems unfair to Guardiola. He inherited a team in disarray after Rijkaard left and turned them into a winning team within 1 season with a league, Spanish cup and Champions League treble. Anything after that was the result of what he did when he took over.

Agree with the rest though. He always seemed to pick clubs with infinite money but he also had them play fantastic football at times.
 
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klopp's team is more than the sum of it's parts, pep shops at the very top end, so his parts should be doing what they have done in recent times, and to me when both are on song, klopp's team is better to watch than pep's
 
cooperman said:
klopp's team is more than the sum of it's parts, pep shops at the very top end, so his parts should be doing what they have done in recent times, and to me when both are on song, klopp's team is better to watch than pep's
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Rodri, Mahrez, Laporte, Mendy, Bernardo and Ederson didn't come from the very top end.

Mendy and Bernardo came from the same club that Liverpool signed Fabinho from.

The idea that Pep is signing the best players in the world and Klopp is turning jobbers into world beaters is absolute nonsense.
 
I'd take Klopp over Guardiola.

Pep has had everything handed to him with the clubs he's managed.

Klopp has managed big historical clubs but has had to build them up.
 
They are both fantastic managers and undoubtedly improve players and teams when they go there.

IMO Klopp edges it as Guardiola, whilst having an almost unlimited chequebook at clubs, rarely buys players who improve the team dramatically. In his sides, he tends to have inherited the best players which see him through i.e. xavi, iniesta, Messi, puyol, pique, robben, ribery, Muller, debruyne, Silva, aguero, kompany.

Klopp has exceeded at Liverpool what pep has at man city (not in volume but in scale of trophy) using a fraction of the money pep has spent.
 
Forth Bear said:
Rodri, Mahrez, Laporte, Mendy, Bernardo and Ederson didn't come from the very top end.

Mendy and Bernardo came from the same club that Liverpool signed Fabinho from.

The idea that Pep is signing the best players in the world and Klopp is turning jobbers into world beaters is absolute nonsense.
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He paid top end money for the players you mentioned, no one said klopp was buying mince, his player are high end too, but not many, Alisson, Salah and Van Dijk are the only ones I recall klopp paying eye popping money for, pep does it quite often, klopp does not always need the better players to shape his team to beat anyone
 
cooperman said:
He paid top end money for the players you mentioned, no one said klopp was buying mince, his player are high end too, but not many, Alisson, Salah and Van Dijk are the only ones I recall klopp paying eye popping money for, pep does it quite often, klopp does not always need the better players to shape his team to beat anyone
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Mahrez was Pep's record transfer at £59m before Rodri signed for £62m

It's a myth that Pep spends huge sums on individual players. City have spent around the same amount on individual players as Liverpool have on the likes of Salah, Mane, Fabinho and Keita.

Liverpool have spent more on Allison and van Dijk individually than City have on a player since Pep has been there.
 
Forth Bear said:
Mahrez was Pep's record transfer at £59m before Rodri signed for £62m

It's a myth that Pep spends huge sums on individual players. City have spent around the same amount on individual players as Liverpool have on the likes of Salah, Mane, Fabinho and Keita.

Liverpool have spent more on Allison and van Dijk individually than City have on a player since Pep has been there.
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Which they more than got back with the Coutinho fee, I aint looking it up by compare the two within the same number of seasons, pep would had spent a lot more than klopp
 
Sebo1872 said:
I'd take Klopp over Guardiola.

Pep has had everything handed to him with the clubs he's managed.

Klopp has managed big historical clubs but has had to build them up.
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Klopp has been given time and finances to build them up. He's not getting that at other clubs - so he's chosen wisely.

I think they've both as good as each other. However if you ask who I'd love to see at Ibrox, then it would be Klopp.
 
cooperman said:
Which they more than got back with the Coutinho fee, I aint looking it up by compare the two within the same number of seasons, pep would had spent a lot more than klopp
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You're now resorting to comparing net spends.

Liverpool have spent well over £400m since Klopp has been there. They have an excellent sporting director in Michael Edwards who has managed to bring in a lot of money selling fringe players, but it doesn't take away from the fact that Klopp has spent a lot of money in his time there.
 
Forth Bear said:
You're now resorting to comparing net spends.

Liverpool have spent well over £400m since Klopp has been there. They have an excellent sporting director in Michael Edwards who has managed to bring in a lot of money selling fringe players, but it doesn't take away from the fact that Klopp has spent a lot of money in his time there.
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City's squad cost almost double Liverpool's did to assemble.

Pep has spent 100's of millions more than Klopp.

Can we please stop trying to deny reality on this thread? Pep is an all time great but the suggestion he hasn't had more resources than everyone else(bar madrid) in every job he's had is just a lie
 
Forth Bear said:
You're now resorting to comparing net spends.

Liverpool have spent well over £400m since Klopp has been there. They have an excellent sporting director in Michael Edwards who has managed to bring in a lot of money selling fringe players, but it doesn't take away from the fact that Klopp has spent a lot of money in his time there.
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stop making out people think klopp has spent no money as a basis of your argument on this subject, nobody has said that, a blind man can see he's spent a bucket load, but not as much as pep, and this resorting to net spend, what are you on about?you are trying to put across that because klopp spent a record on van dijk so that to you means klopp has spent more. it's like saying 1 spends 75 mil on 1 player and 1 spends 50 mil and 40 mil on 2 players, there for the one who spent the 75 mil has spent more???
 
CR5 said:
City's squad cost almost double Liverpool's did to assemble.

Pep has spent 100's of millions more than Klopp.

Can we please stop trying to deny reality on this thread? Pep is an all time great but the suggestion he hasn't had more resources than everyone else(bar madrid) in every job he's had is just a lie
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What are you on about?

I've not once said Pep hasn't had more resources.

I'm pointing out the fact that Liverpool have spend hundreds of millions since Klopp's been there and have spend more individually on Allison and van Dijk than City have on any single player.
 
Sterling, Sane, Bernardo Silva, Jesus, Ederson, Gundogan and the list could go on. What one of these were at the top of their game and best in their position in world at the point Pep signed them?

I would go as far as saying most wouldn’t have heard of half these players on this forum
 
Forth Bear said:
What are you on about?

I've not once said Pep hasn't had more resources.

I'm pointing out the fact that Liverpool have spend hundreds of millions since Klopp's been there and have spend more individually on Allison and van Dijk than City have on any single player.
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That money wouldn't have been made available to Klopp without the sale of Coutinho, Pep tends to get it anyway.

Do you think Pep would have missed out on Werner?
 
Forth Bear said:
He missed out on van Dijk and Sanchez.
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Liverpool were widely considered to have massively overpaid for VVD at the time. City had a £60m bid accepted at one point and they didn't go back in as they felt messed about.

None of this changes the fact he has significantly outspent Klopp with less time in charge
 
CR5 said:
Liverpool were widely considered to have massively overpaid for VVD at the time. City had a £60m bid accepted at one point and they didn't go back in as they felt messed about.

None of this changes the fact he has significantly outspent Klopp with less time in charge
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Nobody has said he hasn't.

The myth that Pep gets limitless money to spend and buys all the best players has been argued on this thread when it's patently untrue.
 
Forth Bear said:
Nobody has said he hasn't.

The myth that Pep gets limitless money to spend and buys all the best players has been argued on this thread when it's patently untrue.
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Limitless? Obviously not, still the most in world football though.

Latter point comes down to recruitment model and you can certainly argue he buys the best players for his system
 
CR5 said:
Limitless? Obviously not, still the most in world football though.

Latter point comes down to recruitment model and you can certainly argue he buys the best players for his system
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PSG and Madrid aren't far off City in terms of the cost of their squads.

I don't think you could argue that. He doesn't have the best ball-playing CBs or the best wing-backs in the world.

He buys players who he can develop and who buy into his philosophy. Rodri being a perfect example.
 
cooperman said:
£50 mil
£55 mil
£44 mil
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What's that got to do with anything?

Someone said Pep doesn't improve players...he's arguably turned them into some of the very best in the world, De Bruyne especially.

BTW at the end of the day, it can come down to a case of 'show me your medals'. In that regard it's not even a contest.
 
dt17 said:
What's that got to do with anything?

Someone said Pep doesn't improve players...he's arguably turned them into some of the very best in the world, De Bruyne especially.

BTW at the end of the day, it can come down to a case of 'show me your medals'. In that regard it's not even a contest.
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of course it has, having dough is a huge plus saying otherwise is not realistic, if you buy top end players, then the work needed to improve them is quite a bit less, that's just logic., I've never said pep does not improve them, I just think klopp does it better,yer show the medals, better still show the most recent ones, cause they're the ones that reflects what's happening now, and I do realise City can still won the champions league, first time pep's had a sniff for god knows how long
 
cooperman said:
of course it has, having dough is a huge plus saying otherwise is not realistic, if you buy top end players, then the work needed to improve them is quite a bit less, that's just logic., I've never said pep does not improve them, I just think klopp does it better,yer show the medals, better still show the most recent ones, cause they're the ones that reflects what's happening now, and I do realise City can still won the champions league, first time pep's had a sniff for god knows how long
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I'd hazard a guess that most people on here didn't have a clue who Bernardo Silva was before Guardiola signed him. He's improved Sterling's game 10 fold as well.

In terms of recent medals, you're making out like Guardiola is yesterday's man. He won the league last season and still wins trophies every season.
 
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