Is our defence good enough to win this league.

LoganBear

LoganBear

Well-Known Member
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Strange question maybe as our defence statistically was as good as mentally challengeds last season.

Mcgregor i would say has another season at the top in him, a good back experienced back up to challenge him is required with wes moving on so hladky from st mirren would make sense.

Arguably i would say we have the best 2 fullbacks in the country in tav and borna, patterson for me can be backup for tav and we need cover for left back.

Central defence is where i think we need to strengthen, i cant quite put my finger on it but i just dont see us winning the league with our centrebacks.
Its not that i think they are poor as i like helander, goldson, katic and edmundsen as players, they all have very good parts to their game.

Personally helander would be my first choice although i know the gaffer obviously rates goldson highly, we then have the two younger guys in katic and big george.

i would love to see us go back and try to get big jake cooper from millwall, played every game for them this/last season and is made for our league, out of contract i think so will be a few clubs down south looking at signing him. Cracking big player.

I wouldnt be too unhappy to see katic or goldson sold for decent money if we could get cooper in or even katic or edmundsen out on loan and keep goldson if funds allow.

Thoughts?

Ps our midfield and attacking options are for another thread.
 
I'd be comfortable with Goldson and Helander, although if we can upgrade on either for a decent price then we should obviously go for it.
 
Statistically, yes.

However, with my own eyes I've witnessed us concede a plethora of tragically poor, almost comical goals.

We don't concede that many, but most of the ones we do concede have more to do with our mistakes rather than genuine quality from the opposition.

I would also argue that Ryan Jack fulfils far more defensive duties than Tav. It's certainly not a traditional back 4.
 
shug1971 said:
Does his assists at the other end not count? Not being dismissive of your point I’m just being realistic
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Simply no. Look at when we have won throughout our history. By not conceding. Tavernier cannot defend well, hence he is not a defender. He is incidentally also an arrogant person without the ability. I have met hundreds of our players in the past 40 years and the only one who matches his ability v attitude was Stuart fecking Munro
 
Slim Jim said:
In a word no. We require better fb’s, Helander is our best CD but as slow as a week in the jail.
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Our first choice centreback pairing is helander and goldson.

I am just not convinced thats a championship winning partnership.

I wonder if our gaffer/coaching staff are.
 
Methilbear said:
Simply no. Look at when we have won throughout our history. By not conceding. Tavernier cannot defend well, hence he is not a defender. He is incidentally also an arrogant person without the ability. I have met hundreds of our players in the past 40 years and the only one who matches his ability v attitude was Stuart fecking Munro
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Wow
 
The Defence is good enough, Goldson & Helander are good enough, they maybe lack a little pace but if they had pace we couldn't afford them, Katic will improve and so to will Edmundson
The problem is more the full back areas, there isn't adequate cover for both Tav & Barasic
Our problem last season wasn't the defence it was the lack of goals after the winter break.
What we need is better quality squad players, the first team is good enough, players like Halliday, Flanagan & Ojo were not.
 
Methilbear said:
Simply no. Look at when we have won throughout our history. By not conceding. Tavernier cannot defend well, hence he is not a defender. He is incidentally also an arrogant person without the ability. I have met hundreds of our players in the past 40 years and the only one who matches his ability v attitude was Stuart fecking Munro
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Personally I thought Stuart fuckn Munro was decent. Very decent. All about opinions I suppose. If I played for the Rangers I would probably come across as arrogant too when I meet people I don’t really care about. Tav definitely isn’t as bad as you say though I agree he’s not great.
 
Nope. They is a weak undercurrent that carn raise its ugly head and yield cheap goals now and again.
We need to improve up front, in midfield AND in defence.
 
I thought the 4 centre halfs we have to choose from would be more than enough quality.
The backs poor at defending.
TBH the defence has disappointed me from the start of the season.
 
Its been the keystone cops at the back this season in about 10 games.
How many times have we known the other team would score,quite a few such ad 2-2 aberdeen.
 
I'm reasonably happy with our current defence. Joint lowest goals conceded in the league last season. I think most of the mistakes in the 2nd half of the season wouldn't be remembered if we had been banging in 3 or 4 goals per game, like we were in the 1st half of the season.

I'm much more concerned about adding goals to our midfield and better quality back up for Morelos - if we do that I imagine there won't be enough budget left to improve our current defence.
 
shug1971 said:
Personally I thought Stuart fuckn Munro was decent. Very decent. All about opinions I suppose. If I played for the Rangers I would probably come across as arrogant too when I meet people I don’t really care about. Tav definitely isn’t as bad as you say though I agree he’s not great.
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Well Munro for starts ignored his ex team mates when he moved toRangers.
Tavernier routinely ignores Rangers Supporters when they follow the Team in Europe. I am 57 and not looking for photos, autographs but he will not even acknowledge you with a Morning, hello etc
Ideas above his station.
Compare and contrast with the Greats, cannot be done.
 
Methilbear said:
Well Munro for starts ignored his ex team mates when he moved toRangers.
Tavernier routinely ignores Rangers Supporters when they follow the Team in Europe. I am 57 and not looking for photos, autographs but he will not even acknowledge you with a Morning, hello etc
Ideas above his station.
Compare and contrast with the Greats, cannot be done.
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I’m not comparing either of them to the greats. Unfortunately footballers are different these days we all know that. Ability wise I’m just saying Munro especially was a good left back. Tav is pretty decent as a modern day right back, he’s far from the biggest problem that’s all
 
shug1971 said:
I’m not comparing either of them to the greats. Unfortunately footballers are different these days we all know that. Ability wise I’m just saying Munro especially was a good left back. Tav is pretty decent as a modern day right back, he’s far from the biggest problem that’s all
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Munro was a better fb than Tavernier. Tavernier was fine in the lower lleagues leaving the defence wide open but he has been culpable for many goals against us at top level. Plus am I the only person who notices that his free kicks and crosses are pish now?
 
I'm not a great fan of goldson but he's not a bad defender makes the odd bad choice or has a lapse of concentration unfortunately it usually ends up costing a goal. Tav offers so much going forward but makes really basic defensive mistakes. I would like to see us try a back 3 against the weaker more defensive teams.
 
Methilbear said:
Munro was a better fb than Tavernier. Tavernier was fine in the lower lleagues leaving the defence wide open but he has been culpable for many goals against us at top level. Plus am I the only person who notices that his free kicks and crosses are pish now?
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Mate I’m not a massive fan of Tav it’s just I don’t think he’s got to go as you originally said. I’m of the opinion that he does contribute quite a lot but could be upgraded. Far from the biggest issue that needs addressing though imo
 
Steve Snedden said:
Statistically, yes.

However, with my own eyes I've witnessed us concede a plethora of tragically poor, almost comical goals.

We don't concede that many, but most of the ones we do concede have more to do with our mistakes rather than genuine quality from the opposition.

I would also argue that Ryan Jack fulfils far more defensive duties than Tav. It's certainly not a traditional back 4.
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Totally agree. Our goals tend to be gifts which the oppositions play has not merited. Too many to mention but Hamilton at Ibrox was tragic. Huge amount of play, couldn't score then one moment of madness and the game is lost. There has been too many of this type of match changing mistakes for me so something has to change. Helander, while lacking in pace, hadn't made any howlers and neither had Edmundson. Goldson and Tav were biggest offenders with Katic at St J being his worst moments. Mental issues. They are all good players but need to lose this howler stuff.
 
Tav needs more protection when going forward. Helander looks slow and not suited to the games on plastic pitch. Goldson and Katic are error prone. Borna could be more consistent but is the best of our defenders. Edmundson, Patterson and Polster have done little wrong.
 
Orange Man said:
Its been the keystone cops at the back this season in about 10 games.
How many times have we known the other team would score,quite a few such ad 2-2 aberdeen.
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These gifts wouldn't be a problem if we weren't so wasteful of chances and killed more games early.
 
When we had tav and candeias playyon our right, I mentioned to the guys who sit next to me at Ibrox that we would win nothing with that right hand side.
My mind hasn't changed. If we really have to continue with tav, then it has to be in a 3-5-2 formation or at a forward player in a 4-3-3. He just can't defend and I'm not looking forward to another season of pointless free kicks from him.
CH, I don't think we are good enough. Goodwin and katic may be our best 2 but there mistakes in them. Helander looks very slow to me but maybe with a good pre season he can do better
Barasic is the best player in our team. My only worry is with a bid comes in that we can't refuse or he gets injured.
 
i’m o
shug1971 said:
Mate I’m not a massive fan of Tav it’s just I don’t think he’s got to go as you originally said. I’m of the opinion that he does contribute quite a lot but could be upgraded. Far from the biggest issue that needs addressing though imo
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We can agree to disagree, great energy etc but not good enough at defending . When I compare him to greats it is not about ability. Greats are mostly approachable, humble and appreciative of the great benefits bestowed upon them.
 
Defence is more than good enough, could it be even better, always strive for better imo. Individual mistakes aside. Our issue wasn't conceding goals last season. It was scoring goals. We flat out stopped doing that near the end. That is what killed our title bid.
 
GeckoBear29 said:
Defence not the problem for me so IMO yes. We’ve conceded same number of goals as that mob so the problem for me is the other end
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Methilbear said:
They do not lose as many important goals,Tavernier must go.
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Just because our defence have the same goals against that mob that does not mean we can have a better defence.

As stated the yahoos don’t lose as many match defining goals as we do .
 
Stevie13000 said:
Just because our defence have the same goals against that mob that does not mean we can have a better defence.

As stated the yahoos don’t lose as many match defining goals as we do .
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"As stated the yahoos don’t lose as many match defining goals as we do ."

Why are they match defining? Simply because we aren't out scoring teams often enough.
 
We lose horrific goals, consistently.

Aberdeen away, 2 up - defensive collapse, 2 points thrown away
Kilmarnock away, 1 up, 2 awful second half goals, 3 points thrown away
Hearts away, 1 up, defensive collapse, 3 points thrown away.

That’s just off the top of my head, but the fact is that’s why we are losing leagues. We cannot defend leads, ergo, our defence is not good enough.
 
Tav and Goldson need sold and replaced with better. We are never going to win anything with them in the team for every game.
 
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