"Just need 3 or 4 more quality players"

Earl of Leven

Earl of Leven

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This has screwed us since Warburton kicked off against Hamilton. We all underestimated the problems involved in finding quality in the bargain bin. I certainly did.

We ALL hoped we would now have a spine, and some excellence around them, but again I'd bet my house on 10-12 out, and same in.

Of the quality we do have I think we will sell Alfie. And he is the forward line, all of it.

The filth have same issues but have stronger spine and squad. £900,000 for Alfie was outrageous luck and is very hard to replicate.

We're no nearer adding 3 or 4 than August 2016. I can't see how we get the investment in that we need....can we do more as fans?
 
Seems to be groundhog day again ! I still feel we are a bit behind the poets but we should be beating likes of st Johnstone at Ibrox with ease .
 
cw3038 said:
Today should have been a comfortable win.
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Absolutely mate, we are dropping far too many points to bog standard teams . I am so angry , the league was there for us to have a right go this season as the tramps have been so inconsistent.
 
PortoyMortoy said:
We're far better than back then. If you don't think so you're just being silly. We need upgrades in a couple of positions and it's important but we're not going to have to go out and get a whole new squad again in the summer
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Yes we are. Genuine class we can build title winning team around who we won't sell? Anyone? Mcgregor maybe?Also around 10-12 out at least.
 
What do we do when we lose Morelos and Kent?

Replace them with squad fillers and play the opposite way to their strengths.

Allen and Gerrard haven't exactly delivered in the transfer market.
 
Genuine class costs money,unless we get a influx of money from somewhere the gaffer will still be shopping in the bargain basement and getting loan players who cannot get a game for their own clubs.
 
Earl of Leven said:
This has screwed us since Warburton kicked off against Hamilton. We all underestimated the problems involved in finding quality in the bargain bin. I certainly did.

We ALL hoped we would now have a spine, and some excellence around them, but again I'd bet my house on 10-12 out, and same in.

Of the quality we do have I think we will sell Alfie. And he is the forward line, all of it.

The filth have same issues but have stronger spine and squad. £900,000 for Alfie was outrageous luck and is very hard to replicate.

We're no nearer adding 3 or 4 than August 2016. I can't see how we get the investment in that we need....can we do more as fans?
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We are way better this year than last imo.
I also think we just need to tough it out til the summer. Finish second. Keep it as tight to the top as we can to at least make it a contest. Maybe win the cup.
Next year if we sign those 3-4 then we will be a lot better off.

We also need a new captain. 100%.
 
Bighuggybear said:
Genuine class costs money,unless we get a influx of money from somewhere the gaffer will still be shopping in the bargain basement and getting loan players who cannot get a game for their own clubs.
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My point. We have no quality to add to...and loads of players leaving. We're no closer to the dream of core of class padded out by quality.
 
Earl of Leven said:
Yes we are. Genuine class we can build title winning team around who we won't sell? Anyone? Mcgregor maybe?Also around 10-12 out at least.
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We need more goals, the defence is fine as is the midfield from a possession and defensive perspective. What we lack is goals and that final ball from midfield and out wide. If we had a quality #10 and a couple wingers who could chip in with more goals i feel confident in saying we would be top of the league at the moment. That's 3 players in and 10-12 players out if you include some of the dross we have out on loan as well then sure maybe but of the players who are regularly playing for us? No chance nor is it needed. Also it's 2019, unless you want a team full of old players near retirement there's nobody that we wouldn't sell, not one player in Scotland fits that description unless it's the players own choosing
 
Earl of Leven said:
I'm saying what we need and not what we will get. You tell me who you see as title winning mainstay.
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Well we've won Scottish Leagues before with Kirk Broadfoot's and Steven Whittaker's. Not every player in those 9IAR squads were Gascoigne and Laudrup either.

More quality is obviously required but I feel you may be overstating it a tad in terms of numbers.
 
PortoyMortoy said:
We need more goals, the defence is fine as is the midfield from a possession and defensive perspective. What we lack is goals and that final ball from midfield and out wide. If we had a quality #10 and a couple wingers who could chip in with more goals i feel confident in saying we would be top of the league at the moment. That's 3 players in and 10-12 players out if you include some of the dross we have out on loan as well then sure maybe but of the players who are regularly playing for us? No chance nor is it needed
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Not sure.

Personally I feel our passing isn't good and we struggle to keep hold of the ball for long spells.

Our possession game has went backwards since Warburton left tbh when clearly that was the one thing he coached them to do.
 
They seem to be able to pass the ball better against the so called lesser teams that we struggle to break down. Our final pass/cross is inconsistent at best.
 
Anyone who believes we already have core of a great passing /possession based side is having a far merrier Saturday night than me.
 
Did the management feel that that the quality was in players like Defoe and Davis? If they do then we are up shit Street, they've had their time. We need leaders on the park, we are still devoid of many basics after all these years
 
Another problem is that when we do spend money, our marquee signings turn out to be either guff (Herrera, Garner), not suitable for Rangers (Peña, Cardoso, Barton), or perform below expected standards (currently Barisic, Grezda, previously Alves). Goldson is the only big money signing that has worked out so far.

When we do spend money, we need to make sure that we will get the most out of it.
 
Amato Turn said:
So how many quality signings are you saying we need then if not 3 or 4? 7 or 8? 11 or 12?
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I think part of the point is that the 3 or 4 quality never comes. We all say that's what we need yet when it comes to windows especially in the summer we lose 4 or 5 and bring in 6 or 7 of no better quality.

We've yet to have a summer window where we sign a very low number of high quality players
 
We have struggled all season to break teams down, who park the bus, they played today with a bank of 4 across the 18 yard line and a bank of 5 from 40 yards out,, and we can't deal with it,, the only way to beat this is to play fast quality football, loads of movement, first touch football, draw them out and then get behind them, we are so poor at this, against teams who attack us we are good, classic example is against the tims, we played a high pressing game, because they wanted to play against us, teams like today just don't,, we have to be better as a team, and have more confidence to beat this anti-football that's played against us on a regular basis
 
The team is clearly better than previous years. That’s why we need 3 or 4 quality players to push on, and arguably, mentality is more important than quality.

Needing 8 or 9 is fantasy stuff. We’re not a million miles away, the team is good enough on its day, those days just don’t happen enough and that’s what needs fixed.

We haven’t come close to laying a glove on the tims the last two years, so the idea we haven’t progressed is guff.
 
CaptainCourageous said:
Signing players like Jordan Jones just won't do.

More squad fillers to fill up a squad already filled up with squad players not good enough through out the course of a season.

Rodgers gets the best out of average players, Gerrard isn't.
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A guy like Jones in a game like today can get us transitioning from defence to attack very quickly and exploit space.

We struggled hugely to do that today. Was all very slow and laboured.
 
We need more than that.
We need to replace Kent most likely and Morelos.
Worral will go also so we need another centre half.
So that's 3 quality players we need just to stay where we are now.
We need to improve that midfider big time. We need another striker. We need something better than Candieas.
So that's around 7 players we need. Gonna need to get some amount of money for Morelos to replace him and have money left over to upgrade on what we need to change.
 
Bighuggybear said:
Genuine class costs money,unless we get a influx of money from somewhere the gaffer will still be shopping in the bargain basement and getting loan players who cannot get a game for their own clubs.
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Thus leading to us never catching the yahoos any time soon !
 
We never looked intrested today we should of went with the flute n defoe up front from the start.
 
Roger Smith Loyal said:
I notice a lot of the same statements getting branded now that were branded about under Warbuton and Pedro.
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That's because, in real terms, we're actually no further forward, than we were under either of them. If we are, the progress is very marginal.

It's absolutely indisputable that Stevie G has improved us - but he has improved us from being rank rotten, to very, very ordinary. We're not vastly or immensely better than we were under MB or PC in any marked or standout way.

  • Out of Europe (after an enjoyable, but ultimately fruitless run).
  • Out of the League Cup.
  • Trailing in the League, with the campaign almost certainly over.
  • Relying on the Scottish Cup, to prevent another barren season.

If we are to win the Scottish Cup, we'll almost certainly have to overcome Kilmarnock, Aberdeen, Hearts and the mentally challengeds. Is anyone confident, that this current team will be able to stand up and be counted when it matters most ?

If we don't, we almost certainly afford that shower of shite, an unprecedented Treble Treble.

The thought of that, chills my veins.
 
Earl of Leven said:
This has screwed us since Warburton kicked off against Hamilton. We all underestimated the problems involved in finding quality in the bargain bin. I certainly did.

We ALL hoped we would now have a spine, and some excellence around them, but again I'd bet my house on 10-12 out, and same in.

Of the quality we do have I think we will sell Alfie. And he is the forward line, all of it.

The filth have same issues but have stronger spine and squad. £900,000 for Alfie was outrageous luck and is very hard to replicate.

We're no nearer adding 3 or 4 than August 2016. I can't see how we get the investment in that we need....can we do more as fans?
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Disagree. This was always going to be an incremental process to catch them.

Warburton was a shyster. He had no football philosophy that worked and focussed purely on attacking flair. That was good enough for the championship (just) but we were just not at a level to jump straight to that in SPL and were found out badly.

His knowledge of English youth football was limited to a very narrow time frame but did help us get some players in Tav and Wes who were better than we should have been able to attract at the time. And he lucked out inheriting MacKay.

Pedro, for all his many many faults had a better footballing philosophy and tried to build a competitive spine. He was unfortunate that Jack got injured. And - to a degree - that his Latin defenders failed. Both had good pedigrees. But he was going for a more solid unit. He lucked out getting Morelos.

Gerrard has built on what Pedro tried and with a lot more success. We actually have a credible defence for the first time since administration. I’m not sure i’d play any player from any other side in our back 5. Gerrard lucked out on Morelos too. But building the side around him makes perfect sense. We’ve yet to see how he and Defoe can play together. Gerrard has been unlucky that Lafferty has not worked out as an understudy. Candeias does exactly what we expect him to. Kent has been immense at times. We have decent defensive mids in McCrorie and Jack. Our problem is the other 2 midfielders as we have completely failed to find individuals or a pairing who can stamp authority on games and dictate play. Morelos compensates for our complete lack of advanced midfielders.

We now have most of a spine and flair players easily up with the best in the league. Our problem is a degree of consistency, the lack of 2 quality midfielders and the fact that, without those midfielders, we cannot cope without Morelos.

Shagger through Goodson, McCrorie/Jack and Morelos is a hugely strong spine. Kent and Tav are flair additions at the top of the SPL. Barisic and Candeias are starters for anyone else with the possible exception of the filth. Katic or Worrall or McAuley are as good as anyone else in the SPL. Our problem is a lack of strength in depth and the absence of the 2 players missing from my list there.

But that is not far off at all.
 
Right now I believe that only McGregor, Kent and Morelos are comfortably of the standard of what we need.

Tav is there or there abouts, if we accept his role is mainly as an attacker and not as a robust, solid FB.

Goldson I think the jury is out on.
Katic we don't know.

McAuley, Flanagan and Wallace are all likely to be finished with us.

Barisic just isn't doing enough so far.
Halliday seldom lets us down with desire or effort. But technically lacking.
Polster we don't know yet.

McCorie has the potential. But his career could probably teeter in either direction. Next 18 months is crucial for him.
Jack, Dorrans, Arfield, Davis. Much of a muchness. No genuine fast feet / ability to drift by a man and open a team up. Jack probably the only one with a longer term future with us.
Early days for Kamara.
Grezda looks like a mistake.
Murphy we don't know how he'll recover.
Docherty and Rossiter look out of it.

Lafferty, Defoe not good enough.

Candeias I love to bits, but isn't doing it consistently enough.
Middleton I'd file the same as McCrorie.
Jones we've not seen in a Rangers shirt yet.

There's potentially a lot of work needing done on that squad. Of course, we don't have the resource to spend £3m + on various positions across most of the first XI. Therefore the one thing that will help is if we start to get the best out of the existing squad, minimising the number of purchases we will need to make. Right now I would suggest that Gerrard is struggling to do that on a regular basis.
 
I felt our recruitment last summer wasn’t quite the triumph it was greeted as at the time.

The failure to add genuine quality to the midfield always looked like it would hurt us at some point.

Jack and Arfield are solid enough performers, but they’re not of the ability to boss games consistently and have themselves in the running for POTY, and that’s exactly the sort of player we need in there.

Dorrans and Rossiter’s chronic injury woes never instilled much confidence they would be those players, so when the best we could come up with was a couple of young guys on loan, the alarm bells rang for me at that point.

On paper it looked glaringly obvious we lacked a genuine match-winning presence in the centre, and adding a 34 year-old former star of yesteryear last month was unlikely to be the remedy.

So this for me is the priority for next season - two guys who’ll go straight into that midfield and instantly improve it.

Thing is, to afford them, we probably are going to have to sell Alfie (and possibly Tav) and then we’ll have the added problem of having to replace him too.

We also need better quality out wide than we have.

Grezda has been a flop and while we still have Murphy to come back, the hard truth is that we need better than him anyway if we’re to take it onto the next level.

So, Morelos and Tav out for circa £20m and four quality players in for the money?

If only it was that easy.
 
Bigbluebear said:
A guy like Jones in a game like today can get us transitioning from defence to attack very quickly and exploit space.

We struggled hugely to do that today. Was all very slow and laboured.
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Jones is a huge upgrade on Middleton and he gets a game.
I keep reading we are much better than last year are we really though.
Morelos spat the dummy after his move to China never happened if he had kept up his good form we could have been much better off last season.
15 wins out of 26 games is that a great Improvement.
I don't see it
We have a bigger far more expensive squad bigger wage bill more backroom staff all this and no great difference in points
 
SG's rotation hasn't helped settling the fan's opinions on certain players but with Europe we have had an awful lot of games.

Whilst I'm not convinced Katic is the player many claim I think there's some kind of issue there-what it is I don't know.
We need a settled defence and LB remains an issue. Midfield we're overloaded and in particular here the rotation hasn't helped clear the picture up.

The big issue is selling your better players I would imagine Kent. Morelos and very probably Tav will leave.

The overall squad quality if we retained a few players might not be that bad but we need genuine quality players in from the fees we might receive to get us up a level....we will need to spend a lot more than we have done. I don't know if that is possible but European money and transfer fees in you would have thought we will be stronger than everyone by a distance except the beggars but we need to get these transfers right...gambles/punts of the Grezda type will not do. Massive challenge ahead.
 
DylanGer said:
SG's rotation hasn't helped settling the fan's opinions on certain players but with Europe we have had an awful lot of games.

Whilst I'm not convinced Katic is the player many claim I think there's some kind of issue there-what it is I don't know.
We need a settled defence and LB remains an issue. Midfield we're overloaded and in particular here the rotation hasn't helped clear the picture up.

The big issue is selling your better players I would imagine Kent. Morelos and very probably Tav will leave.

The overall squad quality if we retained a few players might not be that bad but we need genuine quality players in from the fees we might receive to get us up a level....we will need to spend a lot more than we have done. I don't know if that is possible but European money and transfer fees in you would have thought we will be stronger than everyone by a distance except the beggars but we need to get these transfers right...gambles/punts of the Grezda type will not do. Massive challenge ahead.
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I agree with all of this
If Alfie leaves I think we’ll prepare to play 3-5-2 or 4-4-2
I just can’t see us signing another Alfie to play the lone striker
 
Quite frankly the board need to back SG with some decent net funds.

4 and 5 loan players is a nonsense. I’d argue only Weiss and Kent have been successful loans in the last decade.

If the board can’t stump up then tell the fans that so that expectations are realistic.
 
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