Nathan Young Coombes to West Ham

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Some amount of well wishers happy to see a decent prospect go, someone find a Billy Gilmour thread to compare and contrast:D

I'm pissed off tbh always will be when we lose decent prospects for feck all before they kick a ball for us.
 
Morelos20 said:
Some amount of well wishers happy to see a decent prospect go, someone find a Billy Gilmour thread to compare and contrast:D

I'm pissed off tbh always will be when we lose decent prospects for feck all before they kick a ball for us.
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We will be getting a fee.
 
MurtyMania said:
We have a number of youths who have contract extensions on the table and aren't signing them.

Somethings going on.
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Agents promising them the world elsewhere no doubt.

Some of youths want instant success now instead of realising they aren't yet at 1st team level of ability and clearly attitude too at times.

Nathan Patterson and Lewis Mayo signed new deals and are probably the 2 out of our current crop most likely to have the tools to make our 1st team.

Others may think they're ready, but they're not.
 
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chrisinglis72 said:
We surely have to be insisting on a minimum 10-15% sell-on clause for any player being sold to a team down south, especially English youngsters.

Would be crazy not to with the amounts they tend to go for after even one or two decent-good seasons down there.
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We will be, I'm sure Rudden and Dallas have those clauses so likely most of our academy players will. The academy isn’t run by mugs anymore and is finally getting to the functional level it should have been prior to Sinclair.
 
MearnsUnionist said:
Agents promising them the world elsewhere no doubt.

Some of youths want instant success now instead of realising they aren't yet at 1st team level of ability and clearly attitude too at times.

Nathan and Lewis Mayo signed new deals and are probably the 2 out of our current crop most likely to have the tools to make our 1st team.

Others may think they're ready, but they're not.
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I'd be insulted if someone tried to tell me the likes of Dapo Mebude don't have the tools to contribute to the first team.

We'll never know if we don't give them a chance. Someone else will.
 
MSF said:
Probably seeing the boys they skud at youth level all over the world getting a chance.
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think it’s a combination of 2 things

1. The gilmour effect - young boys have egos and we arnt gonna change thst . Gerrard won’t like it but it’s the way of the world these days all because they see gilmour Playing prem football and earning 10k a week and think it should be them

2. the lack of opportunity we give youth . We have worst position in the world for that though . No other league had the position where losing 1/2 games and that could be the league over . Even down south most years the champions drop points In 8–10 games and still win . We can’t and until we win something it’s not going to change
 
Loved watching him, wish him all the best for his future. He'll be a Ranger for life, which is a status that will always open friendly doors for him.
 
MurtyMania said:
Reasons behind this one will be interesting.

If it's a simple case of homesickness, then it's understandable. He's a young boy that made a big move.

If it's about pathways or first team opportunities...
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What if it is about first team opportunities?
We’re not in a position to just play youngsters because they want to play.
 
May be homesick may be agent turning his head and impatience like Kennedy.

Seems to be a lack of patience by a number of youth players and fans writing them off young.

Look at the youngsters Chelsea getting credit for this season. All been out on loan some to 2-3 teams at least and I think all now early 20s. The impatient ones haven’t done so well. Just look at Solanke probably rich but not done anything and played hardly any football
 
Wilkinsvolley said:
What if it is about first team opportunities?
We’re not in a position to just play youngsters because they want to play.
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We are not in a uniquely difficult situation here. Every single football team has ambitious goals that they want to meet.

Young players actually enhance your ability to meet those goals, because they contribute to the team at a vastly reduced wage cost, allowing you to invest that money in other parts of the team.

The idea that young players are a liability to our ambitions is a fallacy, and I'd be extremely concerned if our management team believed in that.
 
MurtyMania said:
I'd be insulted if someone tried to tell me the likes of Dapo Mebude don't have the tools to contribute to the first team.

We'll never know if we don't give them a chance. Someone else will.
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Dapo isn't ready yet.

He went to Dubai in January and struggled with the intensity of a 2 week 1sr team training camp.

He's certainly way closer than NYC though.
 
BWO said:
Fleck was ’83 so we’re approaching 40 years without producing a proven goalscorer, terrible.
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Trying to think of the most recent mentally challenged one too.

Any since Charlie Nicholas?
 
MearnsUnionist said:
He wasn't one of our best prospects.

He was one who did well through the age groups, but his progress was stalling..

Some will no doubt try to make a big deal out of this, but anyone who watches our youths regularly will know NYC wasn't making it with us.

Good luck to him though and hopefully he can still make a career out of the game.
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I think you’re right that some will make of this more than is needed but it’s also wrong to say that a 17yr old isn’t making it with us.

Players at that age develop at different rates....some can develop quickly then drop off.....then come good again all of a sudden. It’s the consistency that is always difficult for the youngsters to maintain and at 17 this young lad had easily 4 yrs ahead of him of development time before we could safely say he was or wasn’t up to the jersey.
I do wonder how much of a fee we will get from West Ham for his potential.
 
MearnsUnionist said:
Dapo isn't ready yet.

He went to Dubai in January and struggled with the intensity of a 2 week 1sr team training camp.

He's certainly way closer than NYC though.
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Of course he's going to struggle with the intensity of what was effectively a 2 week preseason camp. It's the first time he's done it and he's competing against fully grown adults.

The point is not to expect him to breeze it, and then you know he's ready for the first team. The point is to recognise his potential, and deploy him in matches in a way that hides his weaknesses. Doing so allows him to develop rapidly.

Writing off 18/19 year olds as not ready because they aren't matching the physical performance of 22/23 year olds is daft. Of course they aren't matching that, they shouldn't be expected to. Some will, such as Patterson, but it's no wonder Gerrards youth development record is woeful if that's the test he's setting the youngsters.
 
erskine bear said:
We will be, I'm sure Rudden and Dallas have those clauses so likely most of our academy players will. The academy isn’t run by mugs anymore and is finally getting to the functional level it should have been prior to Sinclair.
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That's pleasing to hear mate. You never really know with youngsters - especially strikers - how their career might suddenly take off and earn them a multi million £ move.
 
Saddened to read this, as I thought it was a real coup when we got him initially. I wish him all the best, whatever he decides to do.
 
MurtyMania said:
We are not in a uniquely difficult situation here. Every single football team has ambitious goals that they want to meet.

Young players actually enhance your ability to meet those goals, because they contribute to the team at a vastly reduced wage cost, allowing you to invest that money in other parts of the team.

The idea that young players are a liability to our ambitions is a fallacy, and I'd be extremely concerned if our management team believed in that.
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We have to win every game and we have to win the league. It is pretty unique.

just because a player is young and wants to play in the first team doesn’t mean the manager should just play them. If the manager thought he was ready to play in the first team and cope with everything that comes with it, including the abuse for making a mistake he’d be playing. They all would be.
 
WATP said:
I think you’re right that some will make of this more than is needed but it’s also wrong to say that a 17yr old isn’t making it with us.

Players at that age develop at different rates....some can develop quickly then drop off.....then come good again all of a sudden. It’s the consistency that is always difficult for the youngsters to maintain and at 17 this young lad had easily 4 yrs ahead of him of development time before we could safely say he was or wasn’t up to the jersey.
I do wonder how much of a fee we will get from West Ham for his potential.
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I know what you're saying and I've seen exactly the same in my own sport of elite athletics and triathlon.

I was one of the later developers who caught up with and overtook athletes who had developed and matured quicker than me through the earlier National age group squads.

NYC was beginning to get caught up and overtaken by our younger players and it was going to become difficult for him to hold his place in our development side.

It's a hard thing for a young kid to deal with.
 
We might have lost young Coombes but we have signed 2 young strikers recently. The lad from Ross County and the boy lindsay.
 
Wilkinsvolley said:
We have to win every game and we have to win the league. It is pretty unique.

just because a player is young and wants to play in the first team doesn’t mean the manager should just play them. If the manager thought he was ready to play in the first team and cope with everything that comes with it, including the abuse for making a mistake he’d be playing. They all would be.
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It's really not unique, there are loads of clubs in that position. Every single league has title challengers that are expected to win every game. The vast majority are capable of bringing young players through, because they recognise the value that it brings to a squad. Academies take advantage of market inefficiencies when deployed correctly.
 
MurtyMania said:
Of course he's going to struggle with the intensity of what was effectively a 2 week preseason camp. It's the first time he's done it and he's competing against fully grown adults.

The point is not to expect him to breeze it, and then you know he's ready for the first team. The point is to recognise his potential, and deploy him in matches in a way that hides his weaknesses. Doing so allows him to develop rapidly.

Writing off 18/19 year olds as not ready because they aren't matching the physical performance of 22/23 year olds is daft. Of course they aren't matching that, they shouldn't be expected to. Some will, such as Patterson, but it's no wonder Gerrards youth development record is woeful if that's the test he's setting the youngsters.
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I know all about how young athletes develop mate.

Dapo isn't ready to be a 1st team player yet, but he could well become one.

NYC was never going to be one.
 
okbear said:
Another potential impact factor for this move could be how he felt during lockdown.

Being so young, away from family, being in a publicised vulnerable category group, must have been mentally horrendous for someone so young.

If he does go then good luck, I'd be surprised if he's critical of the club.
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Could be wrong but I thought most of our players went back home during lockdown.
 
okbear said:
Another potential impact factor for this move could be how he felt during lockdown.

Being so young, away from family, being in a publicised vulnerable category group, must have been mentally horrendous for someone so young.

If he does go then good luck, I'd be surprised if he's critical of the club.
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:D You should really write for women's magazines, mate...;)
 
The demands at our club mean that the vast majority of the time we will go into the market to bring a player in.

And in the extremely rare occasion when someone genuinely shines as a great talent from the youths/academy, a la Gilmour, we won't be able to hold on to them or prevent them going south.

That's the actual reality.
 
MearnsUnionist said:
I know all about how young athletes develop mate.

Dapo isn't ready to be a 1st team player yet, but he could well become one.

NYC was never going to be one.
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This season is going to be a real litmus test for Gerrards ability to bring through young players. If Patterson doesn't see meaningful game time, then the excuses will have run out for Gerrard.
 
MurtyMania said:
This season is going to be a real litmus test for Gerrards ability to bring through young players. If Patterson doesn't see meaningful game time, then the excuses will have run out for Gerrard.
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Are these young players going to bring us the league title? Because that's what we're chasing.

It's not a case of giving the youngsters a chance for the sake of it - it's a case of Gerrard winning trophies. That's what he's paid to do. That's what he needs to deliver.

If we win the league and not one 'young' player features, personally I won't give a f.uck.
 
CoopBlue said:
Are these young players going to bring us the league title? Because that's what we're chasing.

It's not a case of giving the youngsters a chance for the sake of it - it's a case of Gerrard winning trophies. That's what he's paid to do. That's what he needs to deliver.

If we win the league and not one 'young' player features, personally I won't give a f.uck.
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If we don't bring through young players, we are setting ourselves up to fail in the medium and long term.

From a squad-building perspective and as a result of UEFA squad regulations, young homegrown players are absolutely essential. If Gerrard can't do it, then he's making his own job and the job of his inevitable successor much, much harder.
 
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