New TV deal

If 25,000 of our fans who pay £50 a month for Sky were to cancel and take up the RTV Unlimited package they each would save around £25 a month and net the club another £7M a year. Win-Win
That assumption fails that 25,000 of our fans pay for Sky sports only for our games.

They dont, they pay it for the EPL, golf, cricket, F1, darts and other sports it shows.

If we had a standalone streaming service we could offer we would do fantastically well out of it.

We dont though as it would mean the diddy teams get their commercial worth.
 
And if you only want football it drops to £18 a month. I don't think anyone could set up a SPFL streaming service for the same money and still pay the clubs.

1) provide camera crews.
2) commentators (ok I know, dubious they do now)
3) backhaul back to the hub.
4) encoding for distribution
5) Encryption
6) Akamai for caching/distribution
7) Customer service for when it goes wrong and it will.
8) Illegal stream monitoring

It all adds up, someone quoted 500,000 people, paying for this but would 500,000 people pay for just the SPFL and nothing else at £18 a month, in reality you would need to price it under a tenner, as alternate source required for European games. So you end up with £60 million a year, well lets be serious we would all cancel in the summer so £55 million tops, take VAT off and all the costs above and the actual income at a guess is about £12 million a year (ballpark). Sky deal does not look bad compared, and remember they also distribute to areas that cannot get streams on satellite so added expense there.

Not saying we get the true value of our content, but going alone is a whole new ball game.

For any SNP supporters, if you go independent then factor all that in above for BBC and ITV in Scotland, the content budget for a scottish only BBC and ITV will be close to zero by the time they pay their carraige and engineering costs.

The problem with Sky is you cannot just take a Sports package, which is all most would be happy with, you have to take Sky tv which inflates the cost. Now it could be said, and is by many Sky subscribers who aren't bothered with sport, that the Sky tv package subsidies the Sports package and therefore it (Sports package) would be a lot dearer if sold as a standalone package.
 
Why now, why Sky and why such an abysmally low amount?

Italian Serie B and the UAE will have higher domestic income than the SPFL if this deal goes through, it will comfortably be the worst deal of any top-20 ranked European league.

Look at the domestic revenue from some of the leagues "roughly similar" in size
  • Belgium £86m per season
  • Norway £63m per season
  • Sweden £43m per season
  • Denmark £35m per season (up for renewal)
The SPFL's deal is an absolute disgrace and the proposed one is even worse.
"Undersold" is an understatement.
 
Have a different set of people to package up, market and sell the options to various streaming services and tv companies to generate interest.

We have incompetents (shown by the current deal, this proposed deal and the Cinch deal) who are underselling the worth of the tv coverage.

Its basic business development but we employ cabbages in the SPL.
They may be clowns and I Believe they are, however I refuse to believe they are stupid enough to get a ridiculously low price for our tv. Deal, I believe they will get around its true values. If we get £25 million a season someone competent may squeeze a bit more out of it but it’s not going to double or treble or anything like it.
simply put if our current tv deal was so bad others would be bidding the same amount, where are BT sports? Why aren’t they bidding? Why aren’t Amazon prime bidding? Probably because they think SKY are already over bidding and see no value in competing.
whatever we think of Doncaster he will have spoken to outside agencies who will know exactly the value of the product towards tv companies
 
Sky contracts only last 18 months before you negotiate an extension and the 8 sports channels package has never been more than £25.
Obviously before you can access the Sports package you have to take Sky tv first which adds to the overall cost
I think the RRP for the SkyTV + Sky Sports package (no broadband) is £64. £92 if you want the package that includes BTSport via Sky.

Obviously discounts for new joiners and, if you're prepared to haggle, discounts for renewals as well.
 
Why now, why Sky and why such an abysmally low amount?

Italian Serie B and the UAE will have higher domestic income than the SPFL if this deal goes through, it will comfortably be the worst deal of any top-20 ranked European league.

Look at the domestic revenue from some of the leagues "roughly similar" in size
  • Belgium £86m per season
  • Norway £63m per season
  • Sweden £43m per season
  • Denmark £35m per season (up for renewal)
The SPFL's deal is an absolute disgrace and the proposed one is even worse.

The WSL (Women's league in England) just secured a record new deal from Sky, and it's worth more than Scottish football is getting.

It's fucking criminal, Rangers and celtic viewing wise etc, must fucking topple that surely?
 
Sky contracts only last 18 months before you negotiate an extension and the 8 sports channels package has never been more than £25.
Obviously before you can access the Sports package you have to take Sky tv first which adds to the overall cost
I thought it's pretty pointless to pretend they're separate for the purposes of this debate.
 
The problem with Sky is you cannot just take a Sports package, which is all most would be happy with, you have to take Sky tv which inflates the cost. Now it could be said, and is by many Sky subscribers who aren't bothered with sport, that the Sky tv package subsidies the Sports package and therefore it (Sports package) would be a lot dearer if sold as a standalone package.
In a nutshell the EPL is what people want and to get it they have to take the whole package including broadband, mainly due to how they structure packages. If SKy lost the EPL they would lose 75% of customers, that’s why it’s so valuable to them. That why they pay over the odds for it. Sadly the SPL doesn't offer sky the same, in short it generates relatively few new subscribers to sky mainly due to the fact that many Scottish sky subscribers already siubsribe to get english football. the price sky and others pay for Scottish football is based on what extra income it generates them
 
They may be clowns and I Believe they are, however I refuse to believe they are stupid enough to get a ridiculously low price for our tv. Deal, I believe they will get around its true values. If we get £25 million a season someone competent may squeeze a bit more out of it but it’s not going to double or treble or anything like it.
simply put if our current tv deal was so bad others would be bidding the same amount, where are BT sports? Why aren’t they bidding? Why aren’t Amazon prime bidding? Probably because they think SKY are already over bidding and see no value in competing.
whatever we think of Doncaster he will have spoken to outside agencies who will know exactly the value of the product towards tv companies
Others wont go to the effort if they dont believe they have the chance to win.

It sounds like the league is having exclusive extension talks so its not even went to open market
 
Need to ditch Sky.

Grow a set of balls and either ask them for what you think this league is actually worth, or tell them to hit the dirt.

Surely Doncaster etc can approach an independent broadcaster and get more?

Even set up their own broadcast channel, tie in with Amazon to make it available as a subscription service like Paramount+ etc. Clubs can relay footage via their own channels to the SPFL, saves having to go out and get cameras etc, no real logistics involved it's all readily available anyway from most clubs.

They'd make more money on individual subscriptions than this shitey deal.
 
Barry Hearn offered to promote Scottish football years back .

Yes he's a flash cant and would look to make a few quid for himself also,but someone like him is needed to reinvigorate the whole system and get rid of all the self serving blazers and charlatans who are currently in charge of our game.
 
Is there anything we can actually do here?

Write an angry email to the idiots running the game here? Get some of the fan media to raise it at press conferences? Display by the UB?

I don't know how we can stop/fix this, but we need to do something. We've been punching in Europe for the last few years but if our deal stays stagnant at these tiny amounts then other countries and there teams could go by us.
Tbh unless we start getting support from other clubs then nothing will be done , we will just be seen as big bad rangers causing trouble again just like the cinch deal , surely clubs like aberdeen , hearts , hibs have got to see how shit the tv deals are
 
Others wont go to the effort if they dont believe they have the chance to win.

It sounds like the league is having exclusive extension talks so its not even went to open market
That makes no sense at all, if someone is paying below the odds as you say SKY are, then a competior goes in and offers ten million above that and they will win. It’s that simple. The clue is no one else is offering more, there’s a reason for that.
 
That makes no sense at all, if someone is paying below the odds as you say SKY are, then a competior goes in and offers ten million above that and they will win. It’s that simple. The clue is no one else is offering more, there’s a reason for that.

The SPFL have tied themselves in knots with SKY and there’s little way out of the relationship. I dread to think of some of the promises that have previously been made.

The negotiations are really just for show.
 
Others wont go to the effort if they dont believe they have the chance to win.

It sounds like the league is having exclusive extension talks so its not even went to open market
They are tied into the Sky deal until 2025, they can't go to open market until closer to then. They need an overdraft extension to survive and Sky promising x amount is the only way the bank will extend this overdraft.
 
That makes no sense at all, if someone is paying below the odds as you say SKY are, then a competior goes in and offers ten million above that and they will win. It’s that simple. The clue is no one else is offering more, there’s a reason for that.
Can assure you if companies engage in exclusive negotiations then others wont get involved.

It costs a vast sum.of money to submit offers and if they see exclusive negotiations then they dont bother unless a reasonable chance of success.
 
They are tied into the Sky deal until 2025, they can't go to open market until closer to then. They need an overdraft extension to survive and Sky promising x amount is the only way the bank will extend this overdraft.
They are tied to Sky until 2025, there is nothing stopping the SPFL having open discussions or a tender with others unless the current shit deal gives Sky exclusive extension rights.
 
They are tied to Sky until 2025, there is nothing stopping the SPFL having open discussions or a tender with others unless the current shit deal gives Sky exclusive extension rights.
Surely there is some sort of contractual obligations stating when they are allowed to put the product up to tenure. It was a matter of months ago that they signed this deal with Sky.
The desperation in this extension is obvious and I hope it finishes the corrupt bastards.
 
Surely there is some sort of contractual obligations stating when they are allowed to put the product up to tenure. It was a matter of months ago that they signed this deal with Sky.
The desperation in this extension is obvious and I hope it finishes the corrupt bastards.
There may be an exclusive negotiation option in the current shit deal.

If not then SPFL are free to tender any period of tv rights outwith what is covered in the current deal.
 
Barry Hearn offered to promote Scottish football years back .

Yes he's a flash cant and would look to make a few quid for himself also,but someone like him is needed to reinvigorate the whole system and get rid of all the self serving blazers and charlatans who are currently in charge of our game.
Hearn stated at the time "if Doncaster worked for me and showed such poor return he would be out the door". Whilst I am no great fan of the Hearns by feck do we need someone like that to get us a rightful deal.

Our problem is we are run like a bowling club by committee. Of the 42 clubs - 40 of them are so close to the bone they will never gamble on pushing for more for fear of losing what shite deal they have. We are an easy touch and Sky know it.
 
I think the RRP for the SkyTV + Sky Sports package (no broadband) is £64. £92 if you want the package that includes BTSport via Sky.

Obviously discounts for new joiners and, if you're prepared to haggle, discounts for renewals as well.

Does anyone pay full price?

I've never and have left previously when no offer forthcoming and within a week started receiving offers - sat tight and within a month I received up to 50% off.
 
There may be an exclusive negotiation option in the current shit deal.

If not then SPFL are free to tender any period of tv rights outwith what is covered in the current deal.
Sky will have an obligation in the contract preventing them from looking for new broadcasters until the final year, which is the normal practice. The desperation from that corrupt bastards is what's forcing a further shit deal for Scottish football.
 
Something smells really off with the timing of this leak. I get the feeling that the deloitte review will evicerate the current set-up for underselling the product and potentially proposing a break-away structure. This reeks of Doncaster getting desperate.

I just cant fathom why else you would appear so hasty to agree an extension during a cost of living crisis, with a broadcaster whos model is particularly vulnerable right now. I doubt Sky would consider being generous at this point in time.
 
Does anyone pay full price?

I've never and have left previously when no offer forthcoming and within a week started receiving offers - sat tight and within a month I received up to 50% off.
I wouldn't give them the steam off my piss these days - Sky or BTSports. Cost, primarily, drove me away but, to be perfectly honest, the annual 'discussion' trying to get my discount became tiresome. Its a charade. They knew they would do a deal, I knew they would do a deal - just apply a 'loyalty' discount without the need for the phone call FFS.
 
They may be clowns and I Believe they are, however I refuse to believe they are stupid enough to get a ridiculously low price for our tv. Deal, I believe they will get around its true values. If we get £25 million a season someone competent may squeeze a bit more out of it but it’s not going to double or treble or anything like it.
simply put if our current tv deal was so bad others would be bidding the same amount, where are BT sports? Why aren’t they bidding? Why aren’t Amazon prime bidding? Probably because they think SKY are already over bidding and see no value in competing.
whatever we think of Doncaster he will have spoken to outside agencies who will know exactly the value of the product towards tv companies

I know what you mean mate - but I'm not sure about your conclusions

I suspect the alternative rivals to Sky are prevented from bidding due to existing contractual obligations currently in play

If I understand correctly the only time other broadcasters can compete with each other is at a time when contracts are at an end or up for renewal

I'm sure everything has a true cost - but the going rate / value of anything depends on economic laws of supply & demand, market forces & what anyone is willing to pay for this service

As pointed out in many posts above - other similar or even smaller viewing figures - around Europe are generating better revenues than us

This suggests to me we didn't negotiate to true market value in the first place - or others are better at it than we are ?

All that's happening now is - we're polishing another turd with these wee increases here & there
 
I know what you mean mate - but I'm not sure about your conclusions

I suspect the alternative rivals to Sky are prevented from bidding due to existing contractual obligations currently in play

If I understand correctly the only time other broadcasters can compete with each other is at a time when contracts are at an end or up for renewal

I'm sure everything has a true cost - but the going rate / value of anything depends on economic laws of supply & demand, market forces & what anyone is willing to pay for this service

As pointed out in many posts above - other similar or even smaller viewing figures - around Europe are generating better revenues than us

This suggests to me we didn't negotiate to true market value in the first place - or others are better at it than we are ?

All that's happening now is - we're polishing another turd with these wee increases here & there
The demand that provides revenue for sky is not viewing figures it’s packages sold. many viwers to the Scottish game have subscribed to sky sports for English content. Subscribers drive the value of the tv deal not viewers
 
After Motherwell and Dundee United's shameful showing in Europe - and we still have Hearts to show their 'quality' next; it's no wonder SKY value the league so low.

And as for Doncaster. If he was any good at his job, SKY, BT et all wouldn't even bother presenting a crap deal for discussion. They should assume he'd say "I'm not even going to waste my time, or the various club Chairman's time, discussing that derisory offer. Now feck off and think again."

Sadly, Donkey Neil will lap it up and say "I'll get back to you ASAP."
 
The monthly subscription at £24 returned several months ago.

There are Apps available for both Android and Apple mobile devices - though I'd agree they are very, very poor and could be greatly improved - but not for Fire TV Stick or via TV services. I know the App can be sideloaded onto the new 4kMAX Fire TV Stick though. Anything should work via the website however and its only a couple of extra 'clicks' in most cases. I watch every match via RangersTV and wouldn't touch the App with a bargepole.

The VPN issue isn't Rangers doing its just the tech. If you are using a VPN on your phone and trying to cast to an AppleTV, for example, it will see it as being on a different network if you switch the VPN on. On Android I believe the way around this is to cast a Chrome tab using Google Home. Screen mirroring, which may involve a third party app, should work on Apple devices.

The problem with multiple logins is that we all know full well Billy Bloggs will sign up to a subscription and then share his credentials with a dozen of his mates. That screws Rangers over.
Wasn’t aware that had returned so that’s a plus.

Apps need to be on tvs not mobile devices with casting as it’s too many steps that even I can be bothered with and I’m tech savi.

Season at home I just watched games via silk browser (odd one via gers tv with vpn when “away” for non home games that for sale)

Yea I agree with the log ins however just pointed out how nowtv works with it.

Not sure what the full solution is , but one thing for sure is that tv deal is a bigger joke than the last one
 
We get £25m per season at present. Will go up to £30 m until 2029. Inflation this year alone could be 13%, therefore why take a 20% increase that locks you in until 2029. 7 YEAR.!!!
As broadcasting appears to be cheaper as you can stream programmes now, why don't we look to revisit setting up our own TV station. Most clubs have their own infa structure for broadcasting games. Expand that and try and link a proper marketing, collection of subscriptions.
If you charge £20 per month for 9 mths of season =£180. Need 166k subscriptions to cover the £30m.
 
Wasn’t aware that had returned so that’s a plus.

Apps need to be on tvs not mobile devices with casting as it’s too many steps that even I can be bothered with and I’m tech savi.

Season at home I just watched games via silk browser (odd one via gers tv with vpn when “away” for non home games that for sale)

Yea I agree with the log ins however just pointed out how nowtv works with it.

Not sure what the full solution is , but one thing for sure is that tv deal is a bigger joke than the last one
The problem - and I'm partly guessing here - with an App that works on TVs is twofold. Firstly they all have hardware/software of different quality and ability. Secondly there are so many different operating systems - Apple, Android, Sony, Tizen, WebOS etc. - that I doubt coming up with an App that functions on each of them is straightforward. I've no doubt its 'doable' but at what cost? One that works on Fire TV Stick - even if it had to be sideloaded - would be a big step forward for many I think. You can sideload on the 4kMAX Fire TV Stick but not any of the others, so they are part way there. Aside from that, the App is crap anyways of course.

I understand how NowTV works re. logins, and Netflix and others too, but whilst we might all share our logins for those services with a parent, family member or good mate you just know with RangersTV the details would be passed around everybody on the supporters bus ha ha. One suggestion I saw put forward was allowing multiple logins on the same IP Address. That, for instance, would let Dad take out a sub and watch on TV in the Living Room whilst his son shared his login upstairs in the bedroom and watched with a couple of his mates. I think that would feasible too.

We don't disagree on the value of the proposed new deal.
 
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ITV get 10 La Liga games involving Barca and/or Real for 3 seasons

odds on it costing more than the entire SPL deal?
 
Don't know if it's been mentioned already but the English Football League (Championship and below) have a domestic tv deal worth £595m over 5 seasons. The SPFL has higher viewing figures than the Championship. I know that deal includes lower divisions as well but considering the audiences for the lower divisions it's just another figure that makes our deal look terrible.
 
This absolutely stinks. It is incredible that the other Spfl clubs haven't reviewed the performance of the Executive leadership.
 
If we don't put it out to the marketplace how do we know how much someone is willing to pay? Amazon may pay more but if it's a closed shop we'll never know. If clubs vote for this they deserve all they get.
My question is why now? Are Amazon going to make a play in the football streaming? A bit more than now obviously. I think they have some CL games. Are sky securing it to block Amazon?

Btw not saying Amazon will give more cash.
 
That makes no sense at all, if someone is paying below the odds as you say SKY are, then a competior goes in and offers ten million above that and they will win. It’s that simple. The clue is no one else is offering more, there’s a reason for that.

Thats not how exclusivity periods work, will leave it at that as going round in circles.
 
I see the Main Stream print media is running with the big figure of 250 million in their headlines. Down in the small print it mentions that one little word "total".

Are they in league with Skiy or the Donkeykong.
 
Barry Hearn offered to promote Scottish football years back .

Yes he's a flash cant and would look to make a few quid for himself also,but someone like him is needed to reinvigorate the whole system and get rid of all the self serving blazers and charlatans who are currently in charge of our game.

Hell of a promoter though.
 
Sorry did I just read that, you are saying we should get politicians to force sky to pay more than what the contract is worth?

They can’t force them but but they can kick up a stink about anything they please for votes.

Scottish and English tv licence payers/subscribers pay the same fees but we are being massively shortchanged. Time to ‘level up.’
 
Barry Hearn offered to promote Scottish football years back .

Yes he's a flash cant and would look to make a few quid for himself also,but someone like him is needed to reinvigorate the whole system and get rid of all the self serving blazers and charlatans who are currently in charge of our game.
He made snooker and darts viable lucrative products for God's sake, he must be worth a try!
 
Worse than that is he says he would continue to stream illegally games even though the SPFL clubs as a whole would have provided a service that will directly benefit everyone in Scottish football including ourselves.

Me? Where did I say that?
 
They can’t force them but but they can kick up a stink about anything they please for votes.

Scottish and English tv licence payers/subscribers pay the same fees but we are being massively shortchanged. Time to ‘level up.’
Sky aren’t covered by the licence fee, they are a private company. He said politicians should force sky to pay a hiher price. Scottish licence payers get more spent locally than licence payers in England. Fool anyone who pays the licence fee.
 
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