'Racism spotters to be planted in crowds at football matches'

Geoff Hurst

Well-Known Member
Of course racism has no place in society but since when did a facist pressure group like Fare become an arbitrator of what’s racist and what’s not.When i go to the game i don’t want some goon checking to see if i’ve said something they find offensive especially that mob
 

Barryhopez

Well-Known Member
Policing at football should be done by the Police or Stewards and not by 'anonymous figures'.

Racism should absolutely be tackled though, but by the proper authorities and with evidence. Clubs being held to account are the obvious divide and conquer tactics.

Racist chanting - minimal punishment - nobody intervenes.

Racist chanting - punishment of closing a stand/area - Passive people up in arms, report to Police etc.

Could be wrong of course, but to me that's the way it is designed it seems.
 

Laidlaw Loyal

Well-Known Member
This is only problematic when things like 'enforcing immigration law' are viewed as racist. Everything bar prostrate worship at feet of colour is racism to some degree to some people. It's the same for sectarianism. The parameters of transgression are too vague (often what is 'socially' contentious rather than an illegal action).
 

Arminius

Well-Known Member
Official Ticketer
I would have no problem with this but FARE, who are openly racist themselves, are not the correct party to carry this out.
That’s my issue with it, as well.

FARE are bigots themselves. Their blind spot to all things anti British racist and their insistence on microscopically seeking anti Irish racism proves them to be unsuited to the task.

That said, anything that roots out genuine racism is to be supported wholeheartedly.
 

TQ3

Well-Known Member
I believe the only real way to tackle it is to have your name on your ticket and ID as you go through the gate, and have cctv cover all sections of the crowd, then if an incident is reported they can ID the culprit and deal with the individual. The punishment of clubs should only be if they don’t have adequate equipment to pick out individuals, therefore not doing enough to deter bad behaviour.
That said, god help anyone visiting Spurs with a bad lisp!!
 

StuGers

Well-Known Member
That’s my issue with it, as well.

FARE are bigots themselves. Their blind spot to all things anti British racist and their insistence on microscopically seeking anti Irish racism proves them to be unsuited to the task.

That said, anything that roots out genuine racism is to be supported wholeheartedly.
Of course FARE have a blind spot. I mean, the owners wife was spotted on video at a football match shouting “get the Brits out now”. Must be a huge blind spot.
 

The Huguenot

Well-Known Member
It stinks of the secret police of Eastern European and Chinese Communism where everyone lived in fear of each other in case their 'neighbour' was reporting them. If anyone has a complaint to make they should follow due process.
 

Tim Hunter

Well-Known Member
Official Ticketer
I don't know why anyone would have a problem with someone in a crowd weeding out racists.
The OP does not say that is their purpose. They are there simply to report incidents to UEFA.
"Weeding out" racists is the job of the police, if there is illegal acivity occurring they should report it to them.
If FARE is involved, they have already demonstrated that they are not impartial and follow their own particular agenda.
Edit. Noted I have arrived quite late to the party.
 

Wazza

Well-Known Member
Really couldn’t be arsed going England away now to these places, next 3 days social media be full of complete crap. Hard work when the match is next to meaningless as it’s nigh on impossible to qualify anyway.
 

baystatebear

Well-Known Member
The day isn't far away - I predict - that those attending football matches at Ibrox will be given a list of 'officially approved' songs along with 'officially approved' lyrics that can be sung (as determined by FARE or some similar entity). Failure to adhere to these strictures would of course result in the imposition of sanctions - eg. partial or full stadium closure, points deduction etc. Welcome to the future!!
 

a_weir

Well-Known Member
I think the Op is meaning we got a part of our stand closed for singing the Billy Boys which was deemed as Racist by Fare!
We were not singing about the colour of a players skin.
So i think you know whats coming next.
Two things mate;

1.) UEFA deemed it to be racist
2.) The UEFA match delegate reported it

FARE happened to be there and also reported it but take them out of the equation and we still would have gotten caught and charged.
 

MDM

Member

A football-loving judge has made a desperate plea for Scottish fans to help kick the “poison” of bigotry out the game.

Sheriff Allan McKay made an impassioned plea for decent supporters to “stand up and be counted” as he sentenced a cocaine-fuelled hooligan for singing a hate-filled sectarian song at a top Scottish Premiership game.

Barrie Rendall was arrested after he and a Hearts 'ultras' group dubbed the Gorgie Boys had belted out lyrics including being “up to our knees in Fenian blood” at a match at Motherwell.

As he sentenced the 34-year-old Sheriff McKay - a lifelong football fan - told Rendall: “This type of disgraceful conduct has to stop.

“It’s a poison that must be removed because it is debilitating the game I have followed all my adult life.

“Football relies on fans like you who are reaching maturity to stop this kind of stuff.

“It’s up to people like you who are otherwise intelligent and responsible to stand up and be counted, to tell other guys not to do it, to take a different attitude.

“When you’re carrying on with the Gorgie Boys you’re a menace.”

Hamilton Sheriff Court heard how PC Iain Gromett, a dedicated football officer known as a ‘spotter’, picked out Rendall as the “ringleader” in a group of Hearts fans who sang ‘Hello, hello, we are the Gorgie Boys’ repeatedly during the first half.

After his arrest he was also found to be in possession of cocaine.

The officer told prosecutor Lauren Donnelly: “Most fans stop before the offensive line because they know it is something they can be arrested for singing.

“But I watched a group of eight to 10 singing about being up to their knees in Fenian blood.

“They sang it four or five times in the first half.

“I arrested the accused as he went to get a pie at half time. He felt hard done by as he was the only one arrested. We have limited resources and can’t apprehend everyone.”

Rendall, a vehicle parts adviser from Penicuik, Midlothian, said he went to the match with his dad and denied being with the Gorgie Boys in the stadium.

He admitted joining in a chant of “Well, Well, f**k your Well”, but insisted he wasn’t sectarian and wouldn’t sing a song that would get him into trouble.

Rendall told his lawyer, Joe Boyd: “I have no idea how the police could single me out over the noise of a drum being beaten and a crowd of people shouting.”

But Sheriff McKay said he believed the police officers were “absolutely clear” that Rendall was singing the offensive song.

Rendall has a previous conviction for football-related disorder and his lawyer said Hearts have banned him from home games since his arrest in February.

Sheriff McKay ordered Rendall to do 90 hours of unpaid community work and fined him £100. Rendall also admitted possession of cocaine at the match.
 

Robocop1960

Well-Known Member
The only people who will be affected by this are racists, so unless you are one of them what's the problem?
The problem which has been pointed out on numerous occasions is that FARE have an agenda they work to and do not target all forms of racism and bigotry.
 

RedWhiteBlue

Well-Known Member
You don't think football matches would be a better experience without racism or bigotry?
Of course.

However, any program that is designed to get rid of racism, bigotry etc needs to be fully transparent.

There is a big difference between, say, clearly hearing racist chanting form a section of fans on TV and some hidden mole in the crowd telling authorities that in their opinion they heard some guy say something racist at the match.

I think when FARE's name is mentioned people are right to be suspicious.
 

Kimarcus

Well-Known Member
Will FARE be at the Piggery then?

31 March 2019 – Scottish Premiership: Celtic FC v Rangers

Sectarian chants and slurs were heard from both set of supporters and Celtic supporters displayed a sectarian banner. Rangers FC captain James Tavernier was racially abused by an individual Celtic supporter, while monkey chants were directed towards Rangers midfielder Glen Kamara by a number of Celtic fans.


 

tazzabear

Well-Known Member
Will FARE be at the Piggery then?

31 March 2019 – Scottish Premiership: Celtic FC v Rangers

Sectarian chants and slurs were heard from both set of supporters and Celtic supporters displayed a sectarian banner. Rangers FC captain James Tavernier was racially abused by an individual Celtic supporter, while monkey chants were directed towards Rangers midfielder Glen Kamara by a number of Celtic fans.

I don’t recall any press furore here.
What was septics punishment?
 

Wilkinsvolley

Well-Known Member
Official Ticketer
The day isn't far away - I predict - that those attending football matches at Ibrox will be given a list of 'officially approved' songs along with 'officially approved' lyrics that can be sung (as determined by FARE or some similar entity). Failure to adhere to these strictures would of course result in the imposition of sanctions - eg. partial or full stadium closure, points deduction etc. Welcome to the future!!
Some people have been screaming for a list of songs.
 

Bluegeo64

Active Member

A football-loving judge has made a desperate plea for Scottish fans to help kick the “poison” of bigotry out the game.

Sheriff Allan McKay made an impassioned plea for decent supporters to “stand up and be counted” as he sentenced a cocaine-fuelled hooligan for singing a hate-filled sectarian song at a top Scottish Premiership game.

Barrie Rendall was arrested after he and a Hearts 'ultras' group dubbed the Gorgie Boys had belted out lyrics including being “up to our knees in Fenian blood” at a match at Motherwell.

As he sentenced the 34-year-old Sheriff McKay - a lifelong football fan - told Rendall: “This type of disgraceful conduct has to stop.

“It’s a poison that must be removed because it is debilitating the game I have followed all my adult life.

“Football relies on fans like you who are reaching maturity to stop this kind of stuff.

“It’s up to people like you who are otherwise intelligent and responsible to stand up and be counted, to tell other guys not to do it, to take a different attitude.

“When you’re carrying on with the Gorgie Boys you’re a menace.”

Hamilton Sheriff Court heard how PC Iain Gromett, a dedicated football officer known as a ‘spotter’, picked out Rendall as the “ringleader” in a group of Hearts fans who sang ‘Hello, hello, we are the Gorgie Boys’ repeatedly during the first half.

After his arrest he was also found to be in possession of cocaine.

The officer told prosecutor Lauren Donnelly: “Most fans stop before the offensive line because they know it is something they can be arrested for singing.

“But I watched a group of eight to 10 singing about being up to their knees in Fenian blood.

“They sang it four or five times in the first half.

“I arrested the accused as he went to get a pie at half time. He felt hard done by as he was the only one arrested. We have limited resources and can’t apprehend everyone.”

Rendall, a vehicle parts adviser from Penicuik, Midlothian, said he went to the match with his dad and denied being with the Gorgie Boys in the stadium.

He admitted joining in a chant of “Well, Well, f**k your Well”, but insisted he wasn’t sectarian and wouldn’t sing a song that would get him into trouble.

Rendall told his lawyer, Joe Boyd: “I have no idea how the police could single me out over the noise of a drum being beaten and a crowd of people shouting.”

But Sheriff McKay said he believed the police officers were “absolutely clear” that Rendall was singing the offensive song.

Rendall has a previous conviction for football-related disorder and his lawyer said Hearts have banned him from home games since his arrest in February.

Sheriff McKay ordered Rendall to do 90 hours of unpaid community work and fined him £100. Rendall also admitted possession of cocaine at the match.
Isn't it great how the police can be fully focussed when policing speech as opposed to crime that actually physically harms someone such as burglary assault or drug dealing.Our local police are conspicuous by their absence and even when an elderly resident complained about a gang making his life a misery they said they were too understaffed to respond. Probably too busy on their laptops looking at people saying nasty things on twitter
 

Carson's Cat

Well-Known Member
England fans to be reported for signing “no surrender to the Ira”
One reason why FARE can't be trusted is exactly this. Piara Powar is on record as stating:

"No Surrender To The IRA’ comes from a point which is extreme nationalism. It’s about conflict between two states. That then would be reported. We would be making reports as often as our experts feel there is a case to answer. Then it’s down to Fifa.”

The source is here:https://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/news/11601689/England-face-2018-World-Cup-ban-for-fans-anti-IRA-chant.html

Imagine UEFA trusting terrorist-endorsing filth like this.
 

tazzabear

Well-Known Member
I wonder when they’ll pick up on the Anti British racism that is very audible at the theatre of shame most weeks including European games

“ Get the Brits out now “ drumbeat and chant is aired by Separate Entity fans frequently but ignored by our media

Just imagine it was a “ Get the Irish out now “ chant by the Rangers support and the headlines it would generate

There would be questions raised in parliament about it
No need to imagine.
Look at the “go home” song became racist.
 

LOL 133

Well-Known Member
The problem is it's only going to take one idiot in a crowd of 50,000 at Ibrox calling Scott Brown a fenian bastard for a two footed tackle on Alfie for us to be hammered for racism / sectarianism.

Meanwhile over at the Beggarbowl, tumbleweed.
Rangers' players get dogs' abuse every time they arrive at the piggery but its never reported on tv or in the press. One daft boy makes a comment about Broony's deceased sister and all hell breaks loose. They were still writing and reporting on it 3 weeks after it happened. The boy was arrested but the police just stand by when our players get it.
 

insanicdrunk

Well-Known Member
Like the sectarian industry Scotland, they will find what they are looking for, they need to do so the funding keeps on rolling in.
 

Lance Uppercut

Well-Known Member
The only people who will be affected by this are racists, so unless you are one of them what's the problem?
Actually the only people who will be affected by this are those deemed by FARE to be racists. Significant difference.
Weeding out racism is required however a witch hunt by unaccountable faceless, anonymous agenda driven members of a sham organisation does not sit comfortably with me.
 

IBROX11

Well-Known Member
Its no wonder Poileas Alba `never have time to catch criminals . They are either trying to do motorists or football fans . Leaves little time for anything else . The governments security wing are not in business to serve the general public , but to do their masters bidding and bring in much needed revenue for the coffers .
 

Derek1960

Active Member
I think the Op is meaning we got a part of our stand closed for singing the Billy Boys which was deemed as Racist by Fare!
We were not singing about the colour of a players skin.
So i think you know whats coming next.
They don't even understand the definition of race. Catholics are not a race. Fenians are not a race. The Pope is not a race. So rightly or wrongly abusing any of the above cannot be classed as racism. All of the above have been guilty of persecution of others so hence there is a reaction by the common man. Having said all of that we need to rise above it. We are the People
 

GoramsGratefulGrasp

Well-Known Member
I came upon a recent article in the Daily Mail's sports section, stating that 'Racism spotters' were to be planted in the crowds at the upcoming England fixtures with the Czech Republic and Bulgaria

It seems that representatives from 'The Fare' network (previously known as Football Against Racism in Europe), will be placed in the stands in order to quickly detect any acts of racism. These 'Spotters' will be provided with a hotline to a main observer who will be in direct contact with the formal UEFA delegate, who presumably, will recommend appropriate sanctions on the 'guilty' party(s).

Whilst I oppose the racist barracking of black players, I find there is something creepy about inserting anonymous individuals whose task it is to reporting to other anonymous individuals about behaviour they deem to be offensive. Why are so-called 'spotters' needed? If, for e.g., a black player who hasn't been involved in any on-field controversy during the course of a game, is suddenly, without provocation, subjected to widespread, orchestrated abuse, then it can logically be inferred that the abuse directed at him is 'racist' in intent, we surely don't need teams of 'spotters' to tell that this is the case.

How long can it be before demands are made to insert 'Spotters' in Ibrox, each of whom will be armed and ready to dial in to the SFA's appointed delegate, reporting on widespread incidents of 'vicious anti- Irish Catholic' racism, all manner of bigotry, real or imagined, directed by Rangers supporters at opposing players and fans - with of course, sanctions to follow.

The idiotic idea described in the DM article, is I fear, the thin end of a large wedge that will eventually change the entire experience of going to a football match - and not for the better.
I take it they will all be with the Bulgaria fans?

Maybe next they can go and watch a few Serie A games.
 
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