Rangers should produce the FARE charges presented to UEFA

I agree. It clearly does need spelt out to some people, so fucking spell it out in black and white.
 
Candyass said:
Sorry mate, but that's not right. We aren't solely banned from singing/using that word, we are banned from singing "TBB" in all forms - I appreciate that's a bit woolly, but it's reality.

"The Billy Boys" being sung breaches the ban. Not agreeing with it, just telling you what it is.

There's a document from 2006 where fan group leaders met Murray & Bain & a further statement confirmed this, I'd dig it out but too many don't agree with it.
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So we're banned from singing a tune?

That's certainly woolly and wouldn't stand up if we appealed and took it to CAS.
 
[/QUet
monkey magic said:
You mean like Flower of Scotl
Sensiblesteve said:
And who decides what sectarian?

It’s not up to Rangers to tell fans it’s up to UEFA to let Rangers know what chants are classed as sectarian

How can the word 19th Century Terrorist be sectarian for one set of fans but not another ?
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It's use.

Uefa defined 19th Century Terrorist Bastard in terms of the way we use it as racist. Both ourselves and Ajax were fined for it's use and a clear explanation given by uefa including the fact people use it to define themselves as not being an agreeable excuse to use it to insight response
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Tpol_rfc said:
I don't understand what the difficult part to understand is.
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BunkMoreland said:
You need to take responsibility for your own actions. I don't care if somebody down the street is being offensive, if my own house is throwing mud I don't have legs to stand on do I?

Get our own house in order before we start pointing fingers.
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Unfortunately it is the supporters of a club who’s house isn’t in order that seems to have so much input into the punishments we receive from UEFA .
Going by the decisions made by UEFA and how they come to them , then it may well be perceived by some , that they themselves are acting in a racist and or sectarian manner by hitting our club with unjustified punishments whilst dishing out punitive punishments to another club who they continually seem to turn a blind eye to with the many misdemeanours and indiscretions that they commit.
 
Its clear that FARE have had a long running and personalised vendetta against our club and support. We, for our part as a club, should have in our hands their report presented to UEFA. If it is the Bily Boys they've mentioned, then they'll just move onto another song or chant in the future that they themselves proscribe as offensive. We cannot win.
 
monkey magic said:
The fans have to know which songs are and aren't on any FARE proscribed list, as we can see from the numerous threads, it is already causing disharmony amongst the support.
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Dont sing about 19th Century Terrorists and Bobby sands.

Stop shoehorning FTP into every song.

It's not rocket science. My worry is that the more dim witted among us will just think its TBB and sing 'Super Rangers' instead.

I wouldn't even have the club playing simply the best or FF anymore because as sure as night follows day the add ons will be sung
 
monkey magic said:
Its clear that FARE have had a long running and personalised vendetta against our club and support. We, for our part as a club, should have in our hands their report presented to UEFA. If it is the Bily Boys they've mentioned, then they'll just move onto another song or chant in the future that they themselves proscribe as offensive. We cannot win.
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Yes we can ffs. Read my post above
 
Djave82 said:
At some pont in the last 20 or 30 years the definition of 19th Century Terrorist expanded from Keltic warrior to also mean Catholic. Unfortunately we can't do anything about that and can't get around it by saying 'I don't mean Catholic, I mean IRA loving plastic paddys'.
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thats what they said it was
 
ChinaskiBear said:
Dont sing about 19th Century Terrorists and Bobby sands.

Stop shoehorning FTP into every song.

It's not rocket science. My worry is that the more dim witted among us will just think its TBB and sing 'Super Rangers' instead.

I wouldn't even have the club playing simply the best or FF anymore because as sure as night follows day the add ons will be sung
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You do realise that our many enemies see we are the people and no surrender included in songs as being sectarian ?
 
BunkMoreland said:
We know what the word means, but like it or not 98% of people think it is a derogatory term of Irish Catholics or even just Catholics.
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0_SNS_19177118__Celtic_v_St_Johnstone.jpg


Yeah.

They look devastated.

On so many levels.
 
monkey magic said:
You do realise that our many enemies see we are the people and no surrender included in songs as being sectarian ?
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Yes. But they aren't. FTP is.

Let them come after DWs. No chance.

Ajax had a stand closed after their 19th Century Terrorist banner v the scum. The warning was there.
 
clashcityrocker said:
Wasnt Build My Gallows as song that's seen us punished previously?

I'm pretty sure that we'll be getting done for anything that's regarded as unionist/NI related in future.
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According to guys on Twitter it’s 100% the 50p flute song

No surprise if the pricks at fare heard that tbh.
 
monkey magic said:
Its clear that FARE have had a long running and personalised vendetta against our club and support. We, for our part as a club, should have in our hands their report presented to UEFA. If it is the Bily Boys they've mentioned, then they'll just move onto another song or chant in the future that they themselves proscribe as offensive. We cannot win.
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This is bang on. This is nothing to do with uefa. It has everything to do with them lot finding otherways of handicapping us other than on the park.
 
LarkfiedLoyalNS said:
For the people saying it’s this and that and you should know.

Rangers ought to grow a set and get it out in black and white which songs WILL get us into trouble.

It’s a disgrace.
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Unfortunately even a classic Rangers song like Follow Follow would 100% now be deemed sectarian because some are determined to shoehorn FTP and the Vatican into it.

We’ll lose that classic song next as well.

Anyway, it’s pretty clear that the time is nearing when the club will start CCTVing our own fans and banning people. It’s pretty clear that we are incapable of self policing this issue.

Once our own house is on order, then we’re in a stronger position to point the finger elsewhere.
 
Candyass said:
Sorry mate, but that's not right. We aren't solely banned from singing/using that word, we are banned from singing "TBB" in all forms - I appreciate that's a bit woolly, but it's
"The Billy Boys" being sung breaches the ban. Not agreeing with it, just telling you what it is.

There's a document from 2006 where fan group leaders met Murray & Bain & a further statement confirmed this, I'd dig it out but too many don't agree with it.
Click to expand...

Is there anywhere a notice of the Billy boys sing being banned and by whom,now I do get it we need to wise up,but we also need to find out what song or songs are the problem as 19th Century Terrorist is not against any religion
 
hammer-time said:
why isnt it up for debate? why cant we defend ourselves?
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We are where we are because we have rolled over and allowed people to demonise our club and support without putting up any fight whatsoever.
So now they have a free reign, and we are such an easy target why stop now.
You can be 100 percent certain that we will be the first and only club that will be deducted points in the league because of who we are , and if we open up a points gap at the top this season then it may well happen sooner rather than later, just to retain the integrity of the league of course.
 
Yes we should bin all the stuff about the pope and the IRA but then it will be ‘ no surrender ‘ and ‘ WATP ‘ on the hitlist next.
 
hammer-time said:
why isnt it up for debate? why cant we defend ourselves?
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Why do we need so many fucking songs about them ? Really. Keep
monkey magic said:
You actually believe that UEFA know the derivation of the term 19th Century Terrorist ?
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There is a thread with UEFA's reading of this and the logic applied when punishing Ajax.

In other news why oh why do we need to keep singing about 19th Century Terrorists? Enough already we need to move on with songs that constantly reference them. There will be young fans that know more about bobby sands than Davie Cooper
 
Sensiblesteve said:
And who decides what sectarian?

It’s not up to Rangers to tell fans it’s up to UEFA to let Rangers know what chants are classed as sectarian

How can the word 19th Century Terrorist be sectarian for one set of fans but not another ?
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What I still cannot get my head around is if it is politically sound to be a 19th Century Terrorist.

Then you have the same right politically to be anti-19th Century Terrorist?

What am I missing here?
 
ChinaskiBear said:
Why do we need so many fucking songs about them ? Really. Keep

There is a thread with UEFA's reading of this and the logic applied when punishing Ajax.

In other news why oh why do we need to keep singing about 19th Century Terrorists? Enough already we need to move on with songs that constantly reference them. There will be young fans that know more about bobby sands than Davie Cooper
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UEFA are informed by bigots at FARE as to what they deem to be offensive, so it is no surprise we face sanctions. Do you think FARE are correct and impartial ?
 
Earl of Leven said:
Wrong. In Eindhoven the fans didn't sing it and we still got a fine and ban and FARE refused to show report to the club.

So I'm not sure how you work out that's it all so simple.
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Precisely. FARE is a sham organisation, set up by bigots to target Rangers, nothing more.

They are not open, do not operate transparently and refuse to answer any questions regarding their operations and agenda.
 
monkey magic said:
UEFA are informed by bigots at FARE as to what they deem to be offensive, so it is no surprise we face sanctions. Do you think FARE are correct and impartial ?
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No I dont but we have been warned and a precedent has been set with Ajax.

Apparently the flute song was in the report as well. They have too many angles to come at us as we are an open goal.
 
ChinaskiBear said:
Yes. But they aren't. FTP is.

Let them come after DWs. No chance.

Ajax had a stand closed after their 19th Century Terrorist banner v the scum. The warning was there.
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Ah, you think they aren’t. I think they aren’t.
But it doesn’t matter what we think.
Hugh Kevin’s thinks they are.
Who’s right?
Yoofa have put themselves above the law by deeming it to mean whatever they want.
One of the fans not now going next week should be crowd funded to challenge this.
Nothing to do with the club, just an individual with a grievance.
 
I am not a thick guy but I have to admit I am
Confused and worried about where we are going and the club is not helping much.

It’s ok saying don’t sing sectarian songs but when uefa bring racism into that bracket it’s quite a minefield.

Personally we should have appealed or withdrew from the competition
 
ChinaskiBear said:
No I dont but we have been warned and a precedent has been set with Ajax.

Apparently the flute song was in the report as well. They have too many angles to come at us as we are an open goal.
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Yes. We were given a warning by UEFA on the advice of bigots and Rangers haters from FARE. Do you think UEFA were correct to do so ?
 
ChinaskiBear said:
No I dont but we have been warned and a precedent has been set with Ajax.

Apparently the flute song was in the report as well. They have too many angles to come at us as we are an open goal.
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Stupid question but I am now no longer to not like the pope and tell people that I don’t like the pope? Am not being a prick but what if the word was changed to stuff the pope - does that make it acceptable? Not that I would sing it at Ibrox but I fail to see what is wrong with that participial one.
 
RangersEasyOK said:
It’s pretty simple, anything with 19th Century Terrorist or pope in it needs binned
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Or Bobby Sands
Sensiblesteve said:
And who decides what sectarian?

It’s not up to Rangers to tell fans it’s up to UEFA to let Rangers know what chants are classed as sectarian

How can the word 19th Century Terrorist be sectarian for one set of fans but not another ?
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Eufa decide if it's sectarian. They very well might consider it sectarian if they do that banner in a
Djave82 said:
That's where the club have to show leadership, if they come out and say its not TBB that's banned it's 19th Century Terrorist, then people singing Celtic blood can drown it out
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It's the reference to being up to the knees in blood. You can change 19th Century Terrorist to any word you please but Eufa will hammer us for it.
 
monkey magic said:
Yes. We were given a warning by UEFA on the advice of bigots and Rangers haters from FARE. Do you think UEFA were correct to do so ?
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How do you know FARE were involved? Have you seen the list of clubs who have had this punishment applied to previously ? It's quite a list and includes Real Madrid. I think a strong written warning would have sufficed but we are where we are. This has been coming for a long time.
 
FARE refused to show Rangers their report after the PSV fiasco.

They've continually targeted us, yet we've bent over and accepted another shafting.
 
ChinaskiBear said:
Yes. But they aren't. FTP is.

Let them come after DWs. No chance.

Ajax had a stand closed after their 19th Century Terrorist banner v the scum. The warning was there.
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So, you can't sing against the head of a foreign state & head of an organisation that hid child abuse?

Why can't I dislike this man? It doesn't mean I'm sectarian if I say I sing I don't like him.
 
Kaiserweiss said:
Stupid question but I am now no longer to not like the pope and tell people that I don’t like the pope? Am not being a prick but what if the word was changed to stuff the pope - does that make it acceptable? Not that I would sing it at Ibrox but I fail to see what is wrong with that participial one.
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We are entitled to think what we want but the fact we are singing about the fucking pope has been a brass neck at best for a long long time now
 
sadly we have no friends with influence, or in any positions that hold any meaningful sway,and we are fair game to those who despise our very being, we most certainly do not help ourselves at times,but at the same time we have every right to see the selective way ourselves and others are dealt with,(not just eufa),there is no easy solution to where we find ourselves,we can of course cut out the sadly moronic add ons and chants ,and anything else that those dishing out the punishments ,find offensive,but like others have said i am convinced they will just find another way to batter us, we all must play our part now,we know for sure how seriously they are onto us and sticking 2 fingers up and going gung ho isnt going to win,if i am being honest i really do not see any way out now for our club,we are an impotent and a some what easy touch for those who wish us harm and that will not be changing any time soon,so more of this will be the future for us
 
Kimarcus said:
It wasn't FARE this time but FARE will be doing everything they can to screw us in later games.
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Rangers must now produce the evidence of sectarianism presented to UEFA, how and why it was deemed to be sectarianism, and show it to the various fan groups. It is their duty to do so. We must know our prosecutors. It is scandalous.
 
hammer-time said:
So, you can't sing against the head of a foreign state & head of an organisation that hid child abuse?

Why can't I dislike this man? It doesn't mean I'm sectarian if I say I sing I don't like him.
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Not at a Rangers game no. How do think this affects catholics that play for us? They have a right to play football and not hear chants deriding the head of their religion.
 
monkey magic said:
You do realise that our many enemies see we are the people and no surrender included in songs as being sectarian ?
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How about we start with cutting out the ftp and 19th Century Terrorist references first and then worry about the rest on a position of strength.
 
Kaiserweiss said:
Yes I agree however it’s not like we have just started started! It’s been out their for decades
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Times have changed mate unfortunately we have been a bit behind keeping up. We have all done it in not in any way taking some faux moral high ground. Since souness arrived and the influx of catholic players from around the world arrived I have always felt we needed to lose it.
 
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