Rebuilding job at the Piggery is huge

Lets all calm down. Remember Advocaat? Miles ahead but crumbled before O'Neil.
I'm confident well win the league next year, but we must firm up our midfield.
Regarding their complacency, I don't think it was that. I think it was a combination of
A poor manager with no tactics, no way getting players fit and no idea how to improve players
A CEO who wanted to control the appointment of their manager, his staff and the scouting of players
Players wanting away but held back for 10IAR
Very poor recruitment (they spent £35m in 3 transfer windows, thats not complacency).
The only complacency was from their fans (who had seen us compete for 2 half seasons then collapse).
 
Viatrophy said:
For me that only serves to highlight tat the gap is never as big as anyone believes. It took us a few years but we were in a much bigger mess than them. Ultimately though if we add some more game changers and have a similar season next year to this year what they do will largely be irrelevant.
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That's what I thought too. People on here going on about how much money they need when we should know that isn't what it is about.
 
They have a massive rebuild to undertake

even if it is managed well they won’t have the squad depth to sustain a league challenge against us

they might win the off game against us if their starting 11 is decent but won’t be able to turn around the squad depth required in one window

much like Gerrard’s first year and even second year we could look to a roffe or itten to come on and get us goals in tight games

a mean look at who will be left

McGregor
Forest
Welsh
Taylor
Griffiths
3 shite keepers

most likely 3 starters in there to build from

as others have said we need to keep improving Gerrard will not stop

I’d imagine two of Alfie kamara barasic will be sold

with probably 4 players coming in

two centre mids
A striker maybe two depending on Alfie
Left bs k if Borja goes
 
Ajer,Ntcham,Christie,Edouard and Griffiths all in last year of contract.
Duffy,Laxalt,Kenny and Elyounoussi returning to their parent clubs.
Brown already gone.
Barkas,Bitton and Rogic apparently unhappy.

They could easily lose a dozen first team players and be lucky to get the guts of 25 million for them.

Personally I hope as many stay as possible because they're broken mentally imo.
 
sheddensbear said:
Lets all calm down. Remember Advocaat? Miles ahead but crumbled before O'Neil.
I'm confident well win the league next year, but we must firm up our midfield.
Regarding their complacency, I don't think it was that. I think it was a combination of
A poor manager with no tactics, no way getting players fit and no idea how to improve players
A CEO who wanted to control the appointment of their manager, his staff and the scouting of players
Players wanting away but held back for 10IAR
Very poor recruitment (they spent £35m in 3 transfer windows, thats not complacency).
The only complacency was from their fans (who had seen us compete for 2 half seasons then collapse).
Click to expand...

36 point swing in a season.
 
cav said:
Ajer,Ntcham,Christie,Edouard and Griffiths all in last year of contract.
Duffy,Laxalt,Kenny and Elyounoussi returning to their parent clubs.
Brown already gone.
Barkas,Bitton and Rogic apparently unhappy.

They could easily lose a dozen first team players and be lucky to get the guts of 25 million for them.

Personally I hope as many stay as possible because they're broken mentally imo.
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I hope they all stay on and leave for nothing all the while playing shite as to avoid injuries.
 
It’s a big rebuild, but we should calm the hysterics, we only need to look at the Advocaat and O’Neill era’s, huge rebuilds and massive point swings in both directions.

The rebuild at the piggery has been exaggerated, a new manager and a few new players can make a huge difference right away.

Let’s hope they struggle though.
 
sheddensbear said:
Lets all calm down. Remember Advocaat? Miles ahead but crumbled before O'Neil.
I'm confident well win the league next year, but we must firm up our midfield.
Regarding their complacency, I don't think it was that. I think it was a combination of
A poor manager with no tactics, no way getting players fit and no idea how to improve players
A CEO who wanted to control the appointment of their manager, his staff and the scouting of players
Players wanting away but held back for 10IAR
Very poor recruitment (they spent £35m in 3 transfer windows, thats not complacency).
The only complacency was from their fans (who had seen us compete for 2 half seasons then collapse).
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A lot of good points, however I think you've just described complacency to a tee. :)
 
We laughed at them in the summer of 87 when they appointed Mcbungle in a Clydebank car park and lost McClair,Johnston,Macinalyand MacLeod and replaced them with the likes of Stark,WalkerMorris and Maccavennie etc we weren't laughing for long as many of their players had one season wonders and we had our season from hell.
I tend to think they will do similar in the summer by raiding the likes of Motherwell and Hibs for some SPL jobbers to kick us off the park
We will need at least another 2 midfielders and any players sold replaced like for like
We have a great chance to remain top dogs and send them spiralling into mediocrity for a few seasons
 
They were able to sign decent players on the basis of guaranteed success. That has now gone and any replacements will be of interior quality.
 
I think they’ll struggle more than people think without that reptile Brown in their team, his influence is massive and playing that deep role helps them recycle pointless possession between the centre backs.

He might be more limited than his Hibs days but he is their voice on the park and captain.

If they lose Ajer and Edouard too that will be a whole new spine needed, their remaining squad IMO will be weaker than what Gerrard took over. Their rebuild is huge!!
 
Johnny Yen said:
It’s a big rebuild, but we should calm the hysterics, we only need to look at the Advocaat and O’Neill era’s, huge rebuilds and massive point swings in both directions.

The rebuild at the piggery has been exaggerated, a new manager and a few new players can make a huge difference right away.

Let’s hope they struggle though.
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im not disagreeing with your first point, but they will need alot more than a few players, they have almost a full squad to build without the guarrntee of CL money, so probably £15-20m max available due to sales to buy around 15 players

I reckon they are a season or so away from being back to where they were last season.


Johnston
Ajeti
Turnbull
Soro
Ralston
Taylor
Welsh
Julien
Bain
Barkas
Hazard
Forrest
Perez

is what they could potentially end up with at the end of season
 
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sheddensbear said:
Lets all calm down. Remember Advocaat? Miles ahead but crumbled before O'Neil.
I'm confident well win the league next year, but we must firm up our midfield.
Regarding their complacency, I don't think it was that. I think it was a combination of
A poor manager with no tactics, no way getting players fit and no idea how to improve players
A CEO who wanted to control the appointment of their manager, his staff and the scouting of players
Players wanting away but held back for 10IAR
Very poor recruitment (they spent £35m in 3 transfer windows, thats not complacency).
The only complacency was from their fans (who had seen us compete for 2 half seasons then collapse).
Click to expand...

They're all very fair points.

You're right about O'Neil coming in but when he did, they gave him a tonne of money to spend. £4m - £6m on Sutton, Hartson, Lennon, Thompson and I'm sure there were one or two others up there.

I don't see Celtic pulling in the sort of cash (given their current) squad to have an instant success.

20 years back (and it also took us to have a complete collapse under DA) it was easier to turn things round. We're seeing just now with Gerrard that it takes time and patience as well as a quality structure to turn things round.

The other thing they've got to deal with just now (which O'Neil didn't) is the changing of a legacy that's become ingrained over a decade. It's hard to shift on from that.

When our run ended under Smith, they only way to make an instant success of that was with summer 98 level spending and again, I can't see it being the case they'll fund that.

We're in a very good position and with good recruitment and trading this summer, we've got a very stable base to move on from.
 
I never take anything for granted, thankfully we have the men with the foresight to see the same, who will work to make sure complacency doesn't set in.
 
Tailwind said:
That’s a completely random no. you have pulled out of your butthole.

strange post.

And even if we lost 4, that’s 4 we have to replace. Depending on who they are. Not 16 or whatever it is they need.
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Well, time will tell. I genuinely hope I'm wrong about the number, by the way.
 
Walters80 said:
Not selling French diddy last summer was a monumental blunder from them. They'll be lucky to break even now on any potential transfer fee or perhaps maybe even make a loss by the time PSG take a cut.

Other than that they will probably lose around 10-12 players this summer and have to make the around the same number of signings to replace them. All this while the first competitive game for them is only two months away now and they still have no idea who the manager or DOF will be.

If we get in 2 or 3 quality players to add to the first team squad this summer I can see us leaving them the dust for several years to come.

Also wouldn't rule out another Artmedia type hammering for them early in Europe either given the massive changes they have to make right in the middle of European qualifying. Every second they wait to appoint a manager more damage is done.
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They have a European qualifier end of June? Or early July? Ouch, that’s not good B-)B-)B-)
 
Their key appointment will be manager / coaching team. But even if they recruited Pep it will take minimum of 3 windows to sort out the mess they are in.
It has taken SG a full 2 seasons to get us to where we are now and the comforting thought is he is not content and plans to take us further. With the Champions League turmoil we may be able to make deep inroads into the competition next year.
 
TheEgg said:
im not disagreeing with your first point, but they will need alot more than a few players, they have almost a full squad to build without the guarrntee of CL money, so probably £15-20m max available due to sales to buy around 15 players

I reckon they are a season or so away from being back to where they were last season.


Johnston
Ajeti
Turnbull
Soro
Ralston
Taylor
Welsh
Julien
Bain
Barkas
Hazard
Forrest
Perez

is what they could potentially end up with at the end of season
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Despite people trying to underplay the magnitude of the upheaval at that club this summer, that list of likely first team players when the loanees, out of contract and one year left want away players depart, is frighteningly bad.

These same guys encouraging everyone to “calm it”.

What would they be saying if the likely Rangers squad at the end of the season was

Firth
Patterson
Balogun
Bassey
Zungu
Itten

And some more kids

That would be about the size of it.

Would they be saying we just need a new gaffer and a few players?
 
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Laudrup1 said:
They're all very fair points.

You're right about O'Neil coming in but when he did, they gave him a tonne of money to spend. £4m - £6m on Sutton, Hartson, Lennon, Thompson and I'm sure there were one or two others up there.

I don't see Celtic pulling in the sort of cash (given their current) squad to have an instant success.

20 years back (and it also took us to have a complete collapse under DA) it was easier to turn things round. We're seeing just now with Gerrard that it takes time and patience as well as a quality structure to turn things round.

The other thing they've got to deal with just now (which O'Neil didn't) is the changing of a legacy that's become ingrained over a decade. It's hard to shift on from that.

When our run ended under Smith, they only way to make an instant success of that was with summer 98 level spending and again, I can't see it being the case they'll fund that.

We're in a very good position and with good recruitment and trading this summer, we've got a very stable base to move on from.
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2000–01_Celtic_F.C._season#Transfers
 
Tailwind said:
Despite people trying to underplay the magnitude of the upheaval at that club this summer, that list of likely first team players when the loaners, out of contract and one year left want away players depart, is frighteningly bad.

These same guys encouraging everyone to “calm it”.

What would they be saying if the likely Rangers squad at the end of the season was

Firth
Patterson
Balogun
Bassey
Zungu
Itten

And some more kids

That would be about the size of it.

Would they be saying we just need a new gaffer and a few players?
Click to expand...

would be full panic stations calling for the heads of the board the lot lol
 
Rudolph Hucker said:
They’re in a better place right now than we were 3 years ago, BUT they have some BIG problems coming their way:

Most of their better players will be gone in the summer (bearing in mind they were only good enough to be runners-up this year). Either as a result of their loans finishing (Elyanoussi) or being transferred (Edouard, Christie, Ntcham, Ajer). These are all players nearing the end of their contracts, so the amounts received will be less than the filth would have hoped. Alternatively some may hang on and leave on a Bosnian next year, which would be the filth’s ultimate nightmare. They have a load of dross who they must be hoping they can punt to reduce their horrendous wage bill (Thumb, Rogic). This leaves them with the likes of Ajeti, Barkas, McGregor and perma-injured Julie as the foundation of their team for next season.
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Papac coming back to offer lifts away from the place?
 
Al khobar-ger said:
We need to replace Arfield, I like the guy but I think if we can replace him with quality then we will be well on our way
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Disagree. One of a only a select few who always turns up against them. His energy levels are exceptional, from minute 1 to minute 89. I'd be trimming some of the squad fat before letting Arfield go.
 
stuart01x said:
Disagree. One of a only a select few who always turns up against them. His energy levels are exceptional, from minute 1 to minute 89. I'd be trimming some of the squad fat before letting Arfield go.
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Patterson, McGregor, Davis, Kent and Aribo rightly get all the plaudits and headlines.

But Morelos and Arfield were two who were quietly effective and integral to the win Sunday in a high stakes game.

Rangers massive favourites for a double and potential unbeaten league season. Timmy's "ra ten" season a colossal disaster.
 
RWL12 said:
One of their usual consistent players from recent seasons, McGregor, was nowhere today.

I expect he does go and try down south.
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I agree, I have always thought that he was good enough for our midfield ( even from the bench). He was almost invisible on Sunday, I wonder if he is angling for a move as you say. There's no doubt that,on his day, he is very impressive (he is after all, not " one of them").
 
Tailwind said:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2000–01_Celtic_F.C._season#Transfers
Click to expand...

Also to be remembered that O'Neil luckily landed there when Larsson turned in to one of their best players in their history. I can't see many of their current squad making that sort of difference for their next manager.

O'Neil came in to a team with the likes of Mjallby and Lambert there who were still capable compared to the likes of what they have now in Ajer and McGregor who the fans would chase out the door tomorrow if they could.

There's more and more comments from their fans that have them thinking "there's not a single one of them I'd keep" like we were when we were at the lowest ebb of Murty's second reign.

Of course, they can't get rid of them all and maybe even a couple of them could find form and turn things round but it's a big ask to overtake a settled team which has some forward planning in place immediately unless you're throwing Advocaat cash at the process (and even then in his 1st year where he made an immediate turnaround they were a shambles having lost Jansen)
 
Live Forever said:
New gaffer required. New coaching staff. New CEO incoming.

Laxalt, Duffy, Kenny, Elyounousi, Brown all away.

Likely followed by Edouard and Ajer. Maybe Christie and McGregor

New keeper needed as well.

Happy Days

EDIT - We obviously need to keep moving forward. I’m not saying otherwise. But we are in a good position.
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It's even worse than you think, the stadium itself is in dire need of work. The banners hanging on the frame of the stadium structure, aren't there for aesthetic reasons, they are there to hide the rust and decay lurking behind them.
 
Al khobar-ger said:
We need to replace Arfield, I like the guy but I think if we can replace him with quality then we will be well on our way
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Arfield made a massive difference to our midfield on Sunday.

He was way more effective than Aribo had been in the middle 3.
Better cover for Patterson and showed real aggression and workrate when they had possession.

Aribo is more comfortable further forward and had a great game in there.
 
I'm wary about getting too excited because in football things can change quickly. It only takes a couple of bad windows for one team and good ones for another for things to swing. However, we look to be in a good place and they look a mess with a huge amount of work to do in next 3 months. I think if we were to qualify for Champions League it would make life increasingly difficult for them to quickly catch up because the need for us to sell key players would reduce, plus we might be able to bring in more quality too.

I fully expect their rebuild to include 4/5 loan signings and 4/5 permanent signings. I can't see them having the Finance to be able to buy a full squad with quality and so it'll take time for them to match the depth we have.
 
While we can laugh (and we do) , it would be foolish not to look at the players we need replaced in a year or 2
 
SMIB said:
While we can laugh (and we do) , it would be foolish not to look at the players we need replaced in a year or 2
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That scenario applies to pretty much every football team on the planet mate.
Every team needs to replace a 2 or 3 players every couple of seasons.

Our management team never stand still now though and have improved our squad consistently since they took charge.
 
Those of us who are laughing at Celtic's predicament understand that the Rangers squad can, will and does need to change.

This isn't news.

Every team evolves every season. Players come and go.

It is unthinkable that their revolution this summer will not be hugely different to ours.

You aren't some kind of genius for coming on and pointing out that the Rangers squad will also change each window.

Would you rather change from a position of strength needing only 1 or 2 transfers in each direction. Or would you rather have to bring in a new manager, CEO, director of football, back room team and about 15 players for the first XI and squad?

Edit: Mearns beat me to it.
 
VMS said:
At best will take the 2 or 3 seasons,if we manage this correctly we could be out of sight for years to come
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Coupled with the possibility of CL money coming to us, I don’t see us making the mistakes our neighbours have made and mistakes of the past, I agree we could be well past them.
 
No they don’t, we’ve just been very lucky this year.

And don’t forget that they’ve been affected more than any other club by not having fans in their stadium so once thats rectified it‘ll be back to normal for them.
 
Live Forever said:
New gaffer required. New coaching staff. New CEO incoming.

Laxalt, Duffy, Kenny, Elyounousi, Brown all away.

Likely followed by Edouard and Ajer. Maybe Christie and McGregor

New keeper needed as well.

Happy Days

EDIT - We obviously need to keep moving forward. I’m not saying otherwise. But we are in a good position.
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Thought you were referring to the Savilledome!
 
brian401 said:
No they don’t, we’ve just been very lucky this year.

And don’t forget that they’ve been affected more than any other club by not having fans in their stadium so once thats rectified it‘ll be back to normal for them.
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They are still the best team in Scotland.
 
They will be a last resort for any manger worth their weight.

Who in their right mind would take that job on at the moment. Only a delusional rabid tim or a desperate manager with no other options, which means said manager will hit yhe ground running with questions marks all over him.
 
Live Forever said:
New gaffer required. New coaching staff. New CEO incoming.

Laxalt, Duffy, Kenny, Elyounousi, Brown all away.

Likely followed by Edouard and Ajer. Maybe Christie and McGregor

New keeper needed as well.

Happy Days

EDIT - We obviously need to keep moving forward. I’m not saying otherwise. But we are in a good position.
Click to expand...
Pocket change to them......... they are absolutely loaded
 
Think we just need to focus on our own continuous improvement.
We needed almost a complete new team in 1998 when they stopped our 10iar. Didn’t turn out too badly for us in 1998/99, so we should take nothing for granted.
 
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