Ronaldo v Ronaldo: who was the better Ronaldo?

Ronaldo v Ronaldo: who was better?

  • Brazilian Ronaldo

    Votes: 370 54.7%
  • Portuguese Ronaldo

    Votes: 308 45.5%

  • Total voters
    677

macdonut

Well-Known Member
CR7 edges it for his work ethics. First to arrive, last to leave. Everything he has achieved has been through hard work and he'll still be playing at 40. It's often said that R9 was the better team player but CR7 is streaks ahead on assists. Would rather go for a beer with R9 though.
 

CaptainObjective

Well-Known Member
I'm all for having debates but there really is no argument here. One guy has more accolades than the other has had hot dinners.. and that's saying something.
 

HandsomeHead

Well-Known Member
CR7 edges it for his work ethics. First to arrive, last to leave. Everything he has achieved has been through hard work and he'll still be playing at 40. It's often said that R9 was the better team player but CR7 is streaks ahead on assists. Would rather go for a beer with R9 though.
Is that really how you define greatness? Hard work?

What about god given natural talent and an ability to do things with a football the vast majority of professionals, let alone us mere mortals could only dream of?
 

Danger Zone

Just the tip...
In terms of pure natural footballing ability and doing it at the very highest levels I’d have Messi, Maradona, Pele, Zidane, Ronaldinho, Cruyff, Platini, Rivaldo, Romario and the Brazilian Ronaldo ahead of him in the top ten.

I think there’s also a good case to say guys like Michael Laudrup, Beckenbauer, Puskas, Di Stefano, Best, Van Basten and Gullit are all ahead of him too in terms of what they could do on a football field.

To be undeniably thought of as one of the best 20 players of all time is still no mean feat however and I’ll stress that I do think the Portuguese is an exceptional footballer.
If the Portuguese one is in the top 5 or so then Gerd Muller has to be one of the other 4. A remarkable scoring record, leagues, world cups, European cups and European championships, and much like CR7 most of his career was built on him finishing off chances created by his team. Given the similarities big Gerd surely has to be in there too.

I think with most of the alleged top tier greats you have a level of individuality, flare and an X factor that few players have, they tend to be players who create something out of nothing. That typically doesn’t include players like Ronaldo who are all about goal stats and with whom the large bulk of his goals are (if we’re honest) poachers efforts. I think that’s why a lot of people stick him in the tier below.

Your opinion, personally felt he did alright at the Euros and Portugal wouldn't have made the Final without him. The goal against Croatia (which he should have finished himself) would not have happened without him - watch and feel free to tell me otherwise, was a superb example of defence in to attack - his positioning for the ball through was excellent.

You can't have watched much International Football if you think Wales were weaker than some of the stuff in the African Nations Cup and and Asian Cup.
Yeah of course it’s only my opinion. Wouldn’t have happened without Sanches (the run into space) or Nani(laid the chance on a plate for him) either, I just wouldn’t look at that goal and give him the credit when in actual fact he just blew a glaring opportunity from a few yards out and Quaresma was the one who reacted to bundle it in. It’s like the desperate stuff you see on FB and the like where his crazy fans were trying to give him credit with the win over France because of how he screamed from the touchline and motivated his team :D they clearly couldn’t handle the fact that his team had won it without him.
 

Wazza

Well-Known Member
Is that really how you define greatness? Hard work?

What about god given natural talent and an ability to do things with a football the vast majority of professionals, let alone us mere mortals could only dream of?
I go back to that for this goal against Croatia - 117th minute and look at him here, back defending and gets the ball and he is off, they score and go through. Goes back to hard work off the pitch that.

Watch from 3:15.

 

macdonut

Well-Known Member
Is that really how you define greatness? Hard work?

What about god given natural talent and an ability to do things with a football the vast majority of professionals, let alone us mere mortals could only dream of?
Did I say that's how I define greatness? I'm sorry, I didn't realise I had to list every one of their attributes before deciding why I'd side with one of them.
 

Wazza

Well-Known Member
If the Portuguese one is in the top 5 or so then Gerd Muller has to be one of the other 4. A remarkable scoring record, leagues, world cups, European cups and European championships, and much like CR7 most of his career was built on him finishing off chances created by his team. Given the similarities big Gerd surely has to be in there too.

I think with most of the alleged top tier greats you have a level of individuality, flare and an X factor that few players have, they tend to be players who create something out of nothing. That typically doesn’t include players like Ronaldo who are all about goal stats and with whom the large bulk of his goals are (if we’re honest) poachers efforts. I think that’s why a lot of people stick him in the tier below.



Yeah of course it’s only my opinion. Wouldn’t have happened without Sanches (the run into space) or Nani(laid the chance on a plate for him) either, I just wouldn’t look at that goal and give him the credit when in actual fact he just blew a glaring opportunity from a few yards out and Quaresma was the one who reacted to bundle it in. It’s like the desperate stuff you see on FB and the like where his crazy fans were trying to give him credit with the win over France because of how he screamed from the touchline and motivated his team :D they clearly couldn’t handle the fact that his team had won it without him.
Like I said before, some folk will find a negative in anything.

Fantastic player, both of them are/were. Amazing you can still watch him now and feel you will see something special.
 

HandsomeHead

Well-Known Member
I'm all for having debates but there really is no argument here. One guy has more accolades than the other has had hot dinners.. and that's saying something.
Why is that important?

The Brazilian won three ballon d’ors before injury began debilitating his career.

The Portuguese only has two more and he’s played a lot longer at the highest levels due to his admittedly peerless fitness levels.

He has won the CL several times, something the Brazilian never managed, but the latter has a World Cup and two Copa Americas winners medals to stack up alongside the Portuguese’s solitary Euros success, one he was generally disappointing in, again, hobbling off in the final before it had barely begun.
 

Danger Zone

Just the tip...
I'm all for having debates but there really is no argument here. One guy has more accolades than the other has had hot dinners.. and that's saying something.
The question is who was better though, not who was more successful. Success on trophies isn’t the best barometer, for example Lee McCulloch has as many championship winners medals as Davie Cooper, but I wouldn’t saw the two were comparable and in fact one was lightyears ahead of the other.
 

HandsomeHead

Well-Known Member
Did I say that's how I define greatness? I'm sorry, I didn't realise I had to list every one of their attributes before deciding why I'd side with one of them.
The question is who was better.

Your answer is that the Portuguese nicks it because he’s worked harder.

No?
 

Drumchapel-Bear

Well-Known Member
You would think CR7 was a tanned Kris Boyd the way some downplay his actual ability. He had frightening skill and ability in his younger days, was rapid and could make players look stupid with outrageous bits of skill. In his early Man Utd days he was labelled as a bit of a sand dancer with no end product.

He has adapted his game over the years to become the ultimate goal machine. I wouldn't criticise him for that though, that's someone who's smart and developed their game to give themselves incredible longevity at the top level. He has scored dozens of incredible goals in his career as well, left foot, right foot, volleys, headers and 25/30 yarders to go with the tap ins. He's basically the complete forward who can pretty much do anything on the pitch and score any type of goal.

Is he as naturally talented as Messi, Ronaldinho,Maradona and R9? Definitely not but when it's all said and done when judging a player it can't be on talent alone. There's not been many more naturally gifted midfielders in recent times in the UK than Gazza but he wouldn't be rated as a better player than the less talented Steven Gerrard when it's all said and done would he?
 

erskine bear

Well-Known Member
You would think CR7 was a tanned Kris Boyd the way some downplay his actual ability. He had frightening skill and ability in his younger days, was rapid and could make players look stupid with outrageous bits of skill. In his early Man Utd days he was labelled as a bit of a sand dancer with no end product.

He has adapted his game over the years to become the ultimate goal machine. I wouldn't criticise him for that though, that's someone who's smart and developed their game to give themselves incredible longevity at the top level. He has scored dozens of incredible goals in his career as well, left foot, right foot, volleys, headers and 25/30 yarders to go with the tap ins. He's basically the complete forward who can pretty much do anything on the pitch and score any type of goal.

Is he as naturally talented as Messi, Ronaldinho,Maradona and R9? Definitely not but when it's all said and done when judging a player it can't be on talent alone. There's not been many more naturally gifted midfielders in recent times in the UK than Gazza but he wouldn't be rated as a better player than the less talented Steven Gerrard when it's all said and done would he?
I think R9 is the answer. I tend to agree with you however.
 

macdonut

Well-Known Member
The question is who was better.

Your answer is that the Portuguese nicks it because he’s worked harder.

No?
Yeah because they're both geniuses. For me the separator is that CR7 had to work at it from a young age all through his career. It didn't come as naturally for him as it did for R9 but he worked longer and harder than anybody else and got the rewards. Personally, I think that's inspirational.
 

Danger Zone

Just the tip...
Like I said before, some folk will find a negative in anything.

Fantastic player, both of them are/were. Amazing you can still watch him now and feel you will see something special.
Its not a question of finding something negative, it’s a question of looking at the reality of what actually happened instead of going “aye he won the Euros for Portugal by missing from 4 yards out against Croatia and watching the final from the sidelines”.

I don’t get the feeling of watching something special very often from CR7, that’s the point really. Moments of absolute brilliance like that Sweden free kick (albeit it was just a Nations cup game), his header away in Rome or that sensational overhead kick vs Juve are more fleeting than you’d think with the way some talk about him. Watching someone finish from close range doesn’t make me go “wow”, and that’s predominantly what you get with him.

The wow factor tends to come from the Diego Maradona types who created and scored a glut of goals by leaving players in their wake and doing things with the ball you typically don’t see many players do. You see close range finishes and penalties all the time though. As an example look at that video someone posted up of Ronaldo, it’s scary what he was able to do in a fiercely defensive league against the best defenders in the world at the age of only 20, it’s choc full of ‘wow’ moments, and that’s just a tiny portion of his career prior to those horrific injuries.
 
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Wazza

Well-Known Member
Its not a question of finding something negative, it’s a question of looking at the reality of what actually happened instead of going “aye he won the Euros for Portugal by missing from 4 yards out against Croatia and watching the final from the sidelines”.

I don’t get the feeling of watching something special very often from CR7, that’s the point really. Moments of absolute brilliance like that Sweden free kick (albeit it was just a Nations cup game), his header away in Rome or that sensational overhead kick vs Juve are more fleeting than you’d think with the way some talk about him. Watching someone finish from close range doesn’t make me go “wow”, and that’s predominantly what you get with him.

The wow factor tends to come from the Diego Maradona types who created and scored a glut of goals by leaving players in their wake and doing things with the ball you typically don’t see many players do. You see close range finishes and penalties all the time though. As an example look at that video someone posted up of Ronaldo, it’s scary what he was able to do in a fiercely defensive league against the best defenders in the world at the age of only 20, it’s choc full of ‘wow’ moments, and that’s just a tiny portion of his career prior to those horrific injuries. But hey, I’ll bow to the superior knowledge of a Josh Windass cheerleader who must have been in nappies when R9 wasn’t in his prime.
Haha, I saw "R9" (as you call him) score when I was 23 in the Bernabeu v Dortmund.
 

erskine bear

Well-Known Member
I’ve seen people here (think it was DB) who mentioned CR adapting his game. We have to appreciate R9 done the same, when he was at Madrid he no longer had the pace thus altered his game. Was he more clinical at Madrid?. Perhaps, i’m not the best informed on the matter.
 

HandsomeHead

Well-Known Member
You would think CR7 was a tanned Kris Boyd the way some downplay his actual ability. He had frightening skill and ability in his younger days, was rapid and could make players look stupid with outrageous bits of skill. In his early Man Utd days he was labelled as a bit of a sand dancer with no end product.

He has adapted his game over the years to become the ultimate goal machine. I wouldn't criticise him for that though, that's someone who's smart and developed their game to give themselves incredible longevity at the top level. He has scored dozens of incredible goals in his career as well, left foot, right foot, volleys, headers and 25/30 yarders to go with the tap ins. He's basically the complete forward who can pretty much do anything on the pitch and score any type of goal.

Is he as naturally talented as Messi, Ronaldinho,Maradona and R9? Definitely not but when it's all said and done when judging a player it can't be on talent alone. There's not been many more naturally gifted midfielders in recent times in the UK than Gazza but he wouldn't be rated as a better player than the less talented Steven Gerrard when it's all said and done would he?
It’s a fair point DB.

I’m an old school kind of guy where I like my players to be of the Davie Cooper mercurial genius variety rather than the works really hard and makes the most of his talent Gary Lineker sort, but the point about CR7 in his Man U days is a valid one.

I actually thought he was a more exciting player as a winger. When he converted to an out and out striker at Real it was with devastating effect, but I actually felt he was less thrilling to watch beyond an unerring ability to stick the ball into the pokey.

Ultimately there isn’t any right or wrong answer, as has been pointed out several times already, just personal opinions and it’s interested me to read the explanations for those even if I don’t agree with them.

I might not rate the Portuguese as highly as some do, but I think it’s academic anyway because he will undoubtedly be remembered as one of the best of all time and for many of the reasons I find it difficult to get my head around.
 

Danger Zone

Just the tip...
It’s a fair point DB.

I’m an old school kind of guy where I like my players to be of the Davie Cooper mercurial genius variety rather than the works really hard and makes the most of his talent Gary Lineker sort, but the point about CR7 in his Man U days is a valid one.

I actually thought he was a more exciting player as a winger. When he converted to an out and out striker at Real it was with devastating effect, but I actually felt he was less thrilling to watch beyond an unerring ability to stick the ball into the pokey.

Ultimately there isn’t any right or wrong answer, as has been pointed out several times already, just personal opinions and it’s interested me to read the explanations for those even if I don’t agree with them.

I might not rate the Portuguese as highly as some do, but I think it’s academic anyway because he will undoubtedly be remembered as one of the best of all time and for many of the reasons I find it difficult to get my head around.
Absolutely no one is talking about him as though he’s some Boyd type anyway. The comparison I made was Gerd Muller, which is hardly insulting, and I think a very fair one. But it’s like I said in a previous post, some folk just don’t like others really analysing his output or his stats. Which is fine I suppose, each to their own and all that, but why wouldn’t you want to really have a look at it unless you’re trying avoid some sort of truth.

CR7 definitely has those spectacular moments of skill in his career, just that for me they’re much more fleeting than certain others and his game has been more about getting in the box and finishing off chances for the most part.
 

CaptainObjective

Well-Known Member
Why is that important?

The Brazilian won three ballon d’ors before injury began debilitating his career.

The Portuguese only has two more and he’s played a lot longer at the highest levels due to his admittedly peerless fitness levels.

He has won the CL several times, something the Brazilian never managed, but the latter has a World Cup and two Copa Americas winners medals to stack up alongside the Portuguese’s solitary Euros success, one he was generally disappointing in, again, hobbling off in the final before it had barely begun.
It's important as it's a measurable variable. Fitness and durability are easily measured too. Brazilian Ronaldo was a brilliant player but there's no debate to who was better overall.


The question is who was better though, not who was more successful. Success on trophies isn’t the best barometer, for example Lee McCulloch has as many championship winners medals as Davie Cooper, but I wouldn’t saw the two were comparable and in fact one was lightyears ahead of the other.
It's a barometer that is at least measurable and comparable. Anyway the argument doesn't hold water. We're talking about two players playing at the highest level here.
 

erskine bear

Well-Known Member
Absolutely no one is talking about him as though he’s some Boyd type anyway. The comparison I made was Gerd Muller, which is hardly insulting, and I think a very fair one. But it’s like I said in a previous post, some folk just don’t like others really analysing his output or his stats. Which is fine I suppose, each to their own and all that, but why wouldn’t you want to really have a look at it unless you’re trying avoid some sort of truth.

CR7 definitely has those spectacular moments of skill in his career, just that for me they’re much more fleeting than certain others and his game has been more about getting in the box and finishing off chances for the most part.
Muller is weirdly always forgotten in these debates, obviously for good reason in this one. Think the contrast between Muller and R9 is a good argument as to how great the Brazilian was.

He redefined the role of a striker, he didn’t hang about the 18 yard box like a poacher. He could get the ball in his own half and go all the way up and bang a goal. The first of that kind I can think of.

How often did we see that from strikers, Compostella was an utterly breathtaking moment. It was Maradona or Messi-esque, not a type of goal or play I’d associate with the Portuguese.
 

iain18(7)2

Well-Known Member
i take it this guy Cristiano Ronaldo was just some penalty box poacher for a sunday league team or something? the way some people bang on about trying to downplay every single aspect of his career is more sad than funny. ‘Peak’ cristiano ronaldo was something pretty special, he’s not there anymore, but even some of the people on this forum who clearly don’t like him seem happy to forgot what he was like from about 2007-14. he had absolutely everything, just as exciting to watch as anyone else around.

for what it’s worth though, id still take peak R9 over anyone i’ve ever seen play football. The very best i’ll probably ever see.
 

The GOAT

Member
Yeah because they're both geniuses. For me the separator is that CR7 had to work at it from a young age all through his career. It didn't come as naturally for him as it did for R9 but he worked longer and harder than anybody else and got the rewards. Personally, I think that's inspirational.
Working hard and being professional is absolutely something to be admired. But it isn't a 'genuis' trait. There's nothing magical about CR7.

R9 was breath-taking - you just can't say the same about Crinstina.
 

Southsidefollower

Well-Known Member
Brazilian Ronaldo for me. Injuries ruined him but when he was in his prime he was unreal.
Portuguese Ronaldo is the better athlete but don’t think he is as good a player as Brazilian Ronaldo was
 

rez1872

Well-Known Member
In terms of natural talent then R9 is the best I’ve ever seen.

CR7 drive and work ethic is unmatched and he’s taken himself to a level beyond R9 through sheer determination. Yes, there is talent there but not at R9’s level.
 

HandsomeHead

Well-Known Member
In terms of natural talent then R9 is the best I’ve ever seen.

CR7 drive and work ethic is unmatched and he’s taken himself to a level beyond R9 through sheer determination. Yes, there is talent there but not at R9’s level.
In terms of natural talent I’d say it goes:

Ronaldinho
Maradona
Messi
Ronaldo (Brazilian)
Zidane.

It’s debatable whether Cristiano Ronaldo even makes the top 20.
 

erskine bear

Well-Known Member
Kaka: "The best player I played with was Ronaldo Fenômeno. I rate a player for his ability to think and to execute. Cristiano & Ronaldinho are amazing players, but I saw Ronaldo do things that made me think how was that even possible? I wish I played with Zidane too."

I know you could get players of that calibre saying the same about CR. I loved Kaka though so yes I’m posting that :))
 

Captain Cutlass

Well-Known Member
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I really loved the fat Ronaldo until he bottled it in the World Cup Final so that's a massive negative but even just going on sheer ability CR7 leaves him for dead!
 
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