Rules scenario / query

Sasa

Well-Known Member
Had this come up in discussion and we never got to an answer. What’s the views / ruling on here?

I’ll stress that I don’t know the answer.
I think the goal stands and it’s just an unfortunate quirk of the game.

Player A (red team) is booked earlier in the game.

Later on in the game, Player B (blue team) is running through and player A wipes him out for a clear second yellow.

However his teammate runs onto the ball, therefore the ref plays advantage. Said teammate has a shot at goal which the keeper catches. So the ball remains in play.

Goalkeeper kicks it out, player A controls it and then scores.

So - if you’ve followed it - a player who should have been sent off ends up scoring a goal and (presumably) being sent off after as the ball is now dead.

Is that the correct ruling?
 

Valley Bluenose

Well-Known Member
I’d agree the goal stands. Bit of a bastard if it happens against at you.

However, could/should the referee not pull it back for the foul/booking when the keeper saves it, ie the advantage fails to materialise? There’s arguments both ways in all honesty.
 

Sasa

Well-Known Member
I’d agree the goal stands. Bit of a bastard if it happens against at you.

However, could/should the referee not pull it back for the foul/booking when the keeper saves it, ie the advantage fails to materialise? There’s arguments both ways in all honesty.
You could be right. I assumed it could only be stopped by the ref when the ball went dead, but maybe not.
 

chrisyboi

Well-Known Member
Yep, the if its a second yellow after advantage it would only be issued at the stoppage in play and if that is following the goal he has scored then so be it.
 

Ünnëcëssärÿ Ümläüts

Well-Known Member
Official Ticketer
Law 12 part 3 apparently:

Advantage should not be applied in situations involving serious foul play, violent conduct or a second cautionable offence unless there is a clear opportunity to score a goal. The referee must send off the player when the ball is next out of play, but if the player plays the ball or challenges/interferes with an opponent, the referee will stop play, send off the player and restart with an indirect free kick, unless the player committed a more serious offence.
 

Talktalk

Well-Known Member
Would be a goal that then would stop play allowing the Ref to deal with the offence he played advantage on
 

chrisyboi

Well-Known Member
I’d agree the goal stands. Bit of a bastard if it happens against at you.

However, could/should the referee not pull it back for the foul/booking when the keeper saves it, ie the advantage fails to materialise? There’s arguments both ways in all honesty.
Guessing it would be down to the time frame between the challenge and shot. If its immediate then yeah, if its after the second player burst from the halfway line then prob not.
 

Papac

Well-Known Member
May as well ask the same question in this thread as it's sort of relevant.

The penalty tonight for Man Utd was retaken because the keeper left his line. I'm fairly certain he also left his line early on the retake which Fernandes scored.

Likewise encroachment. If the other team put their foot in ahead of the kick and it misses it gets pulled back. If you were quick enough you could assess the penalty going in and put your foot in deliberately.

Does it only apply if the keeper saves it/the players misses?
 

coplandrearl36

Well-Known Member
Official Ticketer
I’d agree the goal stands. Bit of a bastard if it happens against at you.

However, could/should the referee not pull it back for the foul/booking when the keeper saves it, ie the advantage fails to materialise? There’s arguments both ways in all honesty.

What if the keeper saves it because the player getting the advantage fluff’s the advantage eg over runs it/ fall’s over his own feet.
Goal should stand then the second yellow.
 

Crown_Defender

Well-Known Member
Official Ticketer
Yes. Assuming
May as well ask the same question in this thread as it's sort of relevant.

The penalty tonight for Man Utd was retaken because the keeper left his line. I'm fairly certain he also left his line early on the retake which Fernandes scored.

Likewise encroachment. If the other team put their foot in ahead of the kick and it misses it gets pulled back. If you were quick enough you could assess the penalty going in and put your foot in deliberately.

Does it only apply if the keeper saves it/the players misses?

Yes.

Attacking team won't be penalised for the defending team encroaching.
 

Sasa

Well-Known Member
May as well ask the same question in this thread as it's sort of relevant.

The penalty tonight for Man Utd was retaken because the keeper left his line. I'm fairly certain he also left his line early on the retake which Fernandes scored.

Likewise encroachment. If the other team put their foot in ahead of the kick and it misses it gets pulled back. If you were quick enough you could assess the penalty going in and put your foot in deliberately.

Does it only apply if the keeper saves it/the players misses?
That one I do know.

No advantage is to be gained from encroachment.
 

Valley Bluenose

Well-Known Member
Law 12 part 3 apparently:

Advantage should not be applied in situations involving serious foul play, violent conduct or a second cautionable offence unless there is a clear opportunity to score a goal. The referee must send off the player when the ball is next out of play, but if the player plays the ball or challenges/interferes with an opponent, the referee will stop play, send off the player and restart with an indirect free kick, unless the player committed a more serious offence.
Clears it up nicely. Well played.
 

julescotia

Well-Known Member
 

Crown_Defender

Well-Known Member
Official Ticketer
To answer OP, advantage can be played up to the point where the 'offending' player controls the ball from the kick out. Play should be stopped at that point.

So in short, no goal and sending off for player A.
 

rossgers

Well-Known Member
Official Ticketer
I believe if the fouls is bad enough to merit a dismissal the referee should not play advantage in any circumstances.
 

EricBoAnderson

Well-Known Member
Law 12 part 3 apparently:

Advantage should not be applied in situations involving serious foul play, violent conduct or a second cautionable offence unless there is a clear opportunity to score a goal. The referee must send off the player when the ball is next out of play, but if the player plays the ball or challenges/interferes with an opponent, the referee will stop play, send off the player and restart with an indirect free kick, unless the player committed a more serious offence.
This makes sense
 

Northampton_Loyalist

Well-Known Member
Clears it up nicely. Well played.
Not really. That states 'unless there is a goal scoring opportunity'. Seeing as the ball ends up with the keeper because of a shot, advantage was the correct decision and play can now only be stopped when the ball is next out of play.

Goal stands, player is sent off.
 

Valley Bluenose

Well-Known Member
Not really. That states 'unless there is a goal scoring opportunity'. Seeing as the ball ends up with the keeper because of a shot, advantage was the correct decision and play can now only be stopped when the ball is next out of play.

Goal stands, player is sent off.
Advantage played because his teammate had a ‘clear goal scoring opportunity’. That’s how I interpret the scenario in the OP. Therefore,

“The referee must send off the player when the ball is next out of play, but if the player plays the ball or challenges/interferes with an opponent, the referee will stop play, send off the player and restart with an indirect free kick, unless the player committed a more serious offence.”
 
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Crown_Defender

Well-Known Member
Official Ticketer
Not really. That states 'unless there is a goal scoring opportunity'. Seeing as the ball ends up with the keeper because of a shot, advantage was the correct decision and play can now only be stopped when the ball is next out of play.

Goal stands, player is sent off.

Wrong.

Advantage was correct but, Law states that if the 'offending' player plays the ball or challenges/interferes with an opponent play must be stopped. So in this case, its stopped when he receives it from the GK.
 

Grigo Yossarian

Well-Known Member
Had this come up in discussion and we never got to an answer. What’s the views / ruling on here?

I’ll stress that I don’t know the answer.
I think the goal stands and it’s just an unfortunate quirk of the game.

Player A (red team) is booked earlier in the game.

Later on in the game, Player B (blue team) is running through and player A wipes him out for a clear second yellow.

However his teammate runs onto the ball, therefore the ref plays advantage. Said teammate has a shot at goal which the keeper catches. So the ball remains in play.

Goalkeeper kicks it out, player A controls it and then scores.

So - if you’ve followed it - a player who should have been sent off ends up scoring a goal and (presumably) being sent off after as the ball is now dead.

Is that the correct ruling?

Edit.
 

Laudrup1

Well-Known Member
I'm sure, if the booking is a second one and therefore a red card, advantage shouldn't be played.

That was my thinking. I think a red card offence stops the game.

Query would be about it being a yellow incident itself though.

Is the ref meant to manage the situation differently and realise directly that the player has already been booked.
 

Cavin

Well-Known Member
I've thought about this before, personally I think that in this scenario the whistle should be blown as soon as the advantage changes to the other team, eg. as soon as player A or one of his teammates takes control of the ball.

Works great in ice hockey and would be a good add to football.
 

Northampton_Loyalist

Well-Known Member
Disagree.:) We know from the scenario in the OP that his teammate broke through and had a shot at goal. Was that a ‘clear goal scoring opportunity’? That’s how I’m interpreting it.;)
Edit, I was right up to the point I bothered reading but it clearly says that as soon as our man touches the ball, he is ofski.

No goal, red card.

As you were.
 

Crown_Defender

Well-Known Member
Official Ticketer
That was my thinking. I think a red card offence stops the game.

Query would be about it being a yellow incident itself though.

Is the ref meant to manage the situation differently and realise directly that the player has already been booked.
You'd like to think so as the two AR's and 4th official take note of bookings too.


I've thought about this before, personally I think that in this scenario the whistle should be blown as soon as the advantage changes to the other team, eg. as soon as player A or one of his teammates takes control of the ball.

Works great in ice hockey and would be a good add to football.
Already applies mate, see above. Certainly for player A anyway.
 

Birkenshaw Bear

Well-Known Member
I’d agree the goal stands. Bit of a bastard if it happens against at you.

However, could/should the referee not pull it back for the foul/booking when the keeper saves it, ie the advantage fails to materialise? There’s arguments both ways in all honesty.
No because the advantage has been played.

The guidance referees are given is to show a red card for a red card decision and not to play advantage.

Because then you can’t pull it back.
 
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