Tav as a number 8

The only way this could work is if you have them switching positions so one pushes up and the other steps in to cover, making it unpredictable. You could do the same on the other side with Barisic/ Bassey and Aribo to balance it. The problems that leaves are there’s one space for Kamara and Davis, and you’d need your fullbacks and midfielders to effectively be able to play two different roles in the same system.

We’re now year 4 in this system, so it needs to evolve a bit to stay ahead, which was probably the thinking behind the 4-2-3-1 we’ve been seeing more of. We need to get Patterson minutes and figure out how to fit him and Tav into the same team without affecting Patterson’s development, or stopping Tav doing the things he’s really good at. There’s probably a way, but it will be very difficult to pull off.
 
The right side number 8 midfield position is becoming a bit of an issue for me.

We've tried a few there now, but none of them offer Goldson and Tav the same protection Jack did, or that Kamara provides on the left side.

Could Tav play that role for is with Patterson at right back?

He certainly has the energy and would add some much needed pace to the midfield as well as a threat with shots from distance.

Also, in theory he should be good at covering the full back, helping the defence and shuttling across laterally.

Issue might be on the ball and having less time in there.

Aribo doesn't work there, neither does Arfield and it's beginning to look like Lundstram might be better as a defensive number 6.

I'd like to see us trying Tav in there. Thoughts?
No......... Pedro tried it with Tav and Hodgson and after 20 minutes we were effectively playing with 2 right backs
 
The right side number 8 midfield position is becoming a bit of an issue for me.

We've tried a few there now, but none of them offer Goldson and Tav the same protection Jack did, or that Kamara provides on the left side.

Could Tav play that role for is with Patterson at right back?

He certainly has the energy and would add some much needed pace to the midfield as well as a threat with shots from distance.

Also, in theory he should be good at covering the full back, helping the defence and shuttling across laterally.

Issue might be on the ball and having less time in there.

Aribo doesn't work there, neither does Arfield and it's beginning to look like Lundstram might be better as a defensive number 6.

I'd like to see us trying Tav in there. Thoughts?
U daft?
 
I'm not sure I'd go for it. I don't think it's totally an outstandish suggestion mind you. Klopp has a record of redeploying players long term with some success I think. Currently trying to develop Ox Chamberlain (sic) into a centre forward!
 
I'm not sure I'd go for it. I don't think it's totally an outstandish suggestion mind you. Klopp has a record of redeploying players long term with some success I think. Currently trying to develop Ox Chamberlain (sic) into a centre forward!
 
The right side number 8 midfield position is becoming a bit of an issue for me.

We've tried a few there now, but none of them offer Goldson and Tav the same protection Jack did, or that Kamara provides on the left side.

Could Tav play that role for is with Patterson at right back?

He certainly has the energy and would add some much needed pace to the midfield as well as a threat with shots from distance.

Also, in theory he should be good at covering the full back, helping the defence and shuttling across laterally.

Issue might be on the ball and having less time in there.

Aribo doesn't work there, neither does Arfield and it's beginning to look like Lundstram might be better as a defensive number 6.

I'd like to see us trying Tav in there. Thoughts?

Madness. Remember when Walter & Ally used to shoehorn players into other positions? People on this board would be apoplectic.
 
Tavernier is 30 next month. There is no way we are converting him into a midfielder.

He’s a right back that we rely heavily on making those deep runs from the full back area. Playing in a midfield role is a completely different ask.
 
The right side number 8 midfield position is becoming a bit of an issue for me.

We've tried a few there now, but none of them offer Goldson and Tav the same protection Jack did, or that Kamara provides on the left side.

Could Tav play that role for is with Patterson at right back?

He certainly has the energy and would add some much needed pace to the midfield as well as a threat with shots from distance.

Also, in theory he should be good at covering the full back, helping the defence and shuttling across laterally.

Issue might be on the ball and having less time in there.

Aribo doesn't work there, neither does Arfield and it's beginning to look like Lundstram might be better as a defensive number 6.

I'd like to see us trying Tav in there. Thoughts?


Gerrard has already said neither him nor Patterson are particularly good when their starting position is higher up the park.

They are more comfortable facing the play and running on to balls, as opposed to taking the ball on the turn, or half turn.
 
No......... Pedro tried it with Tav and Hodgson and after 20 minutes we were effectively playing with 2 right backs
A very different situation now I would suggest. The midfield roles are very defined now and the coaching staff are infinitely better.
 
Madness. Remember when Walter & Ally used to shoehorn players into other positions? People on this board would be apoplectic.
I can't stand shoehorning players either.

I don't normally like it, but, as I said in my post, I think we are having a problem filling that specific role in midfield and I want to see more of Patterson, so thought it was worthy of debate.
 
Gerrard has already said neither him nor Patterson are particularly good when their starting position is higher up the park.

They are more comfortable facing the play and running on to balls, as opposed to taking the ball on the turn, or half turn.
Yeah I can see that would be the case, particularly with Patterson.

SG also said at the beginning of the season he will be looking at ways to play both.
 
Why do positions, mainly midfield, now have (old) squad numbers to define them?

“Number 8” surely should be your attacking centre mid and “number 6” your defensive centre mid?
Number 8 is an inside right.

Number 6 is a left half.
 
Yeah I can see that would be the case, particularly with Patterson.

SG also said at the beginning of the season he will be looking at ways to play both.


He did mate, but I think he's realised that other players are far better options in the midfield.

I also remember watching Patterson play right midfield for Scotland under 21s last season and he really struggled.
He got hooked at half time and was totally lost.

You've got to remember that Davis, Kamara, Arfield, Aribo, Bacuna and Jack, are all full internationalists playing in midfield.

That's not even counting Lundstram either, or Stephen Kelly.

We have far better options than Tav and Patterson in midfield.
 
The right side number 8 midfield position is becoming a bit of an issue for me.

We've tried a few there now, but none of them offer Goldson and Tav the same protection Jack did, or that Kamara provides on the left side.

Could Tav play that role for is with Patterson at right back?

He certainly has the energy and would add some much needed pace to the midfield as well as a threat with shots from distance.

Also, in theory he should be good at covering the full back, helping the defence and shuttling across laterally.

Issue might be on the ball and having less time in there.

Aribo doesn't work there, neither does Arfield and it's beginning to look like Lundstram might be better as a defensive number 6.

I'd like to see us trying Tav in there. Thoughts?
Take up a different sport.
 
He did mate, but I think he's realised that other players are far better options in the midfield.

I also remember watching Patterson play right midfield for Scotland under 21s last season and he really struggled.
He got hooked at half time and was totally lost.

You've got to remember that Davis, Kamara, Arfield, Aribo, Bacuna and Jack, are all full internationalists playing in midfield.

That's not even counting Lundstram either, or Stephen Kelly.

We have far better options than Tav and Patterson in midfield.
Ah, the sensible, realistic, considered, approach.
 
He did mate, but I think he's realised that other players are far better options in the midfield.

I also remember watching Patterson play right midfield for Scotland under 21s last season and he really struggled.
He got hooked at half time and was totally lost.

You've got to remember that Davis, Kamara, Arfield, Aribo, Bacuna and Jack, are all full internationalists playing in midfield.

That's not even counting Lundstram either, or Stephen Kelly.

We have far better options than Tav and Patterson in midfield.
I was only really thinking Tav for the right side number 8 position and that was assuming Davis playing his usual role and Kamara on the left of the three.

Jack's injury dragging on is the driver for the thought I suppose, because I think we have suffered without his defensive cover from that position.

Aribo, Arfield and Lundstram haven't performed anywhere near the standard required in that role and have consistently lost runners and left the defence exposed imv.

From seeing highlights of the preseason games and reading reviews, Kelly is an exciting one. He seems quite comfortable on the ball.

Bacuna is unlikely to contribute much to the defensive aspect of the role but very keen to see what he can bring. I suspect he might be used in one of the 10 positions when up to speed.
 
I think it's something that Gerrard had been working on but clearly isn't ready to be tried out. I am a big fan of keeping players playing in their natural position. Tav is a right back and it really should be where he is playing. That said, I think Patterson is a better defender and soon to be an overall better player than Tav altogether.

It might be something worth giving a go - not sure when the right time to try it out is though.

That said, I want to see Patterson playing, a lot more.
Change of tact here.
What has Patterson done in his twenty games that’d tell you he’s a better defender than Tavernier?
 
Change of tact here.
What has Patterson done in his twenty games that’d tell you he’s a better defender than Tavernier?
Firstly, as good as Tav is defence is not his strong point. However, all I have had to do is watch him. I think Patterson is better at focussing on staying back when required. Tav for me gets caught out quite a lot further up the field leaving the defence exposed. He also doesn't cut out crosses very often at all.

Tav is superb at going forward but I don't think defending is his strong point. Patterson for me tracks back more whilst still getting forward. As if he has it set in his mind his primary focus is further back.
 
I think it's something that Gerrard had been working on but clearly isn't ready to be tried out. I am a big fan of keeping players playing in their natural position. Tav is a right back and it really should be where he is playing. That said, I think Patterson is a better defender and soon to be an overall better player than Tav altogether.

It might be something worth giving a go - not sure when the right time to try it out is though.

That said, I want to see Patterson playing, a lot more.


Currently, defending is Patterson's weakness mate.

We've seen moments of him switching off in a lot of games.
Celtic last season and Moldova recently being prime examples.

His main strengths are all in an attacking sense.
Although he doesn't have Tav's delivery, he is quicker and more direct than him.

I do agree with you though that he will go on to become an outstanding full back, both defensively and in attack.
 
Warbutton tried this I’m sure in an old firm game no less. Didn’t work.

He’s better at running on to the ball with space to run into.

England tried this with Alexander Arnold recently. Didn’t work either.
It was Murty who did it at The Chamber when we drew 1-1 (though Caixinha was in the stand). It kinda worked but it's not a long term solution.

Tav's strrengths are making the runs from the RB position, whether wide and long or coming inside. Playing him forward negates that attacking threat as he would be picked up easier and quicker.
 
In principal it could work and could offer greater threat with both Tav and Patterson able to go past a defender and deliver crosses, even from deeper positions.

However I think it’s not going to happen and would be seen as a gamble by the management team.
 
Little point converting him to the wide option of the front 3 he’s basically tactically used there anyway.

not convinced tactics are the issue at play here as much as a need for us to tighten our work up
 
He's got an abundance of attributes to play there.

Great engine, good upper body strength, very accurate passer, can shoot from distance. If you just want him to go box to box I think it's a reasonable shout.
Tav had a terrific game at Parkhead in midfield a few years ago. It is an option I think could work but I don't see it happening, at the moment.
 
Gerrard has already said neither him nor Patterson are particularly good when their starting position is higher up the park.

They are more comfortable facing the play and running on to balls, as opposed to taking the ball on the turn, or half turn.
Also the cries of I wank dugs are generally because he has been caught out of position. If Patterson is going to be playing RB in our system and bombing forward, we would be relying on Tav falling back and covering the RB berth.

Tavs strengths are going forward from RB not covering in for someone else. Tav gets his numbers for goals and assists because of where he plays in our system.

It's designed to get the best out of our full backs. I agree with others when they say that Patterson is the better defender, but he is a wee bit away from giving us the attacking threat that Tav does.
 
Very difficult to convert a natural attacking full back into a centre mid

Tavs attacking threat is getting to the byline and getting crosses into the box. We’d lose that by pushing him into midfield.

It’s a no from me
Gerrard has already said if Tavernier was pushed forward it would be to player right mid in a 4-1-4-1 style formation, so you’re right.

I can actually see the OP’s point though. In Europe and without Jack we badly lack a right side centre mid who is reliable defensively.
 
Its not as far fetched an idea as half the folk on this thread make it seem, Many full backs in europe seem to convert to the midfield role later in their careers, Lahm, Daniel Alves, Kimmich( not old but still) Alaba, Zanetti, its worth a shot especially with how we have a sensational talent waiting to step in being wasted on the bench and how poorly the midfield have been anyway
 
Tav is our captain, one of our best players, and had an outstanding season at right back.

The team changes to accommodate him, not the other way around.

If this means Patterson misses out, so be it.
 
Currently, defending is Patterson's weakness mate.

We've seen moments of him switching off in a lot of games.
Celtic last season and Moldova recently being prime examples.

His main strengths are all in an attacking sense.
Although he doesn't have Tav's delivery, he is quicker and more direct than him.

I do agree with you though that he will go on to become an outstanding full back, both defensively and in attack.
I agree, he has been caught out a couple of times and defence may not be the strongest part of his game but I feel he does get caught out less than Tav purely because he does head back to defence once the ball isn't going forward - Tav tends to wait and see if it'll come back towards the half way line.

Patterson isn't great in defence either but I still think he is more solid than Tav. Agreed also he doesn't whip the ball in as well but is more capable of working it into the box with it as his feet.

He will become a superb right back and still feel he should feature more. I have a lot of time for Tav as well though - please don't think I am dismissing him.
 
I'll go against the grain and say I wouldn't mind giving this a go to see how it works.

Tav______Davis_____Kamara

Tav is good on the ball, can drive forward from deep, has great athleticism & has good long range shooting.

It would also mean Patterson getting more game time, who posseses a lot of the same qualities as Tav so we wouldn't lose our threat from RB.

Would it work?.. not sure but I wouldn't complain if Gerrard tried it.
 
We've had people saying Tav should be full back, centre back, midfield, right wing....

Knowing FF I'm astonished no-one has suggested him as the answer to our supposed problem at keeper which someone else brought up.
 
The right side number 8 midfield position is becoming a bit of an issue for me.

We've tried a few there now, but none of them offer Goldson and Tav the same protection Jack did, or that Kamara provides on the left side.

Could Tav play that role for is with Patterson at right back?

He certainly has the energy and would add some much needed pace to the midfield as well as a threat with shots from distance.

Also, in theory he should be good at covering the full back, helping the defence and shuttling across laterally.

Issue might be on the ball and having less time in there.

Aribo doesn't work there, neither does Arfield and it's beginning to look like Lundstram might be better as a defensive number 6.

I'd like to see us trying Tav in there. Thoughts?
Pretty sure the gaffer has already said he doesn’t have the attributes to work in their as he’s suited to coming on to the game rather than having his back to goal receiving the ball
 
Its quite funny the panic this question causes and its utterly bizarre the way folk keep slagging off Patterson and looking for faults in a young kids game after every poor performance that hes not even been part of. Worse we play more motivated folk become to tell us every day aye well Patterson isnae any use either.

I agree with you for what its worth op, they should both be in the team. Not really two right backs its two fine footballers with pace and energy that can get forward and may link up well. Longer it goes on less chance of it happening tonight wouldnt be the worse time to try it or even 4-4-2 which also results in the red mist on here.

Be nice to try something different help the players out as clearly they do need support from fans and management.
 
We've had people saying Tav should be full back, centre back, midfield, right wing....

Knowing FF I'm astonished no-one has suggested him as the answer to our supposed problem at keeper which someone else brought up.
Its because hes a fine footballer that could play in a number of positions, its a compliment.
 
Wouldn't that nullify Tav's attacking threat though? If Patterson is going forward then Tav would be holding back to cover for him, it wouldn't be both of them attacking.

I personally think Tav would be wasted in our midfield.
And Patterson is wasted on our bench. Tavernier in midfield should be considered, and even Gerrard has explored the possibility. We do need Patterson playing on a consistent basis, and we also need Tavernier just as much.
 
Very difficult to convert a natural attacking full back into a centre mid

Tavs attacking threat is getting to the byline and getting crosses into the box. We’d lose that by pushing him into midfield.

It’s a no from me
When was the last time Tav got to the byeline?!

18 yards he launched the ball in. Very rarely do any of our players go there and cut the ball back. It is infuriating
 
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