The disallowed goal in Moscow.

ICA_86

ICA_86

Well-Known Member
How big is that decision in our season now?

It’s amazing to see the luck the mentally challengeds get, while we’ve been stuck with what has been a genuinely group-changing decision from the officials that was totally wrong.

Between that, the goal Vienna scored at Ibrox, the Candeias red against Villarreal - there’s only so much you can do.

I know we had games to make up for that, but looking at how the group has turned out, it has turned out to be an absolute game changer.
 
Simply not good enough... with the next 2 transfer windows the board better give the gaffer the backing he needs !
 
Chastu said:
no it hasn't, we had multiple opportunities to beat Spartak at and f uckin blew it Morales needs to score in these games he had plenty chances
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I agree with that, I said we had chances to turn it round.

But as it’s panned out - a bit like Dundee on Sunday - that decision has cost us in the end.

Walk away from Moscow with the three points and it’s a different ballgame.
 
Can't hinge all our failings on a single offside goal. There are several occasions where we could have played better but didn't.

You could blame it all on Goldson's performance in Moscow if you like - or the sending off against Villarreal.
 
Chastu said:
no it hasn't, we had multiple opportunities to beat Spartak at and f uckin blew it Morales needs to score in these games he had plenty chances
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:mad::D

It still stands that Morelos did score against Spartak and it was wrongly ruled out. He did his job and yet we as a club count the cost.

The OP is right, with hindsight now, if that goal stands, we are likely through.
 
Its fine margins at this level unless your team is full of superstars and you can overcome these types of decisions. You need luck to progress, yes we did not play well in a couple of the games but overall it's been a big improvement.
 
Poor teams like the Scottish National team pour over incidents that go against them and use these as reasons for failure. Good teams win regardless or get through despite poor refereeing.

I’m not saying that the incidents didn’t impact the outcome or play a huge part but we can’t focus on it as the only reason.
 
We’ve failed to qualify from the weakest European group we’ll ever play in. It’s on our heads, not that of the officials in Moscow.
 
That cocksucker of a decision totally altered the direction of the entire second half and ultimately contributed to us taking nothing from that match.

However, failure to make home advantage count on two occasions is what almost always puts teams out of group stages. Win your home games, grab a point on the road, and you’re nearly always through
 
The manager summed it up. We got found out at this level. Not good enough it’s that simple. Did we really deserve to beat SM in both matches? At Ibrox we created very little. In Moscow we scored four good goals and that’s impressive but we defended like last season.
 
ICA_86 said:
How big is that decision in our season now?

It’s amazing to see the luck the mentally challengeds get, while we’ve been stuck with what has been a genuinely group-changing decision from the officials that was totally wrong.

Between that, the goal Vienna scored at Ibrox, the Candeias red against Villarreal - there’s only so much you can do.

I know we had games to make up for that, but looking at how the group has turned out, it has turned out to be an absolute game changer.
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Youve missed the absolute robbery that is Rapid Viennas winning goal in Moscow

2-3 yards offside

We couldve played out the draw last night
 
Chastu said:
no it hasn't, we had multiple opportunities to beat Spartak at and f uckin blew it Morales needs to score in these games he had plenty chances
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If you mean Morelos, he did score.
That is exactly what the OP you replied to is about.
 
There is no way we lose that game if we go 4-2 up I don't care what any one says.

It was the difference between us needing a draw and a win to qualify last night.

Any one saying that one decision didn't have a huge bearing on this group is talking pish.
 
Slickrick said:
The manager summed it up. We got found out at this level. Not good enough it’s that simple. Did we really deserve to beat SM in both matches? At Ibrox we created very little. In Moscow we scored four good goals and that’s impressive but we defended like last season.
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Think that's harsh, we weren't outplayed for 90 mins in any if the 6 group games we competed and competed extremely well in most cases.

2 offside goals in this group have given Rapid an almighty bit of luck they scarcely deserved. Their winning goal in Moscow was miles offside and Morelos disallowed goal in Moscow was miles onside.

Not to mention their goal at Ibrox was offside.
 
It’s unfortunately clutching at straws. Our criminal defending in that game cost us. Our inability to create chances cost us last night, our lack of creativity from midfield against defensive teams is alarming, something we desperately need to try and fix in January which won’t be easy.
 
Chastu said:
no it hasn't, we had multiple opportunities to beat Spartak at and f uckin blew it Morales needs to score in these games he had plenty chances
Click to expand...

This

Yes the officials fkced up but we were piss poor and should have taken more than 1 point of the Russians.

Rapid took 6 points of the Russians and rapid are shit.
 
Even if we had won in Moscow, we would still be out as that would have been us on 9 points, still one below Villareal and Spartak.
If we had beat Spartak at Ibrox and drawn with them in Moscow, we would still only have 9 points.
All the commentators saying we blew it against Spartak, isn’ really the case.
 
Luck plays a huge part in games, especially over a 6 game group.

We were unlucky with a lot of decisions but we compounded it by making mistakes and defending poorly too.
 
Sherlock said:
Even if we had won in Moscow, we would still be out as that would have been us on 9 points, still one below Villareal and Spartak.
If we had beat Spartak at Ibrox and drawn with them in Moscow, we would still only have 9 points.
All the commentators saying we blew it against Spartak, isn’ really the case.
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Correct, although it's basic maths it never surprises me that these matters seem beyond most members of the media
 
Some of the decisions that went against us were awful and contributed towards us being knocked out.

However when it comes down to it, it's the first venture into Europe for most of our squad being managed by a rookie manager, a lack of experience was the ultimate downfall, next season will be a different story, another year experience for Gerrard, couple more transfer windows and the players realising this is where they belong and we will be in a better position to progress.

In football the saying you are never as far away as you think you are is true. A settled back 4 and an attacking midfielder to support Morelos and our starting XI looks good IMO.
 
People saying we should have been good enough elsewhere etc. are missing the point.

At this level, it’s all about fine margins. You need the big decisions to be called correctly. To have three big decisions go against us isn’t acceptable, and that’s the fine margins you need between progress and elimination.

If we go in 4-2 up against Spartak, we more than likely win that game, and last night’s dynamic completely changes.
 
did you also miss Viennas 89th minute offside goal in Moscow two weeks ago which was given?

ICA_86 said:
How big is that decision in our season now?

It’s amazing to see the luck the mentally challengeds get, while we’ve been stuck with what has been a genuinely group-changing decision from the officials that was totally wrong.

Between that, the goal Vienna scored at Ibrox, the Candeias red against Villarreal - there’s only so much you can do.

I know we had games to make up for that, but looking at how the group has turned out, it has turned out to be an absolute game changer.
Click to expand...
 
Good post, was obvious at the time it was gonna be huge, i have never in my life seen a manager/team on the end of so many crucial calls its actually incredible.... and in such a short space of time too. Europe and our own league.

Maybe our luck with scottish refs will change now all focus is on league/scottish cup.

Acutally just ignore the line above.
 
If it was not for McGregor we would have been beat by Villareal at Ibrox.
The league table does not lie, we were not good enough to get through.
 
Sherlock said:
Even if we had won in Moscow, we would still be out as that would have been us on 9 points, still one below Villareal and Spartak.
If we had beat Spartak at Ibrox and drawn with them in Moscow, we would still only have 9 points.
All the commentators saying we blew it against Spartak, isn’ really the case.
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What?
 
It was a sickener but in the end we just weren’t good enough . Even if we had beaten Moscow at home and got a draw away we STILL wouldn’t have qualified which actually gives me some comfort .

I guessed we would get 5 points from the group we got 6 , we take the £13 million and move on .
 
steve1873 said:
What?
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Sherlock said:
Even if we had won in Moscow, we would still be out as that would have been us on 9 points, still one below Villareal and Spartak.
If we had beat Spartak at Ibrox and drawn with them in Moscow, we would still only have 9 points.
All the commentators saying we blew it against Spartak, isn’ really the case.
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Obviously you mean 1 point behind Villarreal and Rapid Vienna. But you forget that had we won in Moscow we would have been going in to last night on 9 points with Rapid Vienna 2 points behind us needing to win. Completely changes the context of the whole group. Had we only needed a point last night we would have got it. I am 100% certain of that.
 
Bigeye said:
If it was not for McGregor we would have been beat by Villareal at Ibrox.
The league table does not lie, we were not good enough to get through.
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Bizarre logic. If it wasn't for our goalkeeper we would have lost to a team! Fancy that eh!

You know that is what having a good goalkeeper is for!

This thread isn't about McGregor having a good game against Villarreal. It is discussing the blatantly wrong decision that cost us IMO 3 points.

At the very worst we would have drawn in Moscow had that goal counted, which would still have had us level on points with Rapid which would mean a draw would have been enough given we had already beaten them in Glasgow.

That single decision probably cost us a place in the next round.

We can debate all day about whether we were good enough etc. But we were never massively outplayed in any of the games (1st 45 in Villarreal excepted) in a tight group. A tight group that was decided by an utterly shocking decision.

Also consider in our next game we had a man incorrectly sent off....
 
ICA_86 said:
How big is that decision in our season now?

It’s amazing to see the luck the mentally challengeds get, while we’ve been stuck with what has been a genuinely group-changing decision from the officials that was totally wrong.

Between that, the goal Vienna scored at Ibrox, the Candeias red against Villarreal - there’s only so much you can do.

I know we had games to make up for that, but looking at how the group has turned out, it has turned out to be an absolute game changer.
Click to expand...

No doubt it has cost us but we need to move and let the gaffer point out where we lost qualification to players so they learn from it.

We have done well for a team of players with no real European experience.
 
I agree that it was probably a decision that had a massive impact on the outcome of the group. In no small part that's because our team isn't good enough to overcome setbacks like that, which is probably why it's importance is magnified. If the goal had been given and we held on for the win or even a draw, the dynamic of the group changes. I'll preface this with the disclaimer that it's a bit of an "if your auntie had baws" scenario, but even allowing for matchday 5 results going the same way, we would have gone in to the last game on 7 or 9 points. Rapid would have 7 but would have needed to win regardless of our points total because of the head-to-head. That makes for a different game in Vienna. The disappointing thing is that while we were quite fortunate against Villareal at Ibrox (if having a good goalkeeper makes you fortunate), Rapid and Spartak were decidedly ordinary teams. Our failure to beat ordinary teams has been a regular theme this season. We desperately need some creativity in the team.
 
Marstonbear said:
Correct, although it's basic maths it never surprises me that these matters seem beyond most members of the media
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I'd be more concerned by football supporters who don't understand how you'd approach a game needing 3 points instead of 1.

Of course a wrongly disallowed goal cost us. The same "basic math" logic would push the argument that Spartak scored 2 more goals anyway and it would have ended 4-4, which is just as stupid as ignoring the team approach when needing 1 point v 3.
 
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