The Herald & Neil Cameron on Abuse at CBC

SPRINGBOKS

Well-Known Member
#1
2 hrs agoNeil Cameron: Child abuse victims at Celtic Boys Club deserve to be given answers
By Neil Cameron
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FOR a man never known for self-censorship, there’s great irony in Jerry Sadowitz’s extreme keenness to suppress his own act. At least in terms of what appears on social media.
You will struggle to find much online of the comedian, which by all accounts is down to him.
In 1987, Sadowtiz recorded an album which included a comedy sketch that clearly stated Jimmy Savile was guilty of child abuse. Sadowitz wasn’t fooled.
Savile was all that and more. But at least the Glaswegian comedian had the guts to say it almost 30 years before the scandal broke into the public domain. The album was pulled for fear he would be sued.

In 1987 I was 14 and still at school. But even then I knew there was something not quite right about Savile. And I wasn’t the only one. Back then his crimes were an urban myth which turned out to be 100 per cent true.
And if a group of teenage boys from Cambuslang had heard the stories about “Sir” Jimmy, then so had hundreds more including the then prime minister Margaret Thatcher, who on several occasions invited Britain’s most notorious paedophile to stay at Chequers on Christmas Eve.
Lots of important people knew what Savile had been doing – or at least suspected. But they did and said nothing. That’s when evil triumphs.
In December, Frank Cairney became the third former Celtic Boys Club coach to be convicted of child sex abuse within six weeks.
Cairney’s case followed the conviction of Jim Torbett, the founder of Celtic Boys Club, who was jailed for six years for abusing three boys – two of these had been in his Under-14s football teams. Gerald King, former chairman at Celtic Boys Club, was found guilty in December of sexually abusing four boys and a girl while coaching football at a primary school in the north of Glasgow.
Cairney himself was found guilty of nine charges of sexually abusing young footballers while running St Columba’s Boys Guild in Viewpark, Lanarkshire, and the Under-16 team at Celtic Boys Club. Last week he was jailed for four years. I deliberately waited until that verdict before writing about this.

Torbett founded Celtic Boys Club but was forced out in 1974 when allegations first surfaced. He was allowed to return. Last year, he was found guilty of five abuse charges between August 1986 and August 1994.
He has already served a two-year jail sentence when in 1998 was found guilty of abusing three Celtic Boys Club players.
This is what the club said last week: “Although Celtic Football Club is an entirely separate organisation to Celtic Boys Club, we wish to express our deep regret that these incidents took place, as well as our sympathy for the victims who suffered abuse.”
John (not his real name) was going to talk to me about his time at the Boys Club. He suffered what he called “light abuse”. He knew what some of his team-mates were going through.
John has since changed his mind. He’d rather get on with his life now both Cairney and Torbett are behind bars. He is not looking to exploit the situation for financial gain. Indeed, he has been a season ticket holder at Celtic for decades.
John also doesn’t blame the current board or anyone working at the club. Nor does he expect an apology from the club. All he wants is some form of closure.
In the case of Savile, people stayed quiet because of his power. Those who did say something were met with brick walls. Maybe that’s what happened here.
In 1987 I didn’t know a single person at Celtic, but I had heard the rumours. Except, again, as was the case with Savile, it turns out these were not rumours.

Too many questions remain unanswered. John, the rest of the victims and their families deserve to be told everything.
 

Hurleyreyes

Well-Known Member
#5
At least someone reporting but still just hints and skirts around the important questions.
Who knew about the abuse?
Who did nothing and allowed children to be abused?
How many others were involved?
Why would a big institution allow a young 20year to rock up and use their name and facilities to start a club? What was the original motive and links with him?

Many many more questions.

Demand a full independent public enquiry you ratbag media.
 

gersrus71

Well-Known Member
#9
Just a crappy puff piece really
Starts of decent by making a comparison to Saville and who knew what and who covered it up but then totally shits out of asking the same questions of Celtic.
There is a bigger dig at Thatcher than there is at the Tim’s.

As for John the season ticket holder, good for him mr mild abuse(WTF is that, abuse is abuse)..still interested in protecting the clubs name more than backing up some of his old mate, scumbag.
 

Sancus

Well-Known Member
#10
The analogy with Saville is correct and appropriate. People either knew or suspected what was going on. Whether it was at school, BB, scouts, youth football - mention Celtic Boys Club and there was always a snigger or a comment about kids being interfered with (we were at an age when we we had no appreciation of the horrors of this behaviour, and it was an immature joke).
If we, as teenagers in the 80’s had heard of what was going on, then adults involved in youth football most certainly did also and probably knew more definitively.
An open secret which was covered up.
 

Buffalo

Well-Known Member
#11
Cameron is a lowlife scumbag.

A puff piece which is as hard hitting as a jay beattie penalty.

He knows fine well, His hero Tommy Burns knew, his Hero Billy McNeill knew, His hero Jock Stein knew and they all kept quiet and allowed children to be systematically raped.

Closure isn't what is needed, even for the majority of the victims, it is that His club, his heroes are held accountable.
 

TinyRick

Well-Known Member
#13
That's a shocking article, masquerading as an exposé.

It talks about Savile and how if a wee boy in Cambuslang knew, then people far more powerful also clearly knew. At the end, he talks about how they'd all heard the rumours about CBC too. Surely it follows that if a wee boy in Cambuslang had heard the rumours then the authorities in Scottish football, the police etc had also heard. For whatever reason, they chose to do nothing and allowed the abuse to continue.

Thatcher invited Savile to Chequers. Burns invited Cairney back to run the youth team.

Separate Entity FC party line is pushed again.

I'm not 100% convinced John exists. Maybe if he'd pulled out because he found trawling over the last too painful, I'd be inclined to believe his existence, but effectively what Cameron has written here is John pulled out to protect the good name of celtic - he's a season ticket holder, the baddies are in jail, he doesn't want money, or an apology and its not the current board's fault. The agenda is clear.

If I could ask John one question, I'd ask him what his views are on tax avoidance and whether or not the current board of a company should be made to pay for retrospective closing of a loophole. I suspect he'd want the book thrown at said company, but is happy to absolve another current board of the historic diddling of kids at their company.
 
#15
I cant believe that John is still a sellik supporter and season ticket holder, But i am wrong.
The deep rooted indoctrination of them from an early age means that they cant see by what they know is at heart a Roman Catholic Irish Institution. It runs parallel with the systematic abuse of young boys and girls by Priest etc where the good name of the Church was protected for the lives of young Children.
As i said to a workmate IF THERE WAS A PAEDOPHILE WORKING AT THE COMMUNITY CENTRE YOUTH CLUB AND HIS CRIMES WERE COVERED UP WOULD YOU LET YOUR CHILD GO THERE. The answer was FFS OF COURSE NOT, WELL WHY DO YOU TAKE YOUR CHILD TO THAT HORRIBLE PLACE.
IM FKN SICK WAS HIS REPLY
NO MY FRIEND YOUR SICK AND YOUR PART OF THE PROBLEM NOT THE SOLUTION.
 
#16
I cant believe that John is still a sellik supporter and season ticket holder, But i am wrong.
The deep rooted indoctrination of them from an early age means that they cant see by what they know is at heart a Roman Catholic Irish Institution. It runs parallel with the systematic abuse of young boys and girls by Priest etc where the good name of the Church was protected for the lives of young Children.
As i said to a workmate IF THERE WAS A PAEDOPHILE WORKING AT THE COMMUNITY CENTRE YOUTH CLUB AND HIS CRIMES WERE COVERED UP WOULD YOU LET YOUR CHILD GO THERE. The answer was FFS OF COURSE NOT, WELL WHY DO YOU TAKE YOUR CHILD TO THAT HORRIBLE PLACE.
IM FKN SICK WAS HIS REPLY
NO MY FRIEND YOUR SICK AND YOUR PART OF THE PROBLEM NOT THE SOLUTION.
 

GimmeShelter

Well-Known Member
Official Ticketer
#18
I'm sorry but that piece is pathetic, Cameron spends more time talking about Saville than he does the abuse at Celtic.

Simply not good enough.

It actually comes across as a warning to all those who suffered 'minor abuse' to not bother coming forward as the good name of Celtic is more important and what does it matter now as the bad men are behind bars.

Seeking financial gain will only hurt the current Celtic and their board.

It's actually pretty disgusting.
 
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#19
That's a shocking article, masquerading as an exposé.

It talks about Savile and how if a wee boy in Cambuslang knew, then people far more powerful also clearly knew. At the end, he talks about how they'd all heard the rumours about CBC too. Surely it follows that if a wee boy in Cambuslang had heard the rumours then the authorities in Scottish football, the police etc had also heard. For whatever reason, they chose to do nothing and allowed the abuse to continue.

Thatcher invited Savile to Chequers. Burns invited Cairney back to run the youth team.

Separate Entity FC party line is pushed again.

I'm not 100% convinced John exists. Maybe if he'd pulled out because he found trawling over the last too painful, I'd be inclined to believe his existence, but effectively what Cameron has written here is John pulled out to protect the good name of celtic - he's a season ticket holder, the baddies are in jail, he doesn't want money, or an apology and its not the current board's fault. The agenda is clear.

If I could ask John one question, I'd ask him what his views are on tax avoidance and whether or not the current board of a company should be made to pay for retrospective closing of a loophole. I suspect he'd want the book thrown at said company, but is happy to absolve another current board of the historic diddling of kids at their company.
John doesn't exist, complete fabrication
 

gersrus71

Well-Known Member
#20
What was the point of that article.
To get out the party line
The last paragraph about John is the most important as far as the Tim’s and journos are concerned.
Season ticket holder, not the current boards fault, not interested in financial gain etc

Look at how the whole stinking lot went after us about the EBTs and still continue to have their digs. You can bet if this was us and not them they would be going after us with all they had
 

Tagsbear

Well-Known Member
#21
Wtf is that supposed to say exactly?

He has more of a go at Maggie Thatcher and victims seeking justice than anyone who kept quiet or the actual abusers.

What a lily livered pile of victim shaming nonsense.

Basically saying the folk who are not like 'John' and simply getting on with supporting whiter than white Celtic are guilty of exploitation, he should be ashamed.

No condemnation of the 'seperate entity' nonsense, nothing. Ridiculous
 
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Thetinman

Well-Known Member
#24
Like others I had high hopes after reading the start of the article. The part about financial gain obviously ruins it though and it's either a sinister attempt to put others off reporting crimes and seeking compensation. Or the journalist is inept and doesn't realise mentioning financial gain could cheapen, trivialise and blacken the idea of justice.
 

Chopper

Well-Known Member
#28
Opened this thread thinking finally some reporter in Scotland has balls.

Who was I kidding.

I really hope Daly (despite how we all feel) is up to something and is going to rip this story wide open.
 

flootbon

Well-Known Member
#32
"He is not looking to exploit the situation for financial gain. Indeed, he has been a season ticket holder at Celtic for decades.
John also doesn’t blame the current board or anyone working at the club. Nor does he expect an apology from the club. All he wants is some form of closure. "

1. John was exploited for the sexual gratification of a paedophile. John would not be exploiting Celtic.

2. John would not be gaining anything. He would seeking recompense for sexual abuse.

3. I'm surprised John absolves the current Board, because they are absolving Celtic FC of any blame. I'm really surprised at John's attitude here.

4. John doesn't want an apology from the club but wants closure. I feel that's a bit of a contradiction.

I feel points 1 and 2 are detrimental to John. Points 3 and 4 are good for Celtic FC. Not too bad an article for a club that covered up child sex abuse for thirty years.

This was a case of light abuse (sic). Wonder how the guys who were raped feel ?
 

Dogbert

Well-Known Member
#35
It's a start, but let's lay off Neil to a certain extent here. He's a Sports Reporter and not a particularly resilient sort as his breaks for "time out" reflect.

There are proper journalists out there that should be going around doorstepping the Kellys, Grants and Whytes along with running through the Trophy Centre accounts with a fine tooth comb as there's likely to be more uncovered as he was involved with Barry Bennell iirc.

Don't get me wrong, you'll need brass ball and a stab jacket as their support will show their concern for the victims and the investigation by all means f threats and violence.
 

tony_gunk

Well-Known Member
#37
Whole piece is basically saying:

"Look at this guy (who i bet the mortgage doesnt even exist) he's not looking for money.

He still supports ra hoops.

He knows its got nothing to do with anyone at the club.

He knows the club has nothing to say sorry for."

Its a clear message being sent out to try and control the narrative.

It smears those who DO blame the club and want some compensation to rebuild their shattered lives.

Anyone who thinks this is some kind of "start" is sadly mistaken.

Its an appalling attempt to twist and bend the story away from the cold hard facts.

Its disgusting.
 
#39
Shameful article - of all the Rangers haters in the SMSM pandering to a Timmy audience, The Gerald is the worse.

Explicit in Cameron's article is the accusation that some victims are coming forward only for the money and that that is in some way the immoral thing to do - "be like John, he's a good Tim, he doesn't want money, he just wants closure. And Bheast FC current incumbents not to blame, let's just have an apology and move on".

Cameron the rest of the SMSM are complicit in this entire scandal, through choosing to be silent. As are the Police, the judiciary and politicians.
 
#41
Just a crappy puff piece really
Starts of decent by making a comparison to Saville and who knew what and who covered it up but then totally shits out of asking the same questions of Celtic.
There is a bigger dig at Thatcher than there is at the Tim’s.

As for John the season ticket holder, good for him mr mild abuse(WTF is that, abuse is abuse)..still interested in protecting the clubs name more than backing up some of his old mate, scumbag.
Absolutely correct what a powder puff article and gives out his side of the argument that we shouldn’t criticise who apparently didn’t say anything if the rumours.
Thatcher Big Jock and Celtic are all the same in his opinion, knowing full well that a lot is may well not criticise Thatcher but criticise Celtic and BJK.

In fact the article is more deflection than truth for the survivors

Hang you head in shame Mr Cameron.

Still trying to protect your football club.
 

Topps

Well-Known Member
#43
As for ‘John not seeking financial gain’ - that’s a disgusting slur on those who do actually want the club to pay for ruining their lives.
I’m glad it wasn’t just me that read it that way. It’s a fvcking scandalous comment. These poor guys are absolutely entitled to compensation here. He’d be as well saying as they were Celtic supporters they really shouldnt want to hurt the clubs finances.
A lot of these guys have been severely damaged and their lives ruined and deserve a bit of cash to help them out a bit.

I actually think Celtic will get off with this though. Too long has passed and they have had too much time to shred the evidence of celtics official links to the boys club and they will be glad a lot of the management involved in the cover up are dead.
 

flootbon

Well-Known Member
#44
Are we now seeing the influence of Murdoch McLennan ?

This article is basically saying Celtic are okay. An abuse victim is a season ticket holder. He doesn't want to sue Celtic. He doesn't want to GAIN. He doesn't want an apology.

People at Celtic Boys Club were bad. And this needs to be investigated.

The Celtic escape route is starting to emerge.

It will soon be "poor Celtic." Celtic are being exploited.
 

Div1872

Well-Known Member
#46
Savile did spend a lot of time in Scotland and mixed a lot at St Pats so Cameron might have spent the time to question why a bheast spent so much time there given his paedofile leanings

To hint “John” doesn’t want any money is a joke

Kenny Campbell wants an apology from St Pats as Torbett abused him when he was part of St Pats and the attacks took place inside the Paedodome.

St Pats failed to give an apology even though they cannot use the CBC were a separate entity.

Torbett abused a St Pats youth player so why no apology from. st Pats to Kenny Campbell

Guys like Cameron are just Lieswells puppets

A pathetic excuse of a journalist and not fit for the job

I hope the victims and there are plenty still to come forward and ensure that St Pats are made to pay for over 40 years of covering up child abuse

Cameron has not questioned St Pats refusal to accept the abuse took place under their banner and they done nothing and actually helped cover up the New Jersey abuse by Cairney

F.uck you Neil Cameron you absolute shitebag.
 

omegaman

Well-Known Member
#48
To be fair to Cameron, he doesn’t excuse Celtic Football Club, just the current board and its employees.

It’s for the court to decide just how culpable CFC and its former board and managerial structure were in the abuse, although if Cameron was a hack worth anything at all, he’d have pointed that out too.
 

StuGers

Well-Known Member
#49
John has since changed his mind. He’d rather get on with his life now both Cairney and Torbett are behind bars. He is not looking to exploit the situation for financial gain. Indeed, he has been a season ticket holder at Celtic for decades.
John also doesn’t blame the current board or anyone working at the club. Nor does he expect an apology from the club. All he wants is some form of closure.
And that, my friends, is the real reason for the article.

Apparently the anonymous victims don’t want Celtic punished now.
 

Eddie Doc

Well-Known Member
#50
Would rather he hadn’t bothered tbh mate , subtle hints in there , demonising anyone who sues them , sending the message John has forgiven so should you . Make no mistake the ones who do come forward and fight Celtic will be in for a terrible time from their vile support , horrible .
I deleted my post 27 minutes ago on further reading of it. I thought it started well but you're right it's a disgrace.
 
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