The majority of these players cannot be allowed to continue into next season.

The Predator said:
Not enough of them understand what it actually means IMO including the captain. I don't see us ever win any major trophies with Tav as captain. Just my thoughts. I tend to agree with Barry Ferguson's assessment other day. Probably About 4 or 5 from the squad get it.
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Of course they understand what it means, do you think they wanted to lose form collectively? It’s a much easier and far more enjoyable job if you’re playing well.
 
We can’t keep this 8-10 players turnaround!

I think we should sell Morelos in the summer for a variety of reasons however if that releases £15-£20m then we have the money for 3 or 4 good quality players
 
I have already mentioned who I think we should sell.

What I think will happen though is different.
We will lose all the loans but hopefully retain Hagi. I think we will get rid of Barker and a few others like Jones and probably Docherty ( I would have kept him and used him this season for us).
I think we will keep both full backs even though I would sell Tavernier as I don’t think having our full backs providing most assists is healthy for the rest of the team.
I think though SG will keep him and I hope the rest of his team mates have more of a stomach to succeed than he has.
I do think we will sell a CH and I feel it will probably be Katic unfortunately. I think Goldson is a player like Tavernier who when a game turns nasty and into a fight goes missing and is prone to a blunder.
However he is SG’s favourite and he will keep him.

What concerns me most about SG since he came in has been the lack of resources allocated to midfield. It has mostly be free contracts, loans or cheap signings like Kamara.
Davis has been a great servant but at his age we should be looking to who is replacing. Jack for me falls into the Tav and Goldson category. Excellent players on their day but have won nothing in the game. Another prone to errors and mistakes when we are in a dog fight.
These are three core players for SG and I think they are actually a weakness. We have won nothing under SG and I think that will continue if we keep them.
The rest of our midfield being Aribo, Kamara and Arfield are decent options. Aribo I think has our best assists from our midfield players but so many don’t like him on FF. Kamara has struggled the last few months but has been good the first half of the season. I don’t know if his form has been due to confidence as the form slipped. Arfield is one player I trust from midfield who when we are in a fight might actually be able to do something to get us back in the game.
I do think though that Kamara will be sold though if we get a good offer.

As for up front there is no need to discuss Morelos’s game I think we will defo sell him this summer.
However our wide players or as Beale calls them (number 10s) have been mostly very poor, apart from Stewart who doesn’t get enough game time.
Jones, Aribo and Kent, Ojo and Barker have not been great in these positions.
Kent cost us a fortune but what we have got in return has been woeful. No SPFL assists is a shocking stat.
I would sell him but I don’t think SG will.
That is now 4 core players to SG I think we should sell ( Tav, Goldson, Jack, Kent). I think if they still stay in the starting 11 we will see the same collapse next season.

I think therefore the likes of Ojo, Jones, Docherty, Wes, Barker, Kamara, Katic and Morelos will go.

There is a real lack of quality in our midfield, we seem to think we are Liverpool where they have three deeper playing mids who control the game.
The difference is they have 3 top quality attacker who all score and assist.
We have one who scores, two who do next to nothing and a midfield lacking enough drive and quality in the middle to break teams and not be bullied.

We need stability, but the problem is our current squad is still mostly not good enough and this will be SG’s last chance to sort this.
 
Jaws II said:
There is a real lack of quality in our midfield, we seem to think we are Liverpool where they have three deeper playing mids who control the game.
The difference is they have 3 top quality attacker who all score and assist.
We have one who scores, two who do next to nothing and a midfield lacking enough drive and quality in the middle to break teams and not be bullied.
Click to expand...

The midfield is decent and an area we do have some options, but it still lacks one, maybe two players of real quality to take us to the next level.

Up until Xmas Davis and Jack had been in superb form completely controlling games both at home and in Europe. Jack especially was a player I felt we needed to upgrade in the summer, but he really upped his game during the close season and has been a standout in the middle since. Kamara was also playing some great stuff alongside them, especially in Europe, but it's after that we begin to struggle.

Aribo is a player with lots of skill and flair but a tendency to disappear in matches and still looks like he hasn't adjusted to the pace and aggression of the Scottish game. Arfield has been good of late, but hasn't had a particularly great season over all.

I think we probably need to look at replacing Davis in the summer with someone younger with similar attributes. Similarly we also need a more advanced goalscoring midfielder. Both of these players should be earmarked to go straight into the midfield alongside Jack.

I'd imagine we'd probably have to lose Kamara to help fund them keeping hold of Arfield and Aribo as backup.
 
Uncle Albert said:
There are players that would likely leave even if we'd won a treble this season. Ojo, Barker, Jones and a few others.

Morelos will almost certainly go as I thought was always expected, I'm actually surprised there's even debate about that although I agree he's in awful form.

I also think Tavernier could raise significant funds. Kamara could easily go and play for a Brighton or Palace etc. There would be takers for Aribo, Goldson and a few others.

I am merely being more emphatic in what the manager said the other night - we thought we had a core that could deal with the pressure and that is now seriously up for debate.

Maybe he's an idiot as well?
Click to expand...

He didn’t suggest selling the core of the squad.
 
The team with the best bench will more often than not win the league.

Our first 11 aren't far from Celtic at all but our bench is absolutely miles behind, we definitely need more than 2 or 3 coming in this summer
 
Graemeh89 said:
No he never , we had 4 shots on target the full game so not sure where your 3 in the first half are coming from. Excellent save from Halliday in the first half though. He definitely wasn’t overworked like I said.
Click to expand...

Morelos then Halliday and then Davis all in the first half.
 
johnnybravo said:
The problem looks more mentality than ability
Click to expand...

I posted about that on here after the cup final defeat and several posters said that’s rubbish and a few even argued if mentality affects any team. Well it clearly does. Confidence too seems a bit low and if you keep missing chances then nervousness creeps in and affects the way you play.
The bheasts are putting away their chances and we aren’t which is adding to the pressure.
 
johnnybravo said:
The problem looks more mentality than ability
Click to expand...

I posted about that on here after the cup final defeat and several posters said that’s rubbish and a few even argued if mentality affects any team. Well it clearly does. Confidence too seems a bit low and if you keep missing chances then nervousness creeps in and affects the way you play.
The bheasts are putting away their chances and we aren’t which is add
 
Necro said:
The team with the best bench will more often than not win the league.

Our first 11 aren't far from Celtic at all but our bench is absolutely miles behind, we definitely need more than 2 or 3 coming in this summer
Click to expand...

Our bench is chronically short of quality. No game changers or impact players you could rely on.
 
Necro said:
The team with the best bench will more often than not win the league.

Our first 11 aren't far from Celtic at all but our bench is absolutely miles behind, we definitely need more than 2 or 3 coming in this summer
Click to expand...

They were struggling at the weekend and brought on Christie and Rogic, 2 excellent options.

As you say we have a strong starting 11, more than a match for them, however they operate at double our budget and the options from the bench are a glaring example of the gulf.

Thats why this thread is totally bonkers, we need to build not rip it up.
 
spartacus said:
I posted about that on here after the cup final defeat and several posters said that’s rubbish and a few even argued if mentality affects any team. Well it clearly does. Confidence too seems a bit low and if you keep missing chances then nervousness creeps in and affects the way you play.
The bheasts are putting away their chances and we aren’t which is adding to the pressure.
Click to expand...

We responded really well to the cup final though.
 
Tagsbear said:
They were struggling at the weekend and brought on Christie and Rogic, 2 excellent options.

As you say we have a strong starting 11, more than a match for them, however they operate at double our budget and the options from the bench are a glaring example of the gulf.

Thats why this thread is totally bonkers, we need to build not rip it up.
Click to expand...
It may well be the case that it won’t be stevie Gerrard as our manager wins 55.but I strongly believe he’d building a foundation that will deliver a 55th title
 
Tagsbear said:
We responded really well to the cup final though.
Click to expand...

We did. But even in beating the bheasts at the piggery Morelos, who was wasteful again against them, and when we are hanging on for a win, he does that ridiculous dive. Then after the winter break it all goes to sh1t.
 
I don’t think that’s a realistic solution to problem that is being overblown due to fear of them getting 10iar.
 
I expect Barisic will leave this summer, he will want to and we will take the money.
Morelos as good as certain to be off.
Maybe we will get a decent offer for Tav.
So if we’re to persevere with this style of play we‘re going to have find wingbacks and a striker that can play on his own up there. Or change the style.
 
Jaws II said:
I have already mentioned who I think we should sell.

What I think will happen though is different.
We will lose all the loans but hopefully retain Hagi. I think we will get rid of Barker and a few others like Jones and probably Docherty ( I would have kept him and used him this season for us).
I think we will keep both full backs even though I would sell Tavernier as I don’t think having our full backs providing most assists is healthy for the rest of the team.
I think though SG will keep him and I hope the rest of his team mates have more of a stomach to succeed than he has.
I do think we will sell a CH and I feel it will probably be Katic unfortunately. I think Goldson is a player like Tavernier who when a game turns nasty and into a fight goes missing and is prone to a blunder.
However he is SG’s favourite and he will keep him.

What concerns me most about SG since he came in has been the lack of resources allocated to midfield. It has mostly be free contracts, loans or cheap signings like Kamara.
Davis has been a great servant but at his age we should be looking to who is replacing. Jack for me falls into the Tav and Goldson category. Excellent players on their day but have won nothing in the game. Another prone to errors and mistakes when we are in a dog fight.
These are three core players for SG and I think they are actually a weakness. We have won nothing under SG and I think that will continue if we keep them.
The rest of our midfield being Aribo, Kamara and Arfield are decent options. Aribo I think has our best assists from our midfield players but so many don’t like him on FF. Kamara has struggled the last few months but has been good the first half of the season. I don’t know if his form has been due to confidence as the form slipped. Arfield is one player I trust from midfield who when we are in a fight might actually be able to do something to get us back in the game.
I do think though that Kamara will be sold though if we get a good offer.

As for up front there is no need to discuss Morelos’s game I think we will defo sell him this summer.
However our wide players or as Beale calls them (number 10s) have been mostly very poor, apart from Stewart who doesn’t get enough game time.
Jones, Aribo and Kent, Ojo and Barker have not been great in these positions.
Kent cost us a fortune but what we have got in return has been woeful. No SPFL assists is a shocking stat.
I would sell him but I don’t think SG will.
That is now 4 core players to SG I think we should sell ( Tav, Goldson, Jack, Kent). I think if they still stay in the starting 11 we will see the same collapse next season.

I think therefore the likes of Ojo, Jones, Docherty, Wes, Barker, Kamara, Katic and Morelos will go.

There is a real lack of quality in our midfield, we seem to think we are Liverpool where they have three deeper playing mids who control the game.
The difference is they have 3 top quality attacker who all score and assist.
We have one who scores, two who do next to nothing and a midfield lacking enough drive and quality in the middle to break teams and not be bullied.

We need stability, but the problem is our current squad is still mostly not good enough and this will be SG’s last chance to sort this.
Click to expand...
Had to stop at the point where you said you’d sell Tav because of the number of assists he produces. Utterly bizarre.
 
I have to disagree.

Our starting line up in the cup final (which although we lost was probably our best overall performance) was:

McGregor, Tavernier, Goldson, Helander, Barisic, Kamara, Jack, Aribo, Arfield, Morelos, Kent.

They put in an excellent performance that ultimately fell short.
That will probably also be the story of this season when the dust settles.
90+ points, Scottish Cup, out of Europe in last 32 or last 16 (my prediction).

The problem is that we inevitably have to deal with suspensions, injuries and loss of form.

When looking at the bench you see:

Defoe, Ojo, Foderingham, Flanagan, Katic, Barker, Stewart.

These are the players that cannot continue into next season, for me.

Our strongest 11, fully motivated, is fantastic.
What's needed is strong back up options or replacements that will turn the likes of Kamara, Goldson, Arfield and even Kent into the back up options.

Morelos will likely be gone in the summer and there's no way of knowing how that will change things.

I'd like to think with guys like Jack, Aribo, Kent, Katic, Edmundson that we have yet to see the best from these players at Rangers. There's plenty of room for improvement there and they are young enough that improvement seems guaranteed.

What we really need to do is get that Scottish Cup win under our belts and see if it can act as some kind of inspiration to drive us into next season.

As it stands we are on 63 points after 26 games. We were on 52 after 26 last season.
We got out of the group stages this year and have already made it to one cup final.

If we were to improve on that once again next season then we'd be well placed.
 
In hindsight, I would not over train players again at the winter break. After a tough first half of the last two seasons, they have come back and looked f****d.

Not rocket science, two weeks to rest and the last week for light training.
 
What we need to be doing is bolstering the squad with players of the same quality as Tav, Barisic, Kamara, Jack, Morelos, Davis etc so that when they are out for any reason we don't need to bring in guys like Barker, Flanagan, Halliday, Stewart etc.

If we get rid of our top players and replace them all like for like without improving the quality of the squad depth then we will just keep having the same issues.
 
We play too slowly at the moment. Prior to the break we were fast, used the space, played some glorious one touch stuff and generally ran around teams. At the moment we are slow, make too many passing mistakes and take an extra touch we don't need to. We've also stopped the intense press when not in possession and have gone back to the point where we let teams come on to us.

Also, another reason for a lot of this anger and dissatisfaction is that plenty in our support had expectations that the Lurgan Bigot would implode at some stage and take his dressing room with him. That hasn't happened (yet) and they've also benefited heavily at our misfortune in terms of decisions from supposedly professional referees. Narrow margins such as this contribute to points lost/gained - take that game yesterday at Shittodrie - there was not much in it, similar to our game in December when we were denied a stonewaller by the same guy who made four or five glaring errors on Wednesday night.

I also think the winter break does us no favours at all. Traditionally, when we've been champions, we've put in a strong run from November through to February/March. The break kills that momentum, just in the same way every international break seems to have done this season and last. We're a team than needs to keep playing.
 
I think people are underestimating how good a season, sadly, that mob are having.

Since they lost to Livi on 6th October, the form is:

P19 W18 D0 L1

That is incredibly hard to compete with.
 
dublinbluenose said:
It may well be the case that it won’t be stevie Gerrard as our manager wins 55.but I strongly believe he’d building a foundation that will deliver a 55th title
Click to expand...
That may be more realistic, but that's still a few years off if it happens.
Hopefully the foundations and level of professionalism he installs can drive us forward.
Until Gerrard has the financial backing to compete then it's going to be difficult.
 
[QUOTE="Jaws II, post: 5385408, member: 8105"

We need stability, but the problem is our current squad is still mostly not good enough and this will be SG’s last chance to sort this.
[/QUOTE]

You spent half an hour typing how crap everyone is!!!

Cannot believe this nonsense is still being debated.

If you are not happy another 2 years down the line do we rip up and start again again?
 
forzarangers87 said:
I think people are underestimating how good a season, sadly, that mob are having.

Since they lost to Livi on 6th October, the form is:

P19 W18 D0 L1

That is incredibly hard to compete with.
Click to expand...

I think we all know that we will get minimal help from the other teams. On Sunday I watched a team in red that having seen previously kick anything that moved hardly commit any fouls.
 
Bigbluebear said:
What we need to be doing is bolstering the squad with players of the same quality as Tav, Barisic, Kamara, Jack, Morelos, Davis etc so that when they are out for any reason we don't need to bring in guys like Barker, Flanagan, Halliday, Stewart etc.

If we get rid of our top players and replace them all like for like without improving the quality of the squad depth then we will just keep having the same issues.
Click to expand...

Personally I think we need to add two or three players of a quality above Tav, Barisic, Kamara, Jack, Morelos, Davis etc, and that’s before we contemplate selling anyone, Morelos the possible exception.
 
derbybear said:
[QUOTE="Jaws II, post: 5385408, member: 8105"

We need stability, but the problem is our current squad is still mostly not good enough and this will be SG’s last chance to sort this.
Click to expand...

You spent half an hour typing how crap everyone is!!!

Cannot believe this nonsense is still being debated.

If you are not happy another 2 years down the line do we rip up and start again again?
[/QUOTE]

If the players aren’t good enough to challenge them to break their cycle of league wins then you don’t just keep putting out an inferior team for stability.
Of course you want stability but you fucking need to win things.
If the core of the team aren’t good enough to do that you have no fucking choice but to try and get better in. Our problem is our funds are limited compared to theirs so we need to sell some of our squad to generate funds.
 
Jaws II said:
You spent half an hour typing how crap everyone is!!!

Cannot believe this nonsense is still being debated.

If you are not happy another 2 years down the line do we rip up and start again again?
Click to expand...

If the players aren’t good enough to challenge them to break their cycle of league wins then you don’t just keep putting out an inferior team for stability.
Of course you want stability but you fucking need to win things.
If the core of the team aren’t good enough to do that you have no fucking choice but to try and get better in. Our problem is our funds are limited compared to theirs so we need to sell some of our squad to generate funds.
[/QUOTE]

Only need to sell one player maybe two. Morelos and Kent. The others that aren't good enough wouldn't generate enough to replace or are loans and will disappear from whence they came.
 
derbybear said:
If the players aren’t good enough to challenge them to break their cycle of league wins then you don’t just keep putting out an inferior team for stability.
Of course you want stability but you fucking need to win things.
If the core of the team aren’t good enough to do that you have no fucking choice but to try and get better in. Our problem is our funds are limited compared to theirs so we need to sell some of our squad to generate funds.
Click to expand...


Only need to sell one player maybe two. Morelos and Kent. The others that aren't good enough wouldn't generate enough to replace or are loans and will disappear from whence they came.
[/QUOTE]


Kamara, Tavernier, Jack and Goldson would generate decent money.
As much as I may want to sell Kent I don’t think we will. I don’t think SG will sell the last 3 but I expect him to sell Kamara and Katic.
I will add I think we will never win anything if SGs core 4 players he plays no matter what is Tav, Goldson, Jack and Kent.
 
We lost our best right back, left back, centre forward and arguably our best central midfielder at the same time for various reasons. It's no surprise that peformances dipped when that happened.
 
A high turnover of players every season isn't financially sustainable and it doesn't make sense if you're building a squad that will challenge and then win the league.
Remember the mess left by McCoist,Warburton and Caixinha and try to appreciate the size of the job that Gerrard took over.
 
HenningBerg said:
So we sell our two best players , replace them with lesser quality , in order to improve ?

How does that work again
Click to expand...

They call it the Ajax Model. Do you remember them? They used to win the European Cup before they adopted the Ajax Model.
 
I think after beating the scum they though jobs done, leagues a cert and off to Dubai they went thinking they were champions ellect.Masive complacency which has cost us
 
Jase said:
After 29th December we were the best team in the league. Now we need to get rid of most of them.

Fcuk me sideways with a fish fork.
Click to expand...

It's mental. The players and management deserve criticism and plenty of it over the past few weeks but they have also shown themselves to be more than capable on multiple occasions and over a period of time.
 
I’m afraid the majority will be at Ibrox next season whether we like it or not .

wholesale changes would be a disaster
 
We've won 80% of our points. This suggest the core of the team is pretty good. We need additions not wholesale changes.

Our dropped points have come due to injuries, suspensions (and godawful refereeing) - and we have little quality to from the bench/squad to step in.
 
Uncle Albert said:
They have sleptwalked into a 10 point deficit in a matter of weeks, are totally incapable of dealing with difficult moments in games and appear lifeless when a reaction to adversity is required and expected.

You can argue the toss about Gerrard, there will be rumblings but there's no chance he's going anywhere given near enough the whole football department has been appointed to suit him.

We have a lot of very good footballers in our squad but there are huge mental scars/question marks with some of them. James Tavernier is someone I have gone to bat for on god knows how many occasions and playing in a Rangers team from different eras is someone I'm sure would have won many titles but even I now find myself wondering if the guy can ever recover from what he's endured in the last 5/6 years. He is merely an example.

I could easily see us in a similar position next winter break because we have some very good players but being honest how many would you really trust in the same situation we found ourselves in post 29th December?

The choice is whether you trust them to have learned from 2 post winter break title race capitulations or whether you roll the dice and bring in new recruits that can handle the situation a bit better.

Either way, the sheer lifelessness and lethargy about recent performances when there is so much at stake has to be factored in when we're planning for next season.
Click to expand...

I think its easy to lambast and we all do it in haste after a bad spell, but these are the players that we were all filling our pants about 2 months ago.

I don't think there is a massive clearout needed, but certainly a few will leave and we need some more quality.

I think teams have, much like Warburtons team, have figured out how to play against us, and we struggle to break down the teams when they sit in - unlike the Orcs from across the city who have that ability to break down teams.
We need to find another way, which isn't down to the players but to the manager and his staff.
 
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