The referee Bob Valentine

Gringo

Well-Known Member
How bad was he? He was generally regarded as the top ref in this country.

His last game in the 89 cup final was an absolute disgrace, I was browsing Youtube and saw some highlights of this, a catalogue of errors against us culminating in a wrongly disallowed goal which would have been a late equaliser.

I also saw a clip of Cooper scoring direct from a corner at the Piggery in 87, Bonner flapped with no Ranger near him and incredibly Valentine blew for a foul.
 
In that cup final, Peter Grant swung a right hook at Walters when he was running down the wing, it was as clear as day and should have been a red card, Ian St John co commentating said it right away, before making a racist joke about Grant giving him a black eye.
 
In that cup final, Peter Grant swung a right hook at Walters when he was running down the wing, it was as clear as day and should have been a red card, Ian St John co commentating said it right away, before making a racist joke about Grant giving him a black eye.

I'd need to see that one again.

Don't remember it as such being at the game.
 
I'd need to see that one again.

Don't remember it as such being at the game.

Some yahoo had uploaded the full game including half time analysis from Jardine and Provo, I flicked through it and this incident was in the first half, Walters himself also missed a glorious chance after they scored.
 
Some yahoo had uploaded the full game including half time analysis from Jardine and Provo, I flicked through it and this incident was in the first half, Walters himself also missed a glorious chance after they scored.

Not disputing you bud. I just can't remember the incident, just as Walters' chance as you state.

It's funny what sticks. I remember Aitken with a free kick at the sellik end with a few minutes to play in a dangerous area, and instead of trying to get a clinching goal, blootered it high into the terracing behind him.
 
Not disputing you bud. I just can't remember the incident, just as Walters' chance as you state.

It's funny what sticks. I remember Aitken with a free kick at the sellik end with a few minutes to play in a dangerous area, and instead of trying to get a clinching goal, blootered it high into the terracing behind him.

Indeed, I was actually at the game and remember little from it, I also remember Butcher playing up front for last 5-10 mins.
 
Indeed, I was actually at the game and remember little from it, I also remember Butcher playing up front for last 5-10 mins.

That's the thing. I can remember Colin Stein having a goal disallowed against them at Ibrox in September 1971, and the ref was John Paterson.

Yet I can't remember the instances you state at a game I actually attended.

I think the words; 'getting old' sums it up.
 
The present batch are worse, much, much worse.

Still remember an FF poll at the start of season 1989/90 and it asked for the save of the season?

And the answer was Bob Valentine for saving the filth's!, the previous term.

Valentine was utterly incompetent but I don't think he was a cheat. He gave us 2 penalties in a league cup final v Celtic, although both were definite spot kicks a proper cheat like Craig Thompson would still find a way not to give it. He also sent off Roy Aitken in a cup final v Aberdeen quite early on that massively helped the tims to lose.
He absolutely cost us 2 Scottish Cups in 77 and 89 by getting decisions blatantly wrong. Known by many as Bob Vatican for that reason.

Not the worst ref at the time despite being hopeless, that was the evil Rangers hating arrogant slimeball called Andrew Waddell.
 
Not disputing you bud. I just can't remember the incident, just as Walters' chance as you state.

It's funny what sticks. I remember Aitken with a free kick at the sellik end with a few minutes to play in a dangerous area, and instead of trying to get a clinching goal, blootered it high into the terracing behind him.
True
 
Valentine was utterly incompetent but I don't think he was a cheat. He gave us 2 penalties in a league cup final v Celtic, although both were definite spot kicks a proper cheat like Craig Thompson would still find a way not to give it. He also sent off Roy Aitken in a cup final v Aberdeen quite early on that massively helped the tims to lose.
He absolutely cost us 2 Scottish Cups in 77 and 89 by getting decisions blatantly wrong. Known by many as Bob Vatican for that reason.

Not the worst ref at the time despite being hopeless, that was the evil Rangers hating arrogant slimeball called Andrew Waddell.
Waddell produced a training video for up and coming referees about what was unacceptable.
Each instance showed a rangers player as the culprit. It was covered in the media at the time
 
Valentine was utterly incompetent but I don't think he was a cheat. He gave us 2 penalties in a league cup final v Celtic, although both were definite spot kicks a proper cheat like Craig Thompson would still find a way not to give it. He also sent off Roy Aitken in a cup final v Aberdeen quite early on that massively helped the tims to lose.
He absolutely cost us 2 Scottish Cups in 77 and 89 by getting decisions blatantly wrong. Known by many as Bob Vatican for that reason.

Not the worst ref at the time despite being hopeless, that was the evil Rangers hating arrogant slimeball called Andrew Waddell.
Waddell was a horrible specimen.

A shameless ar$ehole who would go out of his way to be seen to be giving decisions against us. For as long as I can remember, I have never known Scotland to produce a well known 'good' or dare I say it, 'excellent' referee. The eighties were littered with as many incompetent refs are there are today. The main difference is that, tv didn't dissect every decision with the magnifying glass to the same extent as they do today. Valentine was bad. Davie Syme was bad. Louis Thow was absolutely f**kin' abysmal. Ray Morrison, another clown. Valentine was on the Fifa list and was high profile - that's why there is an urban myth that he was the 'best' referee in the country. Don't be fooled; he was every bit as incompetent as the rest.

The true 'best' referee from that era was the incomparable Willie Miller.
 
Not disputing you bud. I just can't remember the incident, just as Walters' chance as you state.

It's funny what sticks. I remember Aitken with a free kick at the sellik end with a few minutes to play in a dangerous area, and instead of trying to get a clinching goal, blootered it high into the terracing behind him.
That’s true.
The Gallowgate Gallacticos, those cavaliers of attacking football, the team that the Dutch based their “total football” philosophy around, resorted to this.
 
He was one of the worst referees from his era. A known disliker of us. A self-important, schoolteacher type.

This is the type of thread I love on here, as it takes you down all sorts of avenues and alley ways.

As I said, I can remember the ref John Paterson in 1971.

Can't remember the ref who ruled out doddie's goal at the same end in March 1977 against the same opposition.

There were the incidents in the 80s that went against us. Loads of.

There was McGinlay, still lingering, Andrew Waddell and then we had Wullie Young going into the nineties.

My old man always maintains that Dung's performance in the OF reserve match in Jan 1994 (Big Dunc's comeback game) was the worst he'd ever witnessed. (He allowed Galloway to kick the big man up and down the park)

To sum up, when it comes to referees and their howlers, deliberate or not, we can in reality, give the filth a run for their money in their delusions regards bad refereeing calls.

However, the game changer for me was Hugh Dallas in the 1996 SC final when he refused to red card Paul Ritchie for the last man tackle on Gazza.

That was the beginning of the end.

In all previous cases (James Callaghan at the cesspit in 1969, being the obvious exception) you could argue that referees used their interpretation of the rules to officiate. You know the old 'letter of the law' get out clause.

In Dallas' case, he out rightly refused to uphold the rules of the game he was paid to implement.

Since the, it has incrementally got worse and worse and worse.
 
The ball clearly hits DJ on the knee. Couldn't wait to give it. Despise the cheating reptile.

PS One of the worse games I've been at.

Big DJ is quoted as saying around 20 years ago that he would swear on his son's life that he did not handle the ball. He went on to say that nothing is going to change the result and these things happen but he just wanted fans to know he did not use his hands.

IMHO Valentine along with Andrew Waddell & George Smith (who refereed the 1980 OF riot cup final) were 3 scumbags. I don't know if they were just bad refereeing us or whether fans of other clubs felt likewise. However during the 80's I hated when these 3 were refereeing our games, especially the big important ones.
 
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This is the type of thread I love on here, as it takes you down all sorts of avenues and alley ways.

As I said, I can remember the ref John Paterson in 1971.

Can't remember the ref who ruled out doddie's goal at the same end in March 1977 against the same opposition.

There were the incidents in the 80s that went against us. Loads of.

There was McGinlay, still lingering, Andrew Waddell and then we had Wullie Young going into the nineties.

My old man always maintains that Dung's performance in the OF reserve match in Jan 1994 (Big Dunc's comeback game) was the worst he'd ever witnessed. (He allowed Galloway to kick the big man up and down the park)

To sum up, when it comes to referees and their howlers, deliberate or not, we can in reality, give the filth a run for their money in their delusions regards bad refereeing calls.

However, the game changer for me was Hugh Dallas in the 1996 SC final when he refused to red card Paul Ritchie for the last man tackle on Gazza.

That was the beginning of the end.

In all previous cases (James Callaghan at the cesspit in 1969, being the obvious exception) you could argue that referees used their interpretation of the rules to officiate. You know the old 'letter of the law' get out clause.

In Dallas' case, he out rightly refused to uphold the rules of the game he was paid to implement.

Since the, it has incrementally got worse and worse and worse.

Dallas refusing to red card Stewart Kerr for picking up the ball outside the box, shocker of a decision.
 
McGinley is the one that sticks in my head simply because my uncle Fukin hated him.
Whenever we got a bad decision against us no matter who the ref was he would shout “the refs a McGinley” even in European ties.
It started being his word to describe cheating.
If you were playing him at any games etc and he suspected you were cheating he would call you a McGinley :D:D
 
I spoke to him at a bowls match and asked about the pk he gave in77 when it clearly hits DJ on his knees.His responce was you must be a Rangers man but I indicated I was a dundee fan, his answer was stone wall pk.Later in the day when he found out I was a Rangers fan he whispered in my ear " better not tell you the story about giving scum a throw in when it was yours in the joe miller cup final" whank of a man
 
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This is the type of thread I love on here, as it takes you down all sorts of avenues and alley ways.

As I said, I can remember the ref John Paterson in 1971.

Can't remember the ref who ruled out doddie's goal at the same end in March 1977 against the same opposition.

There were the incidents in the 80s that went against us. Loads of.

There was McGinlay, still lingering, Andrew Waddell and then we had Wullie Young going into the nineties.

My old man always maintains that Dung's performance in the OF reserve match in Jan 1994 (Big Dunc's comeback game) was the worst he'd ever witnessed. (He allowed Galloway to kick the big man up and down the park)

To sum up, when it comes to referees and their howlers, deliberate or not, we can in reality, give the filth a run for their money in their delusions regards bad refereeing calls.

However, the game changer for me was Hugh Dallas in the 1996 SC final when he refused to red card Paul Ritchie for the last man tackle on Gazza.

That was the beginning of the end.

In all previous cases (James Callaghan at the cesspit in 1969, being the obvious exception) you could argue that referees used their interpretation of the rules to officiate. You know the old 'letter of the law' get out clause.

In Dallas' case, he out rightly refused to uphold the rules of the game he was paid to implement.

Since the, it has incrementally got worse and worse and worse.
Worse than the Paul Ritchie decision by Dallas, was his decision not to send Stewart Kerr off for catching the ball outside his area around the same time.

Edit: sorry Gringo.
 
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Waddell produced a training video for up and coming referees about what was unacceptable.
Each instance showed a rangers player as the culprit. It was covered in the media at the time
he told the assembly of Referees that Gazza was taking the piss out of Scottish football and should be handled like a “dangerous chemical”

It would be difficult to pick who was worse between Waddle and Vatican. Waddle was worse over the piece, he was a cheat every time, Vatican showed up in bigger games.
 
Worse than the Paul Ritchie decision by Dallas, was his decision not to send Stewart Kerr off for catching the ball outside his area around the same time.

Agree ish.

Ritchie was 96
Kerr was 99.

In between times we had him red carding Hateley at the cesspit in March 97 for having the audacity of putting his jaw in front of McNamara's fist.

Now there is a black and white snap from the game showing the onrushing Dallas having a full on view of the incident.

The game after we won the 2003 LC, we played Motherwell in the league. We were booted up and down the park that night and Dallas allowed them to do what they want.

In the second half, Lovenkrands was slightly late with a tackle. (And tackling was Lovenkrands; strong suit, wasn't it?) and it was an instant yellow. To the letter of the law. Only applied to us.

As I said, Dallas was the game changer for me, despite all the wrongs we have been on the receiving end from beforehand.
 
Waddell produced a training video for up and coming referees about what was unacceptable.
Each instance showed a rangers player as the culprit. It was covered in the media at the time
That’s just ridiculous.
I’m laughing at how ridiculous it is.
Can you imagine if it had been septic who were used this way?
 
How bad was he? He was generally regarded as the top ref in this country.

His last game in the 89 cup final was an absolute disgrace, I was browsing Youtube and saw some highlights of this, a catalogue of errors against us culminating in a wrongly disallowed goal which would have been a late equaliser.

I also saw a clip of Cooper scoring direct from a corner at the Piggery in 87, Bonner flapped with no Ranger near him and incredibly Valentine blew for a foul.

Add the 1977 Scottish Cup Final and a penalty for them that wasn't. He was either bent or incompetent but given the fact his biggest mistakes came against us I think I know which one I'd go for!
 
I remember a game at Tynecastle in Souness's first season we won 5-2 and Valentine single handedly kept Hearts in the game for a while.
He gave them a penalty that day for absolutely nothing.
 
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Waddell was a horrible specimen.

A shameless ar$ehole who would go out of his way to be seen to be giving decisions against us. For as long as I can remember, I have never known Scotland to produce a well known 'good' or dare I say it, 'excellent' referee. The eighties were littered with as many incompetent refs are there are today. The main difference is that, tv didn't dissect every decision with the magnifying glass to the same extent as they do today. Valentine was bad. Davie Syme was bad. Louis Thow was absolutely f**kin' abysmal. Ray Morrison, another clown. Valentine was on the Fifa list and was high profile - that's why there is an urban myth that he was the 'best' referee in the country. Don't be fooled; he was every bit as incompetent as the rest.

The true 'best' referee from that era was the incomparable Willie Miller.


I'll no miss boab or waddell when they shuttle off this mortal coil.
 
Valentine, is possibly in the top three of worst officials, if a team came from the East Coast, or had Reptile tendencies, Rangers were in for it. Another up there for us older a Bears was Hugh Philips, whether it was Wee Man problems, he was another creep.
 
Bringing back some horrible memories this thread,,,,,,,
I also remember a ref from the 80s called Alan Ferguson,,,gave us nothing,,,can't remember anything inparticular,,In thinking a cup tie at Dunfermline maybe,,,but his sons all went to the same as me and were all rampant beggars,,,,
 
Some yahoo had uploaded the full game including half time analysis from Jardine and Provo, I flicked through it and this incident was in the first half, Walters himself also missed a glorious chance after they scored.

McCoist missed an absolute sitter late on too.

The stolen throw in, the Grant swing at Walters and the wrongly disallowed goal.

Valentine gave us a helluva send off that day.
 
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Don't see any mention of big Rowbotham.
i remember coming out of easter rd one day ,and wee andy bain was with andy cameron ,he was calling him rock bottom,and with good reason,he was a another fraud and useless into the bargain ,but like others he stuck it to the rangers ,and so got a free pass from those in charge,
 
The first referee I remember being despised was Bobby Davidson. Even the Tims hated him. Gave us nothing.

Davidson had previous.

Rangers (possibly Ralph Brand) scoring an equaliser in the 1958 SC replay v Hibs, and Davidson disallowing.

Fast forward sixteen years, same team this time at Ibrox in the LC sections and the same ref waves away a screamer from DJ that went underneath the crossbar and bounced out.
 
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