The way SG wants to play doesn’t suit the squad

midlandbear

Well-Known Member
Tonight aside, it looks to me that playing 2 holding midfielders in every game, means he wants to play more like 4-2-3-1.

Unfortunately, players like Candeias and Middleton don’t suit this and we’ve fallen away from what I feel was his original vision. The signing of Grezda, Ejaria and Kent was more in line with that type of fluid style of attack he wants us playing, but none of those players barring perhaps Kent, know how to unlock a packed defence.

All 3 players behind the striker need to be able to beat a man, play a defence splitting pass, shoot from distance and when things aren’t opening, be intelligent with possession. NONE of our current midfield can do even 3 from 4 on that list.
We have 1 player capable of doing most of the list, but he’s playing at RB.

Middleton and Candeias are balls to the wall, full throttle running players. Unless they have space to push the ball past the man, they can’t take someone 1 on 1. They both are similar in their game I feel and lack the composure to play an intelligent advanced role.

Ejaria doesn’t fancy it here I don’t think and personally he doesn’t give us what we need.

Arfield is way to slow in his decision making to play a quick and dynamic attacking game.

The quick fix solution unfortunately is to bring in 3 attacking midfielders, who can do all of the things mentioned above. Not likely to happen without massive funds being available, but even having 1 to link up with Kent and Morelos could see us do pretty well at 4-3-3.

With a lack of goals as a result of limited options, for the short term we could do a lot worse than play Flanagan in his natural position and push Tav to where he can hurt teams. And/or play Halliday in the central attacking role.
The bottom line is, we need a threat there to draw defences out. Anyone who provides a shooting threat at least, will make sides more urgent to push out for second balls. At the moment there’s no need, because none of our current midfield can or would shoot.

Tav and Halliday were both regular scorers for us when playing in a system that gave them the freedom to attack the goal. There are far worse things to try and I think we’ve seen some of them already this season.

If (and there’s nothing to back up why we could be on current form) we get ourselves comfortably in front at the weekend, I’d try this for the last 20-25 mins.

...............................Mcgregor
Flanagan........Goldson.......Katic.........Barisic
..
.......................Mcrorie.........Jack
..
.........Tav................Halliday..........Kent/Grezda
.....
...............................Morelos
 
Tonight aside, it looks to me that playing 2 holding midfielders in every game, means he wants to play more like 4-2-3-1.

Unfortunately, players like Candeias and Middleton don’t suit this and we’ve fallen away from what I feel was his original vision. The signing of Grezda, Ejaria and Kent was more in line with that type of fluid style of attack he wants us playing, but none of those players barring perhaps Kent, know how to unlock a packed defence.

All 3 players behind the striker need to be able to beat a man, play a defence splitting pass, shoot from distance and when things aren’t opening, be intelligent with possession. NONE of our current midfield can do even 3 from 4 on that list.
We have 1 player capable of doing most of the list, but he’s playing at RB.

Middleton and Candeias are balls to the wall, full throttle running players. Unless they have space to push the ball past the man, they can’t take someone 1 on 1. They both are similar in their game I feel and lack the composure to play an intelligent advanced role.

Ejaria doesn’t fancy it here I don’t think and personally he doesn’t give us what we need.

Arfield is way to slow in his decision making to play a quick and dynamic attacking game.

The quick fix solution unfortunately is to bring in 3 attacking midfielders, who can do all of the things mentioned above. Not likely to happen without massive funds being available, but even having 1 to link up with Kent and Morelos could see us do pretty well at 4-3-3.

With a lack of goals as a result of limited options, for the short term we could do a lot worse than play Flanagan in his natural position and push Tav to where he can hurt teams. And/or play Halliday in the central attacking role.
The bottom line is, we need a threat there to draw defences out. Anyone who provides a shooting threat at least, will make sides more urgent to push out for second balls. At the moment there’s no need, because none of our current midfield can or would shoot.

Tav and Halliday were both regular scorers for us when playing in a system that gave them the freedom to attack the goal. There are far worse things to try and I think we’ve seen some of them already this season.

If (and there’s nothing to back up why we could be on current form) we get ourselves comfortably in front at the weekend, I’d try this for the last 20-25 mins.

...............................Mcgregor
Flanagan........Goldson.......Katic.........Barisic
..
.......................Mcrorie.........Jack
..
.........Tav................Halliday..........Kent/Grezda
.....
...............................Morelos
No arfield?
 
No arfield?
Not for me mate. He doesn’t react quick enough. He wants an extra touch most of the time and doesn’t have another gear to go past someone.
Also, how many opportunities has he had to shoot that he hasn’t taken. There’s something not right there from a guy who has been a goal scorer all his days.
 
Not for me mate. He doesn’t react quick enough. He wants an extra touch most of the time and doesn’t have another gear to go past someone.
Also, how many opportunities has he had to shoot that he hasn’t taken. There’s something not right there from a guy who has been a goal scorer all his days.

Does he not have more goals & assists that the rest of our midfielders combined?
 
Does he not have more goals & assists that the rest of our midfielders combined?
It’s not really much to benchmark against though mate, none of the rest of them contribute very much at the sharp end.
It may be the case that he performs better in improved company, I just don’t see it myself.
 
I have said for a long time that Tav needs to be in midfield.

He can be a genuine threat rather than a potential liability in defence.
 
I have said for a long time that Tav needs to be in midfield.

He can be a genuine threat rather than a potential liability in defence.
The best part of his game by a mile is his thread going forward. The current system does not get the best from him.
 
I remember when gerrard came in.It was meant to be modern high pressing and high intensity . Klopp esq.that's not happened.we're as laboured as warburton .Style wise we look like a poor man's walter not a poor man's klopp
 
I think we need to stop mucking about now and get a grip here.

We should be playing 4-5-1 flood the midfield

Mcgregor

Tav
Goldson
Katic/Mcauley
Barisic

Candeias
McCrorie
Jack
Rossiter
Arfield

Morelos

Float long balls to Morelos for the bulk of the game to take down and let Arfield and Candeias come short and take a pass or run for a flick on
 
:eek: Arfield is absolutely key to our formation working. 6 goals and 4 assists, 1 of the highest in the league. Midland bear would drop him for Halliday who couldn't get in Pedro's team and, despite playing 90 games, mostly in the Scottish Championship, has scored 9 goals for us. You'd think Arfield missing Aberdeen and Dundee would have at least stopped this nonsense.
 
He's a rookie manager.
That's the bottom line.
I doubt he will be here for a lot to shout about.
 
I remember when gerrard came in.It was meant to be modern high pressing and high intensity . Klopp esq.that's not happened.we're as laboured as warburton .Style wise we look like a poor man's walter not a poor man's klopp

We've labored against teams who pack defences in the same way that Liverpool often dropped points against teams such as Burnley. They appear to have changed this season and play a more contained game of previous seasons.

Klopp took a while to learn it. SG will, as well.
 
I remember when gerrard came in.It was meant to be modern high pressing and high intensity . Klopp esq.that's not happened.we're as laboured as warburton .Style wise we look like a poor man's walter not a poor man's klopp
Liverpool hardly play the balls to the wall pressing anymore either.
 
We are a much better counter
Attacking team team than a possession team, which is why we are better with ten men than against ten. Works in some games but the majority of games in Scotland we need to be able to unlock a packed defence, especially through the middle as we just go wide all the time it's too obvious can't do much till January tho and probably the summer tbh
 
Two suggestions here are baffling to me.

Arfield one I don’t get, he’s the only midfielder we have that shows any intelligence in attacking areas for me. Does lots of work off ball, gets beyond striker and supports striker. He’s chipped in with a few goals as well. The two games without him in league we were terrible, so I don’t get how playing Halliday there when he’s never a number 10 would help anything.

Tav is a full back/wing back, he’s not a a midfielder. It’s completely different, this notion that full backs who do well going forward are automatically midfielders does my head in. Receiving the ball with back to goal a lot more rather than coming on to game and his starting position would be higher. If you’re saying move him to where he hurts teams, I don’t see the need, as he usually is an asset to us going forward from where he. We’d get less out him in an attacking sense if we moved him forward imo.
 
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We've labored against teams who pack defences in the same way that Liverpool often dropped points against teams such as Burnley. They appear to have changed this season and play a more contained game of previous seasons.

Klopp took a while to learn it. SG will, as well.
I bet both manager's wished they had your tactical knowledge of the game

Honestly, the amount of people on here that think they have superior knowledge than our manager is laughable.
 
Not for me mate. He doesn’t react quick enough. He wants an extra touch most of the time and doesn’t have another gear to go past someone.
Also, how many opportunities has he had to shoot that he hasn’t taken. There’s something not right there from a guy who has been a goal scorer all his days.

Arfield missing in our last two league games is one of the main reasons we have looked absolutely toothless.
His late runs and link up play with the forwards and bringing other people into the game is vital to us breaking defences down
 
Tonight aside, it looks to me that playing 2 holding midfielders in every game, means he wants to play more like 4-2-3-1.

Unfortunately, players like Candeias and Middleton don’t suit this and we’ve fallen away from what I feel was his original vision. The signing of Grezda, Ejaria and Kent was more in line with that type of fluid style of attack he wants us playing, but none of those players barring perhaps Kent, know how to unlock a packed defence.

All 3 players behind the striker need to be able to beat a man, play a defence splitting pass, shoot from distance and when things aren’t opening, be intelligent with possession. NONE of our current midfield can do even 3 from 4 on that list.
We have 1 player capable of doing most of the list, but he’s playing at RB.

Middleton and Candeias are balls to the wall, full throttle running players. Unless they have space to push the ball past the man, they can’t take someone 1 on 1. They both are similar in their game I feel and lack the composure to play an intelligent advanced role.

Ejaria doesn’t fancy it here I don’t think and personally he doesn’t give us what we need.

Arfield is way to slow in his decision making to play a quick and dynamic attacking game.

The quick fix solution unfortunately is to bring in 3 attacking midfielders, who can do all of the things mentioned above. Not likely to happen without massive funds being available, but even having 1 to link up with Kent and Morelos could see us do pretty well at 4-3-3.

With a lack of goals as a result of limited options, for the short term we could do a lot worse than play Flanagan in his natural position and push Tav to where he can hurt teams. And/or play Halliday in the central attacking role.
The bottom line is, we need a threat there to draw defences out. Anyone who provides a shooting threat at least, will make sides more urgent to push out for second balls. At the moment there’s no need, because none of our current midfield can or would shoot.

Tav and Halliday were both regular scorers for us when playing in a system that gave them the freedom to attack the goal. There are far worse things to try and I think we’ve seen some of them already this season.

If (and there’s nothing to back up why we could be on current form) we get ourselves comfortably in front at the weekend, I’d try this for the last 20-25 mins.

...............................Mcgregor
Flanagan........Goldson.......Katic.........Barisic
..
.......................Mcrorie.........Jack
..
.........Tav................Halliday..........Kent/Grezda
.....
...............................Morelos


Haliday as a no 10? Thats absolute madness not sure what yer thinking is behind that
 
Tonight aside, it looks to me that playing 2 holding midfielders in every game, means he wants to play more like 4-2-3-1.

Unfortunately, players like Candeias and Middleton don’t suit this and we’ve fallen away from what I feel was his original vision. The signing of Grezda, Ejaria and Kent was more in line with that type of fluid style of attack he wants us playing, but none of those players barring perhaps Kent, know how to unlock a packed defence.

All 3 players behind the striker need to be able to beat a man, play a defence splitting pass, shoot from distance and when things aren’t opening, be intelligent with possession. NONE of our current midfield can do even 3 from 4 on that list.
We have 1 player capable of doing most of the list, but he’s playing at RB.

Middleton and Candeias are balls to the wall, full throttle running players. Unless they have space to push the ball past the man, they can’t take someone 1 on 1. They both are similar in their game I feel and lack the composure to play an intelligent advanced role.

Ejaria doesn’t fancy it here I don’t think and personally he doesn’t give us what we need.

Arfield is way to slow in his decision making to play a quick and dynamic attacking game.

The quick fix solution unfortunately is to bring in 3 attacking midfielders, who can do all of the things mentioned above. Not likely to happen without massive funds being available, but even having 1 to link up with Kent and Morelos could see us do pretty well at 4-3-3.

With a lack of goals as a result of limited options, for the short term we could do a lot worse than play Flanagan in his natural position and push Tav to where he can hurt teams. And/or play Halliday in the central attacking role.
The bottom line is, we need a threat there to draw defences out. Anyone who provides a shooting threat at least, will make sides more urgent to push out for second balls. At the moment there’s no need, because none of our current midfield can or would shoot.

Tav and Halliday were both regular scorers for us when playing in a system that gave them the freedom to attack the goal. There are far worse things to try and I think we’ve seen some of them already this season.

If (and there’s nothing to back up why we could be on current form) we get ourselves comfortably in front at the weekend, I’d try this for the last 20-25 mins.

...............................Mcgregor
Flanagan........Goldson.......Katic.........Barisic
..
.......................Mcrorie.........Jack
..
.........Tav................Halliday..........Kent/Grezda
.....
...............................Morelos
Maybe we should have you as manager instead
 
Haliday as a no 10? Thats absolute madness not sure what yer thinking is behind that
My thinking is that Halliday was a regular scorer for us when playing in a non holding midfield role. He is the only one from our current crop who has shown he is capable of creating a threat from distance AND beating the time in the process.

What we are doing now doesn’t work. Something different needs to be tried and AH has a good record as a goal threat. He only dropped off when the quality around him dropped off. We have far better protective players for midfield now, to give him the freedom of causing defences problems.

Even if his shooting threat alone causes defences to get out quicker, that will create gaps for us to exploit.


Insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.
 
Multiple pennies need to drop for SG.

He can't moan about teams playing ten behind the ball, then suggest the Rapid game would suit us because they'll be less defensive, then excuse the players when yet again, they pose no attacking threat.

433 is a complete nonsense and the pressure will only increase if he persists with it. It's a basic error, asking the same players to keep trying to stuff a square peg into a round hole.

The Tims WILL play 361 so we've no excuses not being ready for it. They'll murder us if we play our timid 433, wing-shuffling, limp shithousery.

Progress has been good, but we are also failing multiple big tests. Gerrard's system, and largely his signings, haven't hit the mark as yet.
 
My thinking is that Halliday was a regular scorer for us when playing in a non holding midfield role. He is the only one from our current crop who has shown he is capable of creating a threat from distance AND beating the time in the process.

What we are doing now doesn’t work. Something different needs to be tried and AH has a good record as a goal threat. He only dropped off when the quality around him dropped off. We have far better protective players for midfield now, to give him the freedom of causing defences problems.

Even if his shooting threat alone causes defences to get out quicker, that will create gaps for us to exploit.


Insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.

When he was playing in a regular basis he was up against teams in a championship side. Hes never a no10 in his life even he would tell you that but am more than happy to see him play more in the middle just not as a no10
 
I’m not suggesting it as a long term strategy mate. We just need a threat at the edge of the box to make things happen until we can strengthen in January.
 
I bet both manager's wished they had your tactical knowledge of the game

Honestly, the amount of people on here that think they have superior knowledge than our manager is laughable.

I bet they don’t. It’s just an observation. Not sure why you want to be a dick about it.

Look at Liverpool’s results from previous seasons against lower level teams who pack defences. Look at our performances.

Klopp has adjusted how Liverpool play this season. We’ll need to do likewise.
 
Just as well he's only had 1 transfer window and has signed a 4 year contract then. Plenty time to get it right.
 
Tavernier wouldn't be the same player playing in midfield.

His movement, energy, runs and intricate passing from RB is what makes him such an attacking threat. As are his balls from just inside the half way line.
 
Tonight aside, it looks to me that playing 2 holding midfielders in every game, means he wants to play more like 4-2-3-1.

Unfortunately, players like Candeias and Middleton don’t suit this and we’ve fallen away from what I feel was his original vision. The signing of Grezda, Ejaria and Kent was more in line with that type of fluid style of attack he wants us playing, but none of those players barring perhaps Kent, know how to unlock a packed defence.

All 3 players behind the striker need to be able to beat a man, play a defence splitting pass, shoot from distance and when things aren’t opening, be intelligent with possession. NONE of our current midfield can do even 3 from 4 on that list.
We have 1 player capable of doing most of the list, but he’s playing at RB.

Middleton and Candeias are balls to the wall, full throttle running players. Unless they have space to push the ball past the man, they can’t take someone 1 on 1. They both are similar in their game I feel and lack the composure to play an intelligent advanced role.

Ejaria doesn’t fancy it here I don’t think and personally he doesn’t give us what we need.

Arfield is way to slow in his decision making to play a quick and dynamic attacking game.

The quick fix solution unfortunately is to bring in 3 attacking midfielders, who can do all of the things mentioned above. Not likely to happen without massive funds being available, but even having 1 to link up with Kent and Morelos could see us do pretty well at 4-3-3.

With a lack of goals as a result of limited options, for the short term we could do a lot worse than play Flanagan in his natural position and push Tav to where he can hurt teams. And/or play Halliday in the central attacking role.
The bottom line is, we need a threat there to draw defences out. Anyone who provides a shooting threat at least, will make sides more urgent to push out for second balls. At the moment there’s no need, because none of our current midfield can or would shoot.

Tav and Halliday were both regular scorers for us when playing in a system that gave them the freedom to attack the goal. There are far worse things to try and I think we’ve seen some of them already this season.

If (and there’s nothing to back up why we could be on current form) we get ourselves comfortably in front at the weekend, I’d try this for the last 20-25 mins.

...............................Mcgregor
Flanagan........Goldson.......Katic.........Barisic
..
.......................Mcrorie.........Jack
..
.........Tav................Halliday..........Kent/Grezda
.....
...............................Morelos


Pretty much agree with this...for me, Halliday has played well under SG and i was one of his biggest critics and i would like to see him play behind Morelos to see if it could work. Tav also needs to be further up the park away from our defence with Flanagan playing at RB so that if Barasic bombs up the park, then Flanagan can tuck in with the centre halfs..
 
I think we need to stop mucking about now and get a grip here.

We should be playing 4-5-1 flood the midfield

Mcgregor

Tav
Goldson
Katic/Mcauley
Barisic

Candeias
McCrorie
Jack
Rossiter
Arfield

Morelos

Float long balls to Morelos for the bulk of the game to take down and let Arfield and Candeias come short and take a pass or run for a flick on

Long balls to Morelos for the bulk of the game?

Didn’t know Bobby Gould posted on here.

Every day is a school day.
 
Aye alright salsa try contributing something of interest to the forum

Flooding the midfield and hoofing the ball up to a solitary striker is nothing more than roulette.

You’re essentially relying on Morelos to win the ball more than two the two centre half’s.

If it was Hateley up front alone the you might have an argument.

PS....it would also require full backs/centre back who can play an accurate ball.

We have only one of those and he played his first game in months last night.

That better?
 
Said this on another thread. To play 4-3-3 you need proper forwards out wide who can support the striker.

This all day long.

We don’t have the required quality for this at the moment.

The fact two of the front three are out and out wide men makes itworse as not only don’t they support main striker they also hinder full backs bombing on.
 
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