Tim Sherwood - certified football guru

legalbeagle

Well-Known Member
You did the same thing by saying Sherwoods only there because hes white.

That poster is saying he has very good credentials in football and it seems pointless replacing a shite pundit with another shite pundit, only a different race or sex. Its the same as replacing them with another shite pundit whos white. But if the aim is to target and change sexist or racist attitudes in the game by bringing those people in then it wont work if theyre terrible at the job.

I didn’t say he was only there because he was white. However, white is the default setting (and people like Sherwood are lucky it is), other pundits get critiqued based on their sex or colour as the reason they got the job.
 
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bluenosebazza

Well-Known Member
I didn’t say he was only there because he was white. However, white is the default setting (and people like Sherwood are lucky it is), other pundits get critiqued based on their sex or colour as the reason they got the job.
You did though. 'people don’t consider that he actually only has the job because the default still remains white men.'

The argument since has been that he captained a team to a Premier League title and has managed a top team in the Premier League, so he has virtues that make him suitable to commentate on the game other than being a white man.
 

Disraeli

Well-Known Member
Sherwood is thick as shit, but the arguments that Reddy puts forward represent so much with what is wrong about modern football.
 

Business_Bear

Well-Known Member
Sherwood is the classic Little Englander!

Remember his tear stained rant after getting beat by Benfica, moaning about a lack of class from the opposing manager!
 

legalbeagle

Well-Known Member
You did though. 'people don’t consider that he actually only has the job because the default still remains white men.'

The argument since has been that he captained a team to a Premier League title and has managed a top team in the Premier League, so he has virtues that make him suitable to commentate on the game other than being a white man.

i even repeated the comment, the default IS white men.
Clinton Morrison has about as much to qualify him for the job as Paul Merson, both seem to be unpopular as pundits - but only one is assumed to have the job for the wrong reasons.

edit: and if you think it is woke people like me (or whatever anyone calls me) that are obsessed with race and sex just check out the New James Bond thread in the lounge.
 

bluenosebazza

Well-Known Member
i even repeated the comment, the default IS white men.
Clinton Morrison has about as much to qualify him for the job as Paul Merson, both seem to be unpopular as pundits - but only one is assumed to have the job for the wrong reasons.

edit: and if you think it is woke people like me (or whatever anyone calls me) that are obsessed with race and sex just check out the New James Bond thread in the lounge.
Morrison has never won or managed in the premier league. He isnt even as qualified as Merson if were talking about the level theyve played at. He is every bit as bad a pundit as Sherwood and Merson though so he is qualified in that sense. And im also not sure ive ever heard anyone say Morrison got the job because hes black. Heard it about others but i dont think ive heard it about him. Im sure he wouldve started commentating on midweek lower league games because thats the level he had just come from so it made sense.

I havent and would never call you or think youre woke. Its a word used by absolute cretins in the sense you mean.
 

TNT

Well-Known Member
Official Ticketer
This is what stuck out for me. Winning a trophy is THE measure of success, unless you consider being in the top 4 of the epl so you can make more cash a success.
I assume she was referring to the quality of opposition to win that trophy.

Although, as a fan, I want my team to win trophies.

Sometimes a cup win, for example, merely paints over the cracks.
 

legalbeagle

Well-Known Member
Morrison has never won or managed in the premier league. He isnt even as qualified as Merson if were talking about the level theyve played at. He is every bit as bad a pundit as Sherwood and Merson though so he is qualified in that sense. And im also not sure ive ever heard anyone say Morrison got the job because hes black. Heard it about others but i dont think ive heard it about him. Im sure he wouldve started commentating on midweek lower league games because thats the level he had just come from so it made sense.

I havent and would never call you or think youre woke. Its a word used by absolute cretins in the sense you mean.

Fair enough if you haven’t heard it, I have seen the ‘diversity’ complaints when Sky got rid of the three amigos.
 

Thommo2006

Well-Known Member
Might just be me but I rarely listen to the pundits, I know football I know what I'm watching and other than the soccer saturday type shows where you need someone to tell you if theres a goal etc football doesnt really need them. Ideally for me coverage would come on 5 minutes before kick off and end at full time.
 

bluenosebazza

Well-Known Member
Fair enough if you haven’t heard it, I have seen the ‘diversity’ complaints when Sky got rid of the three amigos.
Merson, Nicholas and Thompson stayed in their jobs about 10 years longer than they should have. It was clear a long time ago they had nothing to contribute. Le Tissier i quite liked, he was fun on Soccer Saturday. Morrison already does punditry on the midweek show and weekend championship games so it makes sense to promote him. If they are deliberately going towards a more diverse route then hes done the job and familiar with the format.

For the record, i dont think racial and sexual diversity is a bad thing, even if its being done deliberately. But for it to convince people who are resistant to the status quo you really need to make sure theyre better than what theyre replacing.
 

TNT

Well-Known Member
Official Ticketer
Sherwood is thick as shit, but the arguments that Reddy puts forward represent so much with what is wrong about modern football.

Too many pundits - most of whom offer zero insight. Personally, I think Jamie Redknapp, for example, only points out the bleeding obvious,

Journos in England have a ridiculously high opinion of their importance to the game though. Oliver Hoult being one of the worst.

Football is a simple game of 11v11 and the team who scores the most goals wins.
 

CoopBlue

Well-Known Member
Might just be me but I rarely listen to the pundits, I know football I know what I'm watching and other than the soccer saturday type shows where you need someone to tell you if theres a goal etc football doesnt really need them. Ideally for me coverage would come on 5 minutes before kick off and end at full time.
Agreed.

I simply refuse to watch the pre and post match stuff these days.

It's mostly awful stuff and they are generally just padding out the programme on order to generate advertising income from the commercials.
 

huistrasleftpeg

Well-Known Member
I didn’t say he was only there because he was white. However, white is the default setting (and people like Sherwood are lucky it is), other pundits get critiqued based on their sex or colour as the reason they got the job.
Please get off tour high horse mate. Key to being intelligent is being balanced, intelligent, knowledgeable and experience of playing at the highest level.

Colour or religion should not be a factor, I can’t think of any that are critiqued based on this. Clinton Morrison, for example is a shit pundit, whereas Ashley Cole, Ian Wright or Glen Johnson come across really well.

Women, in my opinion shouldn’t be anywhere near being pundits.
 

legalbeagle

Well-Known Member
Please get off tour high horse mate. Key to being intelligent is being balanced, intelligent, knowledgeable and experience of playing at the highest level.

Colour or religion should not be a factor, I can’t think of any that are. Clinton Morrison, for example is a shit pundit, whereas Ashley Cole, Ian Wright or Glen Johnson come across really well.

Women, in my opinion shouldn’t be anywhere near being pundits IMO.

ok, I’ll maybe just stay on your high horse if you think it is all right to be sexist as long as you don’t think you are racist. Why can’t it just be the best person for the job?
 

huistrasleftpeg

Well-Known Member
ok, I’ll maybe just stay on your high horse if you think it is all right to be sexist as long as you don’t think you are racist. Why can’t it just be the best person for the job?
I’ve given my reasons. Womens football is played at a level probably comparable to Juniors. Therefore, lack top level experience.

Sexist? I don’t think so. Just factual.
 

_DON_

Well-Known Member
I’ve given my reasons. Womens football is played at a level probably comparable to Juniors. Therefore, lack top level experience.

Sexist? I don’t think so. Just factual.

It's still the same game though.

There is no difference in all levels of football other than ability and eventually money, which is why it is the most popular sport on the planet.

TBH, my point is more at pundits who think because they played the game at the top level, somehow think in their uneducated, semi-literate minds think that football is some complex thing, when it really isn't.
 
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prenzlauerbear

Well-Known Member
Him and one of the Custis' made the Sunday Supplement unwatchable for me eventually. Both think their opinions hold more validity than others.

There are so many awful people involved in English football but Neil "Gravy Veins" Custis is in a league of his own when it comes to sheer egregiousness. A fat, pathetic weasle of a human being who has never recovered from being slapped down on live radio by Ray Wilkins.

His obsession with 365.com is hilarious. Stuff like this.
 

legalbeagle

Well-Known Member
I’ve given my reasons. Womens football is played at a level probably comparable to Juniors. Therefore, lack top level experience.

Sexist? I don’t think so. Just factual.

well, it is discriminating against someone purely on the grounds of sex, so, well, it is sexist.
 

huistrasleftpeg

Well-Known Member
It's still the same game though.

There is no difference in all levels of football other than ability and eventually money, which is why it is the most popular sport on the planet.
On that basis, is it OK for for the guy down the pub who comes across well and intelligible to be a pundit? In my opinion, not. Having experience of premier league or top class European football is essential to give viewers an insight to highest level.
 

_DON_

Well-Known Member
On that basis, is it OK for for the guy down the pub who comes across well and intelligible to be a pundit? In my opinion, not. Having experience of premier league or top class European football is essential to give viewers an insight to highest level.

I'm pretty sure that there are many former players or current coaches in the lower levels of football who have a much better understanding of the game than former professional footballers who only have the avenue of punditry because they are a household name. I don't necessarily think that playing at the top level gives anyone anymore insight than those who played at a lower level.
 

huistrasleftpeg

Well-Known Member
I'm pretty sure that there are many former players or current coaches in the lower levels of football who have a much better understanding of the game than former professional footballers who only have the avenue of punditry because they are a household name. I don't necessarily think that playing at the top level gives anyone anymore insight than those who played at a lower level.
I don’t disagree with you. As I stated earlier, ex-players should also be intelligent, knowledgeable and balanced.
 

Danger Zone

Just the tip...
That's pretty much exactly what she said though. Specifically mentioned the tactics he used to win the City and Chelsea games as the measure of what he's doing, looking beyond just winning the cup itself, which can be done with a bit of luck by the likes of Wigan for example.

Yeah I took her point. For a club like that real success is the league or champions league, consistency over 38 games or in a cup competition with Europe’s elite (where even then you can get a fair bit of luck).

Arsenal have won 4 of the last 7 FA cups so that goes back to the end of Wenger’s tenure too. Would anyone really call the last 7 years a success for Arsenal just because they’ve picked up a few FA cups? I’m not even sure that mug Ty from Arsenal TV would believe that.
 

_DON_

Well-Known Member
I don’t disagree with you. As I stated earlier, ex-players should also be intelligent, knowledgeable and balanced.

I think it is mainly the older pundits that cause so much contention - most of which are only their because they were/are a household name and not necessarily their knowledge of football.
 

Bearsdenloyal

Well-Known Member
Sherwood down south, Stewart up here.

Sadly, networks more and more are going for pundits that provoke and get tweets rather than provide genuine insight.

I also suspect they are briefed that that's the reason they're used and to play up to the narrative if they want to keep getting gigs.

Course they are.

All about clicks

Sure they agree before who had which view
 

BiopsyJones

Well-Known Member
"Delivering an RKO..."

"Winning a trophy is not a measurement of success"

Not any better than what that moron Sherwood said.


Let's put it this way. If Rangers won the League Cup but finished third in the league, would he be considered a success?

She's absolutely right that Arsenal winning the FA Cup is not what will determine if Arteta is a success or not. They could have more successful season this year and not win anything.
 

Sir Sidney Ruff Diamond

Well-Known Member
He’s a bell end. Can’t stand the prick, look at him ffs

Sherwood Forest Gump.
 

tottie beck

Well-Known Member
The only issue I have with female pundits is I seem to automatically zone out of whatever they are saying. I think it’s a built in male thing, honed through years of listening to your missus go on and on about her day at work and how Jessie at the supermarkets’ man is cheating on her. Whenever I hear the sound of a woman’s voice talking at length I just mentally shut it out. It doesn’t matter what they’re saying. It’s an automatic response. It could be the most insightful comment in the history of football they are making, I just can’t concentrate on what they are saying.

Maybe subtitles would help... ;)
 

insanicdrunk

Well-Known Member
Might just be me but I rarely listen to the pundits, I know football I know what I'm watching and other than the soccer saturday type shows where you need someone to tell you if theres a goal etc football doesnt really need them. Ideally for me coverage would come on 5 minutes before kick off and end at full time.

Same here, though I have listened to RTV's ones for a change.

You want someone to point out something that you can't see as a non player, but we get the obvious stated all the time.
 

dekcuf

Active Member


Whatever could you mean ?
Ffs! About a decade or so ago journalists used to write pieces that were thought provoking or at least interesting. Disgusting saying this but around that time even Speirs used to write articles that were decent sometimes, he did a history of third Lanark back then that was a cracking read. Now it’s click bait pish or deliberately contrarian views that serve nothing apart from being controversial to get hits. Sure I read that the editor of the herald now gives bonuses based on internet clicks. Sad in a way
 

devilman

Well-Known Member
It is utterly astonishing the level of knowledge that some of these people involved in football punditry and commentary have. The shite they come away with is just mind blowing. What is even more astonishing is in most cases it's all they've - pretty much their entire life has been football and yet they know so little.

Sherwood is just as dumb as they come. As mentioned already, he's like England's answer to Stewart. A guy who appears to keep getting jobs and getting on TV talking about football when in fact, they probably know as much as someone who check in on football every couple of months.
 
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