Watching Sportscene on iPlayer and crowd at Kilmarnock is massive

Superrangers

Well-Known Member
Are Livingston not entitled to have some supporters there, however limited?

Should everything revolve around the demand of Rangers and Celtic?
No but fans are entitled to be upset at the paucity of support of a top flight support, especially if Rangers fans cannot get a ticket.
 

Barryhopez

Well-Known Member
Scottish football fans are mainly concentrated around 2 teams. Why would anyone ever be surprised that most teams outwith us and them are relatively poorly supported?

Folk want the game to revolve around us and facilitate us whilst sneering at all other teams in the country......then get weepy as we are hated.
 

Taki

Well-Known Member
No but fans are entitled to be upset at the paucity of support of a top flight support, especially if Rangers fans cannot get a ticket.
They're not entitled to be upset at all unless they hold the strange belief that only Rangers fans should be allowed to attend league fixtures at Ibrox.
 

Superrangers

Well-Known Member
They're not entitled to be upset at all unless they hold the strange belief that only Rangers fans should be allowed to attend league fixtures at Ibrox.
Of course they are. It’s a pathetic support for a top league side going to the home of the nation’s biggest and most successful club. Truly woeful.
 

ClockworkOrange

Well-Known Member
Of course they are. It’s a pathetic support for a top league side going to the home of the nation’s biggest and most successful club. Truly woeful.
If Livingston had more supporters, they'd be there. They're not because they don't exist. Moaning about a poor support is like getting upset that unicorns or leprechauns don't exist. It's to be entirely expected when there's a duopoly in which one of two teams have won the league for the past 35 years. If you'd like more Livingston supporters to have been there, they need to come from somewhere; in this case, probably from Rangers and Celtic fans.
 

Superrangers

Well-Known Member
If Livingston had more supporters, they'd be there. They're not because they don't exist. Moaning about a poor support is like getting upset that unicorns or leprechauns don't exist. It's to be entirely expected when there's a duopoly in which one of two teams have won the league for the past 35 years. If you'd like more Livingston supporters to have been there, they need to come from somewhere; in this case, probably from Rangers and Celtic fans.
If they aren’t there, they aren’t there but it’s pathetic having such an abysmal support and being in the top flight. How can they even survive financially as a club with such a poor following? We should have better ticketing/segregation to minimise the empty seats.
 

Arminius

Well-Known Member
Official Ticketer
No match shown on TV should ever have acres of empty seating on display.

That means, you restrict the coverage to games involving us and the filth against the diddy teams, matches at Ibrox and the Stadium of Shame, Edinburgh Derby, Dundee Derby, the odd Aberdeen game, etc.

Fans of diddy clubs just have to accept that they only get to see their team when they play us or the filth.

Will the SPF, do that? Will they phuck. They'll continue to show Ross County v St Mirren type games and destroy any hope of getting advertisers or big TV money involved. This pandering to diddy clubs whose average attendance is friends and families of the players and the dug has to stop if we ever want to increase money in the game up here
 

ClockworkOrange

Well-Known Member
If they aren’t there, they aren’t there but it’s pathetic having such an abysmal support and being in the top flight. How can they even survive financially as a club with such a poor following? We should have better ticketing/segregation to minimise the empty seats.
Teams deserve to be in the top flight by virtue of their ability, not the size of their support.

Teams earn significantly more from TV revenue than from ticketing. They will also budget within their means to support a possibly smaller support.

Ticketing and segregation is a different matter altogether, and one I agree with. Routinely slandering smaller teams for the size of their support is just unfair.
 

The Huguenot

Well-Known Member
Scottish football needs a total revamp and in theory we could transform our football. Unfortunately, the rest of Scottish football are only interested in themselves and hating us than the improvement of our national game for everybody's benefit. They are too small-minded and prejudiced.
 

daviemc1872

Well-Known Member
as the gaffer said last season , if scottish football wants to appeal to tv companies then at least pretend there are more fans than what there is, no one wants to see half empty stands , its embarrassing.
 

Coisty09

Well-Known Member
Official Ticketer
Genuinely, what else do you expect them to do?

Do you realise that one of the reasons that teams like Killie and St Johnstone get low attendances is because the football support in this country is concentrated to two teams?

Moaning about the attendances and style of football at clubs where the players are on a pittance, the fans have more appealing options and there is historically limited success is the calling card of a modern football fan totally dismissive and contemptuous of anything that exists outside of the elite. It's snobbery, pure and simple.
Keeping these no mark clubs going is what is likely to eventually strangle Rangers and the other mhob.
I don’t really care what happens to the other clubs or indeed the bheasts.
No major TV deals are coming our way anytime soon while part of the package is showing Livi v Ross County on a plastic pitch.
The only chance Rangers have of becoming a major European force again is getting control of our broadcast rights and/or joining a European league.
Every season we spend in this backwater makes it more difficult to recover.
At the very least the diddy teams should be forced to have grass pitches to at least make the footballing product a bit more attractive.
 

Coisty09

Well-Known Member
Official Ticketer
If they aren’t there, they aren’t there but it’s pathetic having such an abysmal support and being in the top flight. How can they even survive financially as a club with such a poor following? We should have better ticketing/segregation to minimise the empty seats.
They survive because Rangers and the other mhob subsidize them.
Four full houses at home and their more than fair share of the TV deal.
That’s what keeps them going....
 

Barryhopez

Well-Known Member
Keeping these no mark clubs going is what is likely to eventually strangle Rangers and the other mhob.
I don’t really care what happens to the other clubs or indeed the bheasts.
No major TV deals are coming our way anytime soon while part of the package is showing Livi v Ross County on a plastic pitch.
The only chance Rangers have of becoming a major European force again is getting control of our broadcast rights and/or joining a European league.
Every season we spend in this backwater makes it more difficult to recover.
At the very least the diddy teams should be forced to have grass pitches to at least make the footballing product a bit more attractive.
Something that won't happen anytime soon, if at all.

Yes, us and them are far to big for Scottish football but there's not much chance of it changing. Other teams can't magic up more supporters when almost everyone wants to support us and them. There's not much cash injection into our game as we are an unattractive league with little cohesive working on how to make it more appealing and better across the board.

If serious about change then there has to be a move away from the "fuck everyone else" mentality prevalent in Scottish football. All the claptrap about teams needs to merge and the likes is snobbery and if UEFA suggested because Scottish football is so shite in European competiton we have to put in a collective team so we can play against the big boys then we'd all be, rightly, be up in arms telling them to fuck off.
 

Barryhopez

Well-Known Member
They survive because Rangers and the other mhob subsidize them.
Four full houses at home and their more than fair share of the TV deal.
That’s what keeps them going....
Genuine question. Do you wish for numerous other teams to fold (Livingston, Kilmarnock, St Johnstone for example) or get even less money so become even less competitive?
 

ClockworkOrange

Well-Known Member
Keeping these no mark clubs going is what is likely to eventually strangle Rangers and the other mhob.
I don’t really care what happens to the other clubs or indeed the bheasts.
No major TV deals are coming our way anytime soon while part of the package is showing Livi v Ross County on a plastic pitch.
The only chance Rangers have of becoming a major European force again is getting control of our broadcast rights and/or joining a European league.
Every season we spend in this backwater makes it more difficult to recover.
At the very least the diddy teams should be forced to have grass pitches to at least make the footballing product a bit more attractive.
How many no-mark clubs are in the country, then? What do you expect them to do? Just fold because they have a non-existent support?

The reason that there are no TV deals coming our way is because the quality of football is poor and the league has been a duopoly for nigh on 35 years.

Rangers enjoy a significantly higher percentage of fans outside of Glasgow than any other club in the country. While Aberdeen, Killie or ICT fans tend to come from that particular town or city, Rangers have fans from every corner of Scotland. For there to be a more even distribution of fans across these clubs, there needs to be more Rangers (and Celtic) fans supporting their "local" team. I'm not sure that you'd find this a palatable idea.
 

Coisty09

Well-Known Member
Official Ticketer
How many no-mark clubs are in the country, then? What do you expect them to do? Just fold because they have a non-existent support?

The reason that there are no TV deals coming our way is because the quality of football is poor and the league has been a duopoly for nigh on 35 years.

Rangers enjoy a significantly higher percentage of fans outside of Glasgow than any other club in the country. While Aberdeen, Killie or ICT fans tend to come from that particular town or city, Rangers have fans from every corner of Scotland. For there to be a more even distribution of fans across these clubs, there needs to be more Rangers (and Celtic) fans supporting their "local" team. I'm not sure that you'd find this a palatable idea.
They should all be part-timers apart from probably the two Edinburgh teams and the Sheep.
We should literally be in a different league to the Killies and the St Mirrens, one that suits our status.
If that does not happen quite soon, we will end up so far behind clubs elsewhere that we will never be able to properly to get to the top table again. The top table is where we belong. They don't.
 

Coisty09

Well-Known Member
Official Ticketer
Genuine question. Do you wish for numerous other teams to fold (Livingston, Kilmarnock, St Johnstone for example) or get even less money so become even less competitive?
They should be part-timers and we should literally be in a different league from them.
If we cannot get away from this dross soon, then we may never get the chance to properly return to the top table, which is where we belong. They don't.
 

Barryhopez

Well-Known Member
They should be part-timers and we should literally be in a different league from them.
If we cannot get away from this dross soon, then we may never get the chance to properly return to the top table, which is where we belong. They don't.
Making our league even less competitive is hardly going to be great. Which top table are we returning too?
 

ClockworkOrange

Well-Known Member
They should all be part-timers apart from probably the two Edinburgh teams and the Sheep.
We should literally be in a different league to the Killies and the St Mirrens, one that suits our status.
If that does not happen quite soon, we will end up so far behind clubs elsewhere that we will never be able to properly to get to the top table again. The top table is where we belong. They don't.
So your recommendation to help the league is not to intensify the level of competition, but rather reduce it by forcing hundreds of working men to take a pay cut and work part-time, lessening the hours they work for their teams and therefore the chances of them improving themselves as players; your next idea is a rather fanciful one that we should be in a league that suits our status (this is the same kind of snobbish idea often sprouted by Manchester United or Chelsea fans about having to share a league with teams like Sheffield United and Brighton); finally, you repeat this weird idea of being at "the top table." What top table is that, when did we leave it and were these teams not a part of it the first time around?
 

Coisty09

Well-Known Member
Official Ticketer
So your recommendation to help the league is not to intensify the level of competition, but rather reduce it by forcing hundreds of working men to take a pay cut and work part-time, lessening the hours they work for their teams and therefore the chances of them improving themselves as players; your next idea is a rather fanciful one that we should be in a league that suits our status (this is the same kind of snobbish idea often sprouted by Manchester United or Chelsea fans about having to share a league with teams like Sheffield United and Brighton); finally, you repeat this weird idea of being at "the top table." What top table is that, when did we leave it and were these teams not a part of it the first time around?
That top table is to be back on a level playing field with the likes of Manchester United and Chelsea financially and on the field of play.
We need to be thought of in the same way as the other giants of European football.
We were through from our birth until the early 70s and again later in the 80s and 90s.
In the late 19th Century we were arguably the biggest club in the world. The 50s and 60s we were revered like Barca and Real. There is a song that notes that!

We will die a slow death if we continue to be confined to the finances available only in Scotland.

In respect of the other Scottish clubs, they are not viable businesses and need to cut their cloth accordingly to become so.

It is not snobbishness. Historically and traditionally (and with our current support) we have been up there with the biggest and best.

A future that consigns us to playing on plastic pitches against teams with no support for the reward of pennies compared to the top table will inevitably result in a slow, lingering and painful demise.
 

Mr.Spock

Well-Known Member
That top table is to be back on a level playing field with the likes of Manchester United and Chelsea financially and on the field of play.
We need to be thought of in the same way as the other giants of European football.
We were through from our birth until the early 70s and again later in the 80s and 90s.
In the late 19th Century we were arguably the biggest club in the world. The 50s and 60s we were revered like Barca and Real. There is a song that notes that!

We will die a slow death if we continue to be confined to the finances available only in Scotland.

In respect of the other Scottish clubs, they are not viable businesses and need to cut their cloth accordingly to become so.

It is not snobbishness. Historically and traditionally (and with our current support) we have been up there with the biggest and best.

A future that consigns us to playing on plastic pitches against teams with no support for the reward of pennies compared to the top table will inevitably result in a slow, lingering and painful demise.

Spot on mate.With every passing season we're watching the life being sucked out of our club thanks to the incompetents running our game,if nothing changes in the near future the SPFL will be no better than the Welsh or Irish leagues,we will never again attract managers like Gerrard or players that could compete in a European competition.Your last paragraph sums it up for me.
 

ClockworkOrange

Well-Known Member
That top table is to be back on a level playing field with the likes of Manchester United and Chelsea financially and on the field of play.
We need to be thought of in the same way as the other giants of European football.
We were through from our birth until the early 70s and again later in the 80s and 90s.
In the late 19th Century we were arguably the biggest club in the world. The 50s and 60s we were revered like Barca and Real. There is a song that notes that!

We will die a slow death if we continue to be confined to the finances available only in Scotland.

In respect of the other Scottish clubs, they are not viable businesses and need to cut their cloth accordingly to become so.

It is not snobbishness. Historically and traditionally (and with our current support) we have been up there with the biggest and best.

A future that consigns us to playing on plastic pitches against teams with no support for the reward of pennies compared to the top table will inevitably result in a slow, lingering and painful demise.
The only way any of that can be achieved is by leaving Scotland, getting a Russian oligarch to take an interest in the club and bankroll us to the English Premier League title.

Unlikely.

Scottish clubs operate within their means and in some cases are majority-owned by their fans. Just because they're not consistently successful (but in order to be, the Old Firm need to play a role) doesn't mean that they're not viable business. That's snobbery.

We've also not cut it with the big boys in terms of money or even consistent quality of play for about 20 years. Still managed to attract PLG and Steven Gerrard to the club.
 

Coisty09

Well-Known Member
Official Ticketer
@ClockworkOrange We are never going to agree.
I hope you turn out to be right and it will not affect the club longer term.
I am sa Rangers fan and only care about Rangers. Whatever gives us the best future should be the concern of Rangers fans..
Those diddy clubs tried to kill Rangers.
You seem to ignore or forget the role they played in sending us Division 3.
I will never forgive and forget.
They don’t deserve the Blue Pound.
 

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