Who played in Smiths 4-4-2?
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Nacho Novo
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08/09 team I can remember was along the lines of McGregor; Whittaker, Weir, Bougherra, Papac; Davis, Mendes, Ferguson, Lafferty; Boyd, Miller
Subs: Alexander, Wilson, Edu, McCulloch, Fleck, Naismith, Novo
In my opinion his best team out his second spell as manager. He did have Cuellar, Thomson, Hemdani, Beasley, Cousin, Darcheville in 07/08 and Jelavic and Weiss in 10/11.
Subs: Alexander, Wilson, Edu, McCulloch, Fleck, Naismith, Novo
In my opinion his best team out his second spell as manager. He did have Cuellar, Thomson, Hemdani, Beasley, Cousin, Darcheville in 07/08 and Jelavic and Weiss in 10/11.
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Yer da
Well-Known Member
Mendes, Ferguson and Davis. There's the difference between then and now. What a midfield.
wsb&warmy
Well-Known Member
McCulloch was the regular wide left rather than Lafferty.
RFC97
Well-Known Member
Nacho Novo
Well-Known Member
Walter always used to swap him, Novo, Naismith, Beasley, Cousin about on the wings and in his later years Whittaker
My memory is that Ferguson and Mendes never worked well together.
Either played next to Thomson or Edu seemed to make us a better team.
Willing to accept I could be misremembering that.
Amato Turn
Well-Known Member
Depends.
McGregor, Whittaker, Bougherra (replacing Cuellar), Weir, Papac was the regular back 5 for most of his time.
We had Thomson and Ferguson as the two for a while then Mendes and Edu then the much maligned Edu McCulloch (Edulloch) combination. Hemdani really only featured in Europe. We had Christian Dailly stinking up the joint in central midfield at various points in 2008/09.
Davis rarely played centre mid almost always tucked in on the right.
Walter was like Big Eck in that he tried about a dozen different players wide left and it seemed to change every other week:
McCulloch, Novo, Naismith, Adam, Beasley, Rothen, Whittaker, Weiss, Niguez, Lafferty. I think Kenny Miller even got a run on the left wing at points.
Upfront was mainly Boyd & Miller then Jelavic & Naismith with Cousin, Darcheville, Velicka, Beattie, etc used mainly earlier in his time.
McGregor, Whittaker, Bougherra (replacing Cuellar), Weir, Papac was the regular back 5 for most of his time.
We had Thomson and Ferguson as the two for a while then Mendes and Edu then the much maligned Edu McCulloch (Edulloch) combination. Hemdani really only featured in Europe. We had Christian Dailly stinking up the joint in central midfield at various points in 2008/09.
Davis rarely played centre mid almost always tucked in on the right.
Walter was like Big Eck in that he tried about a dozen different players wide left and it seemed to change every other week:
McCulloch, Novo, Naismith, Adam, Beasley, Rothen, Whittaker, Weiss, Niguez, Lafferty. I think Kenny Miller even got a run on the left wing at points.
Upfront was mainly Boyd & Miller then Jelavic & Naismith with Cousin, Darcheville, Velicka, Beattie, etc used mainly earlier in his time.
Amato Turn
Well-Known Member
Nah I think that's correct.
I'm sure when we signed Mendes, Ferguson was injured until about October ish and then Ferguson got dropped around April time after Boozegate before he was sold that summer - so Mendes-Ferguson probably only played together for a short 4 or 5 month period
Amato Turn
Well-Known Member
Lucky you.
Tbh looking back at those times whilst we had some players of the quality we don't have now (Pedro Mendes, younger Steve Davis, Bougherra, Jelavic, etc) we had some average players as well which is why I don't always agree with the narrative you see on here that we can't win the league with some of our current players.
We won 3 leagues with Whittaker and Broadfoot playing RB. You're not telling me Tav isn't a better RB than them. I'd take Glen Kamara/Ryan Jack/Scott Arfield, etc over Mo Edu. I'd rather Ryan Kent than most of the guys we played wide left back then. I'd take Morelos over most of our strikers from that time period as well.
RFC97
Well-Known Member
Those players played above themselves to a certain extent whereas ours are underachieving if anything.
Plus we have one real quality/effective player, whereas there were about 3 or 4 in those sides.
Imo anyway.
SDF
Well-Known Member
Ferguson's chief apologist Iain King wrote an article after the Cup Final defeat to the Tims that Ferguson was being held back because he needed to hold Mendes hand through games. It was pure nonsense to exempt Ferguson from criticism. He was not playing well at all that season.
Boozegate won us the league. We wouldn't have won it had it not happened.
Laudrup1
Well-Known Member
And Kevin Thomson...
Detective Vic Mackey
Well-Known Member
In really miss the formation. Was very effective at home against every diddy team.
The thing that made Smith's 4-4-2 work was the goals the wide players got. I remember his last season, the 2nd half of that year was mostly Lafferty up front with Jelavic with Naismith on the right. Naismith was always getting goals from there, which is something Candeias lacks. If you compare Ryan Kent to that teams Weiss, then we've got the out and out winger, but we don't get enough goals opposite him right now.
SDF
Well-Known Member
McCulloch was injured most of that season. Only played 12 games in the league.
Wide left was a who's who of square pegs in a round hole - Whittaker, Smith, Aaron, Beasley,Lafferty, Novo, Fleck and Adam all had a go.
RFC97
Well-Known Member
I want to see it again. It suits our personnel much more than 4-3-3 and having an extra striker in the box is helpful against these teams sitting in
RFC97
Well-Known Member
Whittaker, Naismith, Davis, Lafferty, Jelavic and to a (much) lesser extent Wylde were all effective attackers.
That’s the difference.
BaTmAn
Well-Known Member
It was a good and efficient team. Pace, power, technical ability, work-rate, organisation and in Jelavic we had a top, top class striker who could do so many things. Wylde's pace down that left hand side was always an effective out ball even if he was a limited player.
McGregor
Weir-Bougherra-Papac were solid foundations.
Not every week but he did do it.Remember Walter was a man who put Duncan Ferguson wide left as well
RFC97
Well-Known Member
I don’t mind the idea of putting a different type of player out wide rather than two out and out wingers.
For example, I might try Arfield out on the right and let him come in more central if needed with Kent out in a traditional wide position. Like a lop sided 4-4-2
I prefer pace out wide,which is strange because my favourite ever player is Davie Cooper and he was slower than a week of back shifts.
I suppose you can do it though if you use midfielders,the problem is trying to shoehorn a striker into an unfamiliar position
The Thomson Mendes combination in midfield was one of our better ones IMO.
We had some cracking midfielders then.
We had some cracking midfielders then.
It was pretty much the only position he could get a game when Boyd and Miller were available
Drumchapel-Bear
Well-Known Member
We always played 3 centre mids in our midfield 4 and 3 centre halves in the back 4.
Papac would play left back and hardly get forward but we would have an attacking player in front of him.
Davis would generally play on the right but tuck in and play narrow, leaving Whittaker to provide the width on the right as an attacking fullback.
It's not rocket science. Scotland is a horrible wee country and its extremely physical.
I feel Gerrard is likely sticking rigidly to the 443 as Beale is one of these modern hipster type coaches who believes the only formation in the world you can play is a 433. This whole generation of coaches has grown and being influenced by Pep Guardiola but Pep is a genius. Not every coach in the world can get his team playing the perfect, fluid 433 that Pep does.
Papac would play left back and hardly get forward but we would have an attacking player in front of him.
Davis would generally play on the right but tuck in and play narrow, leaving Whittaker to provide the width on the right as an attacking fullback.
It's not rocket science. Scotland is a horrible wee country and its extremely physical.
I feel Gerrard is likely sticking rigidly to the 443 as Beale is one of these modern hipster type coaches who believes the only formation in the world you can play is a 433. This whole generation of coaches has grown and being influenced by Pep Guardiola but Pep is a genius. Not every coach in the world can get his team playing the perfect, fluid 433 that Pep does.
With Thomson there to do the dirty work
December 09 we pumped hibs 4-1 at Easter road.
Miller & Boyd up front, Lafferty.and novice out wide and Davis in the middle with Mculloch.
The week before we had won 3 nil at tannadice with Beasley instead of Lafferty.
Beasley scored a screamer.
Miller & Boyd up front, Lafferty.and novice out wide and Davis in the middle with Mculloch.
The week before we had won 3 nil at tannadice with Beasley instead of Lafferty.
Beasley scored a screamer.
Detective Vic Mackey
Well-Known Member
Agreed. We are rooted to this 4-3-3 and it doesn’t work. How much more evidence do we need!? Especially at home against teams who sit in.
RFC97
Well-Known Member
Iv said I’d like us to try a lopsided 4-4-2 like that.
Carlisle Bear
Well-Known Member
He played 4-1-4-1 a lot in 07/08 even in the league. We played some really nice stuff around Xmas that season with Hemdani Thomson and Ferguson with Naismith and Burke off of Cousin.
08/09 we started off really well and hammered them at Parkhead with a flat 4 in midfield of Davis Mendes Thomson and Adam, Miller pulled into the channels that offered a bit of width up top. Mendes and Thomson offered a lovely balance in midfield and Ferguson coming back in and Thomson getting injured really disrupted our season.
09/10 McCulloch played a lot in midfield and , in my opinion, had his best season in a Rangers jersey. He actually played really well in that season. I remember being 1-0 down at Fir Park and he dragged us through the game winning every single kick out, the ugly stuff you need in Scotland.
10/11 we actually played some lovely stuff early on when Naismith, Davis, Weiss, Miller and Jelavic were in the team which would come to be disrupted by Miller leaving and Jelavic getting injured, but Walter dragged us over the line as usual.
08/09 we started off really well and hammered them at Parkhead with a flat 4 in midfield of Davis Mendes Thomson and Adam, Miller pulled into the channels that offered a bit of width up top. Mendes and Thomson offered a lovely balance in midfield and Ferguson coming back in and Thomson getting injured really disrupted our season.
09/10 McCulloch played a lot in midfield and , in my opinion, had his best season in a Rangers jersey. He actually played really well in that season. I remember being 1-0 down at Fir Park and he dragged us through the game winning every single kick out, the ugly stuff you need in Scotland.
10/11 we actually played some lovely stuff early on when Naismith, Davis, Weiss, Miller and Jelavic were in the team which would come to be disrupted by Miller leaving and Jelavic getting injured, but Walter dragged us over the line as usual.
sandbankbear
Well-Known Member
Mcgregor. Broadfoot. Boughie. Weir. Papac. Davis. Thomson. Mendes. Adam. Miller. Cousin. 4 2 win at parkhead. We blew them away that day. Sensational football
ricksen24
Well-Known Member
We have had a number of managers in since Walter I’ve no idea why they dont take a look back to the blue print.’
It’s basicly sign and play players with Hearts that will hardly fit in their body.
Also dont be afraid to mix it up teams know us inside out its crazy.
Mind when Walter put Laff RW v Izzy at Ibrox he was clueless.
Also pulling Ness & Mcabe in at times they ran the show in games v them.
It’s basicly sign and play players with Hearts that will hardly fit in their body.
Also dont be afraid to mix it up teams know us inside out its crazy.
Mind when Walter put Laff RW v Izzy at Ibrox he was clueless.
Also pulling Ness & Mcabe in at times they ran the show in games v them.
That 4-4-2 was the most successful formation I think I've ever seen to handle Scottish football. It was narrow, lacked serious width at times (which was a common football phone-in topic when we drew a game), but it was very successful. Meanwhile, for the last few years we've persisted with wide teams that stretch the play, which puts too much emphasis on our centre mids to do it all themselves.
The wide right midfielder (Davis then Naismith) who tucked in to create space for the attacking fullback (Whittaker) was the best way to handle having a wingback. Davis won player of the year from there, and then Naismith did the year after. The weakest part was always finding a left winger (And Walter wanted a proper winger) who fit the system, I remember we used to change that position every week while the rest of the team stayed the same.
Would love to see us try that with our current squad. I think Arfield could play the wide midfielder role if Davis doesn't have the same energy, which would also give Tav the protection he needs.
The wide right midfielder (Davis then Naismith) who tucked in to create space for the attacking fullback (Whittaker) was the best way to handle having a wingback. Davis won player of the year from there, and then Naismith did the year after. The weakest part was always finding a left winger (And Walter wanted a proper winger) who fit the system, I remember we used to change that position every week while the rest of the team stayed the same.
Would love to see us try that with our current squad. I think Arfield could play the wide midfielder role if Davis doesn't have the same energy, which would also give Tav the protection he needs.
Drumchapel-Bear
Well-Known Member
When arfield got a start for Burnley it was always wide in a 442 formation.
