Gerrard since joining Villa

If we’d won the last two old firm games of the season we’d have won the league.
That’s conjecture though. No one knows how it would have played out, the same way you can’t state “for a fact” that we wouldn’t have gone down 3-0 under Gerrard. Our chances were already slim when they came to Ibrox and won, losing that game was just the final nail in the coffin.

But I reckon we would have won the league if we could have taken care of the Countys, Motherwell’s and Dundee Hib’s of the league, because if we had we wouldn’t have even needed to win the last 2 OF games.
 
You really do have a nasty habit of reading posts completely wrong. Mental.

You’re saying our post winter break form was because of Gerrard and the slump he started.

What doesn’t make any sense is that from when Gio came in after the semi final we won pretty much every game between then and the winter break. So why did the slump disappear then reappear?
 
That’s conjecture though. No one knows how it would have played out, the same way you can’t state “for a fact” that we wouldn’t have gone down 3-0 under Gerrard. Our chances were already slim when they came to Ibrox and won, losing that game was just the final nail in the coffin.

But I reckon we would have won the league if we could have taken care of the Countys, Motherwell’s and Dundee Hib’s of the league, because if we had we wouldn’t have even needed to win the last 2 OF games.

So me saying if we’d won the last two old firms we’d have won the league is conjecture but you saying if we’d taken care of the County’s, Motherwell and Dundee United’s we’d have won the league isn’t?

Our chances were not slim going into that game at Ibrox. If we’d won that game we’d have been level on points with 7 games still to play.
 
So me saying if we’d won the last two old firms we’d have won the league is conjecture but you saying if we’d taken care of the County’s, Motherwell and Dundee United’s we’d have won the league isn’t?

Our chances were not slim going into that game at Ibrox. If we’d won that game we’d have been level on points with 7 games still to play.
I’m just giving my opinion of what I think would have happened based on having big Euro ties to navigate, generally being rotten domestically at that point, and having another trip to the piggery to go. I think it’s extremely unlikely we’d have went onto take the title when they were barley dropping a point and we were toiling.

Similarly if we’d taken care of the dross they’d have never caught us up by the point which would changed the entire makeup of the season. But then that’s just my feeling based on the circumstances, I’m not sitting here making wild statements like “I can tell you for a fact we wouldn’t have got pumped under Gerrard”, when you really can’t state that as a fact. That’s a bit different from me saying “I reckon we would have won IF…..”.
 
Because Gerrard couldn't? That is delusional.
That’s the issue, it’s as though people really believe he was the only manager in world football who couldn’t have done it. As long as we appointed a decent manager big progress would have been a virtual certainty in that first season regardless; based purely on the state of the previous couple of managers who’s performance fell so far below expect standards it was tragic .

The real impressive aspect of Gerrard’s first couple of seasons was Europe where we performed above expectation and really got some of our pride back. But the idea another more experienced manager wouldn’t have went toe to toe with someone like Lennon and managed to actually maintain the challenge and avoid spilling a plethora of points in the month of January isn’t exactly absurd unless you’re just looking at Gerrard through some extremely powerful rose tinted specs. I mean if that’s all true and he’s that good Villa will surely nab a European spot this season.
 
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I’m just giving my opinion of what I think would have happened based on having big Euro ties to navigate, generally being rotten domestically at that point, and having another trip to the piggery to go. I think it’s extremely unlikely we’d have went onto take the title when they were barley dropping a point and we were toiling.

Similarly if we’d taken care of the dross they’d have never caught us up by the point which would changed the entire makeup of the season. But then that’s just my feeling based on the circumstances, I’m not sitting here making wild statements like “I can tell you for a fact we wouldn’t have got pumped under Gerrard”, when you really can’t state that as a fact. That’s a bit different from me saying “I reckon we would have won IF…..”.

Did we not pick up more points than them in those last 7 games of the season?
 
Did we not pick up more points than them in those last 7 games of the season?
Not sure to be honest. But I do know they more or less had the league sewn up after Ibrox and they went and won it, although it’s not uncommon for teams to ease off after clinching the title so if they’ve dropped a couple of points right at the death I wouldn’t say it means much. I think we have finished the season better than them in Gerrard’s first season despite losing the league by a landslide.
 
I think the big challenge for Gerrard is keeping unity in the camp.

At Rangers he always had that. Tav was his captain, Goldson his talisman, you had McGregor, Davis, Defoe et al and they all sang from the same hymn sheet.

He now has an unhappy Mings (who while publicly supports McGinn is sniping in the background) and a camp that isn’t entirely happy. It’s not something he’s had to handle until now.
 
Watched their game at the weekend. Did look a bit fragile at the back but plenty going forward.
 
Watched their game at the weekend. Did look a bit fragile at the back but plenty going forward.
He'll likely be backed to strengthen again before the transfer window shuts which will increase his chances of being successful at Villa.
 
Not as excited as some on here who do not want to give him credit for 55 and have no real grasp on how far behind we actually were when he took over.
Who are they though? I don’t think I’ve ever seen anyone refuse to give him credit for 55.

A lack of grasp of reality is a much bigger issue, the kind that blames the board for giving him his wish, that would have still blamed the board if they’d went against his wish, or alleges that there’s a decent chance we’d have won the league while we were miles behind, struggling every week against mediocrity, spilling points all over the place and in free fall. Anyone who’d be content with giving a Rangers manager a 4th season after 3 trophy less seasons clearly doesn’t have the clubs best interests at heart. At least you can order your gers and Villa kits together and save on postage from Castore.
 
Who are they though? I don’t think I’ve ever seen anyone refuse to give him credit for 55.

A lack of grasp of reality is a much bigger issue, the kind that blames the board for giving him his wish, that would have still blamed the board if they’d went against his wish, or alleges that there’s a decent chance we’d have won the league while we were miles behind, struggling every week against mediocrity, spilling points all over the place and in free fall. Anyone who’d be content with giving a Rangers manager a 4th season after 3 trophy less seasons clearly doesn’t have the clubs best interests at heart. At least you can order your gers and Villa kits together and save on postage from Castore.
You keep using the term of 3 trophy less seasons and whilst under normal circumstances that would be unacceptable but we were not under normal circumstances we were the furthest behind Celtic that we've ever been in our entire history and anyone watching us could see that we were making huge strides under Gerrard which subsequently resulted in us becoming champions.
 
Arguably Graeme Souness but he had a blank cheque book.

Steven Gerrard will get his rightful appreciation when the hurt dies down (as did Souness.)
Possibly yes but I'd say arguably Gerrard took us from the furthest behind Celtic we had ever been and put us back on top.
 
You keep using the term of 3 trophy less seasons and whilst under normal circumstances that would be unacceptable but we were not under normal circumstances we were the furthest behind Celtic that we've ever been in our entire history and anyone watching us could see that we were making huge strides under Gerrard which subsequently resulted in us becoming champions.
Spot on.

They may have been "trophy less" but all the time he was building something beyond our expectations. Something solid that's lasted and is still producing to this day. A European maturity that's been going 4 years now. That's given us not only confidence, but an actual belief we can and will overcome teams who in years gone by would regularly have knocked us out.

Yes it's very much Geo's team these days but there are too many children on here who choose to ignore who put the building blocks in place
 
Spot on.

They may have been "trophy less" but all the time he was building something beyond our expectations. Something solid that's lasted and is still producing to this day. A European maturity that's been going 4 years now. That's given us not only confidence, but an actual belief we can and will overcome teams who in years gone by would regularly have knocked us out.

Yes it's very much Geo's team these days but there are too many children on here who choose to ignore who put the building blocks in place
I'm a big Gerrard fan obviously but I genuinely do not think we've ever come from so far behind Celtic to go on and win a championship than 55
 
In our history has any manager lifted us from being so far behind Celtic than what Gerrard did.
Barring about 2 managers has any other in our history ever taken control with us so far behind Celtic in terms of nearly being obliterated? You actually answer that in the post below which makes it all the stranger.

Honestly mate it’s nauseating. In fact it’s so nauseating that I’ve went from not being overly fussed at how he does at Villa to edging towards hoping to see him tank just to see you tear up and trot out the excuses. And by the way can you at least finally admit something to me? Admit that if the board had sold his top players against his wishes that you would have still blamed them for any potential failure, admit that no matter which option the board took you’d have ultimately always blamed them and absolved your demigod for any future failings….
You keep using the term of 3 trophy less seasons and whilst under normal circumstances that would be unacceptable but we were not under normal circumstances we were the furthest behind Celtic that we've ever been in our entire history and anyone watching us could see that we were making huge strides under Gerrard which subsequently resulted in us becoming champions.
The term? No it’s not a term, it’s a statement of fact. And no, it’s never acceptable, not when we already had by far the second biggest budget in the country, this is Rangers not Motherwell or St Mirren. St Johnstone managed two domestic cups in a season, Mark fecking Waburton even had us a ball hair away from a trophy albeit that team bottled it too as they tended to. It’s not just about not winning a trophy, it’s the fact we struggled to even get near a final most of the time - one solitary final and a myriad of embarrassing exits. But that’s all fine if you’re primary love is Steven Gerrard, because I mean he’s clearly bigger than the club to you mate.

As I said in another post, big strides were always going to be made under any decent manager after the pitiful performances of the previous couple of managers who frankly had no business ever being Rangers managers. That doesn’t mean they’d all have done as well as Gerrard, nor does it mean they wouldn’t have done better, it just means significant progress from where Waburton and Pedro had us shouldn’t have been too difficult for any semi competent coaching team.
 
Barring about 2 managers has any other in our history ever taken control with us so far behind Celtic in terms of nearly being obliterated? You actually answer that in the post below which makes it all the stranger.

Honestly mate it’s nauseating. In fact it’s so nauseating that I’ve went from not being overly fussed at how he does at Villa to edging towards hoping to see him tank just to see you tear up and trot out the excuses. And by the way can you at least finally admit something to me? Admit that if the board had sold his top players against his wishes that you would have still blamed them for any potential failure, admit that no matter which option the board took you’d have ultimately always blamed them and absolved your demigod for any future failings….

The term? No it’s not a term, it’s a statement of fact. And no, it’s never acceptable, not when we already had by far the second biggest budget in the country, this is Rangers not Motherwell or St Mirren. St Johnstone managed two domestic cups in a season, Mark fecking Waburton even had us a ball hair away from a trophy albeit that team bottled it too as they tended to. It’s not just about not winning a trophy, it’s the fact we struggled to even get near a final most of the time - one solitary final and a myriad of embarrassing exits. But that’s all fine if you’re primary love is Steven Gerrard, because I mean he’s clearly bigger than the club to you mate.

As I said in another post, big strides were always going to be made under any decent manager after the pitiful performances of the previous couple of managers who frankly had no business ever being Rangers managers. That doesn’t mean they’d all have done as well as Gerrard, nor does it mean they wouldn’t have done better, it just means significant progress from where Waburton and Pedro had us shouldn’t have been too difficult for any semi competent coaching team.
So in your opinion has anyone lifted us from being so far behind Celtic to winning the league in our entire history.
 
Graeme Souness turned it around in one season. He spent a fortune in doing so, but he still done it.
Different times to be fair, the financial gulf wasn't as great and as soon as Souness came in we were outspending them. Because our situation was so much worse off when Gerrard came in our wage bill was hugely lower than theirs.
 
Just as an example of the financial disparity, the season prior to Gerrard coming in our revenue was £32.7m, the scum's was £101.6m
 
Yes he did but were we as far behind Celtic as what Gerrard was.
Rangers finished 5th in 85/86, 15 points behind Celtic. The following season we were champions. As I said, money played a massive part in that and signing England internationalists definitely helped a wee bit.:))
 
Barring about 2 managers has any other in our history ever taken control with us so far behind Celtic in terms of nearly being obliterated? You actually answer that in the post below which makes it all the stranger.

Honestly mate it’s nauseating. In fact it’s so nauseating that I’ve went from not being overly fussed at how he does at Villa to edging towards hoping to see him tank just to see you tear up and trot out the excuses. And by the way can you at least finally admit something to me? Admit that if the board had sold his top players against his wishes that you would have still blamed them for any potential failure, admit that no matter which option the board took you’d have ultimately always blamed them and absolved your demigod for any future failings….

The term? No it’s not a term, it’s a statement of fact. And no, it’s never acceptable, not when we already had by far the second biggest budget in the country, this is Rangers not Motherwell or St Mirren. St Johnstone managed two domestic cups in a season, Mark fecking Waburton even had us a ball hair away from a trophy albeit that team bottled it too as they tended to. It’s not just about not winning a trophy, it’s the fact we struggled to even get near a final most of the time - one solitary final and a myriad of embarrassing exits. But that’s all fine if you’re primary love is Steven Gerrard, because I mean he’s clearly bigger than the club to you mate.

As I said in another post, big strides were always going to be made under any decent manager after the pitiful performances of the previous couple of managers who frankly had no business ever being Rangers managers. That doesn’t mean they’d all have done as well as Gerrard, nor does it mean they wouldn’t have done better, it just means significant progress from where Waburton and Pedro had us shouldn’t have been too difficult for any semi competent coaching team.
You're not gonna like this but history will show Gerrard as potentially our greatest ever manager m8
 
Rangers finished 5th in 85/86, 15 points behind Celtic. The following season we were champions. As I said, money played a massive part in that and signing England internationalists definitely helped a wee bit.:))
There is absolutely no disagreement but Souness did not take us from them achieving record scorelines and having the audacity to tie scarfs on goalposts
 
You're not gonna like this but history will show Gerrard as potentially our greatest ever manager m8

Sorry but it wont. Love what Gerrard done for us, but he wont be our greatest manager, he won a very important title for us, but Im not going into his record.
 
You're not gonna like this but history will show Gerrard as potentially our greatest ever manager m8
You didn’t address what I said, in fact you’ve ignored absolutely everything I’ve said. Admit that you’d have blamed the board whatever decision they made….Then you can address the rest, time to stop glossing over the parts you don’t like or can’t offer a substantial counterpoint to.

As for the above quoted post, absolutely laughable. He’ll be nowhere near it, in fact a good portion of fans won’t even have him as a club legend because of the manner of his exit and nature of his cup failures. In fact what you allege above is absolutely insulting to the likes of Struth, Wallace and Walter. The biggest shock I’ve got on here recently is finding out you’re actually older than me when I honestly had you pegged as an early twenty something who grew up idolising Gerrard and Liverpool and simply can’t snap out of that fanboy frame of mind. I genuinely wouldn’t be surprised to find out you’ve a SG shrine in your house, or a SG shower curtain.

Btw I’m fine if fans want to carry on supporting him or whatever, that’s fine, but what you’re displaying is just a nauseating level of fanboyism and delusion from someone who clearly sees SG as being bigger than Rangers.
 
Listening for what? If you genuinely think Steven Gerrard is our greatest ever manager there's no point in discussing it.
So there's no debate exactly as I thought. The man took us from being the furthest behind ever and put us on top.
 
You didn’t address what I said, in fact you’ve ignored absolutely everything I’ve said. Admit that you’d have blamed the board whatever decision they made….

As for the above, absolutely laughable. He’ll be nowhere near it, in fact a good portion of fans won’t even have him as a club legend given the manner of his exit. What you allege above is absolutely insulting to the likes of Struth, Wallace and Walter. The biggest shock I’ve got on here recently if finding out you’re actually older than me when I honestly had you pegged as an early twenty something who grew up idolising Gerrard and Liverpool and simply can’t snap out of that fanboy frame of mind. I genuinely wouldn’t be surprised to find out you’ve a SG shrine in your house, or a SG shower curtain.
Fantastic, and I'm glad I didn't offend but at no point did I besmirch our legends all I'll state which is factually correct in my opinion is Gerrard took us to champions from being the furthest behind Celtic we've ever been and managed us to become champions. We have many legends but none have taken us to the top from being so far behind.
 
Don't know how anyone could think ill of Gerrard to be honest. Won an important title and was remarkably consistent in Europe getting us out of the group stage each season. The alternative could've been much, much worse. Could've hired a diddy and still on the search for 55 and a joke in Europe.
 
So there's no debate exactly as I thought. The man took us from being the furthest behind ever and put us on top.

The way you put it is as if he was our manager from 2012.

We were 2nd when SG took over, we were third when Walter took over from McLiesh.

When souness took over we were 5th the year before, the 3 years before that we were 4th.

SG done a great job, transformed our club the same way souness did.
 
You're not gonna like this but history will show Gerrard as potentially our greatest ever manager m8

I am with you that he played a massive part in restoring our rightful place in securing 55 and the European runs...but that's an absolutely insane statement, mate.
 
Fantastic, and I'm glad I didn't offend but at no point did I besmirch our legends all I'll state which is factually correct in my opinion is Gerrard took us to champions from being the furthest behind Celtic we've ever been and managed us to become champions. We have many legends but none have taken us to the top from being so far behind.
I’m guessing in your eyes Claudio Ranieri is the greatest Premier League manager of all time…

By the way, I’m STILL waiting for you to admit you’d have blamed the board no matter what happened. I get that your continual evading of this actual says a lot in itself, but I’d still like to see you actually admit that this is your frame of mind, that no matter what happens, Gerrard stays on his pedestal and the blame is averted elsewhere.

One thing I will say is than feck Celtic capitulated and blundered so badly the way they did so early on, because I’d have never fancied a Gerrard Rangers side in a genuine title race at the business end.
 
Don't know how anyone could think ill of Gerrard to be honest. Won an important title and was remarkably consistent in Europe getting us out of the group stage each season. The alternative could've been much, much worse. Could've hired a diddy and still on the search for 55 and a joke in Europe.
I'm just waiting to find out who took us from that far behind Celtic to eventually put us on top, if nothing else should be a good discussion.
 
I'm just waiting to find out who took us from that far behind Celtic to eventually put us on top, if nothing else should be a good discussion.

You're saying that as if it's the only metric of what would constitute the greatest Rangers manager. Better than Walter achieving 9IAR? Better than his returning under severe financial constraints and securing multiple titles?
 
I'm just waiting to find out who took us from that far behind Celtic to eventually put us on top, if nothing else should be a good discussion.
Again so far behind in what sense? As someone else alluded to we’ve finished behind the likes of Hearts and Aberdeen under previous managers going back decades.

Given that we won the league by a landslide to get 55, you must really rate Postecoglu in a serious way given how quickly he took that scum side from being “so far behind” to champions….
 
You're saying that as if it's the only metric of what would constitute the greatest Rangers manager. Better than Walter achieving 9IAR? Better than his returning under severe financial constraints and securing multiple titles?
Of course it's not, however we had Celtic achieving record scorelines and Gerrard came in from being miles behind and managed to put us on top.
 
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