A few words of clarification about Garry O'Hagen

I can take criticism and I am first to admit there are songs sung by Bears I don't like and I will not join in with but what I do object to is when laws by the likes of Fare and UEFA are not enforced evenly,
Yes we should police ourselves and set our own standards but when other clubs get a free hand to sing whatever they want it sticks in my gullet.
 
Valley Bluenose said:
You don’t need me to answer that and I agree it’s clear we have been targeted by FARE. However, so long as UEFA keep finding we have a case to answer and imposing sanctions on us then pointing the finger elsewhere is going to get us nowhere. We have to clean up our own act first.
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The two issues need addressed. Their bias and our songbook
 
EBT's Loyal said:
It would be interesting to know if FARE stick to their own guidelines as to who they appoint as an observer for our games.

https://farenet.org/get-involved/report-discrimination/observer-scheme-faq/

Who are the Fare observers?
The Fare observers are experts who have been recruited through an open process from across Europe. All have background knowledge in anti- discrimination issues and fan scenes.
All observers speak the language of the teams they have been appointed to observe and are familiar with the corresponding fan cultures. The observers are working on a voluntary basis and are committed to being unbiased. They are not appointed as an observer at a game involving a team they follow themselves as supporters, or a close rival team.
All observers receive training and agree to a strict code of conduct before they start their work. Observers are independent individuals and are not required to be Fare members. Fare members, conversely, are not usually Fare observers.
To protect the personal safety of our observers, Fare guarantees their anonymity towards third parties and we vouch for the quality of their work. All reports are vetted and checked for quality.
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Hence why we need to fund a investigation into FARE, their members and their observers!!
 
Superrangers said:
FARE should be doing their job even-handedly. Us cleaning up our act should not be a pre-cursor to them still looking elsewhere. They don’t and that’s the issue that needs tackled.
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You talking crap mate go and look at the citings, there’s a random weeks worth. Need to stop this conspiracy crap that it’s only us

02 January 2019 – Indian Kerala Premier League: Sports Academy Tirur v FC Thrissur
FC Thrissur player, Yemoah Santa Cruz, was subjected to racial slurs by Sports Academy Tirur players. Santa Cruz was repeatedly called ‘black’ in a derogatory manner. The Kerala Football Association was notified.
05 January 2019 – English Conference Premier League: Wrexham AFC v Dover Athletic FC
Dover Athletic players were racially abused by a group of Wrexham fans during and directly after the match. North Wales Police have launched an investigation.
06 January 2019 – English FA Women’s Super League: Sheffield United Women v Tottenham Hotspur Ladies F.C
The Tottenham Hotspur defender, Renee Hector, was subject to racist abuse from another Sheffield United player. Sheffield United launched an investigation.
08 January 2019 – English Premier League: Tottenham Hotspur FC v Chelsea FC
A Chelsea fan was arrested for using anti-Semitic language before the match. Two other fans were arrested for racially aggravated public order offences.
09 January 2019 – AS Roma supporters
To coincide with the anniversary of SS Lazio, AS Roma supporters distributed anti-Semitic flyers around Rome. The flyers read: ‘Lazio, Napoli and Israel, same colours, same flags. Shit!’. Italian police authorities have launched an investigation.
 
GF1872 said:
You talking crap mate go and look at the citings, there’s a random weeks worth. Need to stop this conspiracy crap that it’s only us

02 January 2019 – Indian Kerala Premier League: Sports Academy Tirur v FC Thrissur
FC Thrissur player, Yemoah Santa Cruz, was subjected to racial slurs by Sports Academy Tirur players. Santa Cruz was repeatedly called ‘black’ in a derogatory manner. The Kerala Football Association was notified.
05 January 2019 – English Conference Premier League: Wrexham AFC v Dover Athletic FC
Dover Athletic players were racially abused by a group of Wrexham fans during and directly after the match. North Wales Police have launched an investigation.
06 January 2019 – English FA Women’s Super League: Sheffield United Women v Tottenham Hotspur Ladies F.C
The Tottenham Hotspur defender, Renee Hector, was subject to racist abuse from another Sheffield United player. Sheffield United launched an investigation.
08 January 2019 – English Premier League: Tottenham Hotspur FC v Chelsea FC
A Chelsea fan was arrested for using anti-Semitic language before the match. Two other fans were arrested for racially aggravated public order offences.
09 January 2019 – AS Roma supporters
To coincide with the anniversary of SS Lazio, AS Roma supporters distributed anti-Semitic flyers around Rome. The flyers read: ‘Lazio, Napoli and Israel, same colours, same flags. Shit!’. Italian police authorities have launched an investigation.
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I am saying that other clubs might be randomly visited but there is a campaign against us and we are targetted constantly. It’s all also well known of the connections of senior people at FARE and Celtc.
 
I don’t like FARE, they have no transparency, their voting membership is open only to groups (C1872 should join) and their agenda is one of leftist social change and not just anti-discrimination. Much of their origin is about raising Power’s profile. And yes they targeted us, and Power’s wife may have to do with that initially, but it was also Spiers and others. And that’s what they do. Look for history and report.

However, regardless of what they do, UEFA have taken action against us for this before ( 2011, a 3 year suspended stadium closure was the last). So it shouldn’t be a surprise they did this
 
Valley Bluenose said:
Can’t argue with that. I would say though that attacking FARE from a position of strength, ie when we don’t have the shadow of sanctions hanging over us, would be more likely to succeed. Right now it would be dismissed as sour grapes or the infamous ‘whataboutery’.
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And we should also attack the mentally challengeds VB. one of our bears watched their game at Fir Park & highlighted all of their songs in the first half, both sectarian & supportive of a banned terrorist group.

Record them every game we can & send the letters to SFA & UEFA. Ultimately it will work & will also show FARE/CallItOut etc up.
 
Can anyone pass information to a Match Delegate and is there a way of finding out before the match who the delegate will be and their contact details?
 
Grigo Yossarian said:
We’re gonna kill our own club if we don’t do this.

1.Stop the sectarian singing & take their excuse away.

2.Only when 1 is complete, go after the haters with a detailed analysis & investigation to get supportive hard evidence of their ( FARE, SFA, O’Hagan or whoever ) bias. Get the evidence & publicise it to the relevant authority dependant upon what we find, SFA, UEFA, Police, etc.

We are working on 2 with respect to the child abuse scandal. Why can’t some intelligent & motivated bears do it for these haters ?
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It matters not who the match delegate is.It matters not who UNFARE send to catch us out. We have been warned and ignored the warning.We have "people" amongst us daft enough to record and put on social media our fans singing "banned" songs.We have the scotshit press sneakily going to these games and recording all sorts of shit to hit us with. We were warned and they have been waiting patiently for the opportunity to do our club and hey presto some fans satisfied their needs. They are not interested in the filth,only us.Stop singing about the pope and 19th Century Terrorists.Problem solved.......maybe.
 
Grigo Yossarian said:
I’ll put 100 quid in.
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Me too GY I personally think Club 1872 should employ professional investigators, the Club are limited by what they can do and our main supporter group needs to fill that void, as a C 1872 monthly contributor I’d be happy to see us divert money assigned for share purchase towards this.....it’s time to play them at their own game, while giving them zero chance to adversely impact us!
 
Superrangers said:
I am saying that other clubs might be randomly visited but there is a campaign against us and we are targetted constantly. It’s all also well known of the connections of senior people at FARE and Celtc.
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If you’re a cop and know there’s areas with a high likelihood of people committing crimes, you might focus your attentions there when trying so stop said crimes. We as a fan base keep giving them ammo, and the longer it goes on, the heavier the punishment is going to be, and it’s not going to stop anytime soon. No matter how much we stamp our feet or say we’ll keep singing in defiance. This has a real possibility of costing the club tens of millions of pounds over stubbornness and trying to prove staunchness.
 
WATP said:
Me too GY I personally think Club 1872 should employ professional investigators, the Club are limited by what they can do and our main supporter group needs to fill that void, as a C 1872 monthly contributor I’d be happy to see us divert money assigned for share purchase towards this.....it’s time to play them at their own game, while giving them zero chance to adversely impact us!
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Absolutely agree WATP. I’m a C1872 contributor too mate, as is my son.

They would be a great shout to do this on ohr behalf. I’d also increase my subscription if I knew they were leading things like this against our community.

The thing not to do is do what we are doing. We are harming Rangers & not our haters.
 
Grigo Yossarian said:
We’re gonna kill our own club if we don’t do this.

1.Stop the sectarian singing & take their excuse away.

2.Only when 1 is complete, go after the haters with a detailed analysis & investigation to get supportive hard evidence of their ( FARE, SFA, O’Hagan or whoever ) bias. Get the evidence & publicise it to the relevant authority dependant upon what we find, SFA, UEFA, Police, etc.

We are working on 2 with respect to the child abuse scandal. Why can’t some intelligent & motivated bears do it for these haters ?
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When the singing stops it will be something else there’s a panic on we’re getting closer
 
Grigo Yossarian said:
And we should also attack the mentally challengeds VB. one of our bears watched their game at Fir Park & highlighted all of their songs in the first half, both sectarian & supportive of a banned terrorist group.

Record them every game we can & send the letters to SFA & UEFA. Ultimately it will work & will also show FARE/CallItOut etc up.
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Agreed. FARE and call it out are farcical agenda-led bigots.
 
Grigo Yossarian said:
Absolutely agree WATP. I’m a C1872 contributor too mate, as is my son.

They would be a great shout to do this on ohr behalf. I’d also increase my subscription if I knew they were leading things like this against our community.

The thing not to do is do what we are doing. We are harming Rangers & not our haters.
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Agree totally, let’s cut out the self harm but really start to box clever.
 
FARE are not fair and until we wise up during the matches the rabid tims that have infected them will have cause to report us.

We need FARE ambassadors that are culturally sympathetic to our cause. And if that means Rangers fans doing so under the guise of being supporters of a provincial club then at this point I would be all for that.
 
ID10 said:
Hate to disagree with you & I realise I face a slap for this

He reported the singing to the Norwegian delegate 100%, the club were informed on the night

Fare also made reports of 3 songs and singing in BF1

Grabs the tinfoil hat
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Reporting the word 19th Century Terrorist in our songs while showing a picture of them holding up the banners claiming to be 19th Century Terrorists of course for balanced reporting :rolleyes:
 
Martin said:
FARE are not fair and until we wise up during the matches the rabid tims that have infected them will have cause to report us.

We need FARE ambassadors that are culturally sympathetic to our cause. And if that means Rangers fans doing so under the guise of being supporters of a provincial club then at this point I would be all for that.
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Yep, let’s join the propaganda war they’ve been waging on us for decades Martin.
 
This FARE mob need investigated and outed if we can prove their bias

It’s obvious they are targeting one team in Glasgow and it’s not the paedo harbourers so we should forensically go through their accounts, personnel, social media posts, LinkedIn profiles the lot

UEFA are corrupt as f.uck too and I would not be surprised if bags of cash are being handed over to push the agenda against us
 
TPP said:
Even Martin Bain called out FARE for what it was

He called that one right it's bang on the money.
We are of the opinion that FARE has been influenced by people who make it their business to damage our club in any way they can.
Rangers chief executive Martin Bain.
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Martin said:
We have to take our medicine for our own short comings at present however regarding the propaganda war we are starting from a position far behind them but as always we should welcome the chase !!!
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You’re right mate. They are experts. But we can recover very quickly.

Stop the singing & publicise every single thing they do. Send it everywhere. Someone will bite.
 
EBT's Loyal said:
It would be interesting to know if FARE stick to their own guidelines as to who they appoint as an observer for our games.

https://farenet.org/get-involved/report-discrimination/observer-scheme-faq/

Who are the Fare observers?
The Fare observers are experts who have been recruited through an open process from across Europe. All have background knowledge in anti- discrimination issues and fan scenes.
All observers speak the language of the teams they have been appointed to observe and are familiar with the corresponding fan cultures. The observers are working on a voluntary basis and are committed to being unbiased. They are not appointed as an observer at a game involving a team they follow themselves as supporters, or a close rival team.
All observers receive training and agree to a strict code of conduct before they start their work. Observers are independent individuals and are not required to be Fare members. Fare members, conversely, are not usually Fare observers.
To protect the personal safety of our observers, Fare guarantees their anonymity towards third parties and we vouch for the quality of their work. All reports are vetted and checked for quality.
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I find the whole 'Fare' set up quite sinister.
'The observers work on a voluntary basis - creepy.
 
Valley Bluenose said:
The proper term for the charges we faced is 'Racist and Discriminatory Conduct' - only nobody has bothered to use that rather misleading and long-winded term.

This is how UEFA define 'Racist and Discriminatory Conduct'.

Any person under the scope of Article 3 who insults the human dignity of a person or group of persons on whatever grounds, including skin colour, race, religion, ethnic origin, gender or sexual orientation, incurs a suspension lasting at least ten matches or a specified period of time, or any other appropriate sanction.

It goes, as you can see, way beyond what most of us would term 'racist'.

Article 14 in their Regs:

https://www.uefa.com/MultimediaFile...CompDisCases/02/60/83/56/2608356_DOWNLOAD.pdf
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None of those terms are what a 19th Century Terrorist is though and who was it that felt discriminated against? Was it the 19th Century Terrorist army?
Our club are absolutely atrocious at fighting our corner
 
Govan_derry said:
None of those terms are what a 19th Century Terrorist is though and who was it that felt discriminated against? Was it the 19th Century Terrorist army?
Our club are absolutely atrocious at fighting our corner
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We all - well most of us in here - know what the literal definition of a 19th Century Terrorist is. However, it’s a battle that was lost, perhaps without ever being fought, because in general use the meaning of the word has changed over the years. Many of us still recall referring to the Dhims as ‘huns’ - in general use the meaning of that word has changed also. And it’s not really to do with the Club fighting that battle or not. In all honesty they shouldn’t be having to deal with definitions or otherwise of 19th Century Terrorist. They are a football club.
 
mdingwall said:
Several threads mentioned Garry O'Hagen, the Kilmarnock chief executive, as being "the guy who reported us to UEFA" as he was match delegate at the St Jospeh's game.

A couple of points.

1/ He was not the UEFA match delegate - that was a Norwegian.

2/ O'Hagen was there as he was there to observe what being a match delegate involves as he is training to be one.

3/ The info on which the complain was made was gathered by a member of FARE and passed to the match delegate.

We can have our views about O'Hagen's suitability to become a delegate but let's keep things factual.
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That’s very fair, no point in giving the guy grief when he’s not responsible
 
Valley Bluenose said:
We all - well most of us in here - know what the literal definition of a 19th Century Terrorist is. However, it’s a battle that was lost, perhaps without ever being fought, because in general use the meaning of the word has changed over the years. Many of us still recall referring to the Dhims as ‘huns’ - in general use the meaning of that word has changed also.
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It shouldn’t be allowed to be used against us as a derogatory term when they call themselves 19th Century Terrorists though. So basically u are allowed to use the term 19th Century Terrorist as long as you identify yourself as a 19th Century Terrorist meaning you are discriminating against everyone else who may want to use the word.

The problem we have with fare is that everyone in Scottish football is our rivals and are out to get us. Our club should compile a dossier on every Scottish club with examples of their hatred towards us and show that every fare observer will have some sort of agenda against our club.
 
Grigo Yossarian said:
We’re gonna kill our own club if we don’t do this.

1.Stop the sectarian singing & take their excuse away.

2.Only when 1 is complete, go after the haters with a detailed analysis & investigation to get supportive hard evidence of their ( FARE, SFA, O’Hagan or whoever ) bias. Get the evidence & publicise it to the relevant authority dependant upon what we find, SFA, UEFA, Police, etc.

We are working on 2 with respect to the child abuse scandal. Why can’t some intelligent & motivated bears do it for these haters ?
Click to expand...

Time for papasmurf to gain a new project
 
Govan_derry said:
It shouldn’t be allowed to be used against us as a derogatory term when they call themselves 19th Century Terrorists though. So basically u are allowed to use the term 19th Century Terrorist as long as you identify yourself as a 19th Century Terrorist meaning you are discriminating against everyone else who may want to use the word.

The problem we have with fare is that everyone in Scottish football is our rivals and are out to get us. Our club should compile a dossier on every Scottish club with examples of their hatred towards us and show that every fare observer will have some sort of agenda against our club.
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I’m sure you are fully aware of the parallels with the use of the ‘n word’ by black folks. It’s a f*cked up world right enough.
 
Valley Bluenose said:
We all - well most of us in here - know what the literal definition of a 19th Century Terrorist is. However, it’s a battle that was lost, perhaps without ever being fought, because in general use the meaning of the word has changed over the years. Many of us still recall referring to the Dhims as ‘huns’ - in general use the meaning of that word has changed also. And it’s not really to do with the Club fighting that battle or not. In all honesty they shouldn’t be having to deal with definitions or otherwise of 19th Century Terrorist. They are a football club.
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I would rather we didn’t sing it. I take my kids along to the game and don’t want them brought up with the same hatred I was but that doesn’t mean uefa an
Valley Bluenose said:
I’m sure you are fully aware of the parallels with the use of the ‘n word’ by black folks. It’s a f*cked up world right enough.
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It’s crazy, we are actually the ones being discriminated against as we aren’t allowed to use the same terminology as others

As an aside Blazing saddles is still one of my favourites
 
Govan_derry said:
I would rather we didn’t sing it. I take my kids along to the game and don’t want them brought up with the same hatred I was but that doesn’t mean uefa an


It’s crazy, we are actually the ones being discriminated against as we aren’t allowed to use the same terminology as others

As an aside Blazing saddles is still one of my favourites
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It’s where we are mate. We have to keep this sort of stuff outside of Ibrox.
 
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