you just compared an ‘expected assist’ rate against an actual ‘assist’ rate?
Kent’s assist rate
- Thread starter PaulS1988
- Start date
you just compared an ‘expected assist’ rate against an actual ‘assist’ rate?
CaptainObjective
Well-Known Member
Starting to look like an unforgivable waste of resources. I still believe he has ability but needs to start producing.
Syme
Well-Known Member
The lanky blonde gimp cb at the bheasts has scored more than Kent... his goal ratio is shocking.
for what we spunked on him we need 10 minimum and that’s being kind!
Jaws II
Well-Known Member
I think he has more assists also.
brain
Well-Known Member
Very mature. You are mis-using the stats to prove a point and making a fool of yourself.
How many expected assists though?
brain
Well-Known Member
If we played Kent as an old fashioned right winger he would do just fine. Run to the byline and cut it back. Leave the intricate stuff and the shooting to those who are good at it. Unfortunately we don't play a right winger and we are shoehorning him into a position where he looks lost.
Trueblueal
Well-Known Member
Makes you wonder why we bought 3 or 4 wingers doesn't it. A forward 3 with 1 striker in it. Even now when the dugs in the street can see Kamberi should have started we persist with Kent who's done nothing for long enough and ruin Hagi out wide.
Coda
Well-Known Member
I'm doing nothing of the sort. The fact you cant interpret them properly, yet want to have an opinion on it, suggests you should probably keep quiet.
47blue
Well-Known Member
Cold hard facts. For a Rangers forward that's damning. We all wanted Kent and he is an exciting talent but its not happening.
Coda
Well-Known Member
Which bit of that are you struggling to understand? If the actual assist and expected assist are the same, that shows the attackers of one team are proficient, and the attackers of another are not. Very simple. If given the same strikers, both would have the same stats.
A lot of people with a lot to say in this thread, but clearly can't understand simple logic.
brain
Well-Known Member
The fact that you are drawing false conclusions from the stats suggests that you should probably keep quiet.
Also, is that how that stat works?
Coda
Well-Known Member
I can't be held responsible for your inability to comprehend some very simple statistics.
The only false conclusions are coming from the helmets that think 0 assists in 19 tells the entire story in isolation.
Jaws II
Well-Known Member
Our attackers are not better than theirs.
Our wide players are not better than theirs.
Our midfield isn’t better than theirs.
That is what the stats show.
One of our worst performers in midfield/wide Attacking positions is Kent with about 5/6 goals and zero assists.
No matter how you try to spin that it is fucking dreadful.
Bertyboy69
Well-Known Member
Operation Green is in full flow I see.
what if forrests xA was ten times higher? What would that tell you.
brain
Well-Known Member
Quite the arrrogant, condescending type aren't you. Nobody said it was the "entire story".
Coda
Well-Known Member
Essentially, yeah. He created 1 chance every 198 minutes that should have been scored by the attacker. That's the jist of it.
Coda
Well-Known Member
I'm left with no option when people choose to ignore what's put in front of them, in favour of an opinion based on nothing but a negative agenda.
Coda
Well-Known Member
That their strikers could be a lot better, but are still better than ours.
His xA for the period was marginally higher, but typically the chances he created were scored, it would seem.
OK, since we are all so incapable of comprehending your obvious genius. Tell me, you said above that "If the actual assist and expected assist are the same, that shows the attackers of one team are proficient, and the attackers of another are not."
How about you do a direct comparison of Kent v Forrest, assists and expected assists totals. If your claim that its all down to the finishing of other players is right, then surely their totals of Assists and Expected assists should be the same? or is it purely that Kent isn't impacting games as often as he should be and Celtic's wingers/attacking midfielders are?
Trueblueal
Well-Known Member
Kent has little end product last season and has continued this season. He's clearly a good dribbler but seems to lack the nous to do much with it. He does attract defenders to him which in theory should leave space but I'd still expect a starting forward to do more.
Right now we need to rip this champ manager formation up and play to our players strengths.
To my mind that means Hagi in a classic 10 behind Morelos and Kamberi. Pick any other 3 midfields behind that.
If we insist upon 3 up then it's 3 strikers so that would be Kamberi, Morelos and Stewart.
If we revert to 442 or 451 then Kent can play wide with Ojo or Jones our only other winger options.
Right now we need to rip this champ manager formation up and play to our players strengths.
To my mind that means Hagi in a classic 10 behind Morelos and Kamberi. Pick any other 3 midfields behind that.
If we insist upon 3 up then it's 3 strikers so that would be Kamberi, Morelos and Stewart.
If we revert to 442 or 451 then Kent can play wide with Ojo or Jones our only other winger options.
Oh, ok. Wasn’t sure if the 0.4 was the cumulative figure for the ten games.
Tav and Borna must have an expected assist number of like 5 a game!
BoyInRoyalBlue
Well-Known Member
See this is the problem
He has indeed delivered on the big occasions, 4 excellent displays vs Celtic and 2 excellent games in Europe and a cup semi vs Hearts
But apart from that, name me games where he has been excellent?
There haven't been more than a handful, we need a player who can turn it on 90% of the time, not 10% of the time which just now is what we get with Kent.
This the reason he goes inside is to allow borna to go by him
Coda
Well-Known Member
Tav's expected assists is 4 times higher than his actual assists.
Barisic's expected assists is 2.5 times higher than his actual assists.
Sorry it doesn't suit your agenda.
brain
Well-Known Member
You are trying to use one stat to say Forrest isn't a considerably better player. The more important stats, goals and actual assists, say very differently for both this season and last. We can all see with our eyes that Kent doesn't regularly create high quality chances that our forwards are constantly spurning. And when I watch Celtic's highlights I see Forrest very often getting to the byline and putting it on a plate for his teammates.
NDC bear forever
Well-Known Member
Coda
Well-Known Member
An expected assist is literally a high quality chance. Half chances don't get recorded.
The stats show that if Edouard and Griffiths are the strikers, then Kent and Forrest would have far closer stats, with Forrest still being a bit better. You can choose to ignore that if you want, you can choose to ignore xG and xA, but they tell far more about the situation than basic goal and assist stats. You've just backed up my point about people thinking they're relevant to the overall picture.
The Lone Sniper
Well-Known Member
Who are you thinking of that turns up for 90% of games? de Bruyne? Haland? Mbappe?
Yet both have more than 0 assists in a year.
im still waiting for the side by side stats as well. Which would conclusively prove his argument as correct.
BoyInRoyalBlue
Well-Known Member
I will compare with our nearest competitors
Forrest, Christie, Both turn up in the vast majority of games for that lot and have telling contributions
Looking back for us, Naismith, Miller used to turn up in the vast majority
If we want to win the league, we need to have the consistency that in the vast vast majority of games, in the 90% ballpark, the players turn up and have telling contributions.
Kent very rarely does.
It is the difference between winning trophies and just winning the big games.
HandsomeHead
Well-Known Member
I’d stop short of saying he’s arguably the best player in Scotland, but he needs support, both from his manager and the fans.
I didn’t think we should spent as much as £7m on him, but he can be a very dangerous player on his day.
He just looks like his confidence has completely gone, hence the support line.
I’ll be interested to see how we look when Borna is back and we’re playing something akin to a 4-4-2 with Kent wide left and Kamberi through the middle with Alfie. I think we can get a lot of joy from this.
The Lone Sniper
Well-Known Member
Kent's been with us for 18 months - the players you mention have all had time to settle in - and are/were playing for Title winning teams. Completely different circumstances.
Kent's struggling for form but patience and support will help.
Korova Milk Bar
Well-Known Member
Makes me want to smash my head in a wall when people don’t realise this and keep using stats...
Would like to see more from him, but don’t think it’s the complete picture for him. The way we play he’s unlikely to have high numbers of assists and so much goes through the fullback.
Assists also rely on the person on the other end actually getting the ball in the back of the net.
More to come from Kent. He’s a talent and a great player. I’m not convinced we’re playing the best system to get the best from him.
Quite often seems to me that when Kent has the ball or our other wide attack that they’ve got nothing to hit when they’ve got the ball on the wing. Against packed defences we aren’t going to see the best from him the way we are playing.
Assists also rely on the person on the other end actually getting the ball in the back of the net.
More to come from Kent. He’s a talent and a great player. I’m not convinced we’re playing the best system to get the best from him.
Quite often seems to me that when Kent has the ball or our other wide attack that they’ve got nothing to hit when they’ve got the ball on the wing. Against packed defences we aren’t going to see the best from him the way we are playing.
BoyInRoyalBlue
Well-Known Member
As you say, Kent has been with us for 18 months.
How long do you want to give it? 4 years, 5 years?
Plenty players take time to settle, no issue with that, infact I have been one who in the past has specifically said I wouldn't really a judge a player until he has had 6 months at us.
The reason Kent isn't in a title winning team, is because he nor his team mates turn up for the amount of games it takes to win titles.
It is specifically our problem.
Your suggesting these players turn up then?
If your comparing these players to their value of the leagues they're playing in then Kent has to be in the same bracket,their leagues have an abundance of quality,high priced players whose wealth far exceeds ours so in that case Kent is 1 of the most valuable players in our league playing against mediocre defences and midfields of a much less value than him so I would say if those players you suggest can play to their value for 90% of the time against tougher,better and considerably more valuable players than ours then why can't Kent do it?
He's nowhere near the player we thought he was if he can't produce the goods against the majority of players he comes up against and he can't,simple as that
He needs dropped as well as others if they don't produce,others should get a chance because something needs to change
He set 4 up yesterday not his fault his team mates couldn’t finish them.
Seems to come deeper and deeper, then passes sideways or backwards. Main reason for this is he's short of confidence and when played in this weird "10" that we play him in he's starved of space. He's generally not a great passer of the ball so will do nothing 40 yards out
The only person with an ‘agenda’ in this thread is you
xA is meaningless in the context of results.
Morelos misses some amount of simple one on ones but we don’t hear how it’s alright because it adds to his xG stats
It’s simple. If our forwards were as bad as you’re making out it wouldn’t matter how many assists are expected from Borna or Tav because they simply wouldn’t score
It’s not just some freak coincidence that Kent hasn’t had an assist in the league for over a year. Especially when we’ve probably been the highest scoring team in that year
TheBlueBlazerV3
Well-Known Member
Football isnt won on should, or would, its won with cold hard decisive statistics like Goals Scored, Assists et al.
If Messi scored 50 in a season, but Ronaldo scored 25, but Ronaldo had x less chances - who would win the golden boot?
If Kent assisted 0 and scored 6 - Forrest created 15 and scored 15 (cant recall the actual numbers) who is more effective and influencing game winning moments more?
Thats the basic principle of this argument, we arent looking for Einstein or Sheldon Cooper - we are looking at facts.
