2 incidents that sum up our central midfield

[Los Pollos Hermanos]

It’s a mystery why we have to play with two defensive mids, in Scotland anyway.

As you say Lundstram hasn’t the discipline for this and that’s why you see him drop in to basically make it a three who then pass the ball between them, slowing things down and letting the opposition get their shape.

He does this to disguise his shortcomings.

If you still think it's a mystery after watching the last few performances there is no hope for you.
We're being totally over ran in that area by jobbers, while Cantwell and Lawrence are trying wee flicks left, right and centre.
Diomande has been a massive miss in that area.

 

[Ball71]

He needs dropped now

Off the friarton bridge would be a start

 

[Ballymena]

Never been a fan of Lundstram, a mediocre footballer who has no positional awareness or general footballing attributes that make him a decent midfielder. For being considered a protecting midfielder he is shocking at it - unwilling to track runners or fill in to cover full back areas for counter attacks.

It's no coincidence the only meaningful game we have won v them is the Scottish Cup Semi where coincidentally he was taken off for Davis before we went on to win.

A ridiculously awful downgrade in the midfield options we had previously and if there is any positives to take from the last week it may be that his contract will not be renewed- potentially freeing up wages for more capable footballers.

He's a safe player. Side to side passes and a few long balls. Couple of forward runs and that's it. No goals or assists in him as a CM. Bang average. He's Hearts level

 

[Dedé Arneaux]

I know there were many more than just the two, but, these were the ones that, for me, we're beyond being amateurish.

Lundstram - I think it was maybe about the 75 minute mark and he inexplicably headers the ball to the feet of the Dundee attacker from inside our own 18 yarder.
Primary school stuff.

Lawrence - That passage of play in the last minute. We have one last chance to break, Matondo has made the run early, you're talking a 20 yard pass but no, the imposter takes a touch too many and then flaps at the pass and puts it straight out of play.

That was our central midfield tonight. Two 'players' who cannot do the absolute basics of either defence or attack.

Two players who showed great promise as youngsters and didn’t make the grade down south. Thats the reason they’re here. And they’re not good enough for us either.
Matondo, Cantwell, Dowell, Davies - same.
Shopping in the damaged goods market hasn’t done us any favours.
Sterling the exception.

 

[Ibroxroar]

It's totally mental that Clement stumbled upon Sterling as a good central midfield option due to lack of numbers, he brought energy, physicality and drive to that area, which is needed especially away from home in our league, yet now plays him in his least effective position throwing the balance of the team out the window.

You have summed up perfectly the root cause of our demise. Sterling and Butland are our only premiership class players. Sterling is desperarely needed in central midfield as Lawrence and Dowell do not have the energy.

 

[Novichok]

I suspect he knows this over the last week or two

My thoughts too. That drop off in effort and running doesn't just happen over night for no reason. He's playing exactly as he did in the last days of the previous two managers.

 

[stonewall Jackson]

If you still think it's a mystery after watching the last few performances there is no hope for you.
We're being totally over ran in that area by jobbers, while Cantwell and Lawrence are trying wee flicks left, right and centre.
Diomande has been a massive miss in that area.

I would say there is no hope for us then if we have to resort to two def mids to cover for our deficiency in midfield.

We have guys earning 20k plus a week in there so maybe start earning it.

 

[Cooper's left peg]

No new deal for Lundstram.

I said that in January, if not earlier, and got slaughtered for it.

His performances have been massively over exaggerated.

He is a big problem in the way we play.

He simply cannot be given a new contract. It would be insane.

 

[dunn1872]

Lawrence is a ten and the way we've playing him recently is baffling. It's Cantwell or him - can't shoe horn both into the same team.

At one point he's dropping in to CB to cover souttar. Absolutely pointless.

Lundstram - the less said about him the better. That clearing header BACK ACROSS OUR OWN BOX - what in holy hell was that

Lawrence has shown absolutely nothing as a 10. His distribution is woeful and for somebody who we're told is meant to be good at a long dig, his shooting is terrible.

 

[Willie81]

Hopefully Yilmaz is back cos Sterling must play CM.

 

[uml]

I suspect he knows this over the last week or two

I suspect so as well. Either that or his fitness is at a deplorable level.

 

[DBallZ]

The sickening thing is we match 99% of the teams we have to play for effort then we win the game. Sunday reminded me of when Hearts knocked us out the cup and was followed up by Hamilton beating us at home. Lesser players getting a result for their teams through nothing more than competing more than you.

It’s absolutely unforgivable

I’d swap at least half the team for ‘lesser’ players from other SPFL teams in a heartbeat.

We’ve had far too many big time Charlie’s darken our door and swan around with zero desire and urgency.

 

[RTD-BEAR]

Yup you wonder if we have rejected his agents most recent proposal and they've decided to start looking elsewhere. A few months ago he could run the midfield by himself but now he looks lost.

Possibly that comes back to the poor squad management from the club over last 3/4 allowing it to happen.

We have rotated nearly everyone else apart apart from JL and have run him into the ground as well injuries hasn't helped but there's been chances to rest him and we havnt

 

[Bigbluebear]

Lundstram Is the main cause for the performance in the last few games being so bad.

He can leave tonight as far as I'm concerned

 

[Loud and proud]

Both should be shown the door at the end of the season.
Nowhere near good enough.

 

[TheScotty]

That’s something that has been bothering me.

We know Raskin can play at a decent level, we’ve seen it.

Ok he is off form, but surely leaving him cast out and on the bench, with no prospect of playing and persevering with a grossly under performing player who is out of contract, rather than trying to work with his younger replacement, on a long contract is simply wromg?

If nothing else, what does this say about our player trading model?

Whatever Raskin is, and I’m not for one minute suggesting he’s any kind of saviour, he would be an upgrade on what Lundstram is producing.
Anyone or anything would be better than what Lundstram is giving us.

 

[Thasunke Witko]

Played near every League game, 4 assists.

Cheeky bassa wants more money, for that.

There lies the problem, knowing your getting a place in the team despite knowing how shit your performing is despicable from the management team, same shite from the same shitey players that pick when and where they want to play and they are all the highest earners at the club.

 

[Corporal Jones]

It's crazy to be playing Dowell and Lundstram ahead of Raskin or even Rice if they are playing this bad and won't be here in the summer.

Much better to try get something out of players that have potential than guys that are what they are.

If raskin is the answer we're totally fecked

 

[TheBlueMagoo]

I'd play bailey rice for lundstram and drop him for until he has left.

He doesn't dominate games for the 18s or b team. McKinnon should see fametime first

 

[Fr-Bear]

It’s not just midfielders tho, late in Game, McAusland had a tussle with that wee blonde midfielder McCowan I think, he eventually poked the ball back to Souttar and turned up pitch for return pass, also I think Lawrence was available for the forward pass unmarked, but Soutter let the ball run past home and turned and played it back to Butland.

To me that’s fear. Totally cautious fear based football. Safe option all the time. And I’m not singling Souttar out but it’s a symptom of this team and our style. It’s timid. Possession based but without the clinical cutting edge of teams who can keep ball but explode forward when the opportunity arises.

Look how quickly Ross County and Dundee played ball forward tonight, early first time passes, and cut thru us at time. We practically never do this. It’s pass, pass, pass usually with no progression forward. No bravery or desire at all.

Drives me up the wall. It’s fecking the SPL. It’s shite, we shouldn’t be treating it with such caution and timidity.

 

[PhilippeTheFair]

There lies the problem, knowing your getting a place in the team despite knowing how shit your performing is despicable from the management team, same shite from the same shitey players that pick when and where they want to play and they are all the highest earners at the club.

I want us signing guys coming from shit wages with real hunger for the game.

Bare minimum is them bursting a gut every 90 minutes.

Easier to forgive a trier for failing, at times.

 

[Stuart_WATP]

If Lundstram starts v Hearts we're in trouble.

A total liability.

100%. He's checked out. Needs dropped.

 

[Maestro72]

Someone else said it, a midfield full of championship type players.

And we’re expecting to produce quality from that?

 

[Crown_Defender]

The sickening thing is we match 99% of the teams we have to play for effort then we win the game. Sunday reminded me of when Hearts knocked us out the cup and was followed up by Hamilton beating us at home. Lesser players getting a result for their teams through nothing more than competing more than you.

It’s absolutely unforgivable

Said this at half time on Sunday. In fact I've said it till I'm demented. You absolutely must match these clubs for desire or they can make you look very stupid. Ross County passed us off the park on Sunday and tonight we were given the runaround by Tiffney (Partick player last season) and Luke McCowan who they got from Ayr. Once Dundee decided around the 65th minute they wanted a draw, that was pretty much it. They got it very easily and were worry their point just as County deserved to beat us at the weekend.

Truly is mind boggling what has happened the last few weeks. 4 points from 15. When you throw in a draw against that mob, it really beggars belief how we've managed that, given where we were prior to those matches.

 

[PhilippeTheFair]

Someone else said it, a midfield full of championship type players.

And we’re expecting to produce quality from that?

Butland aside, none of our players are attractive to the top teams in that league, who could match the wages our players are on.

The middle table clubs couldn't and ours wouldn't leave for mid table clubs there.

Fcukin stuck,

 

[HongKong55]

The fact that lundstram is the first one people blame in there is a shambles. He’s been poor for the past couple of games after 6 months of giving 7/10 most games. Tom Lawrence is a pitiful football player and quite literally offers nothing. He doesn’t defend, he doesn’t create and he doesn’t attack. He’s just shite.

A guy on £30k+ a week is “giving 7/10 most games” against the likes of St Johnstone, Dundee and Ross County. Is it any wonder the players are such losers when some of the support deem that to be acceptable?

 

[WinkieWATP]

Said this at half time on Sunday. In fact I've said it till I'm demented. You absolutely must match these clubs for desire or they can make you look very stupid. Ross County passed us off the park on Sunday and tonight we were given the runaround by Tiffney (Partick player last season) and Luke McCowan who they got from Ayr. Once Dundee decided around the 65th minute they wanted a draw, that was pretty much it. They got it very easily and were worry their point just as County deserved to beat us at the weekend.

Truly is mind boggling what has happened the last few weeks. 4 points from 15. When you throw in a draw against that mob, it really beggars belief how we've managed that, given where we were prior to those matches.

It’s soul destroying mate to be perfectly honest. Feels as if every time you start to believe in them again they boot you square in the bollocks.

 

[RFC56]

A guy on £30k+ a week is “giving 7/10 most games” against the likes of St Johnstone, Dundee and Ross County. Is it any wonder the players are such losers when some of the support deem that to be acceptable?

Surely performing 7/10 most games is what you want for your sitting midfielder no? Do you want him to provide you with goals as well? There’s 8 other teams in the league as well he played mate not just the three you listed.

Listen I don’t think lundstram can be here long term anyway. Any bad performances and he automatically gets the blame. The fans have seen enough of him. But your kidding yourself if you think he’s even the 5th or 6th biggest problem with this team. There is plenty of issues with this team that need fixing, his role in the team is far down the list.

 

[douzpwa]

Even then let’s be honest he is just an honest jobber with plenty enthusiasm. He probably doesn’t have the actual quality to be a long term
CM. His use of the ball is average. We need someone who controls a game in there long term. Said at the time when we played USG we were crying out for a player like their captain but we still have midfielders that don’t like a football at their feet

He gives more balance to what we have there the last two games midfield were posted missing and our dodgy defense were exposed for what they are!

We have players that appear to lack communications all over the park and it is strange the only urgency we had was a 5 minute spell when young Ross came on and pressed till he won the ball!

Looks like our team are done on their feet but one would have thought if so adrenalin should have kicked in with the stakes so high for the club!

 

[Professor Yaffle]

Lawrence is rank rotten.

Lundstram is slow streaky. His form goes from hopeless to excellent to inept, sloe and ponderous. Hes back to his crap phase.

No point giving him a fortune. Move on.

And Lawrence can go for a packet of hot dog buns.

 

[The Moon on Mars is Blue]

I’m wondering whether Lundstram has been told recently that he’s not getting a new contract. These last two games there’s been a noticeable change in his effort/attitude.

I would expect that is the case. We will get better value out there given the wages we are paying him at the moment let alone am improved contract. Clearly he is not interested

 

[douzpwa]

A guy on £30k+ a week is “giving 7/10 most games” against the likes of St Johnstone, Dundee and Ross County. Is it any wonder the players are such losers when some of the support deem that to be acceptable?

It doesn't matter what he gets, the balance of the midfield is off and due to that Lundstram has been forced back to help the defence! Sterling is more effective in midfield than left back and helps that balance!

 

[HSMS]

Lundstram’s form has fallen off a massive cliff in the last month, Unsure what the reason is but his display against Ross County was as bad as I can remember recently.

As much as the players are to blame (and they are) the midfield setup in the last couple of games has been a shocker.

Lundstram almost playing as a sweeper and Lawrence last night floating about, leaving wide gaps that got continually exploited. We effectively play with a midfield 2 and they are both out of position. That is on the manager.

 

[Live Forever]

We’re being overrun in midfield constantly just now.

Going to the Piggery with this set up could be a real doing

 

[MuddyWaters]

I know there were many more than just the two, but, these were the ones that, for me, we're beyond being amateurish.

Lundstram - I think it was maybe about the 75 minute mark and he inexplicably headers the ball to the feet of the Dundee attacker from inside our own 18 yarder.
Primary school stuff.

Lawrence - That passage of play in the last minute. We have one last chance to break, Matondo has made the run early, you're talking a 20 yard pass but no, the imposter takes a touch too many and then flaps at the pass and puts it straight out of play.

That was our central midfield tonight. Two 'players' who cannot do the absolute basics of either defence or attack.

I went berserk at that Lawrence pass, Rabbi gets that ball ahead of him he was breaking towards their goal, ok nothing might have came of it, but FFS as you say primary school play.

 

[bud_light]

Of course he does , he is playing like a guy who wants out.

Bang on.Why would he risk any kind of injury when he knows he will be moving on soon.
No way will he ruin the chance of a nice pay day

 

[Growler]

Of course he does , he is playing like a guy who wants out.

You’re giving him far too much credit.

A guy with his CV is desperate for this title - but the weight of expectation weighs heavy, rather than any specific choice to not perform.

 

[Bobby Russell's Perm]

Sterling.

Okay along with who else

 

[hms]

Remember both incidents well, the midfield for me is the weak point and the 3 main causes of our problems just now and I’m pointing directly at Lundstram, he dictates the play and it’s ponderous. It sets the tone and he hasn’t been on it for weeks.

He cannot play again this season and not be offered a new contract.

 

[BigTinder86]

Who would you play instead of him then? Genuine question

Diomande and Sterling is surely worth a go.

Lundstram is terrible at the moment, really bad. Playing a pivotal position in our team and his performances are costing us.

 

[Up the road]

Lundstram looks like a player who is out of contract soon and doing just enough to get by because that’s exactly the situation he’s in. Barasic has been the same for a while.
The Club are responsible for allowing too many key players enter the last year of their contracts. And this can be the consequence.

 

[GodStruth]

Lundstram will be one of the first names on the teamsheet for Sunday, along with his mates Goldson and Tavernier.

Clement hasn’t the bottle to drop them.

Clement hasn't the players to drop them

 

[Tormusk1872]

Cole McKinnon played against Benfica, he didn’t disgrace himself, but cant even get on the bench now.

 

[Vader]

Central midfield has been a problem for years now. We seriously need to sign a couple of box to box midfielders that make things happen and chip in with a decent goal return. Add a goal scorer and many of our problems would disappear. Any defence would look bad with our lack of midfield in front of them, there's no cover at all.

 

[Cadzow Bear]

How many times is that since he's signed, has Lundstram decided he can't be arsed? Even when he can be arsed he's bang average. Get him the f@#k out of our club.

 

[Thommo2006]

Lundstram let the manager down big time at the weekend imo. Chucked the second and the failed to compete for a bouncing ball at the third.

Should he have started the game tonight? Is his heart still in it with his contact situation seemingly up in the air?

The issue is who do we replace him with? I would have had Sterling in there but with Ridvan injured and Barasic checked out he was needed at left back, if we had people fit then I agree he would be out of the team

 

[WinkieWATP]

The issue is who do we replace him with? I would have had Sterling in there but with Ridvan injured and Barasic checked out he was needed at left back, if we had people fit then I agree he would be out of the team

Raskin should be chocking at the bit to get a game and prove the manager wrong, can’t believe that Silva started last night either after his reaction when he was subbed at County either.

 

[Thommo2006]

Raskin should be chocking at the bit to get a game and prove the manager wrong, can’t believe that Silva started last night either after his reaction when he was subbed at County either.

I just don't think Raskin is very good and the fact he can't get in to that midfield suggests Clement thinks the same

 

[FamousRFC]

If you still think it's a mystery after watching the last few performances there is no hope for you.
We're being totally over ran in that area by jobbers, while Cantwell and Lawrence are trying wee flicks left, right and centre.
Diomande has been a massive miss in that area.

We are being over ran because we can’t find our own players with a pass , how many times did goldson souttar tav pass ball straight out the park or straight to a Dundee player and pressure was on us

 

[Macdonsj]

I just don't think Raskin is very good and the fact he can't get in to that midfield suggests Clement thinks the same

remains to be seen
but at least we'd get effort out of him
Lundstram has simply chucked it altogether