A 4 point swing this weekend due to no VAR.

KuwaitBear said:
Well that's easy, the exact same as what the officials do right now, ignore incidents for us and use it for incidents against us.
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I just don’t believe that. They can get away with it at the moment in one off games (lots of them admittedly) by claiming it is all just one off mistakes. But when you have a body of VAR decisions built up showing what the standard for offside is, what is and isn’t a penalty for handball etc., there just isn’t a way officials can materially deviate from that standard week to week. They just couldn’t be that blatant, they really couldn’t.
 
ald said:
I just don’t believe that. They can get away with it at the moment in one off games (lots of them admittedly) by claiming it is all just one off mistakes. But when you have a body of VAR decisions built up showing what the standard for offside is, what is and isn’t a penalty for handball etc., there just isn’t a way officials can materially deviate from that standard week to week. They just couldn’t be that blatant, they really couldn’t.
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You don't believe that? Go look at the ref video that gets put up here every so often, there is already a large amount of decisions like these that have been ignored or a yellow shown for an assault. And just from this season.

Sorry bud, but they are being that blatant.
 
KuwaitBear said:
You don't believe that? Go look at the ref video that gets put up here every so often, there is already a large amount of decisions like these that have been ignored or a yellow shown for an assault. And just from this season.

Sorry bud, but they are being that blatant.
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What ref video? That clown Dermot Gallagher or whatever he is called? Or the “BT Ref”? Hardly the same as VAR. Whilst it wasn’t without its teething problems, VAR seems to have settled down over the last 6 months or so and been quite consistent.

Each to their own, but I would take VAR in an absolute heartbeat over what we have at the moment. I just don’t see how it could possibly be worse than what we currently have and happen to think it would inevitably be much better, most likely considerably so. Not perfect, but much better than we currently have.

Anyway, I think it is all academic because there is no way Celtic would want VAR.
 
There's a reason why their is no Var its blatantly obvious that we would benefit and the scum would not.
I don't need to say anymore
 
StuGers said:
I’m astounded more wasn’t made of that. A stone wall penalty right there.
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When you have super ally and his their wasn't much in that claptrap talk and his sidekick desperate to see us fail. There lies the reason why you won't hear much said about anything.
 
ald said:
What ref video? That clown Dermot Gallagher or whatever he is called? Or the “BT Ref”? Hardly the same as VAR. Whilst it wasn’t without its teething problems, VAR seems to have settled down over the last 6 months or so and been quite consistent.

Each to their own, but I would take VAR in an absolute heartbeat over what we have at the moment. I just don’t see how it could possibly be worse than what we currently have and happen to think it would inevitably be much better, most likely considerably so. Not perfect, but much better than we currently have.

Anyway, I think it is all academic because there is no way Celtic would want VAR.
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No mate, there's a video that gets posted every now and again of the clearly wrong decisions against us. Just from this season alone its unreal. All incidents talked about on TV that you would think would heap pressure on the refs, but nope, week after week we move on and nobody talks about it again. Well until next time.

VAR would be a great thing, applied properly, but that's the sticking point for me. We would not get a fair crack of it. we would end up with a Clancy type, and our incidents would get barely a mention. Only real difference would be change the ref for VAR. How did the ref not see that/ how can the ref keep that guy on the park/ how can the officials say that was onside. How did the VAR not see that/ how can the VAR keep that guy on the park/ how can the VAR say that was onside.

The compliant officer is a prime example of this.
 
StuGers said:
It’s clear that Defoe gets the first touch and the defender bundles him over. I’m a bit annoyed that Defoe never made more of it too.
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McCoist said that after the replay which showed Defoe clearly got the ball first btw.

Also, Defoe moaning about it isnt going to see the ref give it. Weve had much more blatant ones this season already not given.
 
ald said:
In every other country they would view as a positive something which (a) is objective and fair and (b) helps referees. But not here. Here it is a threat. A threat to inbuilt corruption. Crappy plastic pitches, no VAR and an SPFL that gets sued because it’s members don’t think it is even handed. You couldn’t make it up. But, sadly, that is where we have got to in this country. It is just about enough to make me want to weep. I am absolutely scunnered by it all.
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It’s sickening.

We had issues today Ald, but DESPITE THEM we still deserved to win that match, and would have if Robertson did his job.

Almost a year until we’ve had an SPFL penalty really says it all.
 
I’ve been a critic of VAR, but I’m very much at the stage of realising we won’t win another trophy until we have it.

When we do enough to win games, and the officials award goals that should be blatantly disallowed, then we’ve got no chance.
 
KuwaitBear said:
Deejay, I 100% understand what you are saying but it won't make any difference.

What chance do you have when some of our players are routinely assaulted, it gets highlighted after the match, hell sometimes even the compliant officer gets involved, and it gets allowed to go on unpunished.

The TV evidence just gets ignored, as will VAR. Say Alfie gets brought down a stonewaller, there would be no review or anything, the game would move on. The studio would show the incident after the match, say it should have been a pen, and everything moves on.
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We can't continue as things are, or we are highly unlikely to win another trophy. Biased or corrupt Officials have a huge influence both in one-off cup games and even more so over the course of a season.

It is easier for an Official to admit to making a mistake, like the offsides today and yesterday, during live play than it is for someone monitoring VAR to say they got it wrong when technology clearly shows them whether it was offside or not.

I understand that for penalty decisions it is still down to the interpretation of the individual in control of VAR and we may still suffer from that, but for offside decisions it is the technology that makes the decision and if it is shown on tv/stadium screens like it is in England, then they can't over-rule it. That alone would benefit us and have seen us 4 points better off this weekend.
 
Grigo Yossarian said:
Good shout Ed.

I wasn’t sure about that during the game to be honest but that angle suggests we had a claim.

Anything more on Morelos’s second at the death ?
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You can see at the end of this video. A soft free kick awarded to Hibs when it most likely should have been a penalty to us.
In the video you can also see the holding of our players at the corner before the equalizer. The tug on Goldson is a penalty. The constant holding of Alf is an unpunished feature of Scottish football now.
You can see Porteous's intention in the non-foul Alf got booked for.
I missed two thirds of this game and apparently I saw the best of the officials!!
 
Disco Deejay said:
We can't continue as things are, or we are highly unlikely to win another trophy. Biased or corrupt Officials have a huge influence both in one-off cup games and even more so over the course of a season.

It is easier for an Official to admit to making a mistake, like the offsides today and yesterday, during live play than it is for someone monitoring VAR to say they got it wrong when technology clearly shows them whether it was offside or not.

I understand that for penalty decisions it is still down to the interpretation of the individual in control of VAR and we may still suffer from that, but for offside decisions it is the technology that makes the decision and if it is shown on tv/stadium screens like it is in England, then they can't over-rule it. That alone would benefit us and have seen us 4 points better off this weekend.
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We will have to agree to disagree mate. After what I saw from the SFA at the end of last season and decisions missed/ ignored this season, I just don't believe it would work out how you think. Whether on TV or VAR, if it suits it will get ignored.
 
Having the TV at the side of the pitch for review seems like an easy 'bridge' into full VAR.

I would also be a fan of wiring the referees up as they are in rugby to justify decision making.
 
bluenosebazza said:
McCoist said that after the replay which showed Defoe clearly got the ball first btw.

Also, Defoe moaning about it isnt going to see the ref give it. Weve had much more blatant ones this season already not given.
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But at least it will make the ref think he will have an angry athlete in his face rather than being able to just cheat constantly with absolutely no repercussions. It also helps highlight the terrible actions of the ref and it should then be spoken about.
 
StuGers said:
But at least it will make the ref think he will have an angry athlete in his face rather than being able to just cheat constantly with absolutely no repercussions. It also helps highlight the terrible actions of the ref and it should then be spoken about.
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Morelos gets booked anytime he does that and it leads to bans.
 
WATP said:
Don’t ignore that parts leading up to their opportunities....shambolic defending that is not worthy of a Rangers jersey.....plus numerous easy chances.....today was our players fault....no one else’s!!
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Your opinion won’t be popular but I agree to an extent , everyone blaming refs every time we slip up , we need to look at ourselves too far too many errors and a shocking first half today.
 
Graemeh89 said:
Your opinion won’t be popular but I agree to an extent , everyone blaming refs every time we slip up , we need to look at ourselves too far too many errors and a shocking first half today.
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I think there are two separate issues Graeme.

Whether we played well, given our superior ability, is absolutely worth discussion, and most would agree that we let ourselves down today.

HOWEVER to the ref ( and officials ) That should not be a factor at all. He should be doing his job, and if he did Rangers would have secured three points today.

As well as the offside goal there are again big decisions that were wrong - why do they always seem to go against Rangers with referees such as Clancy & Robertson Graeme ?

Do you genuinely think that’s coincidental ?
 
possilbear2 said:
According to some on here.that doesn't matter we're a team of bottlers
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Course it matters but if Morelos, Kent and Arfield hadn't missed sitters today, this thread wouldn't be here.

By all means, keep up the pressure on officials as there were a few dodgy as f*ck decisions today, but do it week in/week out. When it crops after a poor result it is easily dismissed as sour grapes.
 
Grei9 said:
Be careful what you wish for, who controls the VAR? If it would be implemented professionally I’d be all for it.
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But VAR gets replayed to death so theres no escaping bad calls. I think it will be ok. We need something to balance out the negative reffing.
 
Grigo Yossarian said:
I think there are two separate issues Graeme.

Whether we played well, given our superior ability, is absolutely worth discussion, and most would agree that we let ourselves down today.

HOWEVER to the ref ( and officials ) That should not be a factor at all. He should be doing his job, and if he did Rangers would have secured three points today.

As well as the offside goal there are again big decisions that were wrong - why do they always seem to go against Rangers with referees such as Clancy & Robertson Graeme ?

Do you genuinely think that’s coincidental ?
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Agreed Grigo. There are multiple reasons we can point to for dropping points today, including: (1) refereeing; (2) poor defending; (3) not taking our chances; and (4) just not playing at the right tempo. The point is, we shouldn't have to worry about (1). We should be entitled to expect that we get a fair crack at the refereeing whip. But we don't. We get screwed left, right and centre; and it has been going on now for the thick end of ten years. It's a disgrace. I'll happily debate our team's inadequacies today, of which there were several. But we shouldn't constantly have to put up with shameful refereeing. Not only that, shameful refereeing that only our fans seem interested in calling out. Our club sees it but, for whatever reason, are very circumspect in saying much about it. And the mhedia certainly have no interest in raising it, and we all know why that is. The more it goes on, the more I worry about just how many obstacles we will have to overcome to win the league. I honestly can't imagine the refereeing we will face if we are, say, neck and neck with Celtic going into the final 10 games of a league run in.
 
Disco Deejay said:
I understand what you are saying, but when tv evidence shows that Hibs 2nd goal today and the other lots 2nd goal yesterday were clearly offside, then the evidence puts a lot more pressure on them to apply the rules fairly.
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They won't apply the rules fairly because it would benefit us and they can't have that now,can they? If a lineman can't see that offside for their 2nd goal today and the ref can't see that foul on
morelos by porteous at the end they should not be employed to do their job. It's blatant cheating. And I would not trust some nameless clown watching the replays to go against them and overturn decisions that would help us.Cheating is rife within football here and I think is actually encouraged by some high ranking people
 
I am not convinced VAR would make much difference in Scotland. We see the wrong decisions happening every single game. In almost every single game the referee makes a decision that should see them slapped silly by the SFA. It ends up in the media, it ends up in the papers. It ends up all over social media. It makes zero difference to them.

VAR would highlight a lot of issues refs make. However, they'd still chose to ignore and they'd still make those same mistakes or deliberate calls.
 
Then the manager should call it out.

He had the perfect opportunity to put Clancy in his place after the Dundee Utd game and shat it.

Club should have taken them to the cleaners after the game at the piggery. Speaks volumes that we didn’t.
 
Disco Deejay said:
Celtc's 2nd goal yesterday, clearly offside.

Hibs 2nd goal today, clearly offside.

With VAR or competent officials, they get 1 point and we get 3 points.

For those who say that officials don't have an effect on titles, that's a 4 point difference, in what will be a close run season.
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I agree with you totally. Leaving aside bombscare Goldson who had one of his howlers, we should be taking these results out of the hands of bent refs. The number of sitters and easy chances that our front players missed today and are missing every game is quite alarming.
 
WATP said:
Don’t ignore that parts leading up to their opportunities....shambolic defending that is not worthy of a Rangers jersey.....plus numerous easy chances.....today was our players fault....no one else’s!!
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Yeah, the offside goal was the players’ fault mate. The failure to send off Hanlon and Porteous was the players’ fault too.
 
It’s hard to know whether some of the deranged nonsense on here after dropped points is the obsessed on an attempted wind up or from our own who just didn’t bother to watch the game before slamming the Manager/players/ coaching team/board/kit man.
 
Leif Erikson said:
Can you name one team that's ever won the league by pumping every team 3 or 4 nil? Didn't think so. Every champion ever has won hard fought games by the odd goal - a task that's impossible when you're up again incompetent and/or corrupt officials.
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Spot on. I would just say ‘near impossible’ because despite all the cheating I still think we can find a way.
 
If the decisions weren’t for the most part, and it’s very much the most part, going against Rangers it would be a bit easier to swallow.

Out of curiosity, can someone list the last time one of these “points swing” scenarios went against Celtic and for Rangers. I genuinely can’t think of it.
 
ald said:
Agreed Grigo. There are multiple reasons we can point to for dropping points today, including: (1) refereeing; (2) poor defending; (3) not taking our chances; and (4) just not playing at the right tempo. The point is, we shouldn't have to worry about (1). We should be entitled to expect that we get a fair crack at the refereeing whip. But we don't. We get screwed left, right and centre; and it has been going on now for the thick end of ten years. It's a disgrace. I'll happily debate our team's inadequacies today, of which there were several. But we shouldn't constantly have to put up with shameful refereeing. Not only that, shameful refereeing that only our fans seem interested in calling out. Our club sees it but, for whatever reason, are very circumspect in saying much about it. And the mhedia certainly have no interest in raising it, and we all know why that is. The more it goes on, the more I worry about just how many obstacles we will have to overcome to win the league. I honestly can't imagine the refereeing we will face if we are, say, neck and neck with Celtic going into the final 10 games of a league run in.
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Great post Ald, and I think we saw examples last season of what you are referring to.

As soon as we made it a genuine race in December we saw Beaton give a free kick for a foul on the line of the box at Pittodrie & the biggest most blatant cheating performance I’ve seen in 50 years of OF games by Clancy.

As soon as Robertson allowed Wright to go unpunished for the stamp on Kent’s right foot today I thought that was an indicator. Shocking ‘tackle’.

It’s quite soul destroying to be honest & I can’t understand why the club accepts it.
 
I would like VAR but I would want a league body that has made a success of it to be running our VAR whether that be Germany, Russia, Italy, Spain or Lichtenstein.
 
Having seen how VAR has affected football on the English Prem, im not a fan. But, the refrees in Scotland are that woeful, we ruddy need it here!
 
I'm not convinced it would help.

Dermot Gallagher's comments last week lead me to think things may even get worse.
 
Disco Deejay said:
Celtc's 2nd goal yesterday, clearly offside.

Hibs 2nd goal today, clearly offside.

With VAR or competent officials, they get 1 point and we get 3 points.

For those who say that officials don't have an effect on titles, that's a 4 point difference, in what will be a close run season.
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Don’t forget the penalty St.Mirren never got midweek in the 88th minute that enraged Jim Goodwin also
 
Scarlett said:
I hate VAR at times, but we need it. Our referees are either biased or useless, or both.
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If we had VAR it would be the same 'referees' in control of it , they would more than likely f*cking use that against us as well !
:mad:
 
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