Do the board need to dig deep again to fund the rebuild

Barrymoped said:
It all depends on what else is being offered by other clubs.

For example we would have had to go right to the top of our wage bracket to sign Butland, as he had offers to stay as a backup goalie in the EPL.

In addition, if we are trying to sign Bosnian’s, players on a free tend to command higher salaries because agents know we don’t have to pay a transfer fee. They also tout the same players everywhere to dry and drive a harder bargain.

Then of course there’s the fact our scouting isn’t good enough and we are simply signing the wrong players
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Surely we'll look at more than one nationality :))
 
Barrymoped said:
Thing is , you say we downsized massively, in terms of wages we maybe did, but we absolutely had to, it was far to high for our income, and probably still is.

We still spent a fair wedge though, sadly for us Beale picked the players and largely spent it on players not good enough.

This current boards main guys, ie Bisgrove as CEO and Bennet as chairman, to their credit, realised he was out his depth and sacked him, brought in a proven winner in Clement and hired a new DoF in Koppen,

This is the first summer they have had, we will have a far better idea if they were the right appointments in a years time.

However the painful truth is we won’t have the same cash to match our main rivals, not even close.
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Again generally agree Bennett for what it's worth is picking up a mess created by Dougie Park in how we were run.

When he became chairman he changed direction in how the club was run.

We needed one more tranche of investment to build on which ffp would have allowed some more as it was starting the phased in limits tied in with being strong enough to accept the Alfie offer and put it back into the team.

We cut costs took punts on players that managers didn't want in the main ie in beales case wanted but had no clue but needed bodies it was always going to be difficult.

Wilson was brutal but his hands were tied as well

We had a window of opportunity to invest and set them on a cycle we have been on last few years with falling managers but the board were more focused on other things than a winning team.

We have wasted money on players, and spent money on things like neh that could have being delayed.

Selling half car park to me is one of the stupidest things this board will do and will be seen longer term as the good relations they currently have with council will dissappear when we want something in return.

They are at best naive in the workings of Scottish society and football wise the way they treated gio with Beale at sheep game was poor.

Our board needs independent execs to bring new ideas and some football people on it to guide them around that side.
 
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stefanovitch said:
Clement (according to the media) says Butland should not be sold at any price

Butland is a very very good goalkeeper but his career down south didn't really reach any heights so will he want to head back so soon
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If he gets a call up ahead of Ramsdale this summer he will be off I think. One of the English sides will throw money at him.
 
Butland, Sterling, Diomande, Sima, Cortes
That's the standard we have a model that means we don't need moonbeams to make our team better, not only better but physically better and get higher performances for the huge wages we can still responsibly shell out for
 
giogaddi said:
And there is plenty of development left in them too.
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Absolutely, Cortes is still only about 21 is he not?

And Im not sure Diomande is fully fit and knows our system yet (Do we even have one?)

Sima is Sima and if he stays fit will fire in 20 goals next season provided he stays with us.
 
Arkanoid said:
Butland, Sterling, Diomande, Sima, Cortes
That's the standard we have a model that means we don't need moonbeams to make our team better, not only better but physically better and get higher performances for the huge wages we can still responsibly shell out for
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Not sure if you knew but Butland is away for £21m come the summer B-D
 
Barrymoped said:
It all depends on what else is being offered by other clubs.

For example we would have had to go right to the top of our wage bracket to sign Butland, as he had offers to stay as a backup goalie in the EPL.

In addition, if we are trying to sign Bosnian’s, players on a free tend to command higher salaries because agents know we don’t have to pay a transfer fee. They also tout the same players everywhere to dry and drive a harder bargain.

Then of course there’s the fact our scouting isn’t good enough and we are simply signing the wrong players
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That's all accepted however some of the wages you hear quoted for average players seem excessive,

I would only go to that level for a Butland etc as they seem to deliver performances
 
Probably not as there are some sellable assets that will raise funds

Butland £20 (as rumoured)
Dessers £4m
Lammers £3m
Hagi £3m
Yilmaz £4m +

That’s over £30m and the savings of over £100k + a week with those and the out of contract players
 
RTD-BEAR said:
Again generally agree Bennett for what it's worth is picking up a mess created by Dougie Park in how we were run.

When he became chairman he changed direction in how the club was run.

We needed one more tranche of investment to build on which ffp would have allowed some more as it was starting the phased in limits tied in with being strong enough to accept the Alfie offer and put it back into the team.

We cut costs took punts on players that managers didn't want in the main ie in beales case wanted but had no clue but needed bodies it was always going to be difficult.

Wilson was brutal but his hands were tied as well

We had a window of opportunity to invest and set them on a cycle we have been on last few years with falling managers but the board were more focused on other things than a winning team.

We have wasted money on players, and spent money on things like neh that could have being delayed.

Selling half car park to me is one of the stupidest things this board will do and will be seen longer term as the good relations they currently have with council will dissappear when we want something in return.

They are at best naive in the workings of Scottish society and football wise the way they treated gio with Beale at sheep game was poor.

Our board needs independent execs to bring new ideas and some football people on it to guide them around that side.
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I agree the way Beale turned up at the Aberdeen game was poor from the board, but that can’t be levelled at this board, the main players then were Dougie Park, Stewart Robertson and Ross Wilson, none of who are now involved.

This current board will live and die by their appointments of Clement and Koppen, and what they can scrape together to give them as an affordable budget to rebuild our current shambles.
 
It’s not about digging deep, it’s about getting recruitment right. You will always have hits and misses. We never spent much on likes of bassey, aribo, tav, goldson, done well for us, 1st 2 made us good money. Look at the ones we bought in the summer for good money, and haven’t produced enough.
If we get it right, then little outlay could mean good business on and off the park with success and resale value.
 
I will be guilty of repetition here, because I have been beating this drum for several years. Rangers financial difficulties, go back to the Lawrence days, when the club was sold to David Murray for a nominal sum, to enable Lawrence to pump more money into his building business. Murray set out. with a genuine desire to raise the profile of Rangers, and to make us a top European side. Whether it would be reality or pie in the sky, his heart was in the right place and brought us some of the most exciting times that I have ever experienced as a Rangers supporter. however, when his business hit the skids, he had to get rid of Rangers pronto and was less diligent than Lawrence had been when they sold to murray. it was a panic move on his part and certainly diluted, if not destroyed his legacy at the club. That decision led to several more years of squandering waste as the business moved into the hands of all the wrong people who were cherry, picking the bits and pieces and weren’t entirely dedicated to the rebuild of the Rangers football club. Fortunately, Rangers are blessed without a large and loyal support who supported them through thick and thin on the long journey back to the top. Finally, the club, fell into much better hands, with the likes of Douglas Park and other linked business people, who showed a definite desire to get the club back to where it belongs. But that was never going to be an easy task in the short term, and in all honesty, I think that the board whilst their hearts were in the right place, have made some very very serious mistakes along the way. I will always repeat, that after the disaster of 2012 and liquidation, we squandered the best opportunity that we will ever have to build the club from the bottom up. with the right people on board on the development of players and a Strong football department headed up by a director of football. Giving McCoist the job was a bad decision for Rangers and a bad decision for us, since then we have had several managers each who have come with a promise,but one by one they have been sacked or not been given the time to succeed. Clement is the most recent and possibly one of the most promising appointments as manager, but he does not have a magic wand and neither did the candidates before him. Where supporters think the money is going to come from for a complete rebuild yet again I don’t understand. Rangers need to make some long-term decisions, albeit. Many years too late.

With regard to some of our players, I have been a fan of James Tavernier and would definitely support him being placed in the hall of fame and given a memorable send off . However, it is time for him to go, not because of his football performance, but I now believe he has far too much influence on the park and has made him self indispensable. So he should go with everyone’s best wishes and be honoured for his fantastic contribution over the years. Understandably, pressure comes on to any Rangers manager, to beat Celtic But at some point, we are going to have to have the courage to make some big decisions to give this club hope for the future, I will watch with interest.
 
Kinghornloyal said:
It's not their job to fund what you want. It's their job to fund it from money we bring in and use it under FFP constraints. We can only spend a percentage of what we bring in. They themselves cannot just use their own money to make the changes. Surely you do realise that
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So in effect we will morph into Hearts. Which is pretty much what we are now.
 
Barrymoped said:
I agree the way Beale turned up at the Aberdeen game was poor from the board, but that can’t be levelled at this board, the main players then were Dougie Park, Stewart Robertson and Ross Wilson, none of who are now involved.

This current board will live and die by their appointments of Clement and Koppen, and what they can scrape together to give them as an affordable budget to rebuild our current shambles.
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The board hasn't really changed

Robertson/ Wilson were useful patsys in the grand scheme of things.

The board is pretty much the same in the background that's part of problem for me different front face but generally same strings being pulled

I think the board have done wonders at times in getting us away from Ashley and getting club back but they seem to make the same mistakes in the background

There is no easy solution going forward but I do agree Bennett and Bisgrove have to learn and learn quickly
 
Directors have their own business which comes first and only then will they give cash to Rangers.
Signing new players is up to the manager who will ask the board for cash to sign those he wants.
The board will sign managers and some have been poor at best while others have been excellent and hopefully PC will be another who will get us what we want.
I assisted Rangers and players in finanace for long enough and while in the past I still understand the present position which to be fair many do.
It is unlikely there will be new investors but again the board will give cash to PC and hopefully we can sell some players but other than Butland I am not sure if there will be bids for others for the amount we would want but may have to take.
I am off to hospitality for the last time this season and my support does not waver because we did not win the league or beat the scum. I pay a fortune each season to watch us play but that does not mean I will get the results I want but nothing changes my view on the greatest football club I have watched for more than 70 years.
We will win the cup and two out of the three is excellent even if the league was more important.
Keep the faith and support the club which as a club will always be better than the rest.
 
They most definitely do need to dig deep to fund a rebuild if we are to have any chance of halting a run that’s gone well past the farcical stage. Will they do it? I don’t think so, I doubt they’ll have the funds or be willing to part with the necessary funds to do what needs to be done I fear. It’s also debatable whether there’s enough sound judgement in the building to get the majority of the new signings we do bring in being positive, productive player’s we can rely on? For me, there’s at least 16 players needing shipped out imho. It’s a thoroughly depressing and pitiful situation and it’s hard to see when it’s going to stop?
 
DonDraper said:
The point I’m making is if a year ago he could have been signed for nowt and they didn’t bite, do you really expect the same clubs to now pay £21 million?
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£21m is nothing for a premiership side to buy a proven player.

Just look how much Wolves spent on Silva!
 
I'll be interested to see what Clement will do with the constant injuries our squad suffer. He has said the issue is definitely going to be addressed, so it will be interesting to see how it affects the player recruitment.
 
Luca Stroppi said:
They most definitely do need to dig deep to fund a rebuild if we are to have any chance of halting a run that’s gone well past the farcical stage. Will they do it? I don’t think so, I doubt they’ll have the funds or be willing to part with the necessary funds to do what needs to be done I fear. It’s also debatable whether there’s enough sound judgement in the building to get the majority of the new signings we do bring in being positive, productive player’s we can rely on? For me, there’s at least 16 players needing shipped out imho. It’s a thoroughly depressing and pitiful situation and it’s hard to see when it’s going to stop?
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The board can only release funds which we can afford as part of our yearly financials. We cannot say we have £15m for the manager.but hey let's just spend £40m cause the fans are demanding it. So towards the end of the season when the players don't get paid what then. Or we don't have enough money to pay out PAYE etc. How would that work. We have a years expenditure worked out. So what we lnow we can spend me will. We will not hold any money back just cause the board want to keep it. All money we bring in gets spend to run every aspect of the team. Even if we ended up with a new board or say a.new owner the exact same circumstances will be there. Nothing would change. A new owner just doesn't get to use his own money and buy players from his personal account. He also cannot just bank transfer £100m from his personal account to Rangers account. We spend the money we make from a season. That's how FFP works
 
DonDraper said:
The point I’m making is if a year ago he could have been signed for nowt and they didn’t bite, do you really expect the same clubs to now pay £21 million?
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The £21mill figure is nonsense, there’s not a hope in hell we are getting that for him.

However in general we can command a fairly high price, last year he was on a free as he hadn’t played in a couple of years, so we were taking a risk putting him on big bucks and a long contract, but now he has played every game and been our best player, it’s a high fee, but less of a risk as he is proven again.
 
Kinghornloyal said:
We cannot outspend Celtic. They will sell Oriley for millions and invest heavily into their squad again with the £40m CL guarantee. We need a season of luck to beat them. We've had it once recently. That's it.
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A season of luck wasn't required over the last 9 months.

We haven't won the title due to failures across the footballing side of the Club. While Celtic can outspend, there is a cap on the level of player they can realistically bring in.

Our salary spend is mind-numbing for the trophy return.
 
BrooklynBlue said:
A season of luck wasn't required over the last 9 months.

We haven't won the title due to failures across the footballing side of the Club. While Celtic can outspend, there is a cap on the level of player they can realistically bring in.

Our salary spend is mind-numbing for the trophy return.
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We have outspent them for 1 season just. We generally are behind them in salaries. So a suggestion is seriously lower the wages we give. Which means bringing in young players with potential. That will lead to longer without trophies as its a risk we hope could be fruitful. The fans won't ever be happy for the board to try and take a 3 to 5 year plan of young cheap players only and hope we can build them into a winning squad. So we have to bring in players who are rated and valuable but at end of their contracts. We then pay them high wages or they won't come here.
 
Dado’s Napper said:
Spending 15m on Ed House has been an almighty blunder it won’t make the club money back for years if ever.

The board have gotten a lot right but have made some horrible mistakes with our money.
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We couldn't have done anything else with the money that would produce a revenue stream, a hotel perhaps but that would take even longer to turn a profit and in the current climate likely never would.
 
Spudgun said:
£21m is nothing for a premiership side to buy a proven player.

Just look how much Wolves spent on Silva!
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When you put it like that, should Leeds actually go up then Butland would be a bargain at £20m to help keep them up
 
SM™ said:
Wouldn't matter if we had a billion in the bank to play with.

Do you trust that board to appoint the right Head of Recruitment and the right scouts and the right manager?

Current manager may or may not be good enough. Was it a new manager bounce? Or is he a dud? Certainly wouldn't bin him, but we don't know the answer to that one yet.

But given the board's overall record, I wouldn't trust them to pick the winner of a snooker competition involving Ronnie O'Sullivan and thirty-one thalidomide victims.
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Current chairman and CEO didn't appoint the previous manager or head of recruitment.

New manager bounce doesn't last 15+ games either.

But sure, kick everyone.
 
Kinghornloyal said:
We have outspent them for 1 season just. We generally are behind them in salaries. So a suggestion is seriously lower the wages we give. Which means bringing in young players with potential. That will lead to longer without trophies as its a risk we hope could be fruitful. The fans won't ever be happy for the board to try and take a 3 to 5 year plan of young cheap players only and hope we can build them into a winning squad. So we have to bring in players who are rated and valuable but at end of their contracts. We then pay them high wages or they won't come here.
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But we haven't done that.

Instead we've overpaid for players who's careers are on the slide or have at least stalled. We've gambled on getting something from the likes of Davies, Matondo, Dowell, Dessers, Cifuentes, Lammers and Cantwell, for example. How much is going out weekly on those - $150k?

Unfortunately there's others we could add to that list.
 
BrooklynBlue said:
But we haven't done that.

Instead we've overpaid for players who's careers are on the slide or have at least stalled. We've gambled on getting something from the likes of Davies, Matondo, Dowell, Dessers, Cifuentes, Lammers and Cantwell, for example. How much is going out weekly on those - $150k?

Unfortunately there's others we could add to that list.
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Their cost when buying them meant we had to pay them higher wages aswell though. Cantwell and Dowell were relatively cheap. They aren't anywhere near the highest wage brackets. The rest were bought fir multi millions so what the wanted in salary was agreed or we would have got none of them
 
If, and it's a big if, we can get the ones that don't contribute or need to be moved on, then I think we could be in good shape next season.
The likes of Matonda, Dowell, Lawrence and Ridvan who are injured more often than not need to go. Cantwell doesn't contribute enough. Goldson is completely done, but we'll need someone willing to take over his contract
 
strathavenbear said:
If, and it's a big if, we can get the ones that don't contribute or need to be moved on, then I think we could be in good shape next season.
The likes of Matonda, Dowell, Lawrence and Ridvan who are injured more often than not need to go. Cantwell doesn't contribute enough. Goldson is completely done, but we'll need someone willing to take over his contract
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Plus the players need to want to move. We can't force them
 
Going to recent history, losing to Malmö was a massive kick in the Bollocks. It meant we lost out on the CL money. That meant that we didn't spend much if anything in transfers. It ended the interest in Joey Veerman, and we brought in lundstram on a free. I think that made Gerrards mind up to leave as well. Just my opinion.
 
Vinted said:
Going to recent history, losing to Malmö was a massive kick in the Bollocks. It meant we lost out on the CL money. That meant that we didn't spend much if anything in transfers. It ended the interest in Joey Veerman, and we brought in lundstram on a free. I think that made Gerrards mind up to leave as well. Just my opinion.
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Didn't Lundstram play in the loss to Malmö, getting sent off in the process?
 
Spudgun said:
£21m is nothing for a premiership side to buy a proven player.

Just look how much Wolves spent on Silva!
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It’s £21 million more than the fee he was available for 9 months ago, no one jumped at the proven player then so no waty is anyone paying £21 million
 
BN94 said:
Aye clueless. You know what I bloody mean ffs
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No I don't actually. What you said doesn't make sense. However just to help you out. What if the club was sold. We still only bring in what we do so can only spend what we can. A trillionaire owner just doesn't mean he can spend his on money on transfers. So no I don't know what you mean
 
I'm nearly 50.

Do you know how long in my entire lifetime that there's been someone pulling the strings at Ibrox who's done a good job, and could be regarded as being trustworthy?

About 2 years.

David Holmes.

If someone is abused in the home environment for years, and is then cast out into the street, without any support or anywhere to go to, would you expect them to be trusting? Or do you think they'd more likely be shit-scared, frightened of everyone and everything, full of depression and anxiety, and even suicidal? (Can answer that one for you)

Why should I put my trust in anyone who walks into a job up the stairs at Ibrox?

It's up to them win my trust, because based on the past half century, the default expectation is that they'll be needing chased.
 
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