Injuries and squad a rubbish excuse

strider said:
I reckon Cortes would have started most matches and Silva would have been a rotation option central with Dessers. We never played Silva out wide until the injuries piled up.

He only missed out on the Euro squad due to limitations on the number of changes allowed.
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Could well have been the case, he did look decent in the few games but I do think people are overplaying his impact. He had played 40 minutes of first team football for Lens before coming to us and then started 3 games before a serious injury. He is someone with very little game time to be able to judge what sort of impact his injury had on the title race.
 
Ubik said:
how do you know Danilo would be a better option than Dessers?
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It’s not that he’d be a better option it’s the fact he’d still be an option

Look at them, they brought in Idah in Jan and roared him with Kyogo, we’ve not had that luxury with forward players
 
This is the worst squad we've had since 2017.

A squad that is utterly terrified of Celtic and scarred with almost a decade of failure against them. We are slow, lethargic, old and completely incapable of a pressing game. The midfield cannot run, so we have to bypass them and play a direct game and focus on the wingers, however all our wingers got injured and now we've got "hope we beat the other teams somehow" approach.

The injuries have meant we have had to play the only people capable of playing. Even so, we tried rotating to prevent possible further injuries, brought in Barisic against Killie and he almost singlehandedly threw the game. Brought in Raskin against Motherwell and (alongside Goldson) did throw the game. We then tried not rotating and then the likes of Goldson, Tavernier and Lundstram have essentially thrown the league with their performances in the Motherwell, Ross County and Dundee games.

Clement has made serious mistakes in games, but I don't think there is anything else he really could do with the absolute shambles left to him, but the manner of the collapse in the last month and the shambolic level of performances from the usual suspects has been worrying.
 
Angrybluebear said:
Danilo done nothing to suggest he would be first choice. In the league he had a conversion rate of 11% and a goal every 133 minutes. Dessers is 16% and every 142minutes.

Cortes has started 3 matches for us.

We have a first team squad of over thirty players.
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You know a goal every 133 mins is 1 every 1.5 games, right?

At that rate, he'd be on course for 25 league goals in a season and it's not good enough to be first choice?
 
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I don't agree with it but I can just about understand not using injuries as an excuse.

If you don't want to use the overall quality of the squad as an excuse then you are essentially saying we should just beat them every single time, regardless of circumstance.

A terrible, terrible argument.
 
IbroxMainStand said:
Clement picked Silva for the Euro squad over Cortes so he must rate him as the better player. Dessers suits the tactics we tried yesterday much more than Danilo so if we played the same system I think its likely he would still have started.

It would have been a much stronger bench but the game was ultimately lost in midfield again. Having options on the wing or at striker wouldn't have made much difference to the result for me. Dessers can't really be faulted for yesterday, he got no service and scored with the only chance he had.
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dessers part the only fault for me yesterday was him. And dio I think both went for ball then stopped it went between them about 3 passes later the og is scored

In this case he not that type of player to try hold up the ball that's the problem we have with him

But yesterday he ran didn't get any balls even worth the running he did so can't fault him yesterday thankless task after going to 10 men
 
arnietac1 said:
Which fans? Or did you just make that up and hoped it would become fact.
And if so then why?

Anyway, Danilo 6 goals in 10 games and he was improving before he was injured but that is just a fact mate.
No great shake though.
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There's a very strange breed of 'fan' on here who is desperate to hate every one of our players, coaching staff, and board.

I'd go as far as saying this site might actually be absolutely infested by scum fans seeking to heap pressure on our players from the more easily swayed of our support.
 
As much as I have questioned Clements tactics in old firm games it’s stupidity to say injuries haven’t played a major part. We had no pace or power up front now large parts of every old firm game. You won’t get far without that in these games.
 
Our injury situation is beyond a joke and there's no way it can go on if we want to be successful. Whatever is happening with our prep or recovery it needs to change because you don't win trophies and titles with two thirds of the squad constantly in and out of the treatment room. No club on the planet could be successful with our injury situation - it's chronically bad.
 
Maestro72 said:
Don’t disagree on a one game head to head basis but on the broader point that injuries have been a major contributor to our title loss, that excuse doesn’t wash.

Every team contends with injuries, including them. Spurs, Chelsea and Man United fans in particular have done nothing but bring up injuries for their poor seasons all year - it’s not the root of any of these clubs issues.
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Injuries to players especially on form can have a drastic effect in any team and in particularly ours this season. Sima on form scores goals injured comes back not reaching same level injured again, Lawrence looking good last year injured not reached same level, Cantwell causing probs booted up and down especially against Aberdung gets injured takes time to get that level of threat back, Matondo coming on to a game injured, Cortez our list goes on and on who else has a an injury list like us in OUR league?

Injuries can be a main part in why a league can be won or lost! Even though there are other contributory reasons so yes Maestro it does wash to a bigger extent than not!

Spurs, Chelsea and Man Utd don't play up here ffs they don't have to put up with the hammer throwers and shit scared not all but some match officials there are bias and poor ones too!

They all contribute to a season along with dips in form unfortunately we still don't have that quality that can last the season!

The amount of clumsy and or calamity goals we give away shooting ourselves in the foot then the amount of chances and shots in games that we could have and should have been out of sight where match officials influence poor or otherwise would be out of their hands!
 
Blueranger1872 said:
They do but we’ve also played them when they’ve had Hatate, McGregor, CCV out and still couldn’t get the job done
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All out at the same time though? I'm sure they finished one game vs us with Ralston Welsh Scales and Bernebai on the pitch but what if they had to start with that then delve even deeper into their squad to replace them off the bench as the game went on? Likewise if they started with a front 3 of Palma, Idah, Khun but didn't have Maeda, Furahashi or Forrest available to bring on from the bench and only had Kwan and a kid from their B team left or playing others out of position? The point being is that for big chunks of our season we've been starting matches with 4 or 5 or more of our 2nd choice players almost every game and bringing players even further down the pecking order on when chasing games and expecting positive outcomes. It's just not realistic or attainable.
 
rayrangers said:
I don’t want the manager sacked but there are starting to be some of the same comparisons with GVB and Beale
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In Gerrard's first two seasons we heard plenty of the same things too - not enough quality, over-reliant on Morelos, boring football style, caught out with the same type of goal too often, sh*t at set pieces. All of it was proclaimed as fact when we weren't winning trophies.
 
I think a lot of the posts are missing the point a bit. Why start Lawrence in centre mid at Parkhead? That was never going to work. If he’d started Sterling in there we’d have had a very solid base in centre mid. You could argue the same for Raskin. Lawrence was essentially a spare man we couldn’t afford.
 
Fergie90 said:
Celtic don't play the same way or treat the games against Kilmarnock or Hearts the same as an Old Firm so the comparison doesn't work.

Our game is a derby filled with hatred and the other games are run of the mill games.
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Aberdeen vs US and versus the rest is another prime example..
 
Our injury list is always worse than most. It's clearly more than luck & it must be addressed. Couple that with poor recruitment then we're always 2 injuries away from a Scott Wright appearance.

We need strength in depth & we have to be avoiding guys with patchy injury records.
 
The injuries are part of the problem, but it can’t be ignored that we might have a manager who’s either too arrogant or simply not skilled enough to formulate an approach to suit the players available.

Those two things combined are a concern for me.
 
Both can be true.

We were clearly hindered by injuries, and we were clearly hindered by a lack of options due to our poor recruitments.

However, we were also hindered by the managers selection and tactics and failure to address the issues that we have had in midfield in the previous 2 games.

I don't think injuries and squad can be used as an excuse, but they can be used as a contributing factor.
 
I wonder if the OP has been to an old firm game, prior to lockdown or in a cup final. Its a different beast entirely. Players can crumble in those arenas or become gods. In years gone by we have had players who relished it, loved the battle, the atmosphere and those who did, pulled the others through. Celtic have similar players now. We, well we have the crumblers.

My point is the coach cannot make these boys men. He cannot tackle for them, follow their man for them. System wise, he has earned rave reviews for 'simplifying things' . He had to , as the current crop do not have the capacity to retain more. We tweaked on saturday and Lawerence was clearly told to stay on McGregor. First goal, McGregor cut back, Lawerence 5 yards off. So even a simple tweak to system, these players cannot cope with.
 
We should still be able to put a team that is capable of beating Dundee tonight.
Properly coached and motivated to do their upmost our players should beat Dundee.
 
Davie Weir said:
Danilo also missed a lot of chances when he played. Of course having options would make a massive difference though.
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Danilo, in my opinion and it’s only an opinion, is a more expensive option than Nacho Novo.

However, given Nacho’s record at Rangers, Danilo will have a bit to do to get those numbers
 
brain said:
I think a lot of the posts are missing the point a bit. Why start Lawrence in centre mid at Parkhead? That was never going to work. If he’d started Sterling in there we’d have had a very solid base in centre mid. You could argue the same for Raskin. Lawrence was essentially a spare man we couldn’t afford.
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Fully agree. Within 2 minutes Walter would have altered the midfield to stop McGregor strolling around. There is not a Rangers supporters who attends game WHO would not have started Sterling in midfield to combat their midfield
 
Would Brendan Rodgers managing this Rangers sqyad with these injuries with these referees to the title vs Phil in charge of Celtic ? No chance - would be a 20 point gap.
 
rex555 said:
Kilmarnock have beat them twice this season. Hearts have beat them home and away without conceding. Clement has had injuries to contend with and yes, the players he inherited need improved upon, but if you look at the three games he's had against them, he had plenty of match fit players available to choose from to setup a starting team stronger than the Hearts and Killie starting XIs that had success. Anyone saying otherwise is sticking to the narrative that Beale left after seven games and left Clement with a Sunday league squad incapable of beating Celtic. One poster said, "walking football team". Rubbish.

Clement can be forgiven for setting us up wrong in the December 2-1 game as it was his first, but the next two is unforgivable. With the same squad Beale left him with, we performed well in Europe and won a cup. I know all fans are just armchair managers (me included), but it was obvious we keep losing the game in midfield against them. 'Injuries and a team that's not his' is a rotten excuse (tho refereeing calls isn't).

Clement has had 40 odd games in charge of the squad in all competitions. No new manager should get a pass from criticism and blame for not winning a single old firm because they haven't had a summer transfer window and the chance to replace a full team with his own. Do you think he interviewed saying, "don't judge me on the rubbish squad that's here, I'll need my own players, especially to beat Celtic"? (Fine, you're hired).

Someone started a thread asking if the SC Final should be a "free hit"? Crazy. He shouldn't be replaced if he loses the final, but he should be tore into if he sets us up wrong again and we lose. Celtic aren't Barcelona. Their starting XI is marginally better at full strength compared to ours currently with injuries... but other teams found a way to beat that same Celtic team with players no better than our weakest lineup. Beale had three defeats in seven before he left, so yeah, Clement started with a disadvantage, but they've dropped points too and were always going to. He must win the Scottish cup. Three defeats is indefensible.
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I think we've got a mentality issue winners find a way to win unfortunately losers find a way to lose and are happy looking at any excuse that hides their own shortfalls.
 
If your 2 first choice wingers in Cortes and Sima are missing nothing against Dessers.As he scored and he has at big times in big games but he’s had to do that on his own.But a fit Danilo also helps aswell
 
Thomas Milton said:
Would Brendan Rodgers managing this Rangers sqyad with these injuries with these referees to the title vs Phil in charge of Celtic ? No chance - would be a 20 point gap.
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comparison from saturday would be no:

Vickers (Goldson)
Scales (Balogun)
Taylor only fit for bench (Ridvan)
Kyogo (Danilo)
Maeda (Sima)
Forrest (Cortes)
McGregor (Jack)
Palma (Matondo)

and then Nawrocki comes off at half time to move and non-CB to CB
 
Everybody knows and has known for the last 2 years that Rangers squad is unfit for purpose, both figuratively and literally.

However until the Summer comes was never going to be alterable and Clement himself said many times he would not use it as an excuse because hes a problem solver and not a guy to hide behind excuses.

Until this past week or so when all we hear about are injuries and players not available.

I saw no risks or curve balls thrown into the recent games to try and solve problems, only the same ideas producing ever poorer displays.

Hes done himself no favours recently and the suggestion that there was attempts to resign the likes of Lundstrum or Balogun, when they are part of the very problem around the team and squad, is a real concern.

I was looking forward to the Summer changes but not so much now.
 
rex555 said:
Kilmarnock have beat them twice this season. Hearts have beat them home and away without conceding. Clement has had injuries to contend with and yes, the players he inherited need improved upon, but if you look at the three games he's had against them, he had plenty of match fit players available to choose from to setup a starting team stronger than the Hearts and Killie starting XIs that had success. Anyone saying otherwise is sticking to the narrative that Beale left after seven games and left Clement with a Sunday league squad incapable of beating Celtic. One poster said, "walking football team". Rubbish.

Clement can be forgiven for setting us up wrong in the December 2-1 game as it was his first, but the next two is unforgivable. With the same squad Beale left him with, we performed well in Europe and won a cup. I know all fans are just armchair managers (me included), but it was obvious we keep losing the game in midfield against them. 'Injuries and a team that's not his' is a rotten excuse (tho refereeing calls isn't).

Clement has had 40 odd games in charge of the squad in all competitions. No new manager should get a pass from criticism and blame for not winning a single old firm because they haven't had a summer transfer window and the chance to replace a full team with his own. Do you think he interviewed saying, "don't judge me on the rubbish squad that's here, I'll need my own players, especially to beat Celtic"? (Fine, you're hired).

Someone started a thread asking if the SC Final should be a "free hit"? Crazy. He shouldn't be replaced if he loses the final, but he should be tore into if he sets us up wrong again and we lose. Celtic aren't Barcelona. Their starting XI is marginally better at full strength compared to ours currently with injuries... but other teams found a way to beat that same Celtic team with players no better than our weakest lineup. Beale had three defeats in seven before he left, so yeah, Clement started with a disadvantage, but they've dropped points too and were always going to. He must win the Scottish cup. Three defeats is indefensible.
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Also doesn’t negate the fact we recently dropped points at Motherwell, Ross County & Dundee.
 
IbroxMainStand said:
We are a club when the longer you are out injured the better a player you become in eyes of the fans. Out of the injured players its likely only Sima and Goldson would have started had everyone been available.
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Cortes wouldn't have started ahead of Silva or Sterling? Or ahead of Wright in the last OF?

Danilo, Yilmaz and Balogun would also all have started if available. That's half a team.

Celtic missed Carter Vickers and Hatate for an extended spell and look at their results.

Replacing players with inferior players = an inferior team. It really is that simple.
 
It’s all part of the same issue, we don’t recruit the right players or the right coaching/medical staff so we end up with lots of injuries which hinder us massively on the pitch
 
brain said:
I think a lot of the posts are missing the point a bit. Why start Lawrence in centre mid at Parkhead? That was never going to work. If he’d started Sterling in there we’d have had a very solid base in centre mid. You could argue the same for Raskin. Lawrence was essentially a spare man we couldn’t afford.
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That is a big worry for me why Clement played him in there ahead of Sterling or Raskin. Cantwell even.
 
SaulBearenson said:
You know a goal every 133 mins is 1 every 1.5 games, right?

At that rate, he'd be on course for 25 league goals in a season and it's not good enough to be first choice?
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Danilo has hardly played so his sample size is most definitely skewed. It was more his conversion rate is so low, you may not know but Matondo has a goal every 124 minutes

so you do know that is even better than 1 every 1.5 games, right ?

But one neither is playing enough games to score 57 or 25 goals a season depending on your calculations, yeah.
 
On reflection, injuries plus bent officials are a real handicap, the club neednto address both to give any manager a fighting chance
 
brain said:
I think a lot of the posts are missing the point a bit. Why start Lawrence in centre mid at Parkhead? That was never going to work. If he’d started Sterling in there we’d have had a very solid base in centre mid. You could argue the same for Raskin. Lawrence was essentially a spare man we couldn’t afford.
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devils advocate:

he wanted Sterlings pace and power to go at their left side - given the options are a wildly off form McCausland & and a never on form Wright, i can let that one go

he put Lawrence in the middle for (perceived) more dig than Cantwell but (supposed) ability to get forward - clearly a mistake, he is done in any kind of fitness sense

Raskin clearly hasn't been fancied - clearly a mistake given the cliff that the 50/50 chance of a Good Lundstram's form has falled off - he's done as well IMO
 
Thewandofpedro said:
Kilmarnock have a balanced squad with an identity and a clear way of playing as set out by their manager.

Do we have that?
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Absolutely not. We seem to have a very stubborn man why can’t see he’s wrong.
Lundstram will start the cup final. Wait and see.
 
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