Premier League clubs to vote on proposal to scrap VAR from next season.

[scottishpoet]

It was 2019/20.

History of VAR

www.premierleague.com

The League and Professional Game Match Officials Limited (PGMOL), which officiates Premier League matches, undertook extensive testing during the 2018/19 season in live matches, while the League also observed VAR in action in FA Cup and EFL Cup ties.

It was being used in 2018 19, but if 5 years instead of 6 makes it new then i apologise

 

[Wazza]

The League and Professional Game Match Officials Limited (PGMOL), which officiates Premier League matches, undertook extensive testing during the 2018/19 season in live matches, while the League also observed VAR in action in FA Cup and EFL Cup ties.

It was being used in 2018 19, but if 5 years instead of 6 makes it new then i apologise

I remember it as I went to a Spanish La Liga match on the first weekend it was used in August 2018, they had a factsheet on each seat. We weren’t ready to use it in England at that point.



In November 2018, the Premier League clubs voted unanimously to introduce VAR in season 2019/20, pending testing.

The League and Professional Game Match Officials Limited (PGMOL), which officiates Premier League matches, undertook extensive testing during the 2018/19 season in live matches, while the League also observed VAR in action in FA Cup and EFL Cup ties.

The testing was deemed a success, confirming the introduction of VAR for 2019/20.

 

[The DazzleGer]

Every idiot in every league complains about it.

Clearly VAR gets a higher percentage of decisions correct. Only people of low intelligence would advocate going back to a system that allows more mistakes.

Getting a worldie of a goal chopped of coz a player hasnt cut his nasal hair and thereby denying fans who have spent good money to experience the spontaneous joy that a goal has brought them since the game began is utter madness.
It was meant to help with the clear and obvious not to have every frame examined until something is found to chop of a goal.

Bin it .

 

[IbroxMainStand]

I think there’s not a snowballs chance in hell of it being scrapped

And no, they absolutely do not make as many bad decisions as on field refs who have one view, not even close. They get far more right than they get wrong.

They get most right but its at a cost were a good percentage of match going fans, tv viewers and players don't like it. Is it worth the impact so a few more decisions are correct.

 

[Robert Marshall]

Hmm it’s a hard one I have to say, it should be scrapped up here whilst half the teams can’t afford it and the actual angles of offside are impossible to draw their squiggly lines.

Can see it happening in both leagues now

Not a chance will it be cancelled

 

[giogaddi]

Getting a worldie of a goal chopped of coz a player hasnt cut his nasal hair and thereby denying fans who have spent good money to experience the spontaneous joy that a goal has brought them since the game began is utter madness.
It was meant to help with the clear and obvious not to have every frame examined until something is found to chop of a goal.

Bin it .

And what about people who've paid to watch their team lose a cup final to a goal where 3 players were offside?

 

[IbroxMainStand]

The ref can miss it but how can they watch it on VAR and miss it? It’s the most blatant of blatant penalties.

I agree its a pen but people make errors all the time. They are looking at it over multiple monitors under massive pressure from the likes of Sky to make a decision instantly.

The recording of the offside mistake during the Liverpool Spurs game earlier in the season gives an insight how they are making the calls and how quick its decided.

 

[Wazza]

I agree its a pen but people make errors all the time. They are looking at it over multiple monitors under massive pressure from the likes of Sky to make a decision instantly.

The recording of the offside mistake during the Liverpool Spurs game earlier in the season gives an insight how they are making the calls and how quick its decided.

Often seems very chaotic to me, I think many would struggle.

 

[JC85]

im sure they mentioned something like this on motd a few weeks ago, i think it would work

Yeah Lineker suggested it. Gordon Smith said it a while ago as well. I don't really see a downside to it.

 

[Tpol_rfc]

Getting a worldie of a goal chopped of coz a player hasnt cut his nasal hair and thereby denying fans who have spent good money to experience the spontaneous joy that a goal has brought them since the game began is utter madness.
It was meant to help with the clear and obvious not to have every frame examined until something is found to chop of a goal.

Bin it .

What about getting a worldie chopped off by a linesman putting up a flag wrongly?

That's fine?

 

[TheDerryend]

And what about people who've paid to watch their team lose a cup final to a goal where 3 players were offside?

Same as the fans who paid to watch an equaliser chopped off, because of something that happened up the other end of the pitch.

It's done nothing to improve the game. We were eased into this with being told it would be used only for clear and obvious. That was a downright lie and has never been used.

 

[TheDerryend]

What about getting a worldie chopped off by a linesman putting up a flag wrongly?

That's fine?

So at the end if the day, it makes no difference then. Same things happening that have always happened.

It's not improved football one bit. We just have more people seeing things differently as it's always been.

 

[giogaddi]

Same as the fans who paid to watch an equaliser chopped off, because of something that happened up the other end of the pitch.

It's done nothing to improve the game. We were eased into this with being told it would be used only for clear and obvious. That was a downright lie and has never been used.

Because of a foul.

 

[TheDerryend]

Because of a foul.

Because var went hunting for an excuse to chop of a goal. Nobody knew anything about the foul.

 

[giogaddi]

Because var went hunting for an excuse to chop of a goal. Nobody knew anything about the foul.

Was it a foul?

 

[RangersUK]

Resolution formally submitted by Wolves to abolish system + will be on agenda at June 6 AGM. Any rule change needs 2/3s majority (14 of 20 members) to pass


OFFICIAL: letter sent to the Premier League regarding scrapping VAR.

"Wolves have formally submitted a resolution to the Premier League to trigger a vote at the league's AGM in June, on the removal of VAR from the start of the 2024/25 season.

The introduction of VAR in 2019/20 was a decision made in good faith and with the best interests of football and the Premier League at its heart. However, it has led to numerous unintended negative consequences that are damaging the relationship between fans and football, and undermining the value of the Premier League brand, which include:

• Impact on goal celebrations and the spontaneous passion that makes football special.

• Frustration and confusion inside stadiums due to lengthy VAR checks and poor communication.

•A more hostile atmosphere with protests, booing of the Premier League anthem and chants against VAR.

• Overreach of VAR's original purpose to correct clear and obvious mistakes, now overanalysing subjective decisions and compromising the game's fluidity and integrity.

• Diminished accountability of on-field officials, due to safety net of VAR, leading to an erosion of authority on the pitch.

• Continued errors despite VAR, with supporters unable to accept human error after multiple views and replays, damaging confidence in officiating standards.

• Disruption of the Premier League's fast pace with lengthy VAR checks and more added time, causing matches to run excessively long.

• Constant discourse about VAR decisions often overshadowing the match itself, and tarnishing the reputation of the league.

• Erosion of trust and reputation, with VAR fuelling completely nonsensical allegations of corruption.

The decision to table the resolution has come after careful consideration and with the utmost respect for the Premier League, PGMOL and our fellow competitors.

There is no blame to be placed - we are all just looking for the best possible outcome for football - and all stakeholders have been working hard to try and make the introduction of additional technology a success.

However, after five seasons of VAR in the Premier League it is time for a constructive and critical debate on its future.

Our position is that the price we are paying for a small increase in accuracy is at odds with the spirit of our game, and as a result we should remove it from the 2024/25 season onwards."

VAR is a great thing and the only thing we need to change, is allowing fans to hear what is going on, just like Rugby.

 

[kclarkhall]

Isn't scrapping it just a cop out to prevent them doing some work on fixing it?

VAR is required, it just needs improved and some laws of the game clarified or tweaked. Also needs competent referees to operate it, which is why Scotland in particular will hope this goes through, so they can follow suit.

 

[55degreesnorth]

Resolution formally submitted by Wolves to abolish system + will be on agenda at June 6 AGM. Any rule change needs 2/3s majority (14 of 20 members) to pass


OFFICIAL: letter sent to the Premier League regarding scrapping VAR.

"Wolves have formally submitted a resolution to the Premier League to trigger a vote at the league's AGM in June, on the removal of VAR from the start of the 2024/25 season.

The introduction of VAR in 2019/20 was a decision made in good faith and with the best interests of football and the Premier League at its heart. However, it has led to numerous unintended negative consequences that are damaging the relationship between fans and football, and undermining the value of the Premier League brand, which include:

• Impact on goal celebrations and the spontaneous passion that makes football special.

• Frustration and confusion inside stadiums due to lengthy VAR checks and poor communication.

•A more hostile atmosphere with protests, booing of the Premier League anthem and chants against VAR.

• Overreach of VAR's original purpose to correct clear and obvious mistakes, now overanalysing subjective decisions and compromising the game's fluidity and integrity.

• Diminished accountability of on-field officials, due to safety net of VAR, leading to an erosion of authority on the pitch.

• Continued errors despite VAR, with supporters unable to accept human error after multiple views and replays, damaging confidence in officiating standards.

• Disruption of the Premier League's fast pace with lengthy VAR checks and more added time, causing matches to run excessively long.

• Constant discourse about VAR decisions often overshadowing the match itself, and tarnishing the reputation of the league.

• Erosion of trust and reputation, with VAR fuelling completely nonsensical allegations of corruption.

The decision to table the resolution has come after careful consideration and with the utmost respect for the Premier League, PGMOL and our fellow competitors.

There is no blame to be placed - we are all just looking for the best possible outcome for football - and all stakeholders have been working hard to try and make the introduction of additional technology a success.

However, after five seasons of VAR in the Premier League it is time for a constructive and critical debate on its future.

Our position is that the price we are paying for a small increase in accuracy is at odds with the spirit of our game, and as a result we should remove it from the 2024/25 season onwards."

If VAR wasn't so poorly administered/managed it wouldn't be an issue.

 

[Mustang mad]

Getting a worldie of a goal chopped of coz a player hasnt cut his nasal hair and thereby denying fans who have spent good money to experience the spontaneous joy that a goal has brought them since the game began is utter madness.
It was meant to help with the clear and obvious not to have every frame examined until something is found to chop of a goal.

Bin it .

Orrrrrr, make it work the way it should.

 

[TheDerryend]

Was it a foul?

Don't know, never watched it again, too busy ranting and raving at the goal being ruled out. Let's just say it wasn't clear and obvious and their players were all back in defence when we scored.

 

[Robert1872]

Say it does get voted against. Imagine the uproar when wrong decisions are made and not corrected.

In a weird way i think getting the winner that should have been ruled offside was all part of the football i liked, yes, you do get some against you too but there was nothing funnier than seeing them foaming at the mouth on a Monday morning about it. It’s just part of the game.

 

[Rickety Cricket]

No was meaning the Dessers equaliser in the recent 3-3, I know people can argue its the right decision pulling it back for the Lawrence foul but with no VAR its not even a talking point. That was probably the best reaction to a goal at Ibrox since the Seville run and to have that taken away by VAR changed my mind over it completely.

Roofe's goal in the first game is another we would have had without VAR this year. Its impossible to know as you can't tell how a game will end up without the goals being ruled out but for me we would have won at least one of the Ibrox old firms with no VAR this year.

Yeah, agreed completely.

 

[Baxterno6]

We would have benefited in the Scum games if there had been no VAR.

And also wouldn't have got 14 pens if not for var just think how many points we would have lost .

 

[giogaddi]

Don't know, never watched it again, too busy ranting and raving at the goal being ruled out. Let's just say it wasn't clear and obvious and their players were all back in defence when we scored.

It was a foul mate. I'm not saying VAR is perfect - I mean how can it be with the standard of ref we have in Scotland? But it's so much better than the alternative. Going back to the days of Clancy et al having one look and the final say at something and Celtic supporting linesman chucking their flag up (or keeping it down for them) shouldn't be accepted by Rangers.

 

[Tpol_rfc]

So at the end if the day, it makes no difference then. Same things happening that have always happened.

It's not improved football one bit. We just have more people seeing things differently as it's always been.

How does it make no difference?

One scenario a decision is proven to be absolutely wrong.

Another scenario a decision is proven to be correct but only just.

Clearly you and others think goals that are a wee bit offside should stand. I on the other hand don't.

 

[TheDerryend]

How does it make no difference?

One scenario a decision is proven to be absolutely wrong.

Another scenario a decision is proven to be correct but only just.

Clearly you and others think goals that are a wee bit offside should stand. I on the other hand don't.

Good for you, I think the offside rule needs changed then.

 

[Macdonsj]

We would have benefited in the Scum games if there had been no VAR.

last one at Ibrox - the game changing penalty is not given keeping it 0-2

 

[Tpol_rfc]

Good for you, I think the offside rule needs changed then.

I'm not following you at all mate. So you think the rule should be changed to allow shots that go in the net from an offside player to be a goal?

Run me through your workings here please.

 

[TheDerryend]

How does it make no difference?

One scenario a decision is proven to be absolutely wrong.

Another scenario a decision is proven to be correct but only just.

Clearly you and others think goals that are a wee bit offside should stand. I on the other hand don't.

Listen mate, do yourself a favour and stop acting the James Hunt, with your laughing emoji's and calling everybody idiots that don't see things as you do.

 

[Tpol_rfc]

Listen mate, do yourself a favour and stop acting the James Hunt, with your laughing emoji's and calling everybody idiots that don't see things as you do.

You've explained that well. I get why you think offside goals should count.

 

[joseph]

Because var went hunting for an excuse to chop of a goal. Nobody knew anything about the foul.

Var didn’t go looking for a foul- the VAR operator did and this is the problem

Poorly trained operators who can intervene without actually understanding the guidelines on VAR interventions - they simply go looking for issues that is not within their jurisdiction, this coupled with a poor understanding of the actual rules regarding VAR use - many referees on VAR duty are basically re-refereeing the game- with the onfield referees happily letting VAR control virtually all on-field activity in order to protect the onfield referee from taking actual responsibility for decisions
Var should only be used when a clear and obvious error is made by the referee- given the number of times VAR intervenes during a game the referees are being incompetent by allowing VAR overall control to re-referee a game for any and every infringement
The you have VAR not intervening due to the club the VAR operator supports taking precedent over his ability to be impartial

VAR operators should be independent of Scottish FA referees and fully trained in the use of VAR and the rules on when they can and cannot intervene

 

[TheDerryend]

Clear daylight between the striker and defender. Not complicated.

 

[EddiBrock]

Resolution formally submitted by Wolves to abolish system + will be on agenda at June 6 AGM. Any rule change needs 2/3s majority (14 of 20 members) to pass


OFFICIAL: letter sent to the Premier League regarding scrapping VAR.

"Wolves have formally submitted a resolution to the Premier League to trigger a vote at the league's AGM in June, on the removal of VAR from the start of the 2024/25 season.

The introduction of VAR in 2019/20 was a decision made in good faith and with the best interests of football and the Premier League at its heart. However, it has led to numerous unintended negative consequences that are damaging the relationship between fans and football, and undermining the value of the Premier League brand, which include:

• Impact on goal celebrations and the spontaneous passion that makes football special.

• Frustration and confusion inside stadiums due to lengthy VAR checks and poor communication.

•A more hostile atmosphere with protests, booing of the Premier League anthem and chants against VAR.

• Overreach of VAR's original purpose to correct clear and obvious mistakes, now overanalysing subjective decisions and compromising the game's fluidity and integrity.

• Diminished accountability of on-field officials, due to safety net of VAR, leading to an erosion of authority on the pitch.

• Continued errors despite VAR, with supporters unable to accept human error after multiple views and replays, damaging confidence in officiating standards.

• Disruption of the Premier League's fast pace with lengthy VAR checks and more added time, causing matches to run excessively long.

• Constant discourse about VAR decisions often overshadowing the match itself, and tarnishing the reputation of the league.

• Erosion of trust and reputation, with VAR fuelling completely nonsensical allegations of corruption.

The decision to table the resolution has come after careful consideration and with the utmost respect for the Premier League, PGMOL and our fellow competitors.

There is no blame to be placed - we are all just looking for the best possible outcome for football - and all stakeholders have been working hard to try and make the introduction of additional technology a success.

However, after five seasons of VAR in the Premier League it is time for a constructive and critical debate on its future.

Our position is that the price we are paying for a small increase in accuracy is at odds with the spirit of our game, and as a result we should remove it from the 2024/25 season onwards."

We want more incorrect decisions, more wrong results and more injustice please

Will make timmy and their appeasers happy up here as they can now have a stronger argument to push for the same

How sad

The fact we got close to winning the title was only possible with VAR.

Without VAR we'd have, wrongly, been an extra 10 points or so behind. Yes, a few things went against us. A lot more went for. E.g. about 80% of our penalties awarded

 

[EddiBrock]

So it’s not a good thing then seeing as every league complains about it

Referees are a bad thing. Every league complains about them. Let's just abolish referees too.

We can have mob games like the 1700s or whatever

 

[EddiBrock]

VAR in it's current form is terrible, far too many wrong decisions, takes too long to come to the wrong decision.

Brilliant, can just imagine uproar when first player who is 2 yards offside doesn't get given. Astounds me how many people seem to have forgotten how bad refereeing was pre-VAR.

Why is it that the bar for VAR being accepted is 100% accurate, yet nowhere near that high for any other element of the game?

Even post match charges and appeals are not 100%.

But people only have an issue with VAR.

Before VAR say 80% (for example) of big decisions were correct and now 95% are. Why would you be against this? Astounds me.

"We want perfection or a shit show. We absolutely cannot tolerate very, very good". Makes no sense as an argument to me. Genuinely think it comes from those who aren't smart enough to stop and think for themselves

 

[Davie Weir Loyal]

Can't go back now. It will improve over time

 

[Tpol_rfc]

Why is the bar for VAR being accepted is 100% accurate but nowhere near that high for any other element of the game?

Even post match charges and appeals are not 100%.

But people only have issue with VAR.

Before VAR say 80% (for example) of big decisions were correct and now 95% are. Why would you be against this? Astound me.

"We won't perfection or a shit show. We absolutely cannot tolerate very, very good". Makes no sense as an argument to me. Genuinely think it's comes from those who aren't smart enough to stop and think for themselves

Absolutely mate. Clearly it needs and will improve. Also clearly the amount of correct decisions are higher than without VAR.

When you've got folk complaining that VAR is ruining football because goals that are only slightly offside do not count it becomes a waste of time trying to argue with them.

 

[Slide Away]

VAR is a good thing but they need to be more consistent in its application.

Few rules need tidied up as well. Offsides, hand ball and the attacking phase thing.

 

[bkerr72]

Using fans not accepting human error after review as a reason isn't going to pass. Fans that have decisions go against them are never going to agree.

A huge part of the problem is pundits who used to play give their opinion on what they think because they played the game instead of the actual rule book. Miller last weekend talking a load of crap about Lundstram red, the red for Killie guy because it was harsh etc. Communication for fans needs to improve once the decision is made let the ref speak to crowd to explain the decision.

Blaming VAR for handball when it's the rule itself etc it becomes tedious.

 

[kenbo]

Keep VAR, mic up the refs like rugby, let the fans see and hear the VAR examinations and have referees allowed to give interviews after games to explain their decisions.
We've all heard about transparency and clarification before, theres the answer.
Granted they're not going to get every decision correct but if we can see and hear the workings then most reasonable people should be able to accept honest mistakes.

 

[Bluenose1979]

Can't go back now. It will improve over time

This is exactly it. It’ll evolve. Pressure placed will serve to ensure the application and tech is developed to work better.

It’s not going away but it is getting rightly challenged to be better.

Of course, we’re fucked up here because the bottom line is that the people operating it are far more of a problem than the tech or the principles and this country shows no desire to improve in that respect.

 

[BertsEBT]

Clear daylight between the striker and defender. Not complicated.

Wouldn't have a problem with this.
Someone else in the thread suggested an 'umpire's call rule' for the really tight offside calls which seems more sensible than scrapping it altogether

Edit: caveat with sticking with the on field decision would be that benefit of the doubt should go with the attacker and nobody should be denied a goal when they're onside

 

[EddiBrock]

Decisions now 96% correct vs 82% pre VAR *

Harry Lynch on LinkedIn: #sportingjobs

The Premier League faces a vote to scrap the use of video assistant referees (VAR) from next season. It’s created great debate in our office this week as Matt…

www.linkedin.com

And yet some people want to go backwards?

* These numbers may not be exact, but they will be close enough. There are significantly less miscarriages of justice now

 

[Barrymoped]

Decisions now 96% correct vs 82% pre VAR *

Harry Lynch on LinkedIn: #sportingjobs

The Premier League faces a vote to scrap the use of video assistant referees (VAR) from next season. It’s created great debate in our office this week as Matt…

www.linkedin.com

And yet some people want to go backwards?

* These numbers may not be exact, but they will be close enough. There are significantly less miscarriages of justice now

It won’t be going backwards, there’s not a chance of it.

Things should definitely be done faster though, and it certainly needs tweaked to improve it

 

[SaulBearenson]

That was probably the best reaction to a goal at Ibrox since the Seville run and to have that taken away by VAR changed my mind over it completely.

It didn't take away the reaction though. We all still reacted to the ball hitting the net and celebrated it like f*ck. The next bit was the subsequent reaction to it being chalked off.

I don't know about anyone else, but my reaction to goals hasn't changed one bit since my first game in 1985. I celebrate every single time we put the ball in the back of the net. I'm yet to see anyone at our games who doesn't, especially anyone standing with their hands in their pockets waiting for VAR to review it before seemingly being given permission to celebrate.

 

[BlueSeaOfIbrox]

Decisions now 96% correct vs 82% pre VAR *

Harry Lynch on LinkedIn: #sportingjobs

The Premier League faces a vote to scrap the use of video assistant referees (VAR) from next season. It’s created great debate in our office this week as Matt…

www.linkedin.com

And yet some people want to go backwards?

* These numbers may not be exact, but they will be close enough. There are significantly less miscarriages of justice now

There should be changes to how var works.

Not remove it entirely.

Can't believe people would rather have 18% decisions go against us than 4%

They're moaning about decisions going against us wrongly still but are in favour of 4.5x the amount of wrong decisions against us.

Baffling logic.

Yes var has its issues but it gets far more correct than it gets wrong.

I would rather lose out on a goal if it meant we scored another 4, rather than lose out on 4 goals if it meant we scored 1.

Offside situation people moan about is easily fixed. Draw a thicker line, if there'd any overlap it's onside. Offside only if its completely separated. Not that I think there's an issue with the offside as it Is though.

 

[EddiBrock]

It won’t be going backwards, there’s not a chance of it.

Things should definitely be done faster though, and it certainly needs tweaked to improve it

Improving its implementation should always be sought. Same with any aspect of the game.

 

[IbroxMainStand]

It didn't take away the reaction though. We all still reacted to the ball hitting the net and celebrated it like f*ck. The next bit was the subsequent reaction to it being chalked off.

I don't know about anyone else, but my reaction to goals hasn't changed one bit since my first game in 1985. I celebrate every single time we put the ball in the back of the net. I'm yet to see anyone at our games who doesn't, especially anyone standing with their hands in their pockets waiting for VAR to review it before seemingly being given permission to celebrate.

The celebration to the goal was incredible but once it was ruled out the atmosphere in the ground completely changed. If that goal had stood I am convinced we would have won that game and possibly the league, all that was taken away by VAR.