Squad building v squad togetherness and time together

Earl of Leven

Earl of Leven

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It is 100% understood why we are going slowly - trying to maximise value, and also see who is left out the EPL squads when announced etc. We can't waste money like we did last summer.

It is a strange irony though that we have a relatively (NO chickens counted yet!) appealing Euro draw to face which could lead to ££££ if we progress and we have a tough (by SPL standards) opening to the domestic season...we could have done with a settled squad.

We might not have the time to wait...and using a different 'front six' every game and have nothing up front to mix and match with is unfortunate. Might we start to gel 'too late' to keep the fans from growing restless? We're a hugely patient support who watch dross year after year but underneath simmers a real rage. I just hope we don't get a squad we can believe in too late in the day to stop the critics biting hard.
 
Earl of Leven said:
It is 100% understood why we are going slowly - trying to maximise value, and also see who is left out the EPL squads when announced etc. We can't waste money like we did last summer.

It is a strange irony though that we have a relatively (NO chickens counted yet!) appealing Euro draw to face which could lead to ££££ if we progress and we have a tough (by SPL standards) opening to the domestic season...we could have done with a settled squad.

We might not have the time to wait...and using a different 'front six' every game and have nothing up front to mix and match with is unfortunate. Might we start to gel 'too late' to keep the fans from growing restless? We're a hugely patient support who watch dross year after year but underneath simmers a real rage. I just hope we don't get a squad we can believe in too late in the day to stop the critics biting hard.
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Not sure I get this EOL? (I've run out of coffee)
 
Rangers_2001 said:
We’re a hugely patient support? Have you ever been to Ibrox?
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40,000 + every season and every away game sold out.....in Division 2 and 3!! At one stage we had more fans than the filth and they were top of SPL. We are patient but I see and hear grumblings...people want a road map (Obama stylee) and a path to the top. "We're a bit skint and so it might take 10 years, but we can't have a share issue or seek any investors" is not really going to cut it much longer.
 
Earl of Leven said:
40,000 + every season and every away game sold out.....in Division 2 and 3!! At one stage we had more fans than the filth and they were top of SPL. We are patient but I see and hear grumblings...people want a road map (Obama stylee) and a path to the top. "We're a bit skint and so it might take 10 years, but we can't have a share issue or seek any investors" is not really going to cut it much longer.
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I take your point. We are a loyal support. But we are not patient.
 
Rangers_2001 said:
I take your point. We are a loyal support. But we are not patient.
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I just fear losing a winnable Euro tie and maybe not getting full points from first batch of league games and then starting to integrate new players and systems...people will be 'not delighted'.
 
When McGregor, Arfield, Goldson and Katic signed, I thought we were assembling the squad quickly and looking to hit the ground running. Seems to have stalled a bit recently. Loans - meh. Not for me.

I hope Gerrard knows what he's doing and that he hasn't been misled (PLG-style) regarding budgets. Remember the feverish talk April/May - MacArthur, Skrtel, Davis. Not really panned out that way. Thought we would have went more in than we have, tbh.

No use players arriving in January to try and 'fix' the season.
 
I think we need to look at the big picture.

We're building a squad, but not just for this season.

We can't keep starting again each season and if that means sacrificing a run in Europe this season, to ensure we make the correct signings this window then I'm comfortable with that.
 
MearnsUnionist said:
I think we need to look at the big picture.

We're building a squad, but not just for this season.

We can't keep starting again each season and if that means sacrificing a run in Europe this season, to ensure we make the correct signings this window then I'm comfortable with that.
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But we also have 3 away games from 4 to start season including two teams who finished above us last season. And are we 'building over time'? Apart from Godson and Katic that's not evident yet.
 
Though like 2 seasons back, we can't be out the league race by the end of August.
I'd prefer if in hearts of heart we knew we were going up to Aberdeen with a good squad that would give them a going over, and like wise Celtic. We need more creativity and more flair upfront.
 
frankfurterbear1 said:
Though like 2 seasons back, we can't be out the league race by the end of August.
I'd prefer if in hearts of heart we knew we were going up to Aberdeen with a good squad that would give them a going over, and like wise Celtic. We need more creativity and more flair upfront.
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Kind of what I meant but you used less words. :)
 
MearnsUnionist said:
I think we need to look at the big picture.

We're building a squad, but not just for this season.

We can't keep starting again each season and if that means sacrificing a run in Europe this season, to ensure we make the correct signings this window then I'm comfortable with that.
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You and a few other were heavily hinting about exciting players were coming in a few months ago.

Goldson apart since SG arrived they have all mostly been loan players that most hadn’t heard of unless they play football management games.
 
We've hit a wall I sense in getting players out the door.

Most have gone on loan and likes of Hodson and Forrester have had to be paid to go.

We've also not had the expected bids for Tav, Wes, Windass, Morelos. I think that lack of interest has probably come as a surprise.

You simply MUST balance the books and if we can't get guys out we can't get the ones we want in.

It's frustrating but when recruit as poorly as we have over the last 24 months it will bite you on the arse for some time.
 
As a support we are gonna have to be patient. But I know there are and always will be an element of panty wetter week in week out.
 
I think what is frustrating people is the lack of bodies out, the hints of 'exciting summer that fans will love', the same faces being trusted again, and the apprehension of season almost upon us and the '2 or 3 more' not really appearing yet.

Agree with Uncle Albert though...we clearly hoped for millions IN and no bids have arrived for anyone. I am certain that is a spanner in the works.
 
MearnsUnionist said:
I think we need to look at the big picture.

We're building a squad, but not just for this season.

We can't keep starting again each season and if that means sacrificing a run in Europe this season, to ensure we make the correct signings this window then I'm comfortable with that.
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The level of loans is the counter argument to the building of a squad for the future....we need a perm striker and composed/creative forward playing midfielder or number 10.
 
Uncle Albert said:
We've hit a wall I sense in getting players out the door.

Most have gone on loan and likes of Hodson and Forrester have had to be paid to go.

We've also not had the expected bids for Tav, Wes, Windass, Morelos. I think that lack of interest has probably come as a surprise.

You simply MUST balance the books and if we can't get guys out we can't get the ones we want in.

It's frustrating but when recruit as poorly as we have over the last 24 months it will bite you on the arse for some time.
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This is Robertson’s job to get them out. We have either given players away for free or on loan.
They should be able to sell these players unless they want really silly money.

I am more concerned how this lack of funds will affect SG. We simply cannot afford to waste this chance with him as manager.
 
Earl of Leven said:
But we also have 3 away games from 4 to start season including two teams who finished above us last season. And are we 'building over time'? Apart from Godson and Katic that's not evident yet.
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I think we are already stronger than last season Earl.

Our keeper, central defenders, Flanagan and Arfield are upgrades on what we had last season.

Gerrard has, correctly in my opinion, bought both for the future and some experienced Bosmans.

Yes, we've supplemented them with loan signings, but that is the right thing to do, as we can't buy everyone required in one window.
 
Out to Osijek and 4 points from 12 (NOT saying it will happen but it could) and we will see how understanding the fans are this time around. Board need a plan, a working model for how they will take us where we want and need to be.
 
MearnsUnionist said:
I think we are already stronger than last season Earl.

Our keeper, central defenders, Flanagan and Arfield are upgrades on what we had last season.

Gerrard has, correctly in my opinion, bought both for the future and some experienced Bosmans.

Yes, we've supplemented them with loan signings, but that is the right thing to do, as we can't buy everyone required in one window.
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McGregor and Arfield aren't for the future though...nor are the loan signings.
 
We might, might be able to get by Osijek with the current lot.

However, we go any further then our business has to be done in terms of big name loans etc for round 3.
 
It was always going to go this way. They have so far made massive improvements to the squad.

They've been smart in improving the strength in depth as quickly as they could, and the remaining signings yet to come in will all be for the first 11.

With the world cup and the transfer windows in other countries being different from ours everything wasn't going to happen overnight.

I'm extremely pleased with the work done so far and am confident that with another 3 players of real quality yet to join, we will look back on this transfer window as our best in a very long time.
 
The biggest problem last season was the amount of stupid goals and points we threw away down to pure bad defending. If we get that sorted we are on our way, but agreed we need a goalscorer and a couple more players who will improve on whats there.

I think reality is biting those who thought Gerrard was going to come and fortunes would be reversed. No matter what happens, it is going to take time. Do I think we will win the league this year? No.

IMO if we get a team capable of competing, a clear second, get some more co-efficient points on the board and take the cup then it sets us up very nicely for SG's second season.
 
Jaws II said:
You and a few other were heavily hinting about exciting players were coming in a few months ago.

Goldson apart since SG arrived they have all mostly been loan players that most hadn’t heard of unless they play football management games.
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As I said to you last night Jaws the window has 5 weeks to go.

I still believe that another CD, CM and forward will be recruited before the window closes.

Feel free to have a pop if that doesn't materialise.
 
MearnsUnionist said:
As I said to you last night Jaws the window has 5 weeks to go.

I still believe that another CD, CM and forward will be recruited before the window closes.

Feel free to have a pop if that doesn't materialise.
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Things could look, er....quite different....in 5 weeks.

Let's hope it all comes together.
 
MearnsUnionist said:
I think we are already stronger than last season Earl.

Our keeper, central defenders, Flanagan and Arfield are upgrades on what we had last season.

Gerrard has, correctly in my opinion, bought both for the future and some experienced Bosmans.

Yes, we've supplemented them with loan signings, but that is the right thing to do, as we can't buy everyone required in one window.
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What you, ID10, brogues, butcher 6 and a few other all said including a couple of admin said was “the players we are after would excite the fans”.

Let’s be honest apart from Goldson and those signed before SG was here, have mostly been unknown and loan signings.

We have a Keeper, good CH but lack a creative midfielder (Ferguson/Mendes type) and a goalscorer the spine of our team and are relying on last years failures.
We have all so far spent less than Pedro.

If as Uncle Albert suggests it is due to the failure to sell some players, then it looks as though the board COULD (not are) be fucking up our chances with SG.
 
WATP said:
The level of loans is the counter argument to the building of a squad for the future....we need a perm striker and composed/creative forward playing midfielder or number 10.
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You cannot possibly buy a whole new team in one window .

Permanent signings supplemented with loan signings that improve the squad is the way we have to go.
 
Uncle Albert said:
We've hit a wall I sense in getting players out the door.

Most have gone on loan and likes of Hodson and Forrester have had to be paid to go.

We've also not had the expected bids for Tav, Wes, Windass, Morelos. I think that lack of interest has probably come as a surprise.

You simply MUST balance the books and if we can't get guys out we can't get the ones we want in.

It's frustrating but when recruit as poorly as we have over the last 24 months it will bite you on the arse for some time.
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Agree. And Europa progress probably brings in £1m a round through gate and TV money. Bit of wait and see on the revrnue front.
 
MearnsUnionist said:
You cannot possibly buy a whole new team in one window .

Permanent signings supplemented with loan signings that improve the squad is the way we have to go.
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But it's not been a 'great summer, exciting for all the fans'....and so we're speculating that something happened to derail some of the plans. You must see how that might happen, yes? It's been a decent summer but not much different from the last two apart from Goldson who does look the business.
 
What i,ve seen so far is the defence looks better than last season.which to be honest wouldn,t be very hard .but nothing else seems to have improved. But ot is early days yet and with a run of games things may well get better.also hopefully we will get more players in.
 
Earl of Leven said:
Probably to do with not being able to sell anyone, but interesting none the less.
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The club should be proactive in this regard. Windass we might be able to get say £2.5m for. Morelos god knows what he'd fetch on current form.

Two expendable players that we could get better replacements by selling.
 
MearnsUnionist said:
As I said to you last night Jaws the window has 5 weeks to go.

I still believe that another CD, CM and forward will be recruited before the window closes.

Feel free to have a pop if that doesn't materialise.
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I am not having a pop at you mate. It’s just many felt a sense of relief that we were having a go. I don’t think many though we were after stupid names.
When we got linked to Lucas and the likes Doc quickly told us it was bullshit.
However many though we would have an increased budget for players from last season and our scouting would be looking for some unpolished gems from abroad (the big Croat was a good start). Many ITK posters were hinting that we would be getting some of Liverpool’s best youngsters like Wilson and Solanke.

Now these posters have disappeared or are saying SG is here 4 years and we are playing it long term.

I think posters just get fed up with the fighting talk of Rangers and the propaganda that the club is leaking to posters like yourself and then the reality of how things turns out totally different.

I still cling on to the ideal that SG wouldn’t come to Rangers to challenge Celtic with less than 8 mill to spend and 4 or 5 kids on loan.
I hope we sign another good CH, Creative Mid and a striker who are the core of our team for a few years but I admit I am getting concerned.
 
MearnsUnionist said:
I think we need to look at the big picture.

We're building a squad, but not just for this season.

We can't keep starting again each season and if that means sacrificing a run in Europe this season, to ensure we make the correct signings this window then I'm comfortable with that.
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Exactly, Europe is irrelevant beyond some competitive games that let the manager see how his instructions are being taken on and the players that deliver in training but not in competition.
Everybody would like a settled squad asap, SG and his team more than us, but there are so many factors in bringing players in that it just takes time. Sometimes it happens, others it doesn't.
It's real life guys, it's complicated, messy and subject to the whim of the Gods.o_O
 
Jaws II said:
What you, ID10, brogues, butcher 6 and a few other all said including a couple of admin said was “the players we are after would excite the fans”.

Let’s be honest apart from Goldson and those signed before SG was here, have mostly been unknown and loan signings.

We have a Keeper, good CH but lack a creative midfielder (Ferguson/Mendes type) and a goalscorer the spine of our team and are relying on last years failures.
We have all so far spent less than Pedro.

If as Uncle Albert suggests it is due to the failure to sell some players, then it looks as though the board COULD (not are) be fucking up our chances with SG.
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I think irrespective of the signings, you have to give Gerrard and his staff time to work with the squad.

Remember when Rodgers came in the mentally challenged support were of the opinion, Lustig done, Boyata bombscare, Brown done, Armstrong shite, Forrest sand dancer, Rogic flatters to deceive etc etc.

Most of that was based on 2 crawling over the line league title wins, no trebles and us beating them in the semi final.

Rodgers came in and immediately lost to Red Imps and the cries that the squad were shite got louder.

If you look at them now, only Dembele and Ntcham have been signed and played regularly.

Rodgers has coached the players he inherited, with a couple of additions, into a system that gets the most out of them.

Let's give our coaching staff some time to make their mark on our squad too.
 
Commentator said:
Exactly, Europe is irrelevant beyond some competitive games that let the manager see how his instructions are being taken on and the players that deliver in training but not in competition.
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If we make group stage (a real outside bet at this stage) it would be £7-10m for us. As it is each home game is generating £1m....not irrelevant at all.
 
Earl of Leven said:
Agreed but that's not squad building for years to come as someone else said.
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But surely you must agree Earl that you can't just buy a whole team of 22 or 23 year olds?

We'll easily get another couple of years out of McGregor and longer out of Arfield.

It has to be a gradual process.
 
Earl of Leven said:
If we make group stage (a real outside bet at this stage) it would be £7-10m for us. As it is each home game is generating £1m....not irrelevant at all.
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Nope, undeniably the money would be very useful. Still don't believe that we should be jeopordising our chances of bringing in better players later by going for those that are available now.
I'd rather hold fire now and miss out on Europe to increase our chances of domestic success in the (near) future.
 
Earl of Leven said:
If we make group stage (a real outside bet at this stage) it would be £7-10m for us. As it is each home game is generating £1m....not irrelevant at all.
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Earl seeing the team we have and our draw for the third round, although not top notch still qualified for champs league a year ago and had some good results.
I think it is wishful thinking with the signings we have made so far and the form of our midfield and attack to expect us to put them out and then another good team in the next round.

Even if we park the bus to try and go through none of our mids or strikers are good enough to keep possession.
 
SuperGers07 said:
The club should be proactive in this regard. Windass we might be able to get say £2.5m for. Morelos god knows what he'd fetch on current form.

Two expendable players that we could get better replacements by selling.
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Wes has been hawked about like a stolen watch in a pub mate. Loans or buttons were offered.

Unfortunately scouts watch the same games we do and they know the club and fans are desperate to get rid.
 
MearnsUnionist said:
But surely you must agree Earl that you can't just buy a whole team of 22 or 23 year olds?

We'll easily get another couple of years out of McGregor and longer out of Arfield.

It has to be a gradual process.
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I agree with you on Shagger and Arfield, still a good few years left in them. Defence I am comfortable with (apart from Tav) however the core and spine of the team should have been the main goal.
We have got half of a spine, however the other half is needed pretty sharpish.
 
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