The 1966 World Cup

TheDerryend

Well-Known Member
I would like to find out from a few of our posters who would be around at the time, how much of a disappointment it was not to qualify as it was held in England.

My old fella was at the game when John Grieg scored the winner against Italy and went on about that night many times as he was at the game. Interested to know how much the country really wanted this and does anyone think we could have had a decent run at it. I was too young to remember anything about it. Being blooded towards Rangers was still work in progress for the old man.
 
It was extremely disappointing. We had qualification completely in our own hands and blew it against Poland at Hampden. I was at that game as well as the Italy game a few weeks later. The group of players we had at that time were every bit as good as the England team that won the tournament. How would we have done had we qualified is anybody's guess - it is Scotland after all. My own opinion, however, is that we would have at least gone beyond the group stage.
 
Try reading a report of the Scotland-Poland game to appreciate just how badly failure was taken by the press. Denis Law got a really hard time - so did Alex Hamilton, the Dundee right-back.

In the away fixture with Italy, Scotland had to field a much weakened team because English clubs blocked Scottish players from playing.

Scotland had only been put out after a replay in a qualifying match by Czechoslovakia - the team that were runners up - in the previous World Cup, so we would have fancied our chances. We had also beaten England three times and drew once since the 9-3 drubbing in 1961.

Those were the days when Rangers fans identified very closely with the national team, while Celtic fans didn’t. Changed days!
 
As much as Ingerland had a decent team, they remain the only side to play ALL their fixtures on their home ground. In addition, for the semi-final against Portugal, the Portuguese had home advantage at Goodison, which was their base. The English president of FIFA, Sir Stanley Rous, (read English FA in other words), then successfully managed to re-arrange the semi-final to be played at Wembley, thus giving Ingerland the advantage. Everyone who had planned to go to Liverpool, then had to change their arrangements to go to London instead.
 
As much as Ingerland had a decent team, they remain the only side to play ALL their fixtures on their home ground. In addition, for the semi-final against Portugal, the Portuguese had home advantage at Goodison, which was their base. The English president of FIFA, Sir Stanley Rous, (read English FA in other words), then successfully managed to re-arrange the semi-final to be played at Wembley, thus giving Ingerland the advantage. Everyone who had planned to go to Liverpool, then had to change their arrangements to go to London instead.
And why wouldn't England play their matches at the biggest stadium?Averaging over 90,000 for all their matches in 66.
 
Not just Scotland failed to qualify for the 1966 World Cup amongst the Home Nations. Northern Ireland failed by a whisker in a group containing Netherlands, Switzerland and Albania.

I have posted this previously. NI were 13 minutes away from qualifying beating Albania 1 v 0 away in the final group game until Albania equalised. Switzerland scraped through instead. NI had beaten Switzerland and Netherlands in the group. Maybe difficult for younger supporters to understand that Netherlands were not a team to be reckoned with until the early 1970's.

One of my biggest football disappointments is not to have seen George Best grace the 1966 World Cup in England. It would have been incredible. However he may well have been kicked and fouled out of the competition like some great players have been I.e, Pele.
 
Try reading a report of the Scotland-Poland game to appreciate just how badly failure was taken by the press. Denis Law got a really hard time - so did Alex Hamilton, the Dundee right-back.

In the away fixture with Italy, Scotland had to field a much weakened team because English clubs blocked Scottish players from playing.

Scotland had only been put out after a replay in a qualifying match by Czechoslovakia - the team that were runners up - in the previous World Cup, so we would have fancied our chances. We had also beaten England three times and drew once since the 9-3 drubbing in 1961.

Those were the days when Rangers fans identified very closely with the national team, while Celtic fans didn’t. Changed days!
Law got a hard time because he repeatedly refused to play Willie Johnston in who started the game on fire.
 
It was so much harder qualifying then only 1 team went through in the group.
A missed opportunity with the players we had then we could have gone far on virtually home territory and a probable vast support.
 
I blame Jock Stein for our failure to get to England 66'.
11 days prior to the Poland game the writing was on the wall, when we lost 2-3 to Northern Ireland.
It was the defence of an out of form Alex Hamilton, Billy McNeill and Eddie McCreadie that looked suspect and tired in the latter part of that game, and conceded a last minute winner for Northern Ireland, yet the only changes Stein made for the Poland game was to replace Dave MacKay and Jim Baxter with Pat Crerand and Billy Bremner, with Willie Johnston coming in for John Hughes.
And sure enough, it was that tired defence that gave up two goals in the last five mins to Poland, in a game that we had been winning comfortably for the previous 70 odd mins.
Prior to this game, Poland were effectively out of contention, having failed to win any of their 3 opening games, drawing at home with both Scotland and Italy, and losing away to Finland.
Both Scotland and Italy had taken 5 points out of 6.
Stein did correct it for the home game v Italy one month later, and replaced all three at the back with Greig, McKinnon and Provan, and Scotland gained a fantastic 1-0 win on the night.
Still though, that Polish defeat left us needing to beat the Italians in Italy to qualify, or to get a Draw to force a Play Off.
For that return game four weeks later, we had to do without Jim Baxter and Bill Brown who were injured, and Denis Law, who was still unavailable.
On top of that, Jock Stein decided to drop Alan Gilzean and Willie Henderson in an attempt to beat the Italians at their own game, by being totally defensive, and going for a 0-0 draw to force a Play Off!
Incredibly, Stein opted to play Jim Forrest as a right winger! and John Hughes as a Left winger with no central striker.
Bizarrely he gave the No.9 Shirt to Ron Yeats, but had him operate in the only position he could play, as an extra Central defender.
Yeats had won only 1 Cap previously, and that was in a 2-3 defeat to Wales, where we gave up two goals in the last 3 minutes. All three goals were attributed to mistakes by the debutant Ron Yeats!
Stein chose to bring back Adam Blacklaw (Burnley) in goal, instead of Bobby Ferguson (Kilmarnock). Blacklaw had made only 2 appearances for Scotland some two and a half years earlier (conceding 6 Goals).
He also reinstated McCreadie at Left Back, and he was at fault for the Italian's opener.
Needless to say, the Italians won easily 3-0.
Trying to out defend the greatest defensive nation in the world was a tough lesson for Stein, one that he corrected with his club side eighteen months later, but unfortunately it was a very sorry and bitter lesson for Scotland.
 
Read through all the different qualifiers for the World Cup a while back on wiki, interesting the different methods used. Worth looking at for anyone interested in the topic, same for the Euros.
 
It was so much harder qualifying then only 1 team went through in the group.
A missed opportunity with the players we had then we could have gone far on virtually home territory and a probable vast support.
Read through all the different qualifiers for the World Cup a while back on wiki, interesting the different methods used. Worth looking at for anyone interested in the topic, same for the Euros.

This one was interesting in 66:

 
We had an incredible pool of talent to call upon throughout the 1960's, and arguably as strong as any nation had at England in 1966.
Between 62-68, when England were considered a very good side, they beat us only Once in 7 games, Scotland won 4 and drew 2.

A Scotland Squad in 1966 would have looked something like this

B.Brown (Spurs)
B.Ferguson (Kilmarnock)

J.Greig (Rangers)
T.Gemmell (Celtic)
R.McKinnon (Rangers)
B.McNeil (Celtic)
R.Yeats (Liverpool)
E. McCreadie (Chelsea)

B. Bremner (Leeds Utd)
P.Crerand (Man Utd)
B. Murdoch (Celtic)
D.McKay (Spurs)
P.Stanton (Hibs)
J.Baxter (Sunderland)
C.Cooke (Chelsea)

W.Henderson (Rangers)
J.Johnstone (Celtic)
J.Forrest (Rangers)
A.Gilzean (Spurs)
D.Law (Man Utd)
B.Lennox (Celtic)
W.Johnston (Rangers)

Standby
T.Lawrence (Liverpool)
D.Provan (Rangers)
F.McLintock (Arsenal)
D.Smith (Aberdeen)
B.Collins (Leeds Utd)
A.Penman (Dundee)
J.McBride (Celtic)
I.St John (Liverpool)


Incredible to see players such as Willie Morgan, Willie Wallace, Peter Cormack, John Hughes and
George McLean (39 goals in 34 games that season) don't even make it into the 30
 
And why wouldn't England play their matches at the biggest stadium?Averaging over 90,000 for all their matches in 66.
That's not my point SamEng. They didn't have home advantage in the first place - that belonged to Portugal, who earned it. Interference from Rous changed the venue to Wembley. They could have (like every other country in the history of the World Cup) taken themselves to other parts of the country to let people outside of London see the national team. If they felt they were good enough to win the competition without arranging home advantage at Wembley, why not? Anyway I don't wish to dwell on this. It's been a bone of contention since 1966 that they manipulated this fixture to obtain "home" advantage. I'll put it this way, in a language to which everyone can relate - imagine this scenario, as hypothetical as it may be. "The venue for the 2030 Champions League Final has been selected, and Ibrox Stadium in Glasgow will host the showpiece match. Rangers then go on to qualify for the final to play Celtic. In the name of sporting integrity, Lawwell uses his considerable UEFA influence to change the venue to Parkhead as it has a larger capacity and will allow more fans to attend the game". :)
 
I blame Jock Stein for our failure to get to England 66'.
11 days prior to the Poland game the writing was on the wall, when we lost 2-3 to Northern Ireland.
It was the defence of an out of form Alex Hamilton, Billy McNeill and Eddie McCreadie that looked suspect and tired in the latter part of that game, and conceded a last minute winner for Northern Ireland, yet the only changes Stein made for the Poland game was to replace Dave MacKay and Jim Baxter with Pat Crerand and Billy Bremner, with Willie Johnston coming in for John Hughes.
And sure enough, it was that tired defence that gave up two goals in the last five mins to Poland, in a game that we had been winning comfortably for the previous 70 odd mins.
Prior to this game, Poland were effectively out of contention, having failed to win any of their 3 opening games, drawing at home with both Scotland and Italy, and losing away to Finland.
Both Scotland and Italy had taken 5 points out of 6.
Stein did correct it for the home game v Italy one month later, and replaced all three at the back with Greig, McKinnon and Provan, and Scotland gained a fantastic 1-0 win on the night.
Still though, that Polish defeat left us needing to beat the Italians in Italy to qualify, or to get a Draw to force a Play Off.
For that return game four weeks later, we had to do without Jim Baxter and Bill Brown who were injured, and Denis Law, who was still unavailable.
On top of that, Jock Stein decided to drop Alan Gilzean and Willie Henderson in an attempt to beat the Italians at their own game, by being totally defensive, and going for a 0-0 draw to force a Play Off!
Incredibly, Stein opted to play Jim Forrest as a right winger! and John Hughes as a Left winger with no central striker.
Bizarrely he gave the No.9 Shirt to Ron Yeats, but had him operate in the only position he could play, as an extra Central defender.
Yeats had won only 1 Cap previously, and that was in a 2-3 defeat to Wales, where we gave up two goals in the last 3 minutes. All three goals were attributed to mistakes by the debutant Ron Yeats!
Stein chose to bring back Adam Blacklaw (Burnley) in goal, instead of Bobby Ferguson (Kilmarnock). Blacklaw had made only 2 appearances for Scotland some two and a half years earlier (conceding 6 Goals).
He also reinstated McCreadie at Left Back, and he was at fault for the Italian's opener.
Needless to say, the Italians won easily 3-0.
Trying to out defend the greatest defensive nation in the world was a tough lesson for Stein, one that he corrected with his club side eighteen months later, but unfortunately it was a very sorry and bitter lesson for Scotland.
Before my time, but so much for Stein being a cavalier, attack at all costs football genius.
 
That's not my point SamEng. They didn't have home advantage in the first place - that belonged to Portugal, who earned it. Interference from Rous changed the venue to Wembley. They could have (like every other country in the history of the World Cup) taken themselves to other parts of the country to let people outside of London see the national team. If they felt they were good enough to win the competition without arranging home advantage at Wembley, why not? Anyway I don't wish to dwell on this. It's been a bone of contention since 1966 that they manipulated this fixture to obtain "home" advantage. I'll put it this way, in a language to which everyone can relate - imagine this scenario, as hypothetical as it may be. "The venue for the 2030 Champions League Final has been selected, and Ibrox Stadium in Glasgow will host the showpiece match. Rangers then go on to qualify for the final to play Celtic. In the name of sporting integrity, Lawwell uses his considerable UEFA influence to change the venue to Parkhead as it has a larger capacity and will allow more fans to attend the game". :)
I didn't know that about Portugal I'd need to research it.But I think you may find many times a "home" nation have worked the fixtures to play their matches at their stadium of choice only to have finished second in their group and their plans scuppered.So it would have happened previously if results went accordingly.
 
And why wouldn't England play their matches at the biggest stadium?Averaging over 90,000 for all their matches in 66.
Two other interesting facts about the 66 WC was it was the last world cup without substitutes and also the last one where the host country provided all the referees and linesmen
 
I still remember it quite clearly watching it on black and white telly, there didn’t seem to be the same anti English feelings back then .
 
In group stage, England's group played at Wembley and White City. All 3 England games played at Wembley as well as quarter final v Argentina, semi v Portugal and final obviously.
 
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