The better coached team won

[butch70]

Good post.

Where I initially felt there were grounds for genuine encouragement under Clement compared to Beale at the same stage was that there appeared to be a distinct change to our style of play.

Our positioning looked much better, our passing was sharper, the players looked quicker and we were trying to play it forward more often. There was also some good interchanges going on middle to front that appeared to evidence the training ground at work.

Over the last couple of months or so all of that has rapidly deteriorated however and Clement’s inability to reinfuse it in the team is a worry for me.

The mindless route one football we’ve seen for most of that time, especially with a striker unable to hold the ball up effectively makes it even more so.

You are correct and the last time we played like that was hearts at home in January we scudded them and played fantastic football unfortunately we haven’t reached those heights again which is unbelievable

 

[HandsomeHead]

You are correct and the last time we played like that was hearts at home in January we scudded them and played fantastic football unfortunately we haven’t reached those heights again which is unbelievable

It’s a bit baffling really: why did we stop doing what we had been doing very well?

You can look at the lack of balance with Sima, Cortes and Yilmaz all absent from the left hand side, the decision to accommodate Diomande beside the undroppable Lundstram in the middle, a complete dearth of alternative striking options, no natural width, etc, etc, but it also just looked like players tiring possibly due to poor conditioning last summer.

So we stopped pressing with the same intensity while our passing became slacker and our movement and positioning weren’t nearly as good.

I’m probably making excuses for Clement here, but did he see this creeping tiredness and decide on an alternative plan to try and get the best out of what we did have?

Because the other option is that he actually wants us to play a long ball hit and hope game, and if that’s the case I don’t really fancy his chances unless he gets the players to perform it.

 

[ICA_86]

I literally have no idea what type of football we play under Clement.

It’s all a bit of a mess, he really does shit the bed against them.

 

[Class of 72]

The team that’s allowed to run from their own box to your box with no contest, or are allowed to pop shots into goal with zero contest, or are allowed to run the midfield —they generally win.

Said to my son during the game, we allowed them to run from their half to our D unopposed on numerous occasions. It’s bizarre.

 

[JC85]

They've just got better players. Especially in the middle of the park. It's glaringly obvious when you compare each team trying to pass & progress the ball forwards. Which is another reason why 3 in the middle was so important.

 

[MrStruth]

O’Riley and McGregor had 3 shots each from the edge of the box in the first half (one resulting in a goal). That isn’t individual error, that is them noticing a flaw in our team and exploiting it time and time again. If our manager can’t see that, then we are in big trouble next season

The manager seemed completely oblivious to it. He certainly never done anything obvious to alter the set up.

We just allowed them to dictate the flow of the game. As we always seem to do when we go to the Mhidden

 

[MrStruth]

They've just got better players. Especially in the middle of the park. It's glaringly obvious when you compare each team trying to pass & progress the ball forwards. Which is another reason why 3 in the middle was so important.

We had far better players than Dundee and Ross County. The difference was the effort they put in and the drive they had.
Rangers were far too passive on the ball or getting forward.
Allowed them all the space they wanted. It was a re_run of the last time we played there. The manager changed nothing.

 

[JC85]

We had far better players than Dundee and Ross County. The difference was the effort they put in and the drive they had.
Rangers were far too passive on the ball or getting forward.
Allowed them all the space they wanted. It was a re_run of the last time we played there. The manager changed nothing.

Of course mate. But Dundee and Ross County aren't beating us 3 or 4 times a season, Celtic are and have been for the last 3 seasons.

 

[Mollysblackcoat]

Fortunate enough not to see the game yesterday. Let me guess though, everytime the camera cut to Phil hes doing that stupid circular motion with his hands. Thenwhen its cuts to Rodgers he’ll be giving tactical advice?

No. Your wrong.

 

[Mollysblackcoat]

I literally have no idea what type of football we play under Clement.

It’s all a bit of a mess, he really does shit the bed against them.

He's playing the type of football that the players available to him can only manage. Or what he thinks they can manage.
Attacking wise , we have 4 players our injured and 3 of the would have probably started I fit. Sima, Cortes and Danilo. Matondo on the bench, imo.
Our midfield is a joke, and that's not on PC. We've signed Diomande and as far as I can see, he'll be good enough when he has better around him. Not Lundstram or an immobile Lawrence.
I don't even want to start with the defence.
It's the players like Lundstram and Tav who shit the bed, not the manager.

 

[Manuel]

Yeah, coz he has so many options available.

Take 5 or 6 starters out of their team, we'd have had the league won already.

Clement needs time.
He'll prove that Rodgers is a narcissistic fraud.

You do know he can change his formation to suit the opponent?
If you're missing key players that are key for your particular preferred system, surely you must change it?
We hoped he was going to try something different, a 'solid 3 in midfield', 'pack the midfield' etc, unfortunately he's coming across as entirely predictable.

 

[Manuel]

Said to my son during the game, we allowed them to run from their half to our D unopposed on numerous occasions. It’s bizarre.

This is it though, we're sitting watching it, we can see it, why can't the manager?
We are so easy to play through, yesterday they basically got up to the edge of our box unchallenged, it was shot after shot, he had to tweak his formation mid game to stop that, but he didn't, bizarre.

 

[Class of 72]

This is it though, we're sitting watching it, we can see it, why can't the manager?
We are so easy to play through, yesterday they basically got up to the edge of our box unchallenged, it was shot after shot, he had to tweak his formation mid game to stop that, but he didn't, bizarre.

I don’t think it’s formation it’s game awareness and positioning of the players. Basics of defending is the immediate danger is where the ball is ffs.

 

[Manuel]

I don’t think it’s formation it’s game awareness and positioning of the players. Basics of defending is the immediate danger is where the ball is ffs.

I think the '10' had to drop deeper to plug that hole, be more compact.

 

[Kaybo]

I said during the game they pass the ball at pace inside the box to a players feet. We play the ball into an area where we hope something will happen.

Spot on, and have done for a long time. Their movement, one touch passing and tempo puts our laborious two touch approach to shame. Frustrating thing is it should be basics for players playing for rangers.

 

[HandsomeHead]

They've just got better players. Especially in the middle of the park. It's glaringly obvious when you compare each team trying to pass & progress the ball forwards. Which is another reason why 3 in the middle was so important.

That probably is true to some extent, but not by the margins we’ve seen in the past three games against them.

If you go back to January and February we looked very good in the middle of the park. I felt we were beginning to play some of the best football I’d seen from us since the best days under Gerrard.

The Hearts game is the obvious high water mark, but also the 3-0 win at Easter Road and the 2-1 win against Aberdeen where we really should have been out of sight by half time such was our complete dominance.

The football we were playing then was night and day to what we’re seeing now, so what’s gone wrong and is it something Clement can recover next season with his own players?

I’m seeing some similarities to Gerrard’s second season where we were playing some really good stuff, went to the Beggardome and won and were in a really good position to kick on before it inexplicably fell apart.

He then regrouped over the summer and we returned with a newfound focus and purpose and the rest is history.

This is what Clement is going to need to do now.

 

[JC85]

That probably is true to some extent, but not by the margins we’ve seen in the past three games against them.

If you go back to January and February we looked very good in the middle of the park. I felt we were beginning to play some of the best football I’d seen from us since the best days under Gerrard.

The Hearts game is the obvious high water mark, but also the 3-0 win at Easter Road and the 2-1 win against Aberdeen where we really should have been out of sight by half time such was our complete dominance.

The football we were playing then was night and day to what we’re seeing now, so what’s gone wrong and is it something Clement can recover next season with his own players?

I’m seeing some similarities to Gerrard’s second season where we were playing some really good stuff, went to the Beggardome and won and were in a really good position to kick on before it inexplicably fell apart.

He then regrouped over the summer and we returned with a newfound focus and purpose and the rest is history.

This is what Clement is going to need to do now.

It's not just the last 3 games though, it's 3 years they've been beating us with ease.

Your question in bold is the big question mate. It looked good when Clement first came in, but has he tried to do anything new since then, or since we started struggling? I don't think he has. I understand the injury situation makes that difficult but I'm still really alarmed that he didn't even attempt to change our setup yesterday.

 

[SimonLeBon]

Compared to us, I’d say they are fitter and faster. Their passing is direct and crisp. Their players seem to know what their job on the park is, and look to go forward with pace at every opportunity They also have a mentality that comes from winning just about every other domestic trophy.

Don’t get me wrong, a better celtic team would have put 4 past us in the first half alone, as they were basically gifted free shots from our penalty box. Frustratingly, they are still good enough to see us off for the third(!) season in a row.

Once again we stood off them and allowed them to play to their strengths. The biggest weakness is their defence, but we don’t test it nearly enough. We are too ponderous and lack conviction going forward to be a serious threat. One shot at goal today was evidence of that.

Butland saved us from an absolute tanking.

 

[temperance]

It doesn’t help when O’Riley runs from the touchline past 3 of our players & not one of them track him or even get close to him.

Lundstram standing 3 feet away from him and allowing him to drift away int space was pathetic, as was Davies failure to at least attempt to close him down, that’s not so much down to coaching, simply 2 experienced players failing to do their basic job properly.

 

[HandsomeHead]

It's not just the last 3 games though, it's 3 years they've been beating us with ease.

Your question in bold is the big question mate. It looked good when Clement first came in, but has he tried to do anything new since then, or since we started struggling? I don't think he has. I understand the injury situation makes that difficult but I'm still really alarmed that he didn't even attempt to change our setup yesterday.

That is a big concern, yes. I also think / fear there’s a good chance he’ll approach the cup final exactly the same way and if it’s the same end result then alarm bells really will start ringing.

 

[Battle Fever's On]

The last time we won there the first team coach was Michael Beale.

 

[Damski]

Yet again, another predictable ref decision plays a major role in their win today.

The shocker of a challenge on McCausland at Ibrox against Motherwell wasn't even deemed to be a yellow card, never mind a red. The thug involved stayed on the pitch to score the winner and lose us 3 valuable points. Yet Lundstram is sent off. ?

Today had nothing to do with coaching.

Change the record, man. Same shite from you on practically every post.

 

[muttley]

Change the record, man. Same shite from you on practically every post.

Fans are moaning about dropping points to Motherwell at Ibrox, mate.

The ref cost us again that day for those points when not red carding a shocker of a challenge on McCausland.

 

[skorn]

Did I say Rodgers was the man that made them look better coached? The fact they have scored that first goal against us 4-5-6 times shows it’s a pattern of play they do over and over. Ergo it’s better coached/structured play.

Last time I saw that from us was under SG

Agreed.
They're the better coached team -- so much is obvious, but it's not all down to the current managers/coaches. It's been seasons in the making.
Rodgers has a bit of history with dragging teams down, and that will continue.

But our own players have picked up so many bad habits over the years that I think most of us hoped that Clement would be able to pick them all up and give them a right good shake to change it.

That's not happened, and neither has he created a new formation/tactics on the pitch to make up for our shortcomings, nor instilled the drive and desire that we all want (indeed, need!) to see in Rangers players.

Clement really needs to show that he has the steel to tackle the job ahead -- his remaining team selections and formations and style should let us know if he has learned anything.
It's still a shame that it may have taken him so long though.

 

[android]

A phrase we sometimes heard about Gerrards rangers team. For spells we played patterns and repeatable movements that were effective as players all moved as one and exploited weakness in the opponent.

Today (and generally under Rodgers) they have looked a better coached team to us. That first goal they scored I swear I have seen about 215 times versus us at their midden.

This is something we need to address before next season. There is at times no discernible shape to our play/approach. This is as vital as getting rid of the born losers for me.

As well as the team with the better players!

 

[Kaylasdad]

The team with the better players won. How many of our starting 11 would get in their team? Butland, possibly Tav or Sterling

Tav? Really?

 

[JC85]

Fans are moaning about dropping points to Motherwell at Ibrox, mate.

The ref cost us again that day for those points when not red carding a shocker of a challenge on McCausland.

You're excusing our players losing to Motherwell at Ibrox and just shifting blame on to a refereeing decision. We should be able to beat Motherwell at Ibrox even if WE have 10 men ffs.

 

[Coisty81]

So if Rodgers was in charge of Alloa for a season, they would beat us ? Nonsense

They have better players in midfield, faster players up front. That's it.

We played in their stadium, no fans , 10 men , with cb who 4th choice and not played much in 2 years. But in last 15 mins , we looked most likely to score.

The goals we lost were players error. Lawrence lost mcgregor and Davies and borna too slow to close down, Lundstrum was just lazy for both.

This isn't coaching, it's poor players

 

[gersandproud]

I find this thread pretty confusing -
but that's probably because many posts are merging coaching, tactics, determination & team spirit together when they don't always mean the same thing
That & the fact I'm probably being a bit thick about the topic anyway

One thing that's started to annoy me though is the number of times posters think we've got an amazingly talented & huge squad to call on - the second someone loses a bit of form

Seems to me that so many of our first eleven selections this season have been made out of necessity - mostly due to injuries
& when last resort choices are drafted in it's inevitable that inbalance, limitations & poor performances can be the result

I said in another thread that PC shouldn't be judged on the fiasco he inherited or the injury list he's suffered from
Maybe he hasn't always done the right thing - but I really can't conclude the difference between us & them is mostly down to coaching ?

 

[wd1872]

So if Rodgers was in charge of Alloa for a season, they would beat us ? Nonsense

They have better players in midfield, faster players up front. That's it.

We played in their stadium, no fans , 10 men , with cb who 4th choice and not played much in 2 years. But in last 15 mins , we looked most likely to score.

The goals we lost were players error. Lawrence lost mcgregor and Davies and borna too slow to close down, Lundstrum was just lazy for both.

This isn't coaching, it's poor players

Let's just get Mr Bean in as manager then, it won't matter as long as we manage to get better players.

Back in the real world, coaching has a very big say in all aspects of Football, getting the most out of your team, improving your players, creating structures and patterns in play.

We need to get both right, players and coaches, and a lot of the players we know are not good enough, doesn't mean there can be no (huge) question marks over those coaching them.

 

[Coisty81]

Let's just get Mr Bean in as manager then, it won't matter as long as we manage to get better players.

Back in the real world, coaching has a very big say in all aspects of Football, getting the most out of your team, improving your players, creating structures and patterns in play.

We need to get both right, players and coaches, and a lot of the players we know are not good enough, doesn't mean there can be no (huge) question marks over those coaching them.

Our structure was right. We were down to ten men, in a stadium with not one fan, only cb on field is 4th choice, yet we looked more likely to score in last ten mins.

People who think Rodgers coaching has improved that team, know nothing about football. Every single old firm game has come down to individual mistakes. Unless I'm mistaken, no amount of coaching can legislate for that.

Obviously we need to be drilled and tactically sound, but I firmly believe the majority of our current crop of players are at their capacity. Pep couldn't get more out of Lundstrum, Barasic , Davies, Lawrence etc

 

[Rino100]

Both our pressing game and defensive shape are miles off where we used to be with Gerrard. The players don’t know where they should be relative to each other.

Good point .

When our forwards sometimes attempted to press their back line it was obvious some didn't know to where to be .

 

[FedericoNieto]

I’m pretty sure the whole point in having a manager is meant to be his ability to tactically assess something and set up accordingly.

If he plays them once and he doesn’t get it right, that I can understand, you would expect the appropriate changes for the next game. Unfortunately that’s been three games now with the same glaring tactical deficiencies each time, for that there is absolutely no excuse, he seems lost.

 

[Coza]

As well as the team with the better players!

Thing is if you drop a load of their players into our team they would look shite I bet. We have zero shape and structure to our play so we must be a horrible team to join and play in.

 

[RangersLad1983]

They have much better players than us which makes a big difference!

They certainly do but my gripe against p c is apparently him and Todd Cantwell don't get on so he keeps him benched and puts players on who could never improve us and to me I don't give a feck about him and Cantwell not getting on ,our manager has a duty to our team and our fans who spend thousands every season to see our strongest team play against especially that lot and if it's true that his feelings regarding Cantwell kept him benched then he is not doing his duty to us or the team.Cantwell may or may not have made a difference when we were a man down but he was the most skilful we had on the bench so to me it's a disgrace.

 

[Derek84]

He's playing the type of football that the players available to him can only manage. Or what he thinks they can manage.
Attacking wise , we have 4 players our injured and 3 of the would have probably started I fit. Sima, Cortes and Danilo. Matondo on the bench, imo.
Our midfield is a joke, and that's not on PC. We've signed Diomande and as far as I can see, he'll be good enough when he has better around him. Not Lundstram or an immobile Lawrence.
I don't even want to start with the defence.
It's the players like Lundstram and Tav who shit the bed, not the manager.

The Manager picked Lawrence ahead of Cantwell again and can’t see that he’s hopeless for these games also has kept playing Lundstam who’s been terrible and should have been dropped.

The injuries have been bad and limits him but there are some red flags with the manager and if he doesn’t come up with something for the final we are fucked!

 

[android]

Thing is if you drop a load of their players into our team they would look shite I bet. We have zero shape and structure to our play so we must be a horrible team to join and play in.

I wouldn’t mind their 3 midfielders dropping in to our side and I doubt they’d look as shite as our incumbent midfield unit!

 

[ibroxpark]

End of the day - when Lundstram was playing well, the team generally played well - he’s played like a turd for weeks and the team has played awful….manager should have dropped him before yesterday’s debacle

 

[DylanGer]

Thing is if you drop a load of their players into our team they would look shite I bet. We have zero shape and structure to our play so we must be a horrible team to join and play in.

I'd have a lie down mate...seriously.

 

[Falcon]

We also need to be signing faster players.

Certainly players who are faster and more alert to what is going and being quicker at tracking their movement

 

[GBY74]

Our structure was right. We were down to ten men, in a stadium with not one fan, only cb on field is 4th choice, yet we looked more likely to score in last ten mins.

People who think Rodgers coaching has improved that team, know nothing about football. Every single old firm game has come down to individual mistakes. Unless I'm mistaken, no amount of coaching can legislate for that.

Obviously we need to be drilled and tactically sound, but I firmly believe the majority of our current crop of players are at their capacity. Pep couldn't get more out of Lundstrum, Barasic , Davies, Lawrence etc

Surely when the mistakes continually happen to one team the other team is coached to have a high press or the like to make players make the mistake.

 

[Bluerhap]

If they gave us the space we gave them then we can play like that. It was about fitness and mental strength to play with pace and control the game although they were dead on their feet in the last twenty minutes. If we had an iota of self belief we would have exploited that. Unfortunately our players don’t seem to do self belief against them at present and this must change in the cup final and next season.

 

[Coisty81]

Surely when the mistakes continually happen to one team the other team is coached to have a high press or the like to make players make the mistake.

Your not understanding what I'm saying mate. If you polish a turd, it's still a turd. No manager in the world can make a poor player a world beater.

On Saturday he made a tactical change by sitting our number 10 right on top of mcgregor. It worked to an extent till lawerence fell asleep at the first goal. Clement can't account for that.

We can't break their press because their midfield 3 are better than ours. O'Reilly is linked with big money move to Athletico and Lundstrum is linked on bosman to Sheffield!

Are you expecting us to pull a Steve Clarke and park the bus ? We are still Rangers and we still had to win the game. If it finished 0-0 we are still not winning the league.

 

[ClockworkOrange]

I don't rate Rodgers particularly highly but he's got course and distance success in Scotland and experience of managing in the top flight in England, with mixed to some success. When did we last have a manager as experienced as that? Advocaat?

 

[Davester]

The team have zero energy or drive. I watch that lady's front bottom Maeda, who plays like he`s been told that if he stands still, he`ll be substituted, and compare to our guys fucking jogging about, and i want them all gone. Its just disgusting, and looks worse against them with the energy some of their key players show.

 

[Mollysblackcoat]

The Manager picked Lawrence ahead of Cantwell again and can’t see that he’s hopeless for these games also has kept playing Lundstam who’s been terrible and should have been dropped.

The injuries have been bad and limits him but there are some red flags with the manager and if he doesn’t come up with something for the final we are fucked!

Was on a sabbatical...
There will be "red flags" (yawn) if we have Lundstram and Lawrence in the starting 11 next season.