This Board’s last chance.

[HillsBill]

Well, if we want to talk about poor performance we need not just criticise the Board. Yep fans have paid their way through the turnstiles, marketing etc but flopped dramatically in share ownership and influence through C1872. They set themselves a target of 25% which would have given them a real voice and enabled them to block the type of special resolutions which could have seriously harmed the club. What they got was 4.96% - an even worse miss that Dessers. Perhaps enough fans will stop attending and spending but I suspect all that will achieve is to hand their season tickets to someone else. In any event it's rare for the fans to agree.

Even if new investors can be found, and that's a big ask, they need to buy out the current board who control about 30% of the shares plus a further 15% I would expect from Gibson and Letham who are not on the Board but close to the directors. The bill? At current prices around £34m for the directors and £17m for Gibson and Letham - but they'll want more than that to sell. And that doesn't include shareholder loans which are probably in excess of £15m. And Park won't be easy to deal with either. At the end of last financial year total loans were £17.6m whilst during that year Operations had a cash outflow of £3.8m on top of the net £8.1m invested in the club.

There is no such thing as a free transfer. You can pay a fee up front or pay it as part of wages over the period of the contract but pay it you will. Since we don't have a lot of shekels we mainly pay through wages hence our high bill.

Had C1872 some nous, the fans would have a say with the board but politics get in the way, not for the first time. So, blame the board by all means (though there have been changes) but let's not ignore the role that C1872 has played, or not as the case might be.

Until it is known who has the money to buy out the current shareholdings, repay the existing loans and fund the ongoing cash outflow, I suggest we should be careful what we wish for.

 

[John Wilson]

We make sure he doesn't see the light of day until his deal expires. But that's an extreme scenario that rarely happens.

In reality, when players know their time is up they instruct their agent to find them a new club. You'll always get the odd prick like Bob O'Balde who is quite happy to put their feet up, but the vast majority are unwilling to sacrifice 12-18 months of their career.

We may need to lower the asking price to find a buyer the player will accept, but that's still preferable to half a squad of deadwood marking time on the calendar.

It's the policy everywhere else, including across the city, so I don't see how it's unrealistic to expect the same from us.

Step 1 would be to stop handing out such charitable contracts.

If that's the policy across the city, how is James McCarthy still picking up a wage??

 

[Barrymoped]

I’m finding it hard to be overly critical of this board to be honest. Yes, they fell for Beale’s act, but so did most of you on here. You were jubilant on the whole to hear that “the brains behind Gerrard” was returning, he was swamped for selfies when he made his impromptu appearance in Oswalds. Some of us were skeptical.

Plus the main point that it largely wasn’t this board who appointed Beale to begin with, the main powers were Dougie Park, Stewart Robertson and Ross Wilson who appointed him.

The current boards biggest failing so far has been to not appoint a DoF sooner and instead trusted Beale to spend all our budget on his say so.

Even at that it wasn’t all a disaster, Butland and Sterling and prime examples of how to properly play the Bosman market.

 

[juan guy]

If that's the policy across the city, how is James McCarthy still picking up a wage??

True, he was a very 'us' signing actually - old and past it, big wages and constantly injured.

End of the day nobody gets them all right, but we should be getting most of them right. Player trading is about selling at the right time as much as it's about recruitment.

By the summer we'll have watched Lundstram, Barisic, Morelos, Kent and Kamara walk out the door for nothing, when we could have brought in north of £20m had we sold them all a year or 2 earlier than we did.

Folk are paid a fortune to make these calls and with that track record I'd say any criticism that goes their way is 100% legitimate.

edit: got a fee for Kamara obviously, point is we could've got a lot more if we sold a year or 2 earlier.

 

[Dado’s Napper]

Sorry, but every appointment since Gerrard has been hailed by the majority of the support. AS has every signing. It's not like they've been going out and buying duds that no one wanted.

Raskin was going to be the next big thing.
Silva was the final piece of the jigsaw.
Cifuentes was a coup etc.

The market we shop in is extremely hit and miss, unfortunately we've had more misses than hits.

Proof is in the pudding mate.

The fans will always back what’s coming in and look for the positives look back it’s a war zone of transfers and appointments.

Gio never got backed after making the club huge money and these players done what they are doing now.

We sacked a manager who won titles went within a Goldson mistake of immortality and replaced him with a Rookie manager who should’ve been nowhere near our job.

Also let Beale loose with the biggest budget in years when it was Gio that should’ve been backed.

Huge massive mistakes that somehow Clement might have got us our money back on Lammers and Dessers when they go.

Doesn’t matter if they were lauded they were huge blunders multi millions wasted that could’ve put us on top for years.

Gerrard gets Veerman Gio gets the four quality dutch boys they were within reach too.

 

[MosesMcNeil99]

Has Bisgrove not just been in Position for one Year? Give the guy a break.
The board just now is nothing like ten years ago, look up our Board in 2014

Rab why do we always need to look backwards? I’m not sure the relevance in 2024 to 2014 - Rangers have fully financially recovered and only require constant significant shareholder injections because we have a terrible player trading model and we can’t win our league to access the Champions League.

On Bisgrove, he’s at best a middle manager for a club and business the size of Rangers. At best, based on his experience. A strong CEO is essential to the off the the field issues we face with refereeing - don’t tell me you think he’s a strong voice for us there?

 

[scooter70]

Rab why do we always need to look backwards? I’m not sure the relevance in 2024 to 2014 - Rangers have fully financially recovered and only require constant significant shareholder injections because we have a terrible player trading model and we can’t win our league to access the Champions League.

On Bisgrove, he’s at best a middle manager for a club and business the size of Rangers. At best, based on his experience. A strong CEO is essential to the off the the field issues we face with refereeing - don’t tell me you think he’s a strong voice for us there?

We have not fully financially recovered at all

We are still massively playing catch up from the last decade or so

 

[dublinbluenose]

Wasn't long ago we had a good few mental heads on here wanting the board replaced with that American bint even though she didn't have a pot to piss in but it was all about getting rid of DP of course.Without these guys money we would be in a really bad spot.They have made some bad decisions but what Rangers board didn't from the past.David Murray almost destroyed us.

If a David Murray type figure loomed in the horizon,you just know some would be falling over themselves to welcome them.

 

[GBY74]

None, which is my point.

I was replying to a poster stating Morelos, Kent, Kamara etc should all have been sold after we won 55, but after that summer, I can’t recall many bids.

Rumours at the time were that Gerrard wanted to keep the squad together, which is what happened, but given we were running at a massive loss, then it made any investment impossible, which a lot of people seem to conveniently forget when banging on about investing after 55.

So Gerrard couldn't have demanded players were kept if there was no bids to reject

 

[GBY74]

We have not fully financially recovered at all

We are still massively playing catch up from the last decade or so

We performed consistently well in Europe reaching a Europa League final and qualified for the Champions League, We sold Bassey, Patterson, Aribo and Kamara for substantial fees. We have continually sold out season tickets. If we have not fully recovered financially when will we recover.

 

[JDC76]

We have not fully financially recovered at all

We are still massively playing catch up from the last decade or so

Yet our wage bill is higher than Celtic’s?

 

[TJ72]

I’ve completely had it with the board and feel nothing but anger towards them. In particular, John Bennet and Bisgrove.

If I had the chance I’d replace them now which of course can only be achieved via an AGM vote or buyout.

Whilst I appreciate Bennett’s financial contribution through the years mhe has equally been responsible for throwing tens and tens of millions down the pan.

He was a key part of the board when appointing Warburton, Pedro (it still beggars belief to this day!) then more or less repeating the same or a similar mistake with Beale.

Added to that the utter disastrous appointment of Ross Wilson which has also cost tens of millions. Not to mention keeping Robertson in his place for so long.

Bisgrove likes to shout out about our commercial success over the last few years but any half decent sales and marketing guy would tell you that he couldn’t have stepped into the role that he did at any better and opportune time as there was little to no purchases during the Ashley years of merchandise etc.

A monkey could have done his job after Gerrard stepped in.

Bisgrove is unlike Bennet though in that the latter is at least a decent guy having made huge mistakes whilst Bisgrove is always worth the watching and certainly no imo and whom I would like to see that back of quickly.

There were serious alarm bells back in September 2022 with Bennet’s car crash ‘best in class’ interview.

 

[Hazylight1989]

True, he was a very 'us' signing actually - old and past it, big wages and constantly injured.

End of the day nobody gets them all right, but we should be getting most of them right. Player trading is about selling at the right time as much as it's about recruitment.

By the summer we'll have watched Lundstram, Barisic, Morelos, Kent and Kamara walk out the door for nothing, when we could have brought in north of £20m had we sold them all a year or 2 earlier than we did.

Folk are paid a fortune to make these calls and with that track record I'd say any criticism that goes their way is 100% legitimate.

edit: got a fee for Kamara obviously, point is we could've got a lot more if we sold a year or 2 earlier.

The biggest thing I have learned from all this is that inevitably all managers will want to keep a hold of their best players but ultimately every single player in the squad should have a price at any time.

Remember we turned down 20 odd million for Morelos one January then went on to bottle the league anyway

 

[HarryBosch]

The generated 30+ million in players and spent 23 million. They made their own money.

Of course they have wasted wages on players, every club has and we probably will with new signings as well in the summer.

Are you just ignoring their free run at European money?

You made good points earlier about where our board could do better, but its disingenuous to say they made their own money without recognising it was on the back of our issues.

 

[bad boy boogie]

12 out of the last 13 titles have went to those scumbags in the east end ,seriously time our board & players took a good,long,hard look at themselves
This is not rangers standard and is not acceptable.

 

[Barrymoped]

So Gerrard couldn't have demanded players were kept if there was no bids to reject

Nobody actually knows for certain what went on after 55, but Gerrard was on record as saying he wanted all our important players kept.

He is also on record as saying he wanted to kick on, ie fixing the roof while the sun was shining. Trouble is, the sun wasn’t shining, not off the park anyway, as we were running at an enormous loss.

Right now we are actually in a better financial state than we have been for many years, we aren’t making any significant losses, we have finally rid ourselves of Ashley and sorted our retail operations, Ibrox has had most of it’s maintenance and upgrades done, NEH is built and our corporate deals are at an all time high.

But despite all that our wages are way to high relative to our turnover, and our turnover is still miles from what the beggars is, so we are still playing catchup.

 

[JDC76]

12 out of the last 13 titles have went to those scumbags in the east end ,seriously time our board & players took a good,long,hard look at themselves
This is not rangers standard and is not acceptable.

There are a lot of fans now more accepting of mediocrity which is a worry. People not bothered about winning the league cup for example. For me the league cup is massive - gives the team a chance to get the first trophy of the season and build momentum for the rest.

 

[HarryBosch]

I’ve completely had it with the board and feel nothing but anger towards them. In particular, John Bennet and Bisgrove.

If I had the chance I’d replace them now which of course can only be achieved via an AGM vote or buyout.

Whilst I appreciate Bennett’s financial contribution through the years mhe has equally been responsible for throwing tens and tens of millions down the pan.

He was a key part of the board when appointing Warburton, Pedro (it still beggars belief to this day!) then more or less repeating the same or a similar mistake with Beale.

Added to that the utter disastrous appointment of Ross Wilson which has also cost tens of millions. Not to mention keeping Robertson in his place for so long.

Bisgrove likes to shout out about our commercial success over the last few years but any half decent sales and marketing guy would tell you that he couldn’t have stepped into the role that he did at any better and opportune time as there was little to no purchases during the Ashley years of merchandise etc.

A monkey could have done his job after Gerrard stepped in.

Bisgrove is unlike Bennet though in that the latter is at least is a decent guy having made huge mistakes whilst Bisgrove is always worth the watching and certainly no imo would like to see that back of quickly.

There were serious alarm bells in September 2022 with Bennet’s car crash ‘best in class’ interview.

Well, given your apparent expertise, why didn't you step up?

 

[Maida Vale Bear]

You be real, tell me your answer, who would be willing to take over?
Be very careful about what you wish for, I doubt anyone on FF has any idea how difficult it must have been to get us to this stage.
Yes, the Board has made mistakes but IMO they have brought in good Professional people to steady the operation.
The Board has come up with the money but has been badly let down by how the funds have been spent, that is down to the football people who signed players that have let us all down.

I think you’ve misread my post. I was suggesting the OP was wrong.

 

[MrJ]

Who do you want to replace them with?

It's not a transfer Si so I can't scout a potential owner
I think the board have this season to make it right & if they don't then in my opinion the fans will turn on them & not the Manager due to repeated failure

 

[dublinbluenose]

12 out of the last 13 titles have went to those scumbags in the east end ,seriously time our board & players took a good,long,hard look at themselves
This is not rangers standard and is not acceptable.

How many of those titles were won when we were in no fit state to challenge for a title.

 

[HarryBosch]

Oh right what millions have we spent on Silva. No millions. At the time it was stated no loan fee and we were cover a small part of his wage in line with our own pay structure. So about £600k in wages in total. So what striker were we buying for that who would have scored more goals than Dessers. Oh and also defended to stop the goals. Seeing as not conceding is important as scoring

Some just do not want to accept we have no money.

 

[Kinghornloyal]

Some just do not want to accept we have no money.

Oh and also think the board or Investors should be putting their hands in their own pockets and spending £50m illegally to help us win

 

[JDC76]

Some just do not want to accept we have no money.

We do have money. It needs to be spent more wisely

 

[dublinbluenose]

Some just do not want to accept we have no money.

It’s also why the deals for Diomande and Cortes were done in the way they were we didn’t have the money to buy them right away and doing through the loan system it covered our arse with ffp.

 

[HarryBosch]

Rab why do we always need to look backwards? I’m not sure the relevance in 2024 to 2014 - Rangers have fully financially recovered and only require constant significant shareholder injections because we have a terrible player trading model and we can’t win our league to access the Champions League.

On Bisgrove, he’s at best a middle manager for a club and business the size of Rangers. At best, based on his experience. A strong CEO is essential to the off the the field issues we face with refereeing - don’t tell me you think he’s a strong voice for us there?

Alexa, tell me supporters don't fully understand our financial position?

 

[HarryBosch]

We do have money. It needs to be spent more wisely

Not in comparison to our rivals. But we agree what we have has to be spent wisely.

 

[scooter70]

We performed consistently well in Europe reaching a Europa League final and qualified for the Champions League, We sold Bassey, Patterson, Aribo and Kamara for substantial fees. We have continually sold out season tickets. If we have not fully recovered financially when will we recover.

Yet our wage bill is higher than Celtic’s?

I don’t have the answers but it feels like we are still very reliant on loans etc, that doesn’t feel like a full recovery

Re wage bill, it’s actually ridiculous the value for money we aren’t getting but paying more doesn’t mean we’ve fully recovered imo

We are on our way, and btw I’m making no excuses for what is going on, I’m absolutely scunnered with the lot of it to be honest

Many people have many questions to answer and things to fix, I was just making the point I don’t think we are fully there yet financially

 

[juan guy]

The biggest thing I have learned from all this is that inevitably all managers will want to keep a hold of their best players but ultimately every single player in the squad should have a price at any time.

Remember we turned down 20 odd million for Morelos one January then went on to bottle the league anyway

Aye exactly and that in itself tells you everything. If the manager stamping his feet is enough to derail our strategy then basically there is no strategy.

 

[JDC76]

I don’t have the answers but it feels like we are still very reliant on loans etc, that doesn’t feel like a full recovery

Re wage bill, it’s actually ridiculous the value for money we aren’t getting but paying more doesn’t mean we’ve fully recovered imo

We are on our way, and btw I’m making no excuses for what is going on, I’m absolutely scunnered with the lot of it to be honest

Many people have many questions to answer and things to fix, I was just making the point I don’t think we are fully there yet financially

Our turnover has increased substantially over the last few years which is a big improvement and getting us back to where we need to be. They have a head start on us in terms of stadium size and the CL money. But we aren’t that far off them as we think.

 

[Barrymoped]

The biggest thing I have learned from all this is that inevitably all managers will want to keep a hold of their best players but ultimately every single player in the squad should have a price at any time.

Remember we turned down 20 odd million for Morelos one January then went on to bottle the league anyway

I don’t think this actually happened.

We knocked back £16million from Lille……….then went on to win 55.

 

[MosesMcNeil99]

Alexa, tell me supporters don't fully understand our financial position?

How have we not pal? Weve posted a small profit since. You’re in cuckoo if you think our ability to generate revenues like them and compete is in any way unachievable now. We can, we just spend our money horrifically and get very little back for it.

 

[juan guy]

Well, given your apparent expertise, why didn't you step up?

Don't understand this sort of comment at all. The implication is that you can't criticise someone unless you're an expert in their field. It's a discussion forum for fans to share their opinions.

Do you never criticise managers? Players? Referees? Politicians?

 

[iaatpies]

Well, if we want to talk about poor performance we need not just criticise the Board. Yep fans have paid their way through the turnstiles, marketing etc but flopped dramatically in share ownership and influence through C1872. They set themselves a target of 25% which would have given them a real voice and enabled them to block the type of special resolutions which could have seriously harmed the club. What they got was 4.96% - an even worse miss that Dessers. Perhaps enough fans will stop attending and spending but I suspect all that will achieve is to hand their season tickets to someone else. In any event it's rare for the fans to agree.

Even if new investors can be found, and that's a big ask, they need to buy out the current board who control about 30% of the shares plus a further 15% I would expect from Gibson and Letham who are not on the Board but close to the directors. The bill? At current prices around £34m for the directors and £17m for Gibson and Letham - but they'll want more than that to sell. And that doesn't include shareholder loans which are probably in excess of £15m. And Park won't be easy to deal with either. At the end of last financial year total loans were £17.6m whilst during that year Operations had a cash outflow of £3.8m on top of the net £8.1m invested in the club.

There is no such thing as a free transfer. You can pay a fee up front or pay it as part of wages over the period of the contract but pay it you will. Since we don't have a lot of shekels we mainly pay through wages hence our high bill.

Had C1872 some nous, the fans would have a say with the board but politics get in the way, not for the first time. So, blame the board by all means (though there have been changes) but let's not ignore the role that C1872 has played, or not as the case might be.

Until it is known who has the money to buy out the current shareholdings, repay the existing loans and fund the ongoing cash outflow, I suggest we should be careful what we wish for.

C1872 - and similar groups - will never achieve anything at Rangers. Not because the theory can't work at a club like Rangers. Unfortunately it will never work in practice. Too many supporters are against collective action. Too many simply don't buy into the idea of fan representation at board level and increased fan ownership. There's no appetite for it at Rangers. Limited understanding of what it should look like and limited desire for it to happen. The people involved have made some serious mistakes. Regardless of any intention to do better, the fans simply don't buy into the concept of collective representation and action.

It's pointless blaming C1872 when the wider support have little appetite for the underlying concept. It could be C1872. It was the Rangers Supporters Trust before them. It could be any other fans group looking to deliver meaningful representation. Rangers fans just don't buy into the idea.

 

[High Society]

The feeling I’m getting amongst our supporters tonight is anger more than disappointment, feeling sick and tired of feeling sick and tired.

I reckon this upcoming transfer window will be our board’s last chance to get it right on the park, and produce a winning Rangers, otherwise heads will roll.

We deserve better.

Who are you proposing should take over?

 

[Arkanoid]

If we got a striker in January rather than waste millions on loan signing Silva we could have won this league.

Any other insider financial info you can share on our accounts 6 months ahead of schedule?

 

[Mreblue]

Not sure what's going to be worse, this thread or the transfers thread.

 

[HarryBosch]

Don't understand this sort of comment at all. The implication is that you can't criticise someone unless you're an expert in their field. It's a discussion forum for fans to share their opinions.

Do you never criticise managers? Players? Referees? Politicians?

Nope. Not even close. The guy stated "a monkey could have done his job". That's not a criticism based in fact unless the poster can do better.
Supporter should be free to criticise, but they shouldn't be free to denigrate unless they have better skills.

Should you be able to criticise a quantum physicist?

 

[Arkanoid]

We performed consistently well in Europe reaching a Europa League final and qualified for the Champions League, We sold Bassey, Patterson, Aribo and Kamara for substantial fees. We have continually sold out season tickets. If we have not fully recovered financially when will we recover.

Patterson barely made a dent in the COVID losses, Bassey and Aribo got reinvested in dross

 

[Sheik Ma Shammy]

Did Dessers not get something like 18 goals since January? We wouldn’t have got a striker with a better goal return than him. And a new striker wouldn’t have stopped our players bottling it and conspiring in ever more ridiculous ways to concede goals.

How many did we not score and easy chances we could not put away there are no guarantees but not getting a striker in January when we were crying out for one was a mistake.

 

[Arkanoid]

Not sure what's going to be worse, this thread or the transfers thread.

The good news this one will die a death!
The OP is arguing with himself about discontent, reality is the board seems to already be making positive changes to correct mistakes by hiring Clement and Koppen.
The Transfer thread however will be full of joy for over 3 months yet

 

[Arkanoid]

How many did we not score and easy chances we could not put away there are no guarantees but not getting a striker in January when we were crying out for one was a mistake.

Same argument could be made for a centre back then

 

[Sheik Ma Shammy]

It’s also why the deals for Diomande and Cortes were done in the way they were we didn’t have the money to buy them right away and doing through the loan system it covered our arse with ffp.

Its not its the way a lot of clubs are doing deals now not just us.

 

[HarryBosch]

How many did we not score and easy chances we could not put away there are no guarantees but not getting a striker in January when we were crying out for one was a mistake.

Can you absolutely guarantee another striker takes the missed chances? No, you can't. And that manager told you, we had no money and needed to be creative.

Are you just flat out ignoring that?

 

[Sheik Ma Shammy]

Same argument could be made for a centre back then

It could if the centre-back missed chance after chance in games. I'm not slating Dessers he had a good season but needed help.

 

[Barrymoped]

Its not its the way a lot of clubs are doing deals now not just us.

Diomande’s deal was done precisely because we had no cash to actually buy him in January, Clement said as much.

Plenty of other clubs are doing similar to keep themselves within FFP rules.

 

[Sheik Ma Shammy]

Can you absolutely guarantee another striker takes the missed chances? No, you can't. And that manager told you, we had no money and needed to be creative.

Are you just flat out ignoring that?

The Manager got it wrong it was obvious we needed a striker.

 

[juan guy]

Nope. Not even close. The guy stated "a monkey could have done his job". That's not a criticism based in fact unless the poster can do better.
Supporter should be free to criticise, but they shouldn't be free to denigrate unless they have better skills.

Should you be able to criticise a quantum physicist?

If they're the Director of a commercial business of which I am an investor and customer, and whose audited accounts are freely available, then yes, absolutely.

 

[HarryBosch]

The Manager got it wrong it was obvious we needed a striker.

Well avoided.

 

[Sheik Ma Shammy]

Well avoided.

What is being avoided?