Who is in the better position?

AriseSirWalter

Well-Known Member
I must admit at the time Dave King said about the pack of cards I didn’t see it. Since Gerrard has come in I’ve thought that we could win the league in each of those seasons but ultimate I thought they’d probably win 3 out of 5.

This season though has been remarkable, I’m not sure even DK could have predicted it. On field it’s been all Rangers that’s put them under pressure, but off field they’re such a shambles that it could have repercussions long after this season.

They have alienated their fans to the point that there will likely be a drop in ST sales, their biggest assets (Edourd, Christie, Ajer) don’t have long left on their contracts, they’ve spent a lot of money on players that aren’t performing (Barkas, Duffy, Ajeti) and will require a change of manager and back room staff.

They have a wage bill that requires CL or a big player sale, they have neither this season and spent heavily.

On the other hand, our losses are well documented and we’ll also likely sell an asset or two but we’ll hopefully get CL money and have a settled squad and management team.

Obviously everyone would rather be in our position than theirs for this season but (taking emotion out of it) who is best placed for the next season or two? I think most would say us but anyone want to make a case for them?

Longer-term, say 5+ years, who is better placed? Does their financial advantages mean that they’ll likely be on top in next 5 years or is that financial advantage removed after one league win from us?
 

OohAhHuistra

Well-Known Member
I’d say us, chance of CL football and money massive also, settled squad with good depth for the first time since 2012 whereas on the other hand they’re facing a complete rebuild on & off the park
 

rayrangers

Well-Known Member
They don’t have a massive financial advantage

Massive rebuild at the dome of secrets, new keeper, left back two new central defenders, couple of new midfielders and possibly two strikers to start with.

Think Brown, Mgregor, Christie, Edouard, Ellnoiusi, Laxalt, Duffy, Kimbala, Ncham, Ajer will defo go and that’s only the ones I can think about
 

cooprfc

Well-Known Member
Us.

We quietly got our house in order off the field. We have modernised and our recruitment pisses all over theirs.

We have players that people will pay big money to get. They've already sold all theirs.

We have a hungry team. They have a team that has literally been run into the ground. They may need a full rebuild.

They will be giving out season ticket refunds and poor uptake (unless they do something big in the summer) while we will definitely sell out again, covid or no covid.

We are also the trendier club from the outside looking in now due to being run correctly. That's huge for sponsorship and players.
 

HinshieBluenose

Well-Known Member
I think that will hinge massively on us getting past the PO round and into the CL proper. That is what's going to make the biggest difference.

If they can make up the shortfall this season by selling Ajer, Edouard and Christie... what big money sales do they have to plug the gap next season?
 

Craigie

Well-Known Member
We haven't won't a title since 2011 yet, as the last set of accounts show, our financial position is strengthening whilst this at The Chamber are on the decline.

Granted our costs are also rising but still below the level of them.

Should we reach the group stages of the Champions League while they don't we will overtake them in the next season.

They will continue to downsize dramatically. Remember the Fat Jap said a few years ago they need to qualify the the group stages in 3 seasons out of 5. They have missed the last 3 seasons. A fourth could be devastating for them.
 

DonDraper

Active Member
They are on course to post a loss of around £30 million this FY unless they sell players in January, without CL money next FY they will lose another 25 million IF they sell season tickets at this years level. They are in trouble, they have big decisions to make and will downsize significantly. There will be no top manager and no large splash on new players. They don’t have the budget and quite simply can’t afford it.
The biggest scandal for them is that they have been spoon fed a lie that they are in great financial shape, wait to you see the meltdown when the penny drops. You ain’t seen nothing yet
 

shug1971

Well-Known Member
I must admit at the time Dave King said about the pack of cards I didn’t see it. Since Gerrard has come in I’ve thought that we could win the league in each of those seasons but ultimate I thought they’d probably win 3 out of 5.

This season though has been remarkable, I’m not sure even DK could have predicted it. On field it’s been all Rangers that’s put them under pressure, but off field they’re such a shambles that it could have repercussions long after this season.

They have alienated their fans to the point that there will likely be a drop in ST sales, their biggest assets (Edourd, Christie, Ajer) don’t have long left on their contracts, they’ve spent a lot of money on players that aren’t performing (Barkas, Duffy, Ajeti) and will require a change of manager and back room staff.

They have a wage bill that requires CL or a big player sale, they have neither this season and spent heavily.

On the other hand, our losses are well documented and we’ll also likely sell an asset or two but we’ll hopefully get CL money and have a settled squad and management team.

Obviously everyone would rather be in our position than theirs for this season but (taking emotion out of it) who is best placed for the next season or two? I think most would say us but anyone want to make a case for them?

Longer-term, say 5+ years, who is better placed? Does their financial advantages mean that they’ll likely be on top in next 5 years or is that financial advantage removed after one league win from us?
Any financial advantage they have would disappear overnight if we were to win the league and make cl group stage so it’s too early to say. As things stand we are still losing a lot of money and will need a big sale as do them of course. Difference is imo we have investors that can see that getting group stage is a game changer and going on our euro exploits under SG will trust any investment is spent wisely with promise of return. Them on the other hand ?
 

Scaramanga

Well-Known Member
Like a house of cards

 

rayrangers

Well-Known Member
They are on course to post a loss of around £30 million this FY unless they sell players, without CL money next FY they will lose another 25 million IF they sell season tickets at this years level. They are in trouble, they have big decisions to make and will downsize significantly. There will be no top manager and no large splash on new players. They don’t have the budget and quite simply can’t afford it.
The biggest scandal for them is that they have been spoon fed a lie that they are in great financial shape, wait tomyou see the meltdown when the penny drops. You ain’t seen nothing yet
I imagine Ajeti and Barkas will be on big dough as well
 

northsealoyal

Well-Known Member
We have rebuilt from the ground up and not just on the financial side we have an infrastructure in place with recruitment with marketing and loyal fan base we are in a far superior position to continue to grow than those dirty bead rattling mob across the city
 

Bannockburn Bear

Well-Known Member
Official Ticketer
We’ve had 9 years of absolute hell compared to 9 weeks of poor results and some off field disappointments for them. They’re already turning on their players, staff and one another.

We’ve backed our club through thick and thin, tens of thousands of us bought season tickets this year despite no realistic chance of even getting to a game. Can’t speak for others but I’d do that forever if the club needed it. We’re different from them in so many aspects.

They will notice a massive drop in ticket sales, merchandise and overall fan goodwill when Tav lifts that trophy over his head.
 

LaudrupTheGreat

Well-Known Member
I had the pain and I mean PAIN of having a meeting in work today with a saville and it started with lawel wanted us to win the league and then the license and European 2012 pish and then we were fucked as they could get loans and they could sell the french forward.......

anyway it rumbles on and I say you know what your right, it’s all over the news today that use are hooring the french guy to anyone at a cut price deal but as for loans am not so sure about that! How much is the abuse bill going to be ( aye but use will need to borrow ) yes we may have to borrow however the champions league money will see us fine and the fucker hung up! It was sheer rage of the scale
 

Madjid Moments

Well-Known Member
We could be at a hugely pivotal moment in the clubs history and it could show on the pitch long term.

A league title win will see huge rise in income to the club through prize money, sponsorship, merchandise etc.

The demand for tickets, replica kits, access to our digital platforms etc will again draw major income.

A successful qualification for the CL is the big one. IF we could make it the revenue takes us to another level.

This put into the mix with some shrewd business in the transfer market, with incomings and outgoings seeing us cashing in on players and rebuilding for the future.

Done properly we will reduce internal debts considerably, increase revenue streams and put us into a financial position where we can attest quality players and compete on all fronts.

It’s an exciting time Bears!
 

Wugs

Well-Known Member
They have ignored us !
They have assumed that the '10' was inevitable , it was the next stage after the 'Quadruple Treble'.
They might even have had thoughts of a 'Quintruple Treble'.
The facts are , their arrogance has caught up with them and now their 'tainted' superiority or supposed dominance is about to be toppled.
The have had their 'moment in the sun' since 2012 , but it is now over !
We are back & they are now in decline , over to you Fritzel , bring it on !
 

Beer Belly Loyal

Well-Known Member
When we won the title in 1987 after a nine year wait we all thought it would be a cakewalk for years to come - we lost the league the following season.
We did eventually dominate for the next nine though.
 
The biggest factor for me is that we keep Stevie G, I dont think he will want to leave given he is just starting to build something at the moment, surely he will also want a few cracks at the CL.

He is a big draw for some of the players that we have brought to the club recently. I cant see the likes of Kent, Hagi, Roofe, Aribo etc having wanted to come to the club if he wasnt at the helm considering the position we have been in.

CL football and at a minimum European football is so important, not only for financial reasons but it is also a huge carrot when trying to attract better players, given that with the Scottish Coefficient has improved considerably that they will almost be guaranteed CL for finishing 1st or 2nd in the Scottish league
 

TheWorks

Well-Known Member
They are used to winning tainted titles without us. It’s gonna end now. They will leave in droves.

never forget they are the greatest fans I the world and faithful fru and fru

but only when they are winning trebles. If they aren’t then they hate their team, board, manager and everything about them.

shit team shit fans. And they are being found out for that they are
 

AriseSirWalter

Well-Known Member
They are on course to post a loss of around £30 million this FY unless they sell players in January, without CL money next FY they will lose another 25 million IF they sell season tickets at this years level. They are in trouble, they have big decisions to make and will downsize significantly. There will be no top manager and no large splash on new players. They don’t have the budget and quite simply can’t afford it.
The biggest scandal for them is that they have been spoon fed a lie that they are in great financial shape, wait to you see the meltdown when the penny drops. You ain’t seen nothing yet
I agree, it’ll be interesting to see what they do in this transfer window. The sensible business decision is to sell assets like Edourd who isn’t looking like extending but that signals that they’ve checked the league which will have their fans in the car park.

It’s incredible how they could be at this point considering where both clubs were 3 years ago. Just goes to show what happens when you offer the managers job to a guy in the showers!
 

Blu_ultra

Well-Known Member
As others have said, qualifying for the champions league is key. Not only do we get 30 million quid, but any of our players performing well suddenly double their value. Alfie scores 5 goals in the CL, we're looking at 35 million. It's an absolute game changer and will stop our unsustainable losses.

Just a quick reality check as well bears.. As good as things are just now, we aren't in a good financial place. Sure, there's a plan that we're following, but relying on the goodwill of rich Rangers fans won't last forever. Part of that plan is to begin to break even. That involves champions league football and player sales.
 

BillStruthsGreenhouse

Well-Known Member
This is not just about the last 12 months, the last 3 years, or the last 10 years, or the next 5 years. Go back to any point in Rangers or Celtic history, and it is plain to see who has always had the better teams, the better stadiums, upheld traditions with a progressive approach, and had the more loyal support which has been passed on from father to son, father to son and gladly received.

We were kicked when we were down in 2012, literally abandoned, and cast adrift, but we got up and stood shoulder to shoulder to support the club through thick and thin. We knew there were no quick fixes, but we dug deep, preserved and broke world attendance records in fourth tier, third tier and second tier leagues to the astonishment of Europe.

Celtic have one "bad" season and have imploded. If what had happened to us in 2012, happened to them, whey would have recovered as we have? With their fans, interrupted traditions and delusions, not a chance.

OP we are always in the better position be it in the 4th tier or the 1st.
 

The_Degan

Well-Known Member
Don’t see how you can say even Dave king couldn’t have predicted all this since it’s literally exactly what he predicted ! And it’s only just begun !
 

crocnroll

Well-Known Member
When we won the title in 1987 after a nine year wait we all thought it would be a cakewalk for years to come - we lost the league the following season.
We did eventually dominate for the next nine though.
Correct but had Butcher not broken his leg we would have won the league comfortably and it would have been 11 in a row.
 

Rab_bear

Well-Known Member
The biggest difference is they have been feasting on easy prey over the last 9 seasons and have got fat and lazy on it. In contrast we are hungry, lean and raring to go.
 

monkey magic

Well-Known Member
They have ignored us !
They have assumed that the '10' was inevitable , it was the next stage after the 'Quadruple Treble'.
They might even have had thoughts of a 'Quintruple Treble'.
The facts are , their arrogance has caught up with them and now their 'tainted' superiority or supposed dominance is about to be toppled.
The have had their 'moment in the sun' since 2012 , but it is now over !
We are back & they are now in decline , over to you Fritzel , bring it on !

It was certainly misplaced arrogance. Anyone with half a brain cell at the Piggery should have been preparing for competing in Europe as the League was already a one-horse race against feeble opposition. But not those congenital idiots. They preferred to lord it over Scottish football with a futile fraud quad of trophies which nobody cares about. Always remember, their " golden era " is summed up by them losing 1 - 13 to PSG.
 

wee_bear

Well-Known Member
Us winning the league this year represents a levelling up of the financial gap in the season ahead. Couple this with their expected losses from this season and it’s a real levelling up indeed. £30m in the bank will be gone, balance sheet will be red, day to day losses up. Ours will inevitably be similar to previous seasons, maybe even worse than previous years due to losing the European gate money, both ours and their balance sheets can only be rescued by player sales in first 6 months of 2021 and we know who is more likely to go down that avenue.

We need to have a real crack at CL qualification and all of the recruitment team will know we are under-resourced for that challenge so work will need to be done between now and the summer under tight financial restrictions however we can do it safe in the knowledge that over the road they face a complete rebuild and an far harder pathway to the promised land of the CL £20M.
 

SasaPapacLoyal54

Well-Known Member
It's all up in the air right now.

If we win the league and qualify for the CL next season (big ifs right now) and they don't qualify for the CL through the harder path then we will have CL, settled squad and management team, happy fanbase, basically whole club pulling in the same direction.

While they will have a new management team (hoping for a downsizing Jack Ross type appointment), huge squad upheaval, unhappy fanbase, no CL money etc

That would be the dream scenario but there is a long way to go to get to that place.
 

Valley Bluenose

Well-Known Member
Winning title 55 is huge - and it looks like its going to happen (no chickens counted here yet though).

After that, CL group stage qualification is the next key target. We will find it tough to get there, and even tougher to compete there - but the financial rewards, in just 1 season, will continue the stabilisation of our Club and allow our backers a welcome financial respite.
 

AriseSirWalter

Well-Known Member
Winning title 55 is huge - and it looks like its going to happen (no chickens counted here yet though).

After that, CL group stage qualification is the next key target. We will find it tough to get there, and even tougher to compete there - but the financial rewards, in just 1 season, will continue the stabilisation of our Club and allow our backers a welcome financial respite.
How many qualifiers would we need to get through should we win the league?
 

onedadoprso.1

Active Member
I agree with the OP but we can't look ahead as far as 5 years...they may make the correct managerial appointment who may improve things enough to challenge and that won't take 5 years. However, they may appoint a dud who takes things the other way. Either way, we must be relentless in staying at the top due to our own efforts.
 

Thechemist

Well-Known Member
Only way we don’t pull away is if we sell our top players and the replacements aren’t up to the same level and they get lucky with their replacements. Likes of turnbull for them will be good enough for the majority of games in Scotland but would say bassey for borna be good enough for the season. Financially whoever wins next season will be the biggest factor
 
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